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  • posted a message on Abzan Midrange
    Quote from Makuta_Miras »
    I feel like there should be more Walking Ballista here; otherwise the deck will just get run over by Copycat's combo game, despite being able to compete on Copycat's grindy axis.


    Walking Ballista and to a lesser extent Hangarback Walker should be included in the Card Choices. I'll add them.
    Posted in: Proven (Frontier)
  • posted a message on Abzan Midrange
    FRONTIER ABZAN MIDRANGE


    Introduction
    Frontier Abzan is a true midrange deck that relies on the individual power of its cards to win games. While it does have some nuanced interactions among its cards it does not rely on synergy like Hardened Scales or feature a combo finish like Rally or Copycat. While it is not as fast as Atarka Red or as controlling as Grixis, it shines in its versatility and ability to play roles on both sides of the spectrum.

    Pros/Cons of playing Frontier Abzan
    Reasons to play Abzan:
    It is the best true Midrange Deck in Frontier right now. It is always at least "pretty good"
    It can switch between offense and defense quickly
    It has great sideboard options giving it few truly bad or unwinnable matchups
    It is a flexible deck that can be customized to fit your meta with powerful choices in all three colors.

    Reasons not to play Abzan:
    It plays lots of Answers - sometimes can be dead cards depending on the matchup
    It plays grindy games and does not win "out of nowhere".
    If you play Modern Abzan it will feel powered down. There are no real replacements for Thoughtseize, Tarmogoyf, or Liliana of the Veil. The discard game is not on par with the older format making the Frontier version weaker to combo.

    History
    The combination of Green, Black and White has a long history in Magic. Originally the color combination was called Junk by the community, but with the release of Khans of Tarkir Wizards officially gave the color combination the name Abzan, and that is where the history of Frontier Abzan really begins. Not only did we get a name for the color wedge, much to the rejoicing of good-stuff Midrange players (and groaning from everyone else) we got an undercosted efficient creature in Abzan colors that would dominate Standard and have a huge impact on Modern: Siege Rhino.

    While Siege Rhino was the best reason to play Green/White/Black, we also got two other important cards in those colors that further swayed players toward Abzan: Anafenza, the Foremost and Abzan Charm. Abzan became so ubiquitous in that Standard environment that complaints of the Siege Rhino Format and Abzan Fatigue were common talking points. It was so pervasive that when Frontier was created many players dismissed Frontier as a return to a Siege Rhino dominated format (though that is far from the truth). Here is a sample decklist from Khans-BFZ standard that the Frontier version is based upon:

    Since then there have been some powerful additions to the Abzan shell that make the Frontier version even better that are explained in card choices.

    Card Choices
    Creatures:
    1 CMC
    Warden of the First Tree Rate4.5 The only 1 drop creature we would consider playing with our Midrange gameplan. Great mana sink that can take over the game if not dealt with.

    2 CMC
    Sylvan Advocate Rate4 Ability to play defense early aggainst aggro while also pressuring life totals due to Vigilance. We expect to go long to see Advocate become a 4/5 and also helps our manlands. Good late game top deck. Easy on the mana.

    Grim Flayer Rate4 If you care about delirium in general go with this guy. Worse against aggro than Advocate and harder on the mana, but filters your draws if he can get through. The choice between Flayer and Advocate (or both) will be the first choice you make and will influence how you build the rest of the deck.

    Walking Ballista Rate3.5 Listing as a 2 CMC card here (technically 0 CMC) because 2 is the earliest you would cast it. Scales with your mana and is a good way to fight Saheeli Combo.

    Hangarback Walker Rate3 In Standard Abzan lists this was used as a way to get extra value but has mostly been supplanted by Walking Ballista for the XX costing artifact.

    Scrapheap Scrounger Rate2.5 Recurring threat. Great against control, but bad against Aggro. Extra points for being very easy to cast.

    3 CMC
    Anafenza, the Foremost Rate5 Under-costed body with relevant abilities. Staple of Frontier Abzan.

    Tireless Tracker Rate4 Can take over the game with card draw and his ever-increasing size. Run him in builds with lots of fetchlands. Better when played on turn 4 to guarantee a clue token.

    Nissa, Vastwood Seer Rate3.5 Helps to stay on track with land drops to turn Advocate on. Takes over the game late, but can be a little slow.

    Rhonas the Indomitable Rate3 Undercosted, hard to remove threat. He wants more creatures in the deck than we typically run to make sure he turns on. New in Amonkhet but deserves some testing.

