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The Limited Archetypes of Ixalan
 
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  • posted a message on Eldrazi Stompy!
    Quote from mtgsalaccount »
    So there's no way to actually do anything against creatures that have something like "protection from everything."






    Some builds, especially the Big Eldrazi builds, run All is Dust (often Sideboard), which can force a sacrifice of Progenitus, but otherwise, no, there's not much you can do about it.
    Posted in: Aggro & Tempo
  • posted a message on Primal Amulet Questions
    Quote from Shin_Seiryu »
    Hey, I have some questions about Primal Amulet from the ixalan set. It reads:


    So, the questions are:
    1.) If I make a copy of the Amulet using say Ms. Saheeli Rai or Mechanized Production and remove the counters to transform into the land, does Primal Amulet/Wellspring get sacrificed at the end of the turn?
    2.) If I blink the land from play "somehow", does it return as the Primal Wellspring or does it return as the amulet?
    3.) Finally, is there a set of rules for all dfc cards or is it individually for each card?
    Thanks.


    1) Token copies can never transform. Even if it could, it would still be sacrificed at the end of turn when Saheeli's effect wears off.
    2) Transformed cards always enter the battlefield with their front face unless you are instructed to put it onto the battlefield transformed.
    3) There are common rules for all DFC cards.

    Quote from Comprehensive Rules »

    701.26. Transform

    701.26a To transform a permanent, turn it over so that its other face is up. Only permanents represented by double-faced cards can transform. (See rule 711, “Double-Faced Cards.”)

    701.26b Although transforming a permanent uses the same physical action as turning a permanent face up or face down, they are different game actions. Abilities that trigger when a permanent is turned face down won’t trigger when that permanent transforms, and so on.

    701.26c If a spell or ability instructs a player to transform a permanent that isn’t represented by a double-faced card, nothing happens.

    701.26d If a spell or ability instructs a player to transform a permanent, and the face that permanent would transform into is represented by an instant or sorcery card face, nothing happens.

    701.26e Some triggered abilities trigger when an object “transforms into” an object with a specified characteristic. Such an ability triggers if the object transforms and has the specified characteristic immediately after it transforms.

    701.26f If an activated or triggered ability of a permanent that isn’t a delayed triggered ability of that permanent tries to transform it, the permanent transforms only if it hasn’t transformed since the ability was put onto the stack. If a delayed triggered ability of a permanent tries to transform that permanent, the permanent transforms only if it hasn’t transformed since that delayed triggered ability was created. In either case, if the permanent has already transformed, the instruction to transform is ignored. This is a change from previous rules.

    711. Double-Faced Cards

    711.1. A double-faced card has a Magic card face on each side rather than a Magic card face on one side and a Magic card back on the other. Each face may have abilities that allow the card to “transform,” or turn over to its other face. Tokens and cards with a Magic card back can’t transform. (See rule 701.26, “Transform.”)

    711.1a A double-faced card’s front face is marked by a front-face symbol in its upper left corner. On Magic Origins double-faced cards, the front-face symbol is a modified Planeswalker icon. On cards in the Innistrad block and Shadows over Innistrad set, as well as on Ulrich of the Krallenhorde in the Eldritch Moon set, the front-face symbol is a sun. On other Eldritch Moon double-faced cards, the front-face symbol is a full moon.

    711.1b A double-faced card’s back face is marked by a back-face symbol in its upper left corner. On Magic Origins double-faced cards, the back-face symbol is a full Planeswalker icon. On cards in the Innistrad block and Shadows over Innistrad set, as well as on Ulrich, Uncontested Alpha in the Eldritch Moon set, the back-face symbol is a crescent moon. On other Eldritch Moon double-faced cards, the back-face symbol is a stylized image of Emrakul.

    711.1c If the back face of a double-faced card is a creature, the front face of that card will have the back face’s power and toughness printed in gray above the power and toughness box. This is reminder text and has no effect on game play.

    711.1d Meld cards have a Magic card face on one side and half of an oversized Magic card face on the other. These aren’t double-faced cards and are subject to their own set of rules. See rule 712, “Meld Cards.”

