There is nothing wrong with simply throwing up a request for some type of cards on the forum, because at the end of the day the syntax for wording on Magic cards changes over the years, so it's incredibly difficult to find what you are looking for even with knowing how to use the gatherer search perfectly.
I guess I'm being protective here of the original poster, because I just use the Ruling forum for all my questions. Sure I could do some sort of searching on the rules PDF, but it's just easier to fire off a question on the forums, and people are more than happy to help out.
And they are not specifically saying they simply don't know how to use gatherer, they are saying "to search for such specific cards", which is completely true, as even I'm finding it difficult to know exactly "what keywords to search" for this particular query they have. I think this is what the user is saying.
You can have two cards that do exactly the same thing in Magic, but the wording is different and so you end up missing it in your searches because you've been lead to try and search for some keywords that you think are the only ones that are going to find it.
On the original question, the only enchantment I could find was Quest for Ancient Secrets, but you have to have other things to get infinite going, i.e. milling yourself for 5 each turn and needing to Zur search twice for both the Second Chance and Quest for Ancient Secrets.
Thanks Darren. QAS is a bit problematic. I have to get the five counters and then that enchantment is one more permanent I need to tutor up with Zur. But thank you for your effort.
I think you should ignore the above poster. Even if you figure out how to use gatherer, doesn't mean you want to go through hundreds of enchantments only to not find anything.
I have seen enough Zur decks to know that there are no enchantments with CMC 3 or less that can tutor creatures, and none that can tutor a CMC 2 artifact. There is one enchantment that is like a blue survival of the fittest for artifacts with CMC 1.
I think there are two ways to dig for your combos.
1. Get some good life gain enchantments. This will let you dig more with Necropotence. Peace of Mind, for example, can work well.
2. Get some self mill effects... Fraying Sanity? Mill Sun Titan and reanimate with Animate Dead.
I love your idea of using Second Chance, but it will be hard to get the combo going just with Zur. You need other tutors.
However, there is one flaw in the above methods. Reito Lantern and Sun Titan cannot be tutored by Zur.
What enchantment is there that can be tutored by Zur to put Second Chance back into Library (therefore replacing Reito Lantern) or put Second Chance from graveyard back into play (therefore replacing Sun Titan)?
PS: I don't know how to use gatherer to search for such specific cards, so I am turning to you guys.
You indirectly answered your own questions. If you listed so many answers already, why is it broken in the first place?????????
Because realistically speaking, even if the entire pod is playing decks that are at least 15% removal some of those are going to be sorcery speed, some of those are going to be spent on other things, and others just aren't going to pop up, which would probably be fine for most cards. The problem with PoK is what was said before, it's an effect -everyone- wants so people are going to be trying to copy, reanimate, or steal it, so now suddenly you need to kill it a second or third time, and hopefully you can kill it each time before it becomes a psuedo time walk or time stretch or the person who controls it can reasonably get pretty far ahead... and now you'll need removal for the PoK AND the other threats she's brought down quicker than normal.
In generally I agree that people should run more removal, and I've seen people who hate that argument and yet have literally 0 removal in their decks, but I don't think PoK is an issue that's solved simply by running more removal. Although I always get sad when I cast my Seedborn Muse because it's not a PoK, I'd rather it stay banned.
And yes, the only really good removal thats come out in the past few years for EDH, at least as far as I can remember, is Trophy and that literally just came out.
Like the title says, can Prophet of Kruphix return after a few years of being banned?
With all the new removal, I say yes.
What a perfect example of a non-costructive comment.
You talk about "new removals", yet you don't name them or explain how these new removal are better than the old ones.
Because honestly we could
exie the prophet for W (swords to plowshares)
kill her for U (pongify)
kill her for 1B (doom blade)
shuffle her back for 2R (chaos warp)
kill her for 2G (beast within)
I don't get what those "new removals" are doing better than these old removals.
LED is not necessary to build a Doomsday pile. What it gives you is the most mana efficient (in a vacuum) Doomsday piles.
Assuming you're winning off Laboratory Maniac, a DD pile at just needs to be able to draw 4 cards, then draw 1 card. What makes it complex is doing so in the most mana efficient way. A very simple example would be (in the order you'll draw them):
You cast your starting draw spell to draw Tidings. Cast Tidings to draw the rest of your deck. Cast LabMan. Cast Ponder to draw a card and win. Of course, this is a pretty poor DD pile, as it requires having 9 mana available after you cast your starting spell - so 12 for the turn assuming the best case of your starter being free (e.g. Gitaxian Probe).
Spend some time thinking over what piles you could potentially build within your budget - cards that generate mana and those that draw or mill cards at a very low cost are good things to look for, as are recursion options. Because, frankly, if you can't come up with your own DD piles, you shouldn't be playing the spell - sure, you can look up the best one on the internet, and aim to go for that one, but this is EDH, things rarely go to plan. Often, one of the cards you want to pile isn't available - maybe it's in your hand, maybe you had to cast it earlier and someone used gravehate on it and so on. Being able to come up with workable piles on the fly is the skill behind good Doomsday use.
a) How do I win with Doomsday and Necropotence with the cheapest and easiest available cards possible? I cannot afford Lion's Eye Diamond.