    4 CMC
    Siege Rhino Rate5 The reason we play these colors.

    Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet Rate4 Helps turn off the opponent's graveyard alongside Anafenza. The lifelink really helps.

    5 CMC
    Archangel Avacyn Rate3.5 5 cmc is high for this list, so play only 1 if you run her.

    6 CMC
    Tasigur, the Golden Fang Rate4 Efficient body and threat as we are usually casting this for much less than 6.
    Planeswalkers:

    3 CMC
    Liliana, the last Hope Rate4.5 Our queen of grinding. Gets back all of our efficient threats. Best when the opponent is packing X/1s, but her +1 is still good even if it does not kill the opposing creature. Great follow-up to Advocate to ensure he wins in battle.

    Gideon of the Trials Rate3.5 Seems good though untested. 3 CMC walkers have to be considered

    4 cmc
    Gideon, Ally of Zendikar Rate5 Probably the best planeswalker in the format (Saheeli combo notwithstanding) and an auto-inclusion. Run 3 or 4.

    Sorin, Solemn Visitor Rate3.5 Helps with lifegain which our deck needs. Consider as a 1-of

    5 CMC
    Ob Nixilis Reignited Rate3 Great abilities but probably too slow. Consider as a 1-of.

    Liliana, Death's Majesty Rate3 Reanimating a Siege Rhino makes her an enticing choice, but again probably too slow. Little Liliana seems a better choice on our curve.

    Nissa, Vital Force Rate3 Great abilities on a Planeswalker that compliment our gameplan but probably comes down too late. 5 CMC is just hard.
    Instants and Sorceries
    1 CMC
    Fatal Push Rate5 We are a Midrange deck playing black, so we play 4. This does push the manabase to be more fetchland heavy.

    Duress Rate3 Creatures we can typically deal with better than non-creatures, so we run this over Despise. Its restriction mostly relegates it to the sideboard, but it can be considered for mainboard if you correctly predict the Meta.

    2 CMC
    Dromoka's Command Rate5 We take advantage of our large, efficient creatures by pumping them up and fighting with our opponents creatures. Also removes enchantments such as Hardened Scales and Jeskai Ascendancy and counters burn spells. Its utility makes it a definite include.

    Collective Brutality Rate3.5 Utility makes it appealing with the versatility to kill small creatures or cast a pseudo-duress. Now that Fatal Push is in the format it may be outclassed.

    Grasp of Darkness Rate3 Kills most things in the format, gets around indestructible.

    Ultimate Price Rate3 Great rate for a kill spell but its drawback is heavy in a format full of multi-colored creatures

    Declaration in Stone Rate2 Use this as a last resort against a problem card. We do not play a tempo game where we can afford to give cards to our opponent.

    3 CMC
    Abzan Charm Rate4.5 We will typically only use the first two abilities but those are good enough to include the card. Exiling is relevant against a lot of creatures. Run 1 or 2.

    Painful Truths Rate4 The best pure card draw in our colors. I would run this over Read the Bones due to our individual threat quality. Drawing a card is typically better than Scry 2 here.

    Anguished Unmaking Rate3 The lifeloss is substantial, but it is a catch all against everything but lands.

    To the Slaughter Rate2.5 Good option vs Planeswalker decks. In delirium based Abzan with Grim Flayer and Liliana, the Last Hope it will be much easier to turn on.

    4 CMC
    Cast Out Rate3 The flash and cycling make this card very interesting despite its high cost. Cycling can help turn on delirium and flash can help against CopyCat. It is a new card that deserves some testing.

    5 cmc
    Murderous Cut Rate3 I would choose between this and Tasigur to be a 1-of.
    Lands:
    Creating the mana base is difficult in Abzan and is influenced by how you want to build the rest of the deck. With Fatal Push and Tireless tracker in the deck we want to run more fetchlands though we only have one naturally in our colors.

    Windswept Heath Rate5 - Even in builds that choose not to go heavy on Fetches, run 4.

    Canopy Vista / Scattered Groves Rate4 Main Fetchland Targets for Windswept Heath. Each has its pros/cons. I would go with Canopy Vista due to its ability to come into play untapped, but this deck does not run a lot of basics.

    Wooded Foothills Rate4 Our second Fetchland of choice as getting green early is more important than white. Include Smoldering Marsh to fetch black if you run this.

    Blooming Marsh / Concealed Courtyard Rate4.5 Painfree early untapped mana fixing. It feels bad to draw one off the top on turn 4 needing to cast a Rhino, but the color fixing early in the game makes them a necessity.

