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    posted a message on Transforming Unlimited cards into Beta-like cards. Best way?
    Quote from Pringlesman »
    Black acrylic paint mixed with just a little bit of white to tone down the gloss. Use thin layers.
    Quote from izzetmage »
    Try this, maybe? I expect it'll be more fiddly since you're basically gluing four strips instead of one, and if the centering is off, there will be uncovered regions on the altered card.
    http://imgur.com/a/UXyhL

    Funnily enough, there are people who do the exact opposite: white-border all their cards, instead of black-bordering them. Awesomer!!
    http://imgur.com/FoAWjaL
    Sweet! I'm totally going to investigate these. Thank you!
    Posted in: Magic General
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    posted a message on Transforming Unlimited cards into Beta-like cards. Best way?
    Quote from Ebonclaw »
    Um.....looking for a way to convincingly alter an UL card to look like Beta to the point that you'd have to inform someone it's been altered is really sketchy dude. I mean, how many commons from UL are stuck in white border only anyway? Maybe specific land arts? Even so, you're never going to get an identical border unless the card is printed that way. Stick with sharpies, it's about as close as you can reasonably get with minimal effort and doesn't try too hard to look real.
    If you want sometime looking more real than that, or something that looks as close to beta as possible, that's sketchy. How do any of us know you're not looking for advice on how to upgrade your UL Sea to a Beta anyway? Do we just take your word for it? Even if it could be done, why would we share that information? Isn't that just asking for widespread forgeries?

    Well, you don't. All I can tell you is that I just want my four copies of Unlimited Dark Rituals (and a handful of other commons), since all I play in paper is Pauper, to be convincing as Beta(-like) to me.

    If you don't want to suggest anything, that's fine. But what I do with my cards is up to me, and if anyone in the future happens to be looking through my cards and says to me, "DUDE! FOUR BETA DARK RITUALS?!?!?!" I'll have to sadly inform him or her that they're actually worthless alters.

    My trade feedback on this site and others is 100% positive and I have never sought to deceive anyone about any aspect of any trade, ever. I think it's safe to say that my reasons for asking this of the community are above reproach.

    Maybe how about this? If anyone has a better suggestion than a Sharpie, they can PM me about it. That way you can sleep soundly tonight knowing that no one out there is doping your market with harmless suggestions.
    Posted in: Magic General
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    posted a message on Transforming Unlimited cards into Beta-like cards. Best way?
    Please note, this isn't for any nefarious purposes--I just have a bunch of Unlimited commons that I play in my Pauper decks which are jarringly white-bordered. I want to blacken the margins so they look more like Beta cards. If I ever want to trade them, I will of course let any interested party know that they've been altered.

    I've tried Sharpies, but the finish is too glossy.

    Does anyone have any experience with this? Maybe someone who is also bugged by white borders and has done the same thing?
    Posted in: Magic General
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    posted a message on [SCD] Werebear vs. Hooting Mandrills (Pauper)
    Hi everyone! I've been working on a Pauper UG tempo/Delver list for about a month now. However, Werebear and Mandrills are a pretty bad nonbo, despite the fact that they are very clearly perfect for the shell of this style of deck. I can usually make it work by just playing the hand I am dealt (i.e. drop the Mandrills as soon as I can and just keep loading up the graveyard, but there are some rare situations in which I draw both and ***** gets ugly. Here is my current list:



    Any ideas? Should I just pick one of those creatures and work toward that only? I mean, it's totally possible to keep just being very careful about how I execute my turns.

    So, what do you guys think? Should I just pick one and build toward a list which plans for it? The two cards have one thing in common—they both like full graveyards. With Mandrills, however, that full graveyard gets a lot less full quickly.

    I can also just leave it as-is and pay much closer attention to the executions of my plays and their effects on future turns.