    711.2. Players who are allowed to look at a double-faced card may look at both faces.

    711.3. Players must ensure that double-faced cards in hidden zones are indistinguishable from other cards in the same zone. To do this, the owner of a double-faced card may use completely opaque card sleeves or substitute a checklist card (see rule 713). Sanctioned tournaments have additional rules for playing with double-faced cards. See rule 100.6.

    711.4. Each face of a double-faced card has its own set of characteristics.

    711.4a While a double-faced card is outside the game, in a zone other than the battlefield, or on the battlefield with its front face up, it has only the characteristics of its front face.

    711.4b While a double-faced permanent’s back face is up, it has only the characteristics of its back face. However, its converted mana cost is calculated using the mana cost of its front face. This is a change from previous rules. If a permanent is copying the back face of a double-faced card (even if the card representing that copy is itself a double-faced card), the converted mana cost of that permanent is 0.

    711.5. Only permanents represented by double-faced cards can transform. (See rule 701.26, “Transform.”) If a spell or ability instructs a player to transform any permanent that isn’t represented by a double-faced card, nothing happens.
    Example: A Clone enters the battlefield as a copy of Wildblood Pack (the back face of a double-faced card). The Clone will be a copy of the Wildblood Pack. Because the Clone is itself not a double-faced card, it can’t transform.
    Example: A player casts Cytoshape, causing a Kruin Outlaw (the front face of a double-faced card) to become a copy of Elite Vanguard (a 2/1 Human Soldier creature) until end of turn. The player then casts Moonmist, which reads, in part, “Transform all Humans.” Because the copy of Elite Vanguard is a double-faced card, it will transform. The resulting permanent will have its back face up, but it will still be a copy of Elite Vanguard that turn.

    711.6. If a spell or ability instructs a player to transform a permanent, and the face that permanent would transform into is represented by an instant or sorcery card face, nothing happens.

    711.7. If a double-faced card is cast as a spell, it’s put on the stack with its front face up. See rule 601, “Casting Spells.”

    711.8. A double-faced card enters the battlefield with its front face up by default. If a spell or ability puts it onto the battlefield “transformed,” it enters the battlefield with its back face up.

    711.8a If a player is instructed to put a card that isn’t a double-faced card onto the battlefield transformed, that card stays in its current zone. This is a change from previous rules.

    711.9. If an effect allows a player to cast a double-faced card as a face-down creature spell, or if a double-faced card enters the battlefield face down, it will have the characteristics given to it by the rule or effect that caused it to be face down. That card remains hidden, using either a face-down checklist card or opaque sleeves. See rule 707, “Face-Down Spells and Permanents.”

    711.9a While face down, a double-faced permanent can’t transform. If it is turned face up, it will have its front face up.

    711.10. Double-faced permanents can’t be turned face down. If a spell or ability tries to turn a double-faced permanent face down, nothing happens.

    711.11. A double-faced card that is exiled face down remains hidden, using either a face-down checklist card or opaque sleeves. See rule 713, “Checklist Cards.”

    711.12. When a double-faced permanent transforms, it doesn’t become a new object. Any effects that applied to that permanent will continue to apply to it after it transforms.
    Example: An effect gives Village Ironsmith (the front face of a double-faced card) +2/+2 until end of turn and then Village Ironsmith transforms into Ironfang. Ironfang will continue to get +2/+2 until end of turn.

    711.13. If an effect instructs a player to choose a card name, the player may name either face of a double-faced card but not both.

    712. Meld Cards

    712.1. A meld card has a Magic card face on one side and half of an oversized Magic card face on the other. It doesn’t have a Magic card back.

    712.1a There are three specific meld pairs. Each meld pair consists of two specific cards whose back faces combine to form one oversized Magic card face: Midnight Scavengers and Graf Rats meld to form Chittering Host; Hanweir Garrison and Hanweir Battlements meld to form Hanweir, the Writhing Township; and Bruna, the Fading Light and Gisela, the Broken Blade meld to form Brisela, Voice of Nightmares.

    712.1b A meld card isn’t a double-faced card. It can’t transform or enter the battlefield transformed. (See rule 711, “Double-Faced Cards.”)