    Llanowar Wastes / Caves of Koilos Rate3 In general the life loss on these makes the fastlands preferable but they do not have the drawback of coming into play tapped later in the game.

    Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth Rate3.5 Hitting double black is important for Liliana so running 1 is advised.

    Shambling Vent Rate4.5 The deck's manland of choice as lifegain is important especially with Advocate turned on. Hissing Quagmire is also an option but typically go with Vent as lifelink is better than deathtouch here.

    Forest and Plains: There is no need to run Swamps unless you decide to run a black fetchland. There is currently very little non-basic hate in Frontier outside of Thalia, but running a singleton swamp is unlikely to help enough there. She will be a problem.

    Sandsteppe Citadel Rate3 The best color fixer but enters tapped. This is an option if you want to go light on fetchlands.
    Sideboard Options:
    Manglehorn: Artifact destruction
    Hallowed Moonlight: Bring in versus token generators, Collected Company, and Rally the Ancestors
    Flaying Tendrils: Our best sweeper vs Aggro
    Tormod's Crypt: Anti-Graveyard
    Scarab Feast: Anti-graveyard card that cycles
    Duress: Great discard vs heavy non-creature decks such as control, ramp, combo, and mill
    Transgress the Mind: Good vs CopyCat and decks that go big
    Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet: If not used in the main he is good in the side to further help shut down graveyard shenanigans
    Virulent Plague: Permanent answer to token strategies
    Surge of Righteousness: Good against aggressive red decks

    Matchups

    In general Abzan has good matchups against Aggro and other Midrange decks. It is built to out-grind other fair decks.

    Control and Ramp are difficult as their top end threats outsize ours. A resolved Ulamog, the Ceaseless Hunger or Ugin the Spirit Dragon against us is lights out

    Combo can be problematic as discard is not good enough to be included in the main board.

    Sample decklists:

    Decklists vary from build to build as there are a lot of considerations and cards that are borderline between sideboard and main board.

    Current Sample Decklist

    Posted in: Proven (Frontier)
  • posted a message on Explain Frontier To Me
    CopyCat has two main archetypes:
    1. Control (Torrential Gearhulk + DTT) - often adds black for removal / Tasigur
    2. Value (ETB effects) - often adds Green for Oath of Nissa
    They could be put into the same primer for now.

    Of the ones listed I play CopyCat, Abzan, and Esper Dragons

    We would need permissions from a Mod to post those there and probably a justification on why those decks are selected.
    Posted in: Frontier
  • posted a message on Explain Frontier To Me
    It may help if we could get 10 really well written primers in the Proven section of the site to help legitimize it in the eyes of the competitive community.

    I would suggest:
    1. Grixis Control
    2. Esper Dragons
    3. Rally
    4. CopyCat
    5. Abzan Midrange
    6. Bant Company
    7. U/R/x Ensoul
    8. R/x Aggro
    9. G/B/x Scales
    10. Aetherworks Marvel
    Posted in: Frontier
  • posted a message on Is the new set enough to get you to play standard again?
    Yes going to get into Standard.
    Posted in: Magic General
  • posted a message on Story Behind Username?
    Major spoiler and foreshadowing of the return of Venser in a future set.

    Esper undead Venser is coming blinking unblockable zombies and exiling everything.

    Or he's just my favorite card.
    Posted in: Talk and Entertainment
  • posted a message on Amonkhet Impact on Frontier
    Welcome to Frontier! Red is getting a lot of shiny new toys in this set.

    I hope we go back to calling it Red Deck Wins (my favorite deck name ever)

    Posted in: Frontier
  • posted a message on Getting into modern, budget decks..?
    Soul Sisters is one of the cheaper established decks in Modern (~$250) and you can make a decent budget version (~$50).

    Definitely proxy a bunch of decks and play them a lot to find out what you like. What seems great in your mind may not be that great when you are playing with it game after game as your main deck.
    Posted in: Modern
  • posted a message on Amonkhet Impact on Frontier
    Radiant Flames has the upside of being able to deal 1, 2, or 3 damage instead of a fixed 3 which means you can run it alongside your own x/2s and x/3s. I run the sweeper as a sideboard card and in those games I would never want to cycle the card. That said I expect Sweltering Suns to be played more and is a better option for main board.

    Rhonas the Indomitable seems to immediately be a staple creature in the format and the best of the Amonkhet gods. The others are harder to evaluate so I am interested in seeing what brewers are able to come up with there.