    Thoughts? Experience? Thanks in advance for any commentary Smile
    Posted in: Paper Pauper and Peasant
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    posted a message on [Primer] Monkey Grow (RUG/Temur Delver)
    Quote from Gerschenson »
    Simply not enough time to test it out as we would have wished and as he was crucial on winning preboard against hatebears and sometimes affinity we let 4 pyromancer stay,also against ur delver he was kinda ok as they didnt play electrickery usually.
    Did any of you secretly slip in an Aura of Silence just prior to registration, just in case you encountered another member of your group in the field? :p
    Posted in: Developing Competitive (Modern)
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    posted a message on [Primer] Jeskai Tempo
    Quote from mrc_jr »
    I've been following the thread for a while...and no iw got the permission to reply...
    i need suggestions on my list..and how to beat Heroic...in my lgs there's plenty of them...UW or RW...

    this is what my 75 looks like..



    tks mates!!
    It looks like you're well-equipped, with Magma Spray, Anger of the Gods, and Suspension Field in the sideboard.

    What version of Heroic is giving you trouble? WR? WU? Jeskai?

    Good Heroic players, when playing against decks with a lot of burn or removal, will sometimes wait until T2 or later to drop a mob. That's so they can have mana open for Gods Willing or whatever else they have in hand.

    The best line of play to beat them is to run them out of cards. Once they're topdecking, their mobs aren't going to get any bigger unless they keep drawing only auras or protection spells, which is unlikely.

    Circle of Flame is another option, and might hold them off for a turn or two. It gets better in multiples. But after the first few turns, it's nearly useless.

    Void Snare is decent them as well, as any auras attached to the target will go to the bin, and any counters will evaporate.

    I would find room for a fourth Magma Jet.

    As a poster above noted, Eidolon of the Great Revel will punish their cute little combat tricks. It also sucks for us, however, as the only cards in our lists that won't damage us are Stoke the Flames and our planeswalkers.

    Singing Bell Strike is almost removal, and Ajani's Presence is nerfed by it.

    Cards with high CMC's, such as Aetherspouts and End Hostilities, are just too slow for this matchup. By the time you cast it, you're probably at < 5 life anyway. Granted, you still may be able to pull out of that, but if they have any burn you are toast.

    Sarkhan is okay here. Same story...you may be able to burn away a mob but you are probably on turn 5, or worse: you missed a land drop and it's turn 6 or 7.

    Brimaz is pretty good here as none of their mobs tend to have trample.

    Something that is probably overlooked is Glare of Heresy. Especially on the off chance that they are using something like Return to the Ranks in their sideboard. It hits all their guys except for Monastery Swiftspear, and can also blow away Banishing Light or Suspension Field.

    I hope this helps!
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on [Primer] Jeskai Tempo
    Against the Heroic decks we have a hard time because their "counters" to our removal are so much cheaper than our actual removal. Last FMN I was playing against a kid on RW Heroic. Here's a play-by-play summary of one of his combat damage steps:

    Him: Before damage, I'll Defiant Strike my Favored Hoplite.
    Me: Magma Spray in response.
    Him: Gods Willing, naming red.
    Me: Lightning Strike in response.
    Him: Ajani's Presence.
    Me: ...
    Him: Take 6?
    Me: ...Yep.

    Their deck is full of plays like that. End Hostilities is bad against the UW version because they can (and will) counter it.

    Aetherspouts? Too slow.

    IDK.
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on [Primer] Jeskai Tempo
    Quote from Talroma »
    Only thing I've recently been thinking of changing is going to 23 lands since I cut sarkhan/SBD
    I definitely would. I went down to 23 after cutting all the walkers (except for two Chandra in the sideboard) and I still occasionally get flooded.
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on [Primer] Jeskai Tempo
    Quote from Talroma »
    Only thing I've recently been thinking of changing is going to 23 lands since I cut sarkhan/SBD
    I definitely would. I went down to 23 after cutting all the walkers (except for two Chandra in the sideboard) and I still occasionally get flooded.
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on Enchantress
    Quote from Concordant »
    Yes, RIP definitely helps a bit, but that was not in the scenario you presented. What you said was that you'd be safe by having T0 leyline followed by T2 Sterling Grove, and that simply isn't the case. Besides, I already listed RIP as one of the cards that affect the opponent's possibility of going off. If the scenario is T0 leyline, T2 Rest in Peace, T3 Sterling Grove, then I agree that you are fairly safe, but that means you are using 3 pieces of protection (just like i said you would need). However, the probability that you find all three cards is small.