    712.2. One card in each meld pair has an ability that exiles both that object and its counterpart and melds them. To meld the two cards in a meld pair, put them onto the battlefield with their back faces up and combined (see rule 701.35, “Meld”). The resulting permanent is a single object represented by two cards.

    712.3. The front face of each meld card and the combined face formed by a meld pair each has its own set of characteristics.

    712.3a While a meld card is outside the game, in a zone other than the battlefield, or on the battlefield with its front face up, it has only the characteristics of its front face.

    712.3b While the two cards of a meld pair are on the battlefield as a melded permanent, the object represented by those cards has only the characteristics of the combined back face, and its converted mana cost is the sum of the converted mana costs of its front faces. If a permanent is copying a melded permanent, the converted mana cost of the copy is 0. See rule 202.3c.

    712.3c Anything that needs information about a meld card or a melded permanent sees only the information given by the face that is currently up.
    Example: A Clone enters the battlefield as a copy of Chittering Host (the combined back face of a meld pair). It has the characteristics of Chittering Host, even though the object it becomes is represented by only a single card, and its convered mana cost is 0.

    712.4. If a melded permanent leaves the battlefield, one permanent leaves the battlefield and two cards are put into the appropriate zone.
    Example: Chittering Host, a melded permanent, dies. An ability that triggers “whenever a creature dies” triggers once. An ability that triggers “whenever a card is put into a graveyard from anywhere” triggers twice.

    712.4a If a melded permanent is put into its owner’s graveyard or library, that player may arrange the two cards in any order. If it’s put into its owner’s library, that player doesn’t reveal the order.

    712.4b If a player exiles a melded permanent, that player determines the relative timestamp order of the two cards at that time. This is an exception to the procedure described in rule 613.6j.
    Example: Duplicant is a card with the abilities “When Duplicant enters the battlefield, you may exile target nontoken creature” and “As long as a card exiled with Duplicant is a creature card, Duplicant has the power, toughness, and creature types of the last creature card exiled with Duplicant. It’s still a Shapeshifter.” As Duplicant’s first ability exiles Chittering Host, a melded permanent, Duplicant’s controller chooses whether the last creature card exiled is Midnight Scavengers or Graf Rats.

    712.4c If an effect can find the new object that a melded permanent becomes as it leaves the battlefield, it finds both cards. (See rule 400.7.) If that effect causes actions to be taken upon those cards, the same actions are taken upon each of them.
    Example: Otherworldly Journey is an instant that reads “Exile target creature. At the beginning of the next end step, return that card to the battlefield under its owner’s control with a +1/+1 counter on it.” A player casts Otherworldly Journey targeting Chittering Host, a melded permanent. Chittering Host is exiled. At the beginning of the next end step, Midnight Scavengers and Graf Rats are both returned to the battlefield, each with a +1/+1 counter on it.
    Example: False Demise is an Aura with the ability “When enchanted creature dies, return that card to the battlefield under your control.” A Chittering Host enchanted by False Demise dies. The triggered ability returns both Midnight Scavengers and Graf Rats to the battlefield.
    Example: Mimic Vat is an artifact that reads, in part, “Whenever a nontoken creature dies, you may exile that card.” A Chittering Host dies. As Mimic Vat’s triggered ability resolves, its controller makes a single choice and both cards that represented Chittering Host are either exiled or not.

    712.4d If multiple replacement effects could be applied to the event of a melded permanent leaving the battlefield or being put into the new zone, applying one of those replacement effects to one of the two cards affects both cards. If the melded permanent is a commander, it may be exempt from this rule; see rule 903.9a.
    Example: Leyline of the Void is an enchantment that reads, in part, “If a card would be put into an opponent’s graveyard from anywhere, exile it instead.” Wheel of Sun and Moon is an Aura with enchant player and the ability “If a card would be put into enchanted player’s graveyard from anywhere, instead that card is revealed and put on the bottom of its owner’s library.” If the controller of Chittering Host is affected by both cards’ effects, that player chooses one effect to apply to the event and Midnight Scavengers and Graf Rats are both moved to the appropriate zone.

