Hello, so I'm looking to make this deck as consistent as possible, it's a turn 4 kill if you curve out. You only need 1 U on turn 4 if you have the other combo pieces in play so you can spend up to 3 mana digging turn 4. Most other decks aren't going to kill you turn 4 so you don't usually have to win turn 4 but the less time you give to interact with your board the better.
Thoughts on cards not part of the combos: Vapor Snag Buys time by removing something important off your opponent's board or can get a Shield Sphere back to hand if you need to block with it. Counterspell I had 1 slot left and it's just a little more interaction. Fire//Ice Buys time and digs or can act as spot removal.
Everything else is just for digging.
Sideboard:
The deck really doesn't care what your opponent is doing and with the combo basically requiring most of the deck and needing just as much card draw as possible I don't know what I would even SB in. This deck really just wants to buy a few turns and then go off.
In play testing it was fairly resistant to land destruction as you only need 3 mana for 1 turn. Targeted spot removal or forced sacs are rough as you will usually only have 1 creature in play for that 1 turn that you just have to sit through to get past summoning sickness, but this does force your opponent to have removal right then and there as you usually wont drop the 3 cost creature unless you can win the next turn or have decent dig.
one offers cycling if its not the right color but the other is 1 colorless for its effect vs W.
I don't know what to put in for finishing once the fort is set up or even if this would work out. I'm feeling like this is just a slower/inefficient fog deck but I can't get the idea to go away.
Curious if anyone has any thoughts on this or another use for Muddle in pauper.
So I've been out of standard play (and largely MTG play outside of pauper) for the past two years but still peruse spoiler lists when they come out. This time around I noticed Burglar Rat and it piqued my interest as I enjoy mono B control in pauper. So I poked around and came up with a very budget list for a Mono B Control in standard.
The Sideboard is unfinished as I'm not sure what to add being out of standard for so long. Plague Mare is there to counter token decks, Duress for slower or control decks, Dire Fleet Poisoner for creature heavy decks, and an extra Murder if something Cast Down can't handle becomes a problem.
Also, not sure if I should use Dimir Guildgate instead of Island as the U is only necessary for Notion Rain if I don't get a Demon of Catastrophes by turn 4 or if one dies without a replacement. But the deck also feels like it needs to have all its mana available for the first 4 turns and a guildgate would be a hindrance if that's a land I have to play early.
Lastly I was kicking around the idea of a single Bone Dragon MB as a contingency.
Any an all thought are welcome and please try to keep suggestions down in price as budget is a concern. Thanks!
I updated the deck and played a few more games going 3-3 in matches
I find that I'm having issues with the right mana at the right time. For now I've gone up to 21 mana and that's working but I'm might go back to 20 and try some Evolving Wilds
1-2 Threshhold
I'm finding that any deck that is also looking to beef up creatures is just a race between who can make the biggest creatures fastest and first. There wasn't any issues with my deck here, opponent just got there first 2 out of 3 times
1-0 Burn
I had counters available and he couldn't remove enough creatures or hit me enough times
0-2 burn
between the two games I got 2 counters total even after siding in all my dispel the second game. I just couldn't stop the burn.
1-2 Boggles
Again this was just a race between his/her enchanted boggles and my unblockables and he/she got the damage through first.
1-0 Zombies
opponent played a lot of zombies but had nothing to back them up and I swung through with lots of unblockable damage
So on a lark I built this deck on MTGO for a little over 1 ticket and it's turning out to not be half bad.
The goal is to dump creatures and pump them. Unblockable is an amazing key word in a deck that can easily make a 6/6+ by turn 3!
With a few tweaks and SB I'll probably look to convert this to paper and try it at my LGS
I played three games and won all three:
2-0 vs Infect
I was able to play way more creatures and block the few infect creatures my opponent was able to play and then just pumped for the win both games.