    You can normally GSZ for Teeg on turn 2 just like you could GSZ for an enchantress. Although Teeg shuts down some of our wincons, ANT literally can't win while he is in play. So either they get rid of it, or we have time to dig for our Emrakul, Words of War or Karakas. There is also the option of killing the opponent by attacking 10 times.
    I'm not arguing with you or presenting scenarios for you to prove or disprove.

    I just find it hard to swallow that these combo decks are going to have everything going right for them in each of these cases.

    But I defer more to folks with more Legacy experience than I.
    Posted in: Control
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    posted a message on [PRIMER] Sultai Control (BGU)
    Quote from contumaz »
    Quote from Tapped Out »
    Sorry for the double post, but here's my most recent list. I haven't been playing Sultai for a while now (I was on Temur for a minute there), so I would love to hear what folks think about this configuration:


    Looking forward to any and all feedback. Thanks in advance!


    i wonder, is the main purpose of ashiok to force weird attacks? i know that against midrange decks (with a bit of luck)it is great.
    SB plan against aggro ? have you tested it against U/W heroic o you don´t see that deck too much ?
    Ashiok is multi-purposed, I would say. He forces them to make weird attacks, yes. He also recruits threats directly from their deck. And if left unchecked, his ultimate is pretty back-breaking.

    If they're killing your CMC-3 planeswalker they are allowing you latitude to develop your board further that you may not have had otherwise.

    It is important to note that Ashiok on the play can't be killed by any combination of attackers in current Standard. They can get him to 2 or even 1, but not zero.

    Sideboard plan against aggro is—

    - 4 Thoughtseize
    - 3 Ashiok, Nightmare Weaver
    + 4 Drown in Sorrow
    + 3 Nylea's Disciple

    I haven't tested against UW Heroic, but if I do start seeing it (or other Heroic variants), I suspect I will probably bring Aetherspouts back up to 2-3 main with more in the board.
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on [PRIMER] Sultai Control (BGU)
    Quote from ukyo_rulz »
    Quote from Tapped Out »
    here's my most recent list. I haven't been playing Sultai for a while now (I was on Temur for a minute there), so I would love to hear what folks think about this configuration


    I liked most of what I saw in your list, except for the large number of Planeswalkers. I tried them all and wasn't impressed. Kiora was way too easily dealt wirh. Her low starting Loyalty and the proliferation of flying threats made it difficult to keep her alive. Nissa was a fast an efficient finisher, but she didn't help to stabilize the game and by the time she gets good a Sphinx usually would have finished the game also. Ashiok was great against midrange but Sultai was already great against midrange even without him. Also sometimes he just did nothing.

    My list has been mostly unchanged. I played it in a couple of tournaments and did pretty well. The latest one was a 3-round FNM of roughly 20 people in Machida (near Yokohama). I beat Abzan Midrange, then Abzan Aggro, then Mardu Midrange. This continues the same pattern of Sultai being a heavy favorite against midrange strategies. The only games I lost were lost due to mana issues. Aggro strategies were slightly bad game 1 and got significantly better post-board. I also played against UB Control in a tournament and lost to it pretty badly. The match-up is certainly winnable but it's not good by any stretch of the imagination. Here is the latest incarnation of my list:

    MD:
    4 Sylvan Caryatid
    4 Courser of Kruphix
    4 Reaper of the Wilds
    4 Prognostic Sphinx
    4 Thoughtseize
    4 Bile Blight
    4 Hero's Downfall
    2 Dissolve
    3 Dig Through Time
    1 Bow of Nylea
    4 Opulent Palace
    4 Temple of Malady
    3 Temple of Mystery
    3 Temple of Deceit
    2 Llanowar Wastes
    2 Yavimaya Coast
    3 Forest
    2 Swamp
    1 Urborg

    SB:
    4 Drown in Sorrow
    3 Nylea's Disciple
    3 Negate
    2 Disdainful Stroke
    2 Silence the Believers
    2 Unravel the AEther
    1 Bow of Nylea

    The list has 58 cards with a 17-card sideboard. The idea is to bring in two SB cards based on the predicted metagame. My meta has tons of midrange so I normally start with two Silence the Believers.
    Ah, thank you for the feedback.

    One difference between this season and last is that you can't rely on your PW's to stabilize the game for you. I'm not 100% sure I want any at all. But left unchecked, any of them will win the game!

    Abzan is one of our better matchups because our late-game answers are cheaper than their late-game threats. Our starting strategies are nearly the same (T1 Tapland; T2 Land, Caryatid, maybe Thoughtseize, T3 something else). Which means the threats they play are inefficient in light of our cheapr removal.

    If it were your deck, would you cut all of the PW's?
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on [Primer] Mono Black and B/x Aggro
    Pain Seer, IMO, is more valuable than Herald.

    You guys are right about Brain Maggot being a delay. But that's his purpose! You make your opponent make bad attacks because they need to leave something back to block it. You also force them to use removal on it, which keeps that removal away from your Pain Seers and other cards that you need to have on the board.

    I too was skeptical about cutting Herald when my buddy told me, but the proof is in the pudding Smile
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on [Primer] Jeskai Tempo
    What's ML?
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on [Primer] Jeskai Tempo
    Quote from Talroma »
    Mine is the 6th place list. The sideboard wasnt 100% right. I forgot to put in elspeth in the board.

    In my actual list I play elspeth over the end hostilities. That may or may not be wrong.

    http://magic-league.com/deck/86343/khans_standard_t2.html
    Ooooo nice. How many people partook of that event? Just curious.
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on [Primer] Mono Black and B/x Aggro
    Quote from Yokai_ »
    Mantis Rider, Colossus and Sphinx blocks every creature of this deck(and every creature on standard lol), block Herald is not a disvantage.
    I guess that's true. But it still doesn't change the fact that the "Flying" ability is less valuable now than it was last season.

    My buddy was running 4 Herald and never thought to change it, until one day he was like, "Hmm... I want to try out Brain Maggot main. What do I cut? Is Herald so sacrosanct that I can't try it out?"

    He then proceed to 3-1, 3-1, and 4-0 three consecutive dailies. I'd say that's evidence.

    But, as with all things, try it before you buy it! One man's trash is another man's treasure.
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on [Primer] Monkey Grow (RUG/Temur Delver)
    Hmm. I guess you also get a lot more sideboard options too, e.g. Huntmaster and Thrun, if you want them. Plus it also allows us to play Engineered Explosives with more latitude, a thing I greatly appreciate.
    Posted in: Developing Competitive (Modern)
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    posted a message on [Primer] Monkey Grow (RUG/Temur Delver)
    Interesting to see that we're only in green for seven cards. LOL. Makes me wonder if the green splash is worth it. Particularly if one of your mainstays is Tarmogoyf, who gets worse alongside Treasure Cruise.

    There is a part of me recently that has been considering dropping green altogether. We have seen UR Delver go from a Tier 2 deck to a Tier 1 deck overnight with the addition of TC.

    Now, if TC gets banned (seems likely) and we're left only with DTT, then I can see more of a reason for green.
    Posted in: Developing Competitive (Modern)
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    posted a message on [Primer] Jeskai Tempo
    I think 2 copies of Erases fine in the sideboard. The decks you want it against run a boatload of enchantments (Sidisi Whip & GB/x Constellation).