    712.4e If an effect needs to know the number of objects that changed zones, a melded permanent among those objects counts as one object that moved. If the effect needs to know the number of cards that changed zones, that melded permanent counts as two cards that moved.

    712.5. Players who are allowed to look at a meld card may look at its half of the combined back face. Players may access Oracle text for the other member of the meld pair and the combined face at any time (see rule 108.1).

    712.6. Meld cards in a player’s deck may be represented by checklist cards. See rule 713, “Checklist Cards.”

    712.7. If a meld card is cast as a spell, it’s put on the stack with its front face up. See rule 601, “Casting Spells.”

    712.8. A meld card enters the battlefield with its front face up unless it’s being melded with its counterpart.

    712.9. If an effect allows a player to cast a meld card as a face-down spell, or if a meld card enters the battlefield face down, it will have the characteristics given to it by the rule or effect that caused it to be face down. That card remains hidden, using either a face-down checklist card or opaque sleeves. See rule 707, “Face-Down Spells and Permanents.”

    712.10. Meld cards on the battlefield and melded permanents can’t be turned face down. If a spell or ability tries to turn such a permanent face down, nothing happens.

    712.11. If an effect instructs a player to choose a card name, the player may choose the name of a front face of a meld card or the combined back face of a meld pair.

    Posted in: Rumored Card Rulings
  • posted a message on Eldrazi Stompy!
    As it says in the matchups guide, it's heavily build-dependent. Eldrazi lists that pack multiple maindeck Karakas do better against Sneak Show than lists without. Phyrexian Revoker as a flex slot can stop Griselbrand or Sneak Attack activations. If you're heavier in white, maindeck Eldrazi Displacer and sideboard Containment Priest help a ton as well. Warping Wail and Thought-Knot Seer are relevant maindeck disruption, and Thorn of Amethyst, Trinisphere, and/or Sphere of Resistance can keep them from Daze/FoWing your Wail.

    Basically, unless you're in the white splash, you have to accept that you're going to lose the game if it gets to turn 4-5, because you're not going to have a great answer to Show into Emrakul with Force backup or Sneak Attack with multiple red sources. You want a hand that has the right mix of disruption and Smashers to close the game out before they can get to their inevitability point.
    Posted in: Aggro & Tempo
  • posted a message on Ixalan full spoilers
    Everybody in this thread needs to take a step back and stop attacking each other. Further hostile comments will be infracted
    Posted in: The Rumor Mill
  • posted a message on Rivals of Ixalan Planeswalkers
    The Speculation forum should not be used for Custom Card Creation. We have a Custom Card Creation format for that. It's acceptable to speculate on what Planeswalkers might exist in Rivals, and even a speculation as to what ability the likely planeswalker, Angrath, might have, but please limit this to more general speculation based on known information. Full-scale card creation does not belong here
    Posted in: Speculation
  • posted a message on old cards becoming dinosaurs
    Quote from Tvtyrant »


    Why couldn't they have done a Dinosaur Masterpieces set? I would buy the heck out of those.


    My guess is they believed (and likely correctly) that there wouldn't be enough interest for it to be worthwhile. Of those cards, not a one has serious Modern, Legacy, EDH, or other appeal, with the closest being Deathmist Raptor. The majority of them are limited-filled commons and uncommons.
    Posted in: Speculation
  • posted a message on Will the master piece set continue in IXALAN?
    Not a Rumor, and they've stated Ixalan does not have Masterpieces. Closed
    Posted in: The Rumor Mill
  • posted a message on Wish Boards
    In the future, please do not revive threads that are this old, as they are generally no longer relevant. It is better to start a new thread once they're a few years out. Thanks
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
  • posted a message on Eldrazi Stompy!
    Quote from DJ_AGUILA »
    This deck is "Big Eldrazi"and I like more than Eldrazi agro because I think is more fast with Grim Monolith and Thran Dynamo and you can find Ulamog the Ceaseless Hunger easy with Eye of Ugin and cast it.
    I haven't anything who sideboarding with Big Eldrazi, Do you know who sideboarding?