2-1 vs Izzet cyclops/delver
g1 my opponent stalled on mana and I was able to win easily
g2 I was able to knock my opponent down to 8 life but he/she was able to pump a Nivix Cyclops for a one hit kill of I think 24 damage
g3 opponent didnt draw into any creatures and I was able to pump a few unblockables for the win
(A further note, with 20 creatures this deck was amazing vs removal in this match and with vines and pump I never traded unfavorably)
2-0 vs threshhold
both games were a simple race of my unblockables vs their threshhold creatures and I was able to throw up a few blockers in both games to stay ahead in life
None of these were S tier decks but I never felt like I was struggling in any match and most every win was with a comfortable margin. (minus the cyclops, seriously the guy/gal had to play 7 cards in one turn including counters to stop my reply and give double strike, cause I blocked, just to pull out a win)
Deeproot Warrior was the only creature that had no impact. Every time it was played I only used it to block so I'll probably look to replace it with another merfolk with a more useful ability before it dies. Mana Leak functioned fine but I'm curious if a 1cmc card like Dispel or Vapor Snag wouldn't be more useful as keeping open 2 mana when I wanted to pump did cause a few hiccups. (maby these could be SB options to replace Mana Leak in games 2&3)
Lastly the draw is lousy with only Cartouche of Knowledge but I'm not sure what to cut if anything to add more draw. I did find myself top decking a few times but luckily most every draw is useful as long as there's at least 1 creature in play. and the Cartouche's ability to give flying was also useful in providing an extra source of evasion several times and even to block a delver in the second match.
Over all for how little I invested, the deck performed well and was fun to play, I think it needs a few tweeks in the main board and a sideboard and it's a great 2nd or 3rd tier deck that can definitely win.
They would still take 4 dmg for targeting frilled deathspitter twice with the ping so I wouldn't say free, but yea 3 mana for 4 dmg isn't the greatest trade off assuming it get taken out first try. But with 1 pestilence and 1 spitter your opponent now needs to sit above 6 health at all times; certainly reduces the kill clock for control. Also doesn't need the buildup for something like gray merchant of asphodel (of course it also doesn't help the merchant).
I also agree that it looks like it could fit nicely into any number of creature decks
I had think twice in there but switched it for gitaxian probe for something to do on turn 1 or an extra "free" card on turn 3-4. I went over the other flashback cards but I just couldn't figure a way to replace anything that was already in.
The only one I could see dropping is vapor snag for maby a tap effect like feeling of dread but I'm not sure which one has more payoff.
I agree that red, with not only all the sorcery and instants, but also kiln fiend and nivix cyclops is better but its already an archetype (and I've already got that deck sitting around). I'm really trying to get something out of seeker of the way.
Hi all I've been reading on this forum for a few years and finally decided to post a deck idea.
I'm really into white and blue and with several of the cards that are getting downgraded in Iconic Masters I have a 2/3's of the way there idea that I wanted to bounce off anyone willing to take a look.
The idea is to use cards with recursion to keep activating prowess.
I think my interactions with the opponents play/board are kinda weak with just counterspell & vapor snag but I'm not sure what to run or if I should just focus on all in on aggro and forget hindering the opponent.
11 Island
6 Mountain
4 Silverbluff Bridge
Instant / Sorcery [24]
4 Brainstorm
4 Ponder
4 Retraction Helix
1 Banishing Knack
2 Vapor Snag
1 Counterspell
4 Deliberate
4 Fire//Ice
1 Reckless Fireweaver
1 Ornithopter
4 Shield Sphere
2 Mirran Spy
3 Nettle Drone
4 Impact Tremors
Hello, so I'm looking to make this deck as consistent as possible, it's a turn 4 kill if you curve out. You only need 1 U on turn 4 if you have the other combo pieces in play so you can spend up to 3 mana digging turn 4. Most other decks aren't going to kill you turn 4 so you don't usually have to win turn 4 but the less time you give to interact with your board the better.
Here's the main combo:
With either Reckless Fireweaver or Impact Tremors in play cast Banishing Knack or Retraction Helix on Nettle Drone or Mirran Spy, then cast Ornithopter or Shield Sphere. Then tap to return the 0 cost creature to hand and repeat.
