MTG Salvation

I'm going to give the following list a try tonight and see if I can't take down another FNM:


Wish me luck!

Quote from Concordant »

I just showed how the storm player only needs a single bounce spell and 2 mana in addition to what they need in a goldfish win to beat 2 pieces of protection. How is this "a lot of things" that have to go right? Combo has always been a really bad matchup for enchantress; merely having 4 enchantment that give you shroud in the sideboard does not change this.

So if I go T0 Leyline and T2 Sterling Grove, they can still beat that "easily"?

And what if I have two T0 Leyline?

HOW DO YOU LIKE ME NOW?!?!

Quote from contumaz »

Quote from Tapped Out »

Quote from contumaz »

Quote from Tapped Out »

Running Bile Blight as your main insurance policy vs. aggro may mean you need to tweak your manabase. I'd start with like:

3-4 Llanowar Wastes
4 Temple of Malice
4 Opulent Palace

And go from there. We generally don't need blue until the later turns.

mmmmm that affects a lot the dissolve you may draw or have in hand. That´s another reason for ulcerate.

Would you share your most recent list? I might be missing something.

You don't need Dissolve mana up on turn 3, generally. Ideally, you are saving your counterspells for the late game when they try to do something big. Plus, Sylvan Caryatid really helps out with your mana.

My manabase is a little slower than the one I proposed. I'm generally not at a loss for colors with both four copies of Opulent Palace and Polluted Delta. BB on turn 2-3 is never usually an issue unless I've drawn a hand that's got like...two Temple of Mystery or something.

Anyway:

Sultai Walkers/Control by Tapped OutMagic OnlineOCTGN2ApprenticeBuy These Cards
Creatures (10): 4 Courser of Kruphix 2 Prognostic Sphinx 4 Sylvan Caryatid Planeswalkers (6): 3 Ashiok, Nightmare Weaver 2 Kiora, the Crashing Wave 1 Nissa, Worldwaker Instants & Sorceries (19): 1 Aetherspouts 3 Bile Blight 2 Dig Through Time 4 Hero's Downfall 1 Murderous Cut 4 Sultai Charm 4 Thoughtseize	Land (25): 3 Forest 2 Island 3 Swamp 4 Opulent Palace 4 Polluted Delta 4 Temple of Malady 4 Temple of Mystery 1 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth	Sideboard 2 Bow of Nylea 1 Disdainful Stroke 2 Dissolve 4 Drown in Sorrow 2 Negate 3 Nylea's Disciple 1 Phenax, God of Deception

First of all, your deck is really different.

I disagree with dissolve; i rather dissolve a T3 polukranos (phoenix or whatever) than downfall it. obviously i preffer to disdainful stroke it but i run just two. But again, your deck is pretty different.

Different from yours? Or different from what we're doing here in general? It's very similar to Shaheen Soorani's list and ones that are close to it. Confer:

http://sales.starcitygames.com//deckdatabase/displaydeck.php?DeckID=75983

Quote from Concordant »

Contrary to popular belief, Leyline of Sanctity alone does absolutely nothing, nothing at all, agaist storm. Even when supported by a Sterling Grove the storm deck is heavily favoured. The leyline does not prevent them from going off, so they can for example tutor for Past in Flames, flashback the tutor to get another tutor, tutor for Chain of Vapor, cast and flashback Chain of Vapor to bounce both Sterling Grove and leyline and finally flashback the tutor for Tendrils of Agony.

If they are given time to actually draw a Chain of Vapor, they dont need to spend the extra mana on tutoring. All they need is 2 extra blue mana while they are going off for the chain of vapor.

A similar argument applies to high tide. They go off, generate 50+ mana and then wish for Repeal or similar to bounce the Leyline. Painter decks have close to 8 cards that kill the leyline once they have painter in play.

Leyline requires double Sterling Grove to be effective and even with double grove you're not safe. Belcher and some other Burning Wish decks can wish for Reverent Silence...

Even a single Sterling Grove will help protect you. Anything like that will buy you turns. Solitary Confinement itself is very good against them as well. It just can't come down on turn zero.

I feel like the Storm decks need a lot of things to go right for them before they can get Chain of Vapor and start going off.

Quote from counterb4lance »

Check out this Enchantress list that has been top 8ing several Japanese legacy tournaments.

DeckMagic OnlineOCTGN2ApprenticeBuy These Cards
Maindeck (60) Creature [5] 4 Argothian Enchantress 1 Emrakul, the Aeons Torn 2 Helm of Obedience 1 Enlightened Tutor 1 Green Sun's Zenith 3 Banishing Light 3 Mirri's Guile 3 Solitary Confinement 3 Journey to Nowhere 1 Sigil of the Empty Throne 4 Enchantress's Presence 3 Rest in Peace 2 Carpet of Flowers 1 Moat 4 Wild Growth 4 Utopia Sprawl	9 Forest 3 Plains 4 Windswept Heath 3 Serra's Sanctum 1 Karakas	Sideboard 3 Humility 4 Leyline of Sanctity 3 Elephant Grass 3 Suppression Field 2 Replenish

Discuss!

I like it. Three wincons (Emrakul, Sigil, Helm). Very elegant.

Quote from Talroma »

Thats is best case senario. Most of the time they will have a 2nd untapped mana for multiple things and you cant just run out a seeker. I find the matchup creature wise in the mirror and mardu is very chess like, all the while you both are flinging burn at each other begging for the other one to tap out.

That's why it's important to not blink first when you're on the draw.

On the play you can just keep running out guys. There is no more Doom Blade or Ultimate Price. Running out guys will force them to use their mana and cards in defensive way. It's almost a strategic "soft lock" to keep them dealing with your guys and not attaining any board presence of their own.

