So, I have been brewing the new version of my deck. Speed is the name of the game. The deck has a lot of haste to keep the pressure going throughout the match. I could use some CC and I will try and update as I test more.
The deck is very creature heavy. Channeler initiate is a great mana dork and synergizes with crocodile of the crossing. Voltaic Brawler provides energy for lathnu hellion and can trample over. Lathnu Hellion I think gets better here as he does turn on rhonas the indomitable and a 4/4 for 3 is not bad. He does get chump blocked yes, but rhonas can give trample so I feel that will help his playability. Glorybringer and chandra, torch of defiance are your win cons. Glorybringer so far has been amazing, especially if he comes down turn 4. Heart of kiran is still great and helps rhonas. The tireless tracker as a 1 of is a flex spot and I am not sure what could go here. Maybe rhonas # 3 when I get one. Overall a pretty straightforward aggro/midrange deck. Sideboard is a work in progress. I am also not great at building manabases, but 20 lands feels fine with all the other ways I can get mana in the deck.
The deck is a basic looking jund energy list, I know. I think blossoming defense is at least a 1 of in the deck. With so much removal out there this could turn the tide in your favor. Your opponent will then have to play around it, not knowing how many you have. Arlinn I see some potential in. She provides tokens, anthems, and removal in the same package. With a removal heavy meta, again I think she can shine. She will be one of my test cards and hopefully secret weapons. The removal package is pretty standard. I did not try and go for a token theme, hence no rishkar. Gearhulk is just too solid not to include. The deck will win through evasion (heart+SS) solid creatures, with chandra + arlinn as backup win cons. The mana base may not be perfect yet, but looks ok on the outset. I do feel 20 lands is good enough with 4 attunes.
My sideboard is geared toward my meta. So far I know there are at least 3 G/B players (various deck types), 1 mardu, 1 bant control (3 MD fumigates....), 1 bring to light control (hate this deck gains so much life...) and various rogue builds to contend with. I am not sure why I do not see heroic intervention in more sideboards. The card seems crazy good as boardwipes are one of this decks weaknesses.
I will report back after the weekend with more testing. Any CC welcome!
Hey guys been trying out variations of this deck for awhile now. Is adding black or blue our best option? Is snake just too potent not to run? I have been struggling with my builds. I still do well, but I want to try and be more competitive.
My meta has several B/G, and vehicles, but also some great rogue builds including bring to light control, which I struggle immensely with. How do we beat B/G variations consistently with devolving into the same deck minus a few cards?
I have been trying some U/B control. I have no Kalita's though. Any recommendations? Is lily not good right now? I managed to get a few in some great trades and have them in place of the kalitas I see in a lot of deck lists.
I really like that list. Fleetwheel Cruiser surprises me though. I would have expected the 3/5 flyer over that.
Google car has haste and is more of a 5 mana potential recurring burn spell. That is how I see it anyway and trample is the big reason to play it. I have been using a pair for awhile in my G/R variants with great success. It replaced lathnu hellions in my deck.
Juza's deck is very similar to one I am tuning up so nice to see him in the top 8 to break up the mardu frenzy. I hope he wins. Definitely want to see what he sideboards and how. Since I don't own hearts I am using a few aethersphere harvesters.
There are GREAT answers to Vehicles and Artifacts in Standard at the moment. What there are not, however, are good answers to Scrapheap Scrounger (on top of my head, only Declaration In Stone, Stasis Snare, Incendiary Flow and Natural Obsolescence can deal with it). More than any vehicles, that is the card that is pushing Mardu at the front and keeping Control down. It is incredibly cheap for what it does, and doesn't require a heavy color investment. Compare it to its previous version: Despoiler of Souls!
Blue also has the counter spells that exile creatures in void shatter, spell shrivel, and horribly awry, otherwise, I agree scrounger is very good. Maybe he will be one of the next banned cards? I mean if 3/4 of the PT finals is the same deck expect it to get hit hard with the ban hammer imo, at least that is what I get out of what wizards is trying to do now?
It is kind of sad to see so little deck diversity. There was some. I am hoping to see some of the U/B control deck lists. I really thought G/R stood a decent chance. I guess no one wanted to play it.
