what in your opinion is the most viable mono black deck in legacy right now? I use to play suicide black years and years ago and would like to update the deck.
Prog's protection from everything includes lands, yes. It's a very good polymorph/proteus staff target, possibly better than Emrakul, but I would personally take polymorph over the staff, 2 less mana. It's a helluva faster win than trying to beat down with teeny tiny factories or ramp into a huge DoJ.
Ah nice, I figured as much but I thought I would ask. Yea, I play U/W/x landstill and although I love it, this could be a fun option to shake things up even if it doesn't turn out to be the most competitive option.
I would run polymorph as well. Although my landstill wishboards to enlightened tutor, there's no reason I couldn't toss in a mystical tutor. I have my doubts that it will be as good as DOJ/Elspeth, but it sure sounds like fun. I'll proxy some up when I have the chance.
I'm glad people are at least thinking about this. I thought it would be fun to run in my landstill shell. I like polymorph over Proteus Staff and Emrakul and Progenitus both seem like the best options for trying it out. But Prog's protection is pretty killer. Does Prog's protection from everything include lands? ie. Karakas?
@Meddling Mage: He was good to me where I wanted him to be good to me: combo. Since I didn't see any storm combo, and instead faced thopter, I was happy to have his versitility. Ethersworn is way better against storm than MM is, but MM has so many more uses in other bad matchups while being pretty good against storm too that I hesitate to make the switch. I guess my conclusion based solely on what I used him for there was: not too helpful, but more helpful than cannonist given the lack of storm combo.
@Jace 2.0: MVP all day. If you havent tested him yet, please try him. He's such a bomb in literally every matchup and would have singlehandedly won me every game he resolved in if my opponents hadn't been packing needles sometimes.
It really sounds like I need to test Jace 2.0 by the sounds of the results people have been having.
Now, my thoughts on your deck. I'm not an expert but I think it's kind of odd to run both Fact or Fiction and Cunning wish. I've never tried a wish board but I'd choose one or the other to free up some slot for other stuff, like maybe a 2nd Humility. That's something I think I picked up from rsaunder here and he's right, it's been good to me so far.
Hmm, that may be an option. I'll test it out with one FoF instead of 2 and see how that runs. Or drop both and run 1 Jace 2.0.
also see a single swamp in your mana base. Is that there to protect you from Blood Moon effects? If so, then it's probably safe to remove it because even if they do get a Blood Moon out on you the mountain can still be your third color. I'm think of taking out the swamp in favor of another plains.
Yeah the swamp was for moon effects and if I swap in any black spells from SB. But you're absolutely right, especially since my black spells are part of my wishboard (before I was runing planar void etc). I'll try w/o the swamp.
Another thought. If you want to have 3 Tops you could safely drop to 3 Standstills to make room. When I ran 4 Standstills I seems to always be drawing them when I really didn't want one. Dropping to 3 works better for me. This probably comes down to personal taste though.
I think I'm happy with 2 tops, but I may drop to 3 Standstills anyways and free up some space. I'm going to see how many times they sit around in my hand being useless (although they are always a FOW pitch I suppose). I'm still waiting for the majority of my deck in the mail - so one I receive the cards I'll proxy some cards and do a little bit of testing.
Rignes, I don't have the most constructive feedback since I'm just building the deck myself. I do have some questions, however.
Do you find 2 Elspeth and the 5 man lands enough for win conditions? how do you like Jace? I'm running 2 FoF's but I've been thinking of trying a jace too. is Karakas solely for reanimators?
I think your counters and board control are perfect. Excuse my ignorance, but what is so great about Vendilion Clique in the deck?
Its looking pretty good as far as I can tell though!
Updated the list - tell me what you think about the changes. Rignes, how do you insert those links to your decks so you avoid filling up the page like I am?
Thanks rsaunder. That makes sense, I wasn't sure if you meant to drop the enlightened altogether or not. I like the look of that SB I think I'll drop the energy flux for sure. why only Relics over crypts? I'm guessing that by the time you set them off you have enough mana and getting the draw is key? edict is a really good suggestion as well, should I include something like a disenchant?
