Night Terrors is super tech! I love it.. I hadn't realized that the card gets exiled.. I might need to work that into my build instead of Distress..
I really like your setup. It's a bit more aggro with the Nobles and the burn. How has Chandra been? That's one card that I really wanted to use but I don't have any yet so I've only tested online (which I don't consider reliable, really..)
that's a bit much no matter what deck you'll face. RDW and the like have hero, so he'll be a worse blocker, and other options exist at 4-drop even for aggro. we have peace strider who can actually block vs hero, skinrender for black. I'd never place a 3-of creature at any spot in my deck aside from birds and emissary, even after sideboard.
You realize we're talking about siding out the birthing pods right? please pay attention before criticizing..
If he's going to side out the pods against RDW/Wolf Run, and then only side in a bunch of singleton creatures, how is he supposed to get one in play during the first 6 turns (i.e. before he dies)??
Peace Strider dies to the artifact removal they just sided in. It's mediocre at best. It creates a cute combo with Razor Hippogriff, but that doesn't make the card truly useful..especially against something like Mono red where they're going to be extremely fast.
I would take out sylvok replica as well, for that match-up. I have no idea what your sb is like so IDK what to suggest for a replacement though.. Maybe another Thrun?
RDW's such a bad match-up for us. I made the MD less friendly toward aggro, but, if they draw a Hero of Oxid Ridge, it's still usually a blow out. The version that runs G for Wolf Run and Grudge is even rougher.
Here's what I plan to try out to make that match-up a little better:
It's heavy GW with a small splash of B for Glissa and Unburial Rights. The heavy W and B commitment in my last version rarely caused mana problems, but against agressive beats I can't really afford to ever have mana problems.
Here's the reasoning for why I went with what I did:
6 Dorks: They're acceleration and mana fixing. Either allows a T2 Blade Splicer against aggro or T2 Birthing Pod against control. 4 Viridian Emissary: I think they're okay at best against everything else, but against aggro they shine, so in go four. 2 Perilous Myr: 2-for-1 against aggro. 2 Spellskite: I like them in every matchup. 3 Blade Splicer: Good against everything. 1 Glissa: Too good to drop. 1 Sylvok Replica: One of the few Silver Bullets I kept. It's all-around usefulness + synergy with Glissa and Sun Titan were enough to warrant it's inclusion. 3 Solemn Simulacrum: This was almost always my go-to Pod target anyway, so I upped their numbers to rely less on Pod. 1 Thrun: Good against everything. Excellent one-of. 2 Slime, 2 Archon: The Slime has an excellent comes-into-play ability and the Archon is a fairly fat-butted flier (the only one in the deck) that axes something to leave on it's way out. Two of each looks right. 1 Sun Titan: Gets stuff back, so I left him in. 3 Wurmcoil Engine: My go-to six drop. This guy's pretty amazing against everything so I made drawing one 300% as likely.
The SB is up in the air at the moment... I'm pretty sure I want 2 Myr, 1 Splicer, 2 Mimic Vat, and Elesh, but that's about all I know for sure.
Thoughts or suggestions?
If 3-color pod is going to be good, it would probably look something like this.
I like your list a lot. I too had problems when running solid 3 colors, so I tried splashing white in B/G pod and it was still too inconsistent.. but yours looks great.
Would you run Elesh Norn in the sideboard?
Vs. RDW and Wolf Run - In my aggro-pod build I've been working on, I actually have a better match-up against them than I do Solar Flare (but I'm still about 50/50 against flare, post board). But I have maindeck 4x Emissary, x3 Spellskite, and 3x Perilous Myr. That's some pretty serious RDW hate.. and it definitely helps. And when I match against any deck running both green and red, I side out all my pods for more burn, making their ancient grudges pretty much dead cards (except for my spellskites)
I see where you're coming from, but the ramp is so important for us. It is a little costly for what it does, but we don't get that effect from anything else. It's the price we pay for playing MBC.. Back in the original Mirrodin standard they all ran Solemn in MBC, and I think we should now too. It gives black ramp, which it usually never has, a blocker, and a cantrip. Very useful..
I'm not sold. It's too slow for what it does imho. It also qualifies as a card that is only good with a Pod in play. Honestly, other than Slime I'm not really sold on any other 5 drops : /
Is Brimstone Volley only good with Pod in play? I don't think so.
Morkrut Banshee might be more difficult to utilize without a sac outlet, but that doesn't mean the card is only good if you already have a pod in play.
I'm not gonna get myself too deep into this though, as I firmly refuse to support toolbox pod anymore, and the Banshee is definitely a toolbox-pod type of card.
if you're playing black there's no reason you can't fit in Morkrut Banshee.. it's soooo good
having clone effects isn't going to win games if you can't draw what you need though. Toolbox pod just seems too slow for this format. So much can happen in the first four turns and it's likely that you wouldn't even have played anything yet by that point (maybe a BOP) if you're playing the toolbox version. Pod needs to be a supporting engine to some kind of combo. Not necessarily a win-that-turn sort of combo, but it must only help along your already efficient deck, not be the card that gets the deck running.