Interesting decklist Lugger. This looks very close to one of my drafts except for the skyship stalker. Never really considered him. No harnessed lightning either? Care to go over the deck a bit, also what would be your take on a bushwhacker based deck? I could use some of the more veteran deckbuilder's on this forums advice. I am thinking of starting with something like this:
I am still getting cards and tweaking my G/R build. I am debating on trying a fast G/R as I think reckless bushwhacker is a viable option right now. There are plenty of nice 1 drops we can use to curve out nicely. Kari Zev's expertise is another interesting card. Stealing a blocker, playing a free 2 or less spell (more removal or creature) could help you swing lethal turn 4-5 very well. A turn 3 bushwhacker/rampager would be one of the best case scenarios.
White is indeed a powerful color...if you can afford $120 for a playset of Gideons and $25 per Avacyn etc.. I got lucky and picked up chandra, torch of defiance's in pack openings and some trades. I see red as a no brainer just for her. She is so powerful and has won me many games. With smuggler's copter gone she can shine even more, not to mention brawler, shocks, harnessed lightning, and some of the other new toys in red. I think for an energy build G/R (or G/Rx) is the stronger color combo.
I can't wait top start brewing with the new editions. There will be a lot more removal though so that will be hard for us. Looks like 4 toughness is where we want to be. Blossoming defense will be important as ever and the new heroic intervention will be MB by me as least as a 1 of with more in the SB.
Some more cards to consider might be: Narnam renegade for a nice 1 drop with deathtouch. Would work with nature's way too right? Natural obsolescence will also be a good way to deal with problem vehicles and other artifacts, especially the ones enchanted to be creatures. That will be a nice 2 for 1. Hope of Ghirapur is a great anti-control card for the SB. Shock is reprinted as well, which could help us close out the game quicker.
Overall the deck gained some nice pieces for all of its versions.
Hi,
- Harnessed Lightning seems pretty useless, only Kalitas, Gisela and Eldrazi Displacer seem to be worthwhile targets in the format
- Chandra is hard to cast, low impact and BG players are so scared of Hydra that they board in Transgress anyway
- as expected, many decks just lose to Pummeler
- Key to the City destroys BG
- UW is a fairly good matchup unless they have Gisela when it is unwinnable
- Marvel is a race, but it is easy to win
- Vehicles and other Copter aggro decks can win on play, but on draw if you kill Copter, they have nothing
So after these conclusions, I got rid of Harnessed Lightnings and I have two keys instead, plus random Uncaged Fury and the +2/+1 Trample instant. In sb, I have dropped Chandras and I am trying out Negates/rebuffs.
Your ideas opinions?
Harnessed lightning, in my limited experience, has been invaluable to me. The card is an auto 4x of in pretty much any deck that runs red I would imagine for a reason, especially with energy ramp. I have killed everything with it (including an 8/8 dragon in a fun game) and has many targets, like any creature in your way (especially quellers... hate him) I have also won a game by just using the card to bank energy saving my hydra from dying so it has other uses other than just killing. I have had pretty much no issues with my mana base so chandra has been a breeze to cast for me and has won me so many games. She is an auto include imo.
So I won standard showdown tonight (3-0) I stuck with my midrange build and made a few tweaks:
Notes:
My new includes this week(pia, vhulk, hotwheels, nissa, key) all did pretty well. Hotwheels is replacing lathnu hellion for me now. Has trample, resilient to sorcery speed removal, and no further energy investment are all pluses. Pia as a 1 of seems ok. the free flying thopter did some damage. Her firebreathing I never used, but works well with gearhulks and hotwheels. Nissa did work, especially vs control. I am not sure she is a MB card, though. Negate won me the match vs UW flash so those will stay. Key to the city performed well and won me a game, I like the 2x include here. Not sure about Botanical sanctum. I think the 1x island is good enough with our other mana sources. I am on the fence with brawler too. He was lack luster this time around.
Some very nice posts in the thread. Thanks Lugger for your insight. I know G/R is not tier 1, but it can be fun especially since my LGS there are not a lot of net deckers and people run rogue decks mostly.
The decks seems interesting and, with some tweaking, could be even better.
Being to deal 8 damage with a glorybringer or 10 with a rhonas could give an unexpected victory.