Rignes: thanks for the land suggestions. My problem is that I like the Academy and Mishra's at 4 seem's ideal. I'm still leaning towards 3MF, 1A and 2 Wastelands (3 if the academy doesn't work out though). Maybe I could run 7 colorless, although that may be pushing it.
Thanks a lot Xeroninja, it looks great!
Ah nice, I figured as much but I thought I would ask. Yea, I play U/W/x landstill and although I love it, this could be a fun option to shake things up even if it doesn't turn out to be the most competitive option.
I would run polymorph as well. Although my landstill wishboards to enlightened tutor, there's no reason I couldn't toss in a mystical tutor. I have my doubts that it will be as good as DOJ/Elspeth, but it sure sounds like fun. I'll proxy some up when I have the chance.
Jace the Mind sculptor
http://image3.examiner.com/images/blog/EXID21272/images/Jace,_the_Mind_Sculptor.jpg
http://fc08.deviantart.net/fs70/f/2010/047/5/9/Jace__the_mind_sculptor_by_NoOne00.jpg
- Blue hands, aura and eyes glowing if possible!
Cheers
I agree with both of these..they would be great in the deck.
What decks did you have the most success with MM?
It really sounds like I need to test Jace 2.0 by the sounds of the results people have been having.
I'm suprised they outdrew you so much! any idea what they were running? it looks like most MUC lists run 4 Brainstorm, 3-4 FoF and 2 SDT's?
5-2 is a pretty good run. Good job! what were the main issues against MUC?
Hmm, that may be an option. I'll test it out with one FoF instead of 2 and see how that runs. Or drop both and run 1 Jace 2.0.
Yeah the swamp was for moon effects and if I swap in any black spells from SB. But you're absolutely right, especially since my black spells are part of my wishboard (before I was runing planar void etc). I'll try w/o the swamp.
I think I'm happy with 2 tops, but I may drop to 3 Standstills anyways and free up some space. I'm going to see how many times they sit around in my hand being useless (although they are always a FOW pitch I suppose). I'm still waiting for the majority of my deck in the mail - so one I receive the cards I'll proxy some cards and do a little bit of testing.
Thanks Rignes,
SB
Do you find 2 Elspeth and the 5 man lands enough for win conditions? how do you like Jace? I'm running 2 FoF's but I've been thinking of trying a jace too. is Karakas solely for reanimators?
I think your counters and board control are perfect. Excuse my ignorance, but what is so great about Vendilion Clique in the deck?
Its looking pretty good as far as I can tell though!
MD Changes:
-1 Counterspell
-1 Spell Snare
-1 Sensei's Divining Top
-2 Wasteland
-1 Mishra's Factory
+2 Tundra
+1 Underground Sea
+1 Flooded Strand
+1 Swamp
SB Changes:
-1 Energy Flux
-1 Planar Void
-1 Tormod's Crypt
+1 Diabolic Edict
+1 Relic of Progenitus
+1 Negate
3 Brainstorm
3 Counterspell
3 Cunning Wish
2 Decree of Justice
2 Fact or Fiction
4 FOW
3 Spell Snare
4 STP
2 Wrath of God
1 Humility
4 Standstill
3 E.Explosives
2 Sensei's Divining Top
2 Elspeth, Knight-Errant
1 Academy Ruins
3 Mishra's Factory
3 Wasteland
2 Flooded Strand
2 Marsh Flats
1 Polluted Delta
2 Island
2 Plains
1 Swamp
4 Tundra
2 Underground Sea
SB
4 Meddling Mage
1 Enlightened Tutor
1 Extirpate
1 Path to Exile
1 Pulse of the Fields
1 Ravenous Trap
1 Diabolic Edict
1 Negate
1 Runed Halo
1 Crucible of Worlds
2 Relic of Progenitus
Rignes: thanks for the land suggestions. My problem is that I like the Academy and Mishra's at 4 seem's ideal. I'm still leaning towards 3MF, 1A and 2 Wastelands (3 if the academy doesn't work out though). Maybe I could run 7 colorless, although that may be pushing it.