BW gives them a 3/3 token, O-Ring potentially gives them the permanent back, and can't hit lands, and isn't instant speed. Also O-Ring blows at removing stuff with ETB abilities like Titans or Solemn Simulacrum.
O-Ring > BW - as long as you're piloting a deck that can handle a little aggro, and you're not playing against an insanely fast aggro deck (such as TS or RDW)
I'm not saying O-Ring is bad, rather that Beast Within is probably better in Birthing Pod..but honestly if you're in both colors there's no reason not to run both.
I recently added 2 Buried Ruin to my build in place of 2 swamps, but haven't tested it out yet. I trust that it should definitely increase my win percentage.
I haven't really considered using any planeswalkers, only because there are other clutch cards that I would rather dedicate deck slots to that I don't even have room for yet.. Mainly a single Lashwrithe and a single Consume Spirit. The Lashwrithe would go well with the artifact theme (especially with Buried Ruin) but also consume spirit could be used as a late game fireball to simply just end it right there.
Although Sorin might prove useful in ways those cards fall short. I just need to playtest more and figure out exactly what my weaknesses are.
Entomber exarch costs too much for it's effect (IMO) so I haven't considered trying it. I ran it B/G pod because it's easy to cheat out, but it doesn't belong here (again, IMO)
I wouldn't play the deck without 4 Spellskites, and maybe the reason you're always holding Altar's Reap with no creatures is because you need more Spellskites? Spellskite protects your fatties from removal and it protects you from aggro. It's an amazingly defensive card, and the fact that you can steal removal, and then sac the skite to draw cards is just great. The skite+AR combo is especially useful against Oblivion Ring and Fiend Hunter.
Is anyone actually having any success with toolbox pod??
And by success, I don't mean you enjoy playing the deck.. but rather actually have a 50/50 or better match-up against RDW, Flare, Humans, etc
In all the variations of toolbox pod I tried, the result is always just inconsistency. If we're really going to evolve Birthing Pod as a deck we need to look into more consistent options. Two colors, with maybe a small splash of a third, might be viable. But IMHO we're going to have to start focusing on just solid 2-color builds. G/B and G/W are the obvious 3-color choices (splashing the third color for unburial rites) but I think going completely 2-color would be best with G/W or G/R
It's a much more situational card, with all the aggro around. But it's still important to get rid of swords, planeswalkers, etc.. But possibly most importantly to remove Kessig Wolf Run.
I still love the card, but have bumped my maindeck slots down to 1 from my original 3.
Though this is not the pod thread, I think it's possible that pod can be used in a way similar to Sontag's GSZ, but pod allows us to run more red. Also, we can really abuse Chandra's Phoenix. Cards like Spellskite and Perilous Myr help against RDW
why would you run RSZ over Devil's Play? Devil's Play seems better in most circumstances. (not going to say strictly, but definitely 'commonly' better.
The exile effect is key here. In my build specifically, I'm also very light on red cards and red mana sources, so it's unlikely I'll ever use the flashback of Devil's Play.
As an aside, this thread is likely to be closed and merged with the other (main/longer) jund thread, so be aware of that. (it happened to several others of us in the Jund thread). You might want to try to get ahead of that and just post there. (http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=358056)
If you actually read that thread you would notice that not only have I posted in that thread, but my first post (on the first page, no less) mentions that I started another thread by mistake, and that it can be closed by a mod. And I linked my OP from this thread into the more appropriate thread.
Also: Altar's Reap is super conditional and it's very likely not where you want to be unless you have a significant token generation / morbid theme. (more than just solemn + emissary)
The deck doesn't need to be built around AR for it to be useful. In my experience it's never been a dead card. It's great to protect your Wurmcoil from Oblivion Ring, or other exile effects.
I originally ran Alchemy but every time I casted it I was always hoping for a counter, so instead I just replaced them with more counters. Dissipation Field is more useful here because it continually slows down opposing creatures, whereas DOJ only clears the field once. Also I have a couple DOJ in here already..
The only reason I don't use the O-Ring is because of the manabase. I like Beast Within better anyway..as the 3/3 is rarely a problem. And the fact that it can hit lands is very important as well, since this deck has some amazing LD potential with the addition of Unburial Rites
The Revoker may be coming out for another Spellskite, but currently I always find something useful for the Revoker. I only side it out against control deck with no swords and no planeswalkers. I take the LD/mana denial route often with this build, and I'll even drop the Revoker naming BOP if they play one
I guess the main reason I want the bounce is because its reusable, and the fact that you aren't required to have the spell in your hand + mana open when they cast the creature. Both Grasp of Phantoms and Silent Departure have flashback, and I can even return them with Runic Repetition later. Although I'll probably use Visions of Beyond instead of Think Twice..yeah definitely.
I really like your setup. It's a bit more aggro with the Nobles and the burn. How has Chandra been? That's one card that I really wanted to use but I don't have any yet so I've only tested online (which I don't consider reliable, really..)