I don't understand. I guess put a pile with Laboratory Maniac and card draw? What are the circumstances? Like, you cast Doomsday and only have Necropotence and mana? I guess you put Flash, Laboratory Maniac, and Brainstorm... or any instant speed cantrip. Leap?
Dunharrow, browsing reddit tells me that in order to win with Doomsday and Necropotence, I need to stack the cards in a specific order with specific cards. One of them is LED. I can't afford it.
Thanks Darren. QAS is a bit problematic. I have to get the five counters and then that enchantment is one more permanent I need to tutor up with Zur. But thank you for your effort.
Thanks, Dunharrow.
I play Zur the Enchanter. I want to take infinite turns.
Second Chance and Necropotence and Reito Lantern and Zur the Enchanter means infinite turn.
Second Chance and Necropotence and Sun Titan means infinite turn.
However, there is one flaw in the above methods. Reito Lantern and Sun Titan cannot be tutored by Zur.
What enchantment is there that can be tutored by Zur to put Second Chance back into Library (therefore replacing Reito Lantern) or put Second Chance from graveyard back into play (therefore replacing Sun Titan)?
PS: I don't know how to use gatherer to search for such specific cards, so I am turning to you guys.
This is a good answer.
You indirectly answered your own questions. If you listed so many answers already, why is it broken in the first place?????????
All I hear: I am reluctant to pack in answers.
Reasons (Excuses)? I don't want to dilute my deck.
Answers are answers to every threat.
Isn't that true? Don't flame me please. Just my perception.
With all the new removal, I say yes.
This deck has some comboes.
Contamination and Bitterblossom means lands only produce black mana.
Mist of Stagnation and Rest in Peace and Vow of Duty means nobody can untap and I don't have to worry about upkeep cost of Stasis.
Web of Inertia and Rest In Peace means nobody can attack me.
Solitary Confinement and Necropotence means nobody can touch me.
Unspeakable Symbol and Phyresis means instant death to my opponents.
Second Chance and Necropotence and Reito Lantern and Zur the Enchanter means infinite turn.
Second Chance and Necropotence and Sun Titan means infinite turn.
Laboratory Maniac and Demonic Consultation means instant win.
1 Arcane Sanctum
1 Azorius Chancery
1 Azorius Guildgate
1 Boreal Shelf
1 Caves of Koilos
1 Command Tower
1 Darkslick Shores
1 Dimir Aqueduct
1 Dimir Guildgate
1 Drowned Catacomb
1 Flooded Strand
1 Godless Shrine
1 Hallowed Fountain
1 Orzhov Basilica
1 Orzhov Guildgate
1 Prairie Stream
1 Temple of Silence
1 Tranquil Cove
1 Underground River
1 Watery Grave
7 Plains
1 Reliquary Tower
6 Island
2 Swamp
1 Bloodstained Mire
1 Dismal Backwater
1 Scoured Barrens
6 Creatures
1 Bruna, Light of Alabaster
1 Laboratory Maniac
1 Aetherling
1 Medomai the Ageless
1 Sun Titan
1 Zur the Enchanter
1 Arrest
1 Azorius Keyrune
1 Azorius Signet
1 Banishing Light
1 Capsize
1 Contamination
1 Counterspell
1 Diplomatic Immunity
1 Dissolve
1 Ethereal Armor
1 Imprisoned in the Moon
1 Land Tax
1 Lightning Greaves
1 Necropotence
1 Phyresis
1 Render Silent
1 Rest in Peace
1 Shielded by Faith
1 Sol Ring
1 Solemnity
1 Solitary Confinement
1 Sphinx's Revelation
1 Steel of the Godhead
1 Supreme Verdict
1 Swiftfoot Boots
1 Talisman of Progress
1 Unspeakable Symbol
1 Vanishing
1 Vow of Duty
1 Wayfarer's Bauble
1 Wrath of God
1 Armageddon
1 Azorius Cluestone
1 Battle Mastery
1 Bitterblossom
1 Nevermore
1 Condemn
1 Darksteel Mutation
1 Demonic Consultation
1 Dimir Signet
1 Fellwar Stone
1 Mist of Stagnation
1 Negate
1 Obelisk of Esper
1 Oblivion Ring
1 Orzhov Cluestone
1 Orzhov Signet
1 Planar Collapse
1 Prison Term
1 Reito Lantern
1 Second Chance
1 Swan Song
1 Swords to Plowshares
1 Talisman of Dominance
1 Winds of Rath
This is a very useful reply. Thanks, Phrox.
Dunharrow, browsing reddit tells me that in order to win with Doomsday and Necropotence, I need to stack the cards in a specific order with specific cards. One of them is LED. I can't afford it.
a) How do I win with Doomsday and Necropotence with the cheapest and easiest available cards possible? I cannot afford Lion's Eye Diamond.
b) How does Demonic Consultation and Laboratory Maniac win games? DC says put the card into hand, not draw.
Thank you.