4x channeler initiate
4x voltaic brawler
4x lathnu hellion
4x crocodile of the crossing
4x glorybringer
2x rhonas the indomitable
1x tireless tracker
4x harnessed lightning
2x chandra, torch of defiance
3x heart of kiran
4x game trail
4x aether hub
2x cinder glade
2x sheltered thicket
4x forest
4x mountain
The deck is very creature heavy. Channeler initiate is a great mana dork and synergizes with crocodile of the crossing.
Voltaic Brawler provides energy for lathnu hellion and can trample over. Lathnu Hellion I think gets better here as he does turn on rhonas the indomitable and a 4/4 for 3 is not bad. He does get chump blocked yes, but rhonas can give trample so I feel that will help his playability. Glorybringer and chandra, torch of defiance are your win cons. Glorybringer so far has been amazing, especially if he comes down turn 4. Heart of kiran is still great and helps rhonas. The tireless tracker as a 1 of is a flex spot and I am not sure what could go here. Maybe rhonas # 3 when I get one. Overall a pretty straightforward aggro/midrange deck. Sideboard is a work in progress. I am also not great at building manabases, but 20 lands feels fine with all the other ways I can get mana in the deck.
Any advice is welcome.
4 greenbelt rampager
4 voltaic brawler
4 longtusk cub
3 scrapheap scrounger
2 tireless tracker
2 verdurous gearhulk
sorcery/instants
4 attune with aether
4 unlicensed disintegration
2 harnessed lightning
2 fatal push
1 blossoming defense
2 chandra, torch of defiance
2 arlinn kord
3 heart of kiran
1 skysovereign, consul flagship
Land
4 forest
2 mountain
1 swamp
1 smoldering marsh
4 aether hub
4 blooming marsh
4 game trail
1 blossoming defense
1 natural state
1 release the gremlins
2 heroic intervention
1 chandra, torch of defiance
2 harnessed lightning
2 fatal push
2 tireless tracker
2 verdurous gearhulk
1 scrapheap scrounger
The deck is a basic looking jund energy list, I know. I think blossoming defense is at least a 1 of in the deck. With so much removal out there this could turn the tide in your favor. Your opponent will then have to play around it, not knowing how many you have. Arlinn I see some potential in. She provides tokens, anthems, and removal in the same package. With a removal heavy meta, again I think she can shine. She will be one of my test cards and hopefully secret weapons. The removal package is pretty standard. I did not try and go for a token theme, hence no rishkar. Gearhulk is just too solid not to include. The deck will win through evasion (heart+SS) solid creatures, with chandra + arlinn as backup win cons. The mana base may not be perfect yet, but looks ok on the outset. I do feel 20 lands is good enough with 4 attunes.
My sideboard is geared toward my meta. So far I know there are at least 3 G/B players (various deck types), 1 mardu, 1 bant control (3 MD fumigates....), 1 bring to light control (hate this deck gains so much life...) and various rogue builds to contend with. I am not sure why I do not see heroic intervention in more sideboards. The card seems crazy good as boardwipes are one of this decks weaknesses.
I will report back after the weekend with more testing. Any CC welcome!
My meta has several B/G, and vehicles, but also some great rogue builds including bring to light control, which I struggle immensely with. How do we beat B/G variations consistently with devolving into the same deck minus a few cards?
I could use a little help from some veterans.
Google car has haste and is more of a 5 mana potential recurring burn spell. That is how I see it anyway and trample is the big reason to play it. I have been using a pair for awhile in my G/R variants with great success. It replaced lathnu hellions in my deck.
Juza's deck is very similar to one I am tuning up so nice to see him in the top 8 to break up the mardu frenzy. I hope he wins. Definitely want to see what he sideboards and how. Since I don't own hearts I am using a few aethersphere harvesters.
Blue also has the counter spells that exile creatures in void shatter, spell shrivel, and horribly awry, otherwise, I agree scrounger is very good. Maybe he will be one of the next banned cards? I mean if 3/4 of the PT finals is the same deck expect it to get hit hard with the ban hammer imo, at least that is what I get out of what wizards is trying to do now?
It is kind of sad to see so little deck diversity. There was some. I am hoping to see some of the U/B control deck lists. I really thought G/R stood a decent chance. I guess no one wanted to play it.