Back up combo: This is turn 5 or later assuming you dropped the creatures on turns 3 and 4
With both Nettle Drone and Mirran Spy in plan cast Banishing Knack or Retraction Helix on Mirran Spy. Then ping for 1 with Nettle Drone, cast Ornithopter or Shield Sphere, untapping Nettle Drone, use Mirran Spy to bounce the 0 cost and repeat.
Thoughts on cards not part of the combos:
Vapor Snag Buys time by removing something important off your opponent's board or can get a Shield Sphere back to hand if you need to block with it.
Counterspell I had 1 slot left and it's just a little more interaction.
Fire//Ice Buys time and digs or can act as spot removal.
Everything else is just for digging.
Sideboard:
The deck really doesn't care what your opponent is doing and with the combo basically requiring most of the deck and needing just as much card draw as possible I don't know what I would even SB in. This deck really just wants to buy a few turns and then go off.
In play testing it was fairly resistant to land destruction as you only need 3 mana for 1 turn. Targeted spot removal or forced sacs are rough as you will usually only have 1 creature in play for that 1 turn that you just have to sit through to get past summoning sickness, but this does force your opponent to have removal right then and there as you usually wont drop the 3 cost creature unless you can win the next turn or have decent dig.
Runes of protection, ie Rune of Protection: Red
or Circles of protection, ie Circle of Protection: Red
one offers cycling if its not the right color but the other is 1 colorless for its effect vs W.
I don't know what to put in for finishing once the fort is set up or even if this would work out. I'm feeling like this is just a slower/inefficient fog deck but I can't get the idea to go away.
Curious if anyone has any thoughts on this or another use for Muddle in pauper.
4 Hired Poisoner
4 Pilfering Imp
4 Burglar Rat
4 Dusk Legion Zealot
2 Graveyard Marshal
4 Demon of Catastrophes
Instant
3 Cast Down
1 Murder
2 Duress
4 Vicious Rumors
3 Sovereign's Bite
4 Notion Rain
Land
17 Swamp
4 Island
3 Plague Mare
2 Duress
4 Dire Fleet Poisoner
1 Cast Down
1 Murder
The Sideboard is unfinished as I'm not sure what to add being out of standard for so long. Plague Mare is there to counter token decks, Duress for slower or control decks, Dire Fleet Poisoner for creature heavy decks, and an extra Murder if something Cast Down can't handle becomes a problem.
Also, not sure if I should use Dimir Guildgate instead of Island as the U is only necessary for Notion Rain if I don't get a Demon of Catastrophes by turn 4 or if one dies without a replacement. But the deck also feels like it needs to have all its mana available for the first 4 turns and a guildgate would be a hindrance if that's a land I have to play early.
Lastly I was kicking around the idea of a single Bone Dragon MB as a contingency.
Any an all thought are welcome and please try to keep suggestions down in price as budget is a concern. Thanks!
I updated the deck and played a few more games going 3-3 in matches
I find that I'm having issues with the right mana at the right time. For now I've gone up to 21 mana and that's working but I'm might go back to 20 and try some Evolving Wilds
1-2 Threshhold
I'm finding that any deck that is also looking to beef up creatures is just a race between who can make the biggest creatures fastest and first. There wasn't any issues with my deck here, opponent just got there first 2 out of 3 times
1-0 Burn
I had counters available and he couldn't remove enough creatures or hit me enough times
0-2 burn
between the two games I got 2 counters total even after siding in all my dispel the second game. I just couldn't stop the burn.
1-2 Boggles
Again this was just a race between his/her enchanted boggles and my unblockables and he/she got the damage through first.
1-0 Zombies
opponent played a lot of zombies but had nothing to back them up and I swung through with lots of unblockable damage
2-1 RU tokens using Rites of Initiation
two of three games I was able to counter Rites of Initiation and won
The goal is to dump creatures and pump them. Unblockable is an amazing key word in a deck that can easily make a 6/6+ by turn 3!
With a few tweaks and SB I'll probably look to convert this to paper and try it at my LGS
4 Shaper Apprentice
4 Gaea's Skyfolk
4 Jade Bearer
4 Mist-Cloaked Herald
4 Triton Shorestalker
Instants
3 Spell Pierce
1 Mana Leak
3 Giant Growth
1 Ranger's Guile
4 Vines of Vastwood
4 River Heralds' Boon
3 Perilous Research
8 Forest
9 Island
4 Thornwood Falls
3 Dispel
1 Spell Pierce
2 Mana Leak
3 Aerial Volley
4 Natural State
2 Nihil Spellbomb
I played three games and won all three:
2-0 vs Infect
I was able to play way more creatures and block the few infect creatures my opponent was able to play and then just pumped for the win both games.
2-1 vs Izzet cyclops/delver
g1 my opponent stalled on mana and I was able to win easily
g2 I was able to knock my opponent down to 8 life but he/she was able to pump a Nivix Cyclops for a one hit kill of I think 24 damage
g3 opponent didnt draw into any creatures and I was able to pump a few unblockables for the win
(A further note, with 20 creatures this deck was amazing vs removal in this match and with vines and pump I never traded unfavorably)
2-0 vs threshhold
both games were a simple race of my unblockables vs their threshhold creatures and I was able to throw up a few blockers in both games to stay ahead in life
None of these were S tier decks but I never felt like I was struggling in any match and most every win was with a comfortable margin. (minus the cyclops, seriously the guy/gal had to play 7 cards in one turn including counters to stop my reply and give double strike, cause I blocked, just to pull out a win)
Deeproot Warrior was the only creature that had no impact. Every time it was played I only used it to block so I'll probably look to replace it with another merfolk with a more useful ability before it dies.
Mana Leak functioned fine but I'm curious if a 1cmc card like Dispel or Vapor Snag wouldn't be more useful as keeping open 2 mana when I wanted to pump did cause a few hiccups. (maby these could be SB options to replace Mana Leak in games 2&3)
Lastly the draw is lousy with only Cartouche of Knowledge but I'm not sure what to cut if anything to add more draw. I did find myself top decking a few times but luckily most every draw is useful as long as there's at least 1 creature in play. and the Cartouche's ability to give flying was also useful in providing an extra source of evasion several times and even to block a delver in the second match.
Over all for how little I invested, the deck performed well and was fun to play, I think it needs a few tweeks in the main board and a sideboard and it's a great 2nd or 3rd tier deck that can definitely win.
I also agree that it looks like it could fit nicely into any number of creature decks
Would it be worth splashing for in MBC to ping it with cuombajj witches or Pestilence, or even chump blocking
The only one I could see dropping is vapor snag for maby a tap effect like feeling of dread but I'm not sure which one has more payoff.
I agree that red, with not only all the sorcery and instants, but also kiln fiend and nivix cyclops is better but its already an archetype (and I've already got that deck sitting around). I'm really trying to get something out of seeker of the way.
I cant believe I missed elusive spellfist.
I took out Archaeomancer and the thief and added brainstorm and gitaxian probe.
I also, added a sideboard of general counters/hate, tried to keep it as wide as possible.
I'm really into white and blue and with several of the cards that are getting downgraded in Iconic Masters I have a 2/3's of the way there idea that I wanted to bounce off anyone willing to take a look.
4 seeker of the way
4 spellweaver eternal
4 augur of bolas
4 elusive spellfist
Instant/Sorcery
4 brainstorm
4 emerge unscathed
4 artful maneuver
4 gitaxian probe
4 memory lapse
4 vapor snag
7 plains
9 island
4 tranquil cove
4 negate
3 journey to nowhere
2 relic of progenitus
3 fragmentize
3 lumithread field
The idea is to use cards with recursion to keep activating prowess.
I think my interactions with the opponents play/board are kinda weak with just counterspell & vapor snag but I'm not sure what to run or if I should just focus on all in on aggro and forget hindering the opponent.