    Hordeling Outburst is an interesting choice. I'm interested in hearing how it works out for you!
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on [Primer] Jeskai Tempo
    Quote from moondemon88 »
    Knew i forgot something important haha my bad sorry about that. Ya I've been wondering if anyone has figured out additional ways to deal with the Siege Rhino/Whip or Meandering Towershell/Whip. Without a complete overall on my sideboard since right now it basically destroys my meta except that combo. Sometimes it feels like a Remand without the card draw and that's all i need to push them that much closer to lethal.
    Hehe there it is! The problem!

    Against Whip decks you pretty much have to stop them from landing/activating a Whip. Counterspells such as Disdainful Stroke and Negate are very good against it, but the problem with using them is that we have to keep mana up for them from turn 4 onward or we risk getting blown out.

    I don't know what your sideboard looks like, but 2-3 Erase therein is also a solid choice. In addition to being useful against Whip, it hits other stuff like over half the GB Constellation deck and any Coursers you may encounter. So, in short, I would use:

    Disdainful Stroke
    Negate
    &
    Erase
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on [Primer] Mono Black and B/x Aggro
    Quote from Yokai_ »
    Quote from Tapped Out »
    I don't know why, but people seem to think that Herald is an automatic 4-of in this deck. I disagree with that.

    There are so many other things we could be doing.

    My buddy dropped Herald for 4 Brain Maggot and hasn't looked back. In fact, he recently 4-0'ed a daily on MTGO with such a list.

    However, I'm not sure Agent is a replacement for it. Sure, the mana costs are the same, but they are fundamentally different cards.

    I believe you are safe running one Agent mainboard and some more in the side. You can also put all of them in the side if you like. That's what I'm probably going to be doing.


    Bestow is the answer. +3/+3 and fly is a great deal. A 3/3 flyer for 3 mana also is good. Wich card could be better?
    I still don't like it. At CMC 3 we just have other things that we could be using that have a more impressive and long-lasting effect on the board.

    The bestow ability is nice, but at CMC 5, I found myself rarely using it.

    On turn 3, I'd rather play a 2-cost mob and follow it up with something like Thoughtseize, Crippling Blight, or Boon of Erebos. Being able to cast two spells in a single turn is a huge tempo swing.

    And now, with the exisence of Jeskai tempo having made an impact on the worldwide metagame, people are already prepared for 3/3 fliers. Bile Blight, Prognostic Sphinx, Arbor Colossus, even an opposing Mantis Rider...

    It's not a bad card, it's just not where I think we should be right now. It's extremely well-suited to the BW Midrange list I've been seeing popping up, and not half bad in some of the Constellation lists either.
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on [PRIMER] Sultai Control (BGU)
    Sorry for the double post, but here's my most recent list. I haven't been playing Sultai for a while now (I was on Temur for a minute there), so I would love to hear what folks think about this configuration:


    Looking forward to any and all feedback. Thanks in advance!
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on [Primer] Jeskai Tempo
    Quote from moondemon88 »
    I've been playing and tweaking this when i get the chance. It regularly takes first at the LGS against things like Junk midrange, Mardu Control, Mardu Tokens, Jeskai Control, Jeskai Tempo, U/B Control, RUG Midrange, Junk aggro, Homebrew outlast, Sultai Control, Villainous wealth deck, U/R Robots and Green Devotion.




    Originally i was running more temples but started to reduce it for a faster start. Was running 2 Mystic Monastery, 4 Temple of Epiphany, and 2 Temple of Triumph, but opted for the faster painlands and it's been worker out so well for me since i felt 8 lands that enter tapped was too much of a disadvantage. I kept a play set of Mystic Monastery and 2 Temple of Epiphany after some testing and i like to be able to more reliably hit both blue and white early game so i have kept them around.