Quote from Lharmon11123 »

Is there a primer for the delverless variant of this deck? If so, could someone post a link? Thanks in advance

You mean the RUG Midrange deck that's been floating around? Here's one.

Quote from contumaz »

Quote from Tapped Out »

Running Bile Blight as your main insurance policy vs. aggro may mean you need to tweak your manabase. I'd start with like:

3-4 Llanowar Wastes
4 Temple of Malice
4 Opulent Palace

And go from there. We generally don't need blue until the later turns.

mmmmm that affects a lot the dissolve you may draw or have in hand. That´s another reason for ulcerate.

Would you share your most recent list? I might be missing something.

You don't need Dissolve mana up on turn 3, generally. Ideally, you are saving your counterspells for the late game when they try to do something big. Plus, Sylvan Caryatid really helps out with your mana.

My manabase is a little slower than the one I proposed. I'm generally not at a loss for colors with both four copies of Opulent Palace and Polluted Delta. BB on turn 2-3 is never usually an issue unless I've drawn a hand that's got like...two Temple of Mystery or something.

Anyway:

Quote from ObnixilisNate »

What about a t-1 ruthless ripper?

If they want to waste a removal or burn spell on that early instead of a pump spell and hit for 1 then pass the turn for us to deal with it or counter what's next...

Late game it isn't entirely a dead card and makes akward attacks for the opponent. Plus late game we can push a couple more points of damage via morph.

Ruthless Ripper is quite ill-suited to our deck. It's another cool card that belongs in Monoblack Aggro, if anywhere.

Running Bile Blight as your main insurance policy vs. aggro may mean you need to tweak your manabase. I'd start with like:

3-4 Llanowar Wastes
4 Temple of Malice
4 Opulent Palace

And go from there. We generally don't need blue until the later turns.

Gaddock Teeg is soooo good vs. combo, but I feel like running him alongside 4 GSZ is extremely risky.

You GSZ for him, and now all the rest of your GSZ's (including the one you're now shuffling back in) are dead. Unless your opponent kills him, that is.

I contend that against most combo lists, 4 Leyline of Sanctity in the sideboard is juuuuust fine. You could also add a single copy of Orim's Chant. If they're on the Empty the Warrens plan, you already have Elephant Grass and Solitary Confinement.

Quote from ObnixilisNate »

For those running the more typical creature based version my friend playing abzan midrange just showed me a neat piece of tech in grim haruspex
Prone to removal but laughs at any sort of sweeper.

Perhaps a card that might prove useful once standard gets two orzhav sweepers in jan?

We don't really run enough guys to make Grim Haruspex profitable. That's a card that belongs in like...Mononlack Aggro or BW Warriors.

Also, you probably want to avoid talking about upcoming cards or sets. It's against the Competitive forum rules (stupid, I know).

The earlier decks that played Seeker alongside Titan's Strength and Gods Willing made such better use of him.

He's not Heir of the Wilds, that's for sure. I end up boarding him out in nearly every matchup these days. Although he is pretty stellar against control, but decks that don't play early creatures are few and far between these days, unfortunately.

Our biggest weapon against G/x devotion decks is End Hostilities. With monogreen Garruk gone, they don't really have any way to draw extra cards. And that's perfectly fine. 2- or 5-for-ing them is a back-breaking play and I would play to that long before bringing in a bunch of subpar mobs out of the sideboard to race them (you won't win).

New Jace is baaaad in this deck. A one-of Garruk is probably fine, however.

There's no reason to run Evolving Wilds over Polluted Delta or scrylands. It's probably fine as a singleton, but no more. We need to be able to play an untapped green/black source on turn two.

Against Rabble you will always take damage. I'm of the opinion that Bile Blight is where we want to be with that. We shouldn't have a much trouble landing it, either, because Rabblemaster is CMC 3 and BB is CMC 2. We will have at least one turn to get ready and have our removal live. In light of this, Ulcerate isn't quite where you want to be. Until there is a serious CMC 1 threat in the format, at least. Monastery Swiftspear, Favored Hoplite, Soldier of the Pantheon, and Bloodsoaked Champion are all very good, but removing them isn't worth three life.

Drown in Sorrow is huge against them too. There's a reason that well-performing lists tend to have 4 in the sideboard. You can go down to 3, but I wouldn't recommend it.

Kiora and Nissa were both much better before KTK dropped. They're not awful, either one of them, but they're also not the all-stars that they used to be. I personally run 2 Kiora and 1 Nissa and that's probably riiiiight where I want to be. Ashiok mainboard at 2-3 (3 preferred) is also where I want to be. He is always very good. Played on T3 with Caryatid out will really present a problem for your opponent where they are forced to make bad attacks.

Bow of Nylea is very, very good for us. Kills Hornet Queen & friends and helps out immensely in the burn matchup. There's no reason not to have two of them somewhere in your 75. If it wasn't nearly dead in the control mirror, I'd maindeck one and sideboard another. As it stands, however, two copies in the sideboard are just what the doctor ordered.

As for Thassa and Aqueous Form, I'd stay away from both. By the time we're sitting back to play a wincon, both of them are highly unnecessary.

Quote from ObnixilisNate »

Hi guys! New Poster here. Been out of Std for about a year and decided I would return with contumazes list.

Just waiting for the cards in the mail. (Should be about a week)

Anybody playtesting against this new jeskai heroic combo deck? How's the match up?
Personally I think it's going to be hated out of the meta very quickly.

Shouldn't be too hard to beat between Thoughtseize, Negate, and Sultai Charm.

Quote from csanders »

Chained has actually been really nice. I haven't run into too many Back to Nature or Reclamation Sage yet. Against green decks, I typically side out some of the Chains and put in more sweepers/rabbles.

You bring in Rabblemaster vs. green? Seems subpar. I'd rather have Brimaz.