    I love the design of Nissa, Steward of Elements. You can play her early as her Scry 2 feeds naturally into her middle ability. Later on she can ultimate immediately for 10 damage. I hope to see her in some kind of UG ramp strategy.
    Posted in: Frontier
  • posted a message on State of Frontier: Bans, format health, and more!
    In a perfect world for me Frontier would stay a non-rotating format that begins with M15 as it is now. A more slowly rotating format doesn't sound appealing to me as I prefer idea of getting excited about little upgrades here and there to the decks I already have built. Standard is enough for me as far as rotating formats go.

    A 'rotation' to me would be to create another new format in another 6 years or so while keeping the other non-rotating formats intact.
    Legacy - starts in 1993
    Modern - 2003
    Frontier - 2014
    "Outback" - 2023

    What I think will happen is Frontier will be effectively replaced and renamed by Wizards in a couple years and start with Origins. I'll miss my fetchland / Khans build but inevitably will move on and enjoy that format too.

    In the meantime I'll push/play this format because I enjoy it.
    Posted in: Frontier
  • posted a message on Kudos
    Thanks! Really enjoying this format right now.

    I think new eternal formats are inevitable and should be embraced. I got into Modern because I loved some of the cards I played in Standard but they were not close to even fringe playable in Legacy - cards like Blade Splicer and Restoration Angel.

    Same thing with Froniter. A lot of the format staples are not close to playable in Modern but I get to use Savage Knuckleblade and Thunderbreak Regent without feeling silly for not playing Tarmogoyf.

    While Frontier in general costs about half of what Modern does the lower cost argument is overblown. The price of Magic is what it is and prices of staples will go uper over time as demand increases.

    I play and enjoy Standard, Frontier, Modern, Legacy, Pauper, Commander because they give me a different but enjoyable experience. The difference with Frontier with me is I was there playing from the beginning so it feels like my format. I hope it lives. The next standard rotation is big for the format - how much will people still want to play with BFZ and a SOI cards?

    Posted in: Frontier
  • posted a message on Amonkhet Impact on Frontier
    What do we think of the new Planeswalkers from Amonkhet?
    Gideon of the Trials
    Liliana, Death's Majesty

    I found an article ranking the Frontier-legal planeswalkers: https://thejapanhobbyist.com/2016/10/28/a-new-frontier-power-rankings-planeswalkers/
    Ironically enough the two highest rated are Gideon, Ally of Zendikar and Liliana, the Last Hope and the earlier (better?) versions may be what keep the Amonkhet versions from seeing more play.

    New Gideon - As a three mana walker I would be shocked if he didn't fit somewhere. In Midrange / Aggro he is an indestructible 4/4 beater and in Control he blanks your best creature forcing you to over-commit into a sweeper. His emblem seems least likely to be used but can be a nice roadblock in some matches. I would love to see someone live the dream and use every version of Gideon possible in the same deck.

    New Liliana - Personally I am in love with the card and have to play her somewhere but objectively I think she will have a tough time. Is she a mid-range value walker (Abzan) where you make value plays getting Siege Rhino and company back? This might be where Liliana, the Last Hope outshines her.
    Or is she part of a dedicated reanimator deck where you try to cheat out discarded fatties? Right now Marvel does the same thing and still lets you use cast triggers - which are important to the top end creatures. Maybe there is deck out there that wants to do both.
    Posted in: Frontier
  • posted a message on Mardu Dragons
    I do love Mardu Dragons as a deck that always gives me trouble.

    As someone who also plays a Dragon list, I originally played Draconic Roar out of habit. After it failed me one too many times I replaced it with Lightning Strike and have never looked back. The consistency of doing what you want when you want it to beats out the upside of Roar.

    Not sold on Mardu Charm but modal spells can be very good if you use them right. Personally I'd go with hard removal like Murderous Cut, Murder, or Unlicensed Disintegration.
    Posted in: Deck Creation (Frontier)
  • posted a message on Amonkhet Impact on Frontier
    Looks like a huge impact on the mana-bases for Frontier - fetchable dual cycle-lands

    Posted in: Frontier
  • posted a message on Amonkhet Impact on Frontier

    Quote from Makuta_Miras »
    Glorybringer should be a planeswalker murderer, although tapping out for it when Saheeli is in the format is a bad idea.


    Glorybringer seems decent against CopyCat as it potentially kills both halves - Saheeli with 4 attack power in the air and Felidar Guardian with exert.

    Quote from Baorap »
    Aven Mindcensor could be the base of a new Hatebears deck in Frontier.


    We do have the new Thalia to pair with it as well. Other than fetchlands I can't think of another prominent strategy it hoses though. Chord of Calling hasn't taken off yet.
    Posted in: Frontier
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