Interesting decklist Lugger. This looks very close to one of my drafts except for the skyship stalker. Never really considered him. No harnessed lightning either? Care to go over the deck a bit, also what would be your take on a bushwhacker based deck? I could use some of the more veteran deckbuilder's on this forums advice. I am thinking of starting with something like this:
4 narnam renegade
4 greenbelt rampager
4 voltaic brawler
4 longtusk cub
4 reckless bushwhacker
3 rishkar, peema renegade
4 lathnu hellion
4 fleetwheel cruiser
Obviously I will have to cut some creatures and tweak numbers.
White is indeed a powerful color...if you can afford $120 for a playset of Gideons and $25 per Avacyn etc.. I got lucky and picked up chandra, torch of defiance's in pack openings and some trades. I see red as a no brainer just for her. She is so powerful and has won me many games. With smuggler's copter gone she can shine even more, not to mention brawler, shocks, harnessed lightning, and some of the other new toys in red. I think for an energy build G/R (or G/Rx) is the stronger color combo.
Some more cards to consider might be:
Narnam renegade for a nice 1 drop with deathtouch. Would work with nature's way too right?
Natural obsolescence will also be a good way to deal with problem vehicles and other artifacts, especially the ones enchanted to be creatures. That will be a nice 2 for 1.
Hope of Ghirapur is a great anti-control card for the SB.
Shock is reprinted as well, which could help us close out the game quicker.
Overall the deck gained some nice pieces for all of its versions.
Harnessed lightning, in my limited experience, has been invaluable to me. The card is an auto 4x of in pretty much any deck that runs red I would imagine for a reason, especially with energy ramp. I have killed everything with it (including an 8/8 dragon in a fun game) and has many targets, like any creature in your way (especially quellers... hate him) I have also won a game by just using the card to bank energy saving my hydra from dying so it has other uses other than just killing. I have had pretty much no issues with my mana base so chandra has been a breeze to cast for me and has won me so many games. She is an auto include imo.
So I won standard showdown tonight (3-0) I stuck with my midrange build and made a few tweaks:
4 aether hub
4 game trail
2 cinder glade
1 botanical sanctum
1 hanweir battlements
1 island
3 mountain
5 forest
Creaures:
4 longtusk cub
4 servant of the conduit
3 voltaic brawler
1 pia nalaar
4 tireless tracker
4 bristling hydra
2 verdurous gearhulk
4 attune with aether
4 harnessed lightning
2 blossoming defense
Other:
2 key to the city
2 fleetwheel cruiser
2 chandra, torch of defiance
1 nissa, vital force
4 negate
2 blossoming defence
3 root out
4 weaver of lightning
2 plummet
Notes:
My new includes this week(pia, vhulk, hotwheels, nissa, key) all did pretty well. Hotwheels is replacing lathnu hellion for me now. Has trample, resilient to sorcery speed removal, and no further energy investment are all pluses. Pia as a 1 of seems ok. the free flying thopter did some damage. Her firebreathing I never used, but works well with gearhulks and hotwheels. Nissa did work, especially vs control. I am not sure she is a MB card, though. Negate won me the match vs UW flash so those will stay. Key to the city performed well and won me a game, I like the 2x include here. Not sure about Botanical sanctum. I think the 1x island is good enough with our other mana sources. I am on the fence with brawler too. He was lack luster this time around.
Any questions, thoughts or advice welcome.
If going low and fast (I will try this, this weekend) What about reckless bushwhacker with a fleetwheel cruiser finisher?
How would you sideboard this glass cannon aggro? Various removal and maybe chandra, torch of defiance?
Maybe something like:
4 inventor's apprentice
4 smuggler's copter
4 longtusk cub
3 reckless bushwhacker
1 pia nalaar
4 bristling hydra
4 fiery temper
2 key to the city
2 fleetwheel cruiser
as a start point?
Good start:
t1- bomat or apprentice 1dmg (if bomat)
t2- copter 1 dmg from bomat or 2 from apprentice
t3- apprentice + bushwhacker 10 dmg (4 from copter, 3 appren, 3 bush, bomat or apprentice pilots)
t4- cruiser 5 + 3 copter _ whatever else = 8+ total
So we can get a turn 4 win, theoretically.