    I know a lot of people dropped Monastery Swiftspear in this deck, but for some reason i just can't find a real reason to pull it out yet. It has haste really good turn 1 and the majority of the deck boost it's power even if it sneaks in just for 2 damage that's two damage i won't have to deal later on with a burn spell or another creature.

    Seeker of the Way is a good card and fits in with me running all the pain lands and has often saved me when playing against the other Jeskai Tempo that pops up on occasion, but it feels clunky in my hand on occasion i feel on turn 2 i would rather do other stuff unless i got no turn 3 drop

    Magma Jet vs Stoke the Flames to me normally it should lean towards stoke with no exception, but i have found that with Chandra, Pyromaster sometimes it's way better to have the extra scry just before i ult her. I have watched my opponent's use her just to find there stoke or other burn just out of range and miss out on all there burn by 1 or 2 cards just enough to make me always want to have one in hand if possible before it get's to that point.

    Why no Brimaz, King of Oreskos? probably has to due with the fact i traded mine for a playset of Snapcaster's, but even before that i just didn't quite like him enough in this deck. Probably has something to do with the requirements for turn 3 are normally Blue, White, Red i would not like to have it be at Blue, White, White, Red on top of the additional 3 drop.

    Not sure what to say on my sideboard it's targeted for my meta alone for when i play so not sure how effectively it would be for anyone else, but if anyone want's i'll break it down on how and what i use it for.

    I was gonna play this at the last GPT a few weeks ago, but my friend who has been using this was supposed to show up so in a last minute effort i ditched my control deck and built a pseudo pod deck which ended up fourth. I'll probably have to deal with that since a few people took the deck list home. Did enjoy that deck though the looks on peoples face's was priceless.

    Sorry for the last minute ramble i would really like some suggestions and constructive criticisms to help me make this deck even better. I've been lacking on keeping up with the standard scene for the last month due to school work.

    EDIT: the 1 MISC card in my sideboard is honestly because i'm not sure what to put there my sideboard as it is currently has pretty much helped me with every deck so i've not been sure what to put in that spot yet.

    Mmm I like your deck. How is your matchup against Rabble Red/RDW? How is it against W/x Heroic? They seem like they could get in underneath you quickly, and their mobs would get out of burn range quickly as well.

    23 land is ballsy in a deck with 4- and 5-CMC planeswalkers. You can't tell me you've never gotten mana screwed with a configuration like that :p

    So you said, "i would really like some suggestions and constructive criticisms to help me make this deck even better." I would love to help, and so would other folks (I'm sure), but you didn't really give us any information about what you are struggling with. Is there a matchup that you're having difficulty with?
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on [PRIMER] Sultai Control (BGU)
    Quote from HIGHfive89 »
    She is great in the mb- even vs decks that you don't so much need the blockers she is 6 power in the air that is hard to deal with outside of a few answers that happen to line up poorly vs the rest of the deck. Say game 1 they see Kiora, Prognostic Sphinx, and Hornet Queen- it is going to make sideboarding very difficult for them as our threats would require very different and specific answers- also making them all the more vulnerable to Thoughtseize. The steep mana cost isn't an issue like it is out of more midrange decks since we are control and are going to take the game long regardless (plus caryatid helps too). There's really no reason not to mb her. What wouldn't you want Queen against? Very few decks.

    Here is my deck running Hornet Queen. The Queen is a straight up all star- the single most dominating card in the deck hands down.

    I could definitely see dropping a MB Silence or something to make room for another Sultai Charm if Jeskai Ascendency is big in your meta.



    Interesting. Question, however: Why Dissipate over Dissolve in the maiboard? Is your meta crammed with graveyard decks?
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on Temur Midrange
    Quote from jub77 »
    Yeah, I dropped the deck last night. Trying black in place of blue for more proactive ways of dealing with threats, in addition to thoughtseize. Also deathdealer is the real deal. Right now if my lgs stays the same, we have about 5-6 uw heroic decks floating around so I'm trying my best to combat this as I constantly lose to it