You realize we're talking about siding out the birthing pods right? please pay attention before criticizing..
If he's going to side out the pods against RDW/Wolf Run, and then only side in a bunch of singleton creatures, how is he supposed to get one in play during the first 6 turns (i.e. before he dies)??
Peace Strider dies to the artifact removal they just sided in. It's mediocre at best. It creates a cute combo with Razor Hippogriff, but that doesn't make the card truly useful..especially against something like Mono red where they're going to be extremely fast.
3 Tree of Redemption sounds solid.
If 3-color pod is going to be good, it would probably look something like this.
I like your list a lot. I too had problems when running solid 3 colors, so I tried splashing white in B/G pod and it was still too inconsistent.. but yours looks great.
Would you run Elesh Norn in the sideboard?
Vs. RDW and Wolf Run - In my aggro-pod build I've been working on, I actually have a better match-up against them than I do Solar Flare (but I'm still about 50/50 against flare, post board). But I have maindeck 4x Emissary, x3 Spellskite, and 3x Perilous Myr. That's some pretty serious RDW hate.. and it definitely helps. And when I match against any deck running both green and red, I side out all my pods for more burn, making their ancient grudges pretty much dead cards (except for my spellskites)
Is Brimstone Volley only good with Pod in play? I don't think so.
Morkrut Banshee might be more difficult to utilize without a sac outlet, but that doesn't mean the card is only good if you already have a pod in play.
I'm not gonna get myself too deep into this though, as I firmly refuse to support toolbox pod anymore, and the Banshee is definitely a toolbox-pod type of card.
having clone effects isn't going to win games if you can't draw what you need though. Toolbox pod just seems too slow for this format. So much can happen in the first four turns and it's likely that you wouldn't even have played anything yet by that point (maybe a BOP) if you're playing the toolbox version. Pod needs to be a supporting engine to some kind of combo. Not necessarily a win-that-turn sort of combo, but it must only help along your already efficient deck, not be the card that gets the deck running.
O-Ring > BW - as long as you're piloting a deck that can handle a little aggro, and you're not playing against an insanely fast aggro deck (such as TS or RDW)
I'm not saying O-Ring is bad, rather that Beast Within is probably better in Birthing Pod..but honestly if you're in both colors there's no reason not to run both.
I haven't really considered using any planeswalkers, only because there are other clutch cards that I would rather dedicate deck slots to that I don't even have room for yet.. Mainly a single Lashwrithe and a single Consume Spirit. The Lashwrithe would go well with the artifact theme (especially with Buried Ruin) but also consume spirit could be used as a late game fireball to simply just end it right there.
Although Sorin might prove useful in ways those cards fall short. I just need to playtest more and figure out exactly what my weaknesses are.
I wouldn't play the deck without 4 Spellskites, and maybe the reason you're always holding Altar's Reap with no creatures is because you need more Spellskites? Spellskite protects your fatties from removal and it protects you from aggro. It's an amazingly defensive card, and the fact that you can steal removal, and then sac the skite to draw cards is just great. The skite+AR combo is especially useful against Oblivion Ring and Fiend Hunter.
And by success, I don't mean you enjoy playing the deck.. but rather actually have a 50/50 or better match-up against RDW, Flare, Humans, etc
In all the variations of toolbox pod I tried, the result is always just inconsistency. If we're really going to evolve Birthing Pod as a deck we need to look into more consistent options. Two colors, with maybe a small splash of a third, might be viable. But IMHO we're going to have to start focusing on just solid 2-color builds. G/B and G/W are the obvious 3-color choices (splashing the third color for unburial rites) but I think going completely 2-color would be best with G/W or G/R
I still love the card, but have bumped my maindeck slots down to 1 from my original 3.
3 Birds of Paradise
4 Viridian Emissary
3 Spellskite
4 Chandra's Phoenix
3 Thrun, the Last Troll
2 Hero of Oxid Ridge
2 Acidic Slime
2 Inferno Titan
Artifacts:
4 Birthing Pod
3 Brimstone Volley
1 Dismember
Sorceries:
3 Arc Trail
2 Red Sun's Zenith
Lands:
4 Copperline Gorge
4 Rootbound Crag
2 Kessig Wolf Run
1 Buried Ruin
7 Forest
6 Mountain
4 Autumn's Veil
3 Naturalize
3 Ancient Grudge
4 Slagstorm
1 Hero of Oxid Ridge
What do you guys think?
The exile effect is key here. In my build specifically, I'm also very light on red cards and red mana sources, so it's unlikely I'll ever use the flashback of Devil's Play.
If you actually read that thread you would notice that not only have I posted in that thread, but my first post (on the first page, no less) mentions that I started another thread by mistake, and that it can be closed by a mod. And I linked my OP from this thread into the more appropriate thread.
The deck doesn't need to be built around AR for it to be useful. In my experience it's never been a dead card. It's great to protect your Wurmcoil from Oblivion Ring, or other exile effects.
I didn't use bb code, I just used the bold button. But I guess that was my mistake, wasn't it..