    Yeah, it's definitely a different deck than the Eldrazi Aggro deck, which just hasn't seemed to cut it lately for whatever reason. Maybe the loss of Miracles has weakened the Cavern of Souls + Chalice setup, and Delver is way more brutal to your manabase if you're playing City of Traitors.

    I'd have to dig for the sideboarding guides for Big Eldrazi, it's a build I haven't tinkered with much myself.
    Posted in: Aggro & Tempo
  • posted a message on Angrath is a minotaur planeswalker
    Quote from thatmarkguy »


    This is weird. This is the second time today someone has replied to me, ignored the part where I say something, then tell me the very thing they ignored as if it's supposed to be news to me. I say above "It is looking more likely the tenth DFC is red and rare though (as each of the other colors got a rare DFC)."

    One of two balances has to be upset (every color gets two mythics or every color gets one fliprare) and I agree with you that it seems most likely the fliprare is the balance that gets completed (as I said two and a half hours before you told me!). That's why my original post had that emoji. I realized what I was saying was incredibly unlikely.


    "Every color gets X mythics" is a balance that's upset in basically every set. It's less common to see an equal distribution of colors among the mythics than to not see it. And even if they were going to use the DFC slot to make up this difference, it's *green* that's down a Mythic, not Red, and Angrath is 100% Red (with other color(s) tbd).

    MaRo has also commented about the color balance of Planeswalkers in this set. Huatli is RW and not RWG because Huatli's RW complements Vraska's BG and Jace's U to cover all five colors. That wouldn't be a meaningful comment for MaRo to make if there was another Planeswalker in Ixalan.
    Posted in: Speculation
  • posted a message on Angrath is a minotaur planeswalker
    Quote from thatmarkguy »


    In theory, the as-yet-unspoiled tenth DFC could be a planeswalker! :p


    Sure, except we're missing the Red Enchantment->Land flip.

    Quote from Raptorchan »
    As I said before, he IS on booster packs for Ixalan, not RoI.
    And... Did we seen all rares from that list? What about cards like Captivating Crew that were spoilered only yesterday?


    We've seen a complete rare sheet. Not all of it was legible, but you can clearly make out a column of Mythics with 10 mythics with know and an unknown White Enchantment. The other 4 Mythics are in another column and known as well. There are clearly only three walkers on the sheet and we know them all.
    Posted in: Speculation
  • posted a message on Angrath is a minotaur planeswalker
    We know due to the rare sheet leak that there are no other Planeswalkers in Ixalan. So he's likely going to be in Rivals of Ixalan if anything.
    Posted in: Speculation
  • posted a message on Hello everyone
    Moved to Community Discussion

    Welcome.
    Posted in: Community Discussion
  • posted a message on [XLN] Vampire tribal
    Quote from drk210 »


    Disagree with "needs several lords", it just needs more creature synergies, one lord would be enough but it needs to be correctly placed on the curve, currently there's only 4 one drops and 4 two drops that seem reasonable in a b/w vampire deck, there needs to be more options in order for the tribe to have a decent deck before the next set comes out.


    In order for a Tribal deck to be worth playing, there needs to be considerable payoff. Look at the mono-black zombies list being played a bunch in Standard right now: Cryptbreaker, Diregraf Colossus, Lord of the Accursed, Relentless Dead, Dark Salvation, AND Liliana's Mastery all reward you for playing Zombies, and four of those six ALSO produce zombie tokens making them more or less self-contained.

    Meanwhile the vampire payoff we have so far consists of:
    Duskborn Skymarcher - Pretty darn bad
    Mavren Fein, Dark Apostle - Decent but likely weaker than, say Diregraf Colossus
    Bishop of the Bloodstained - Too slow
    Deathless Ancient - Straight-up bad
    Sanctum Seeker - Probably your best bet

    You've also got all of three token generators: Mavren, Call to the Feast, and Legion's Landing. So you've got two middling payoff cards, one of which makes its own tokens (but can't trigger off of tokens), and then two other token generators. That's not sufficient for a tribal deck by any stretch of the imagination.
    Posted in: New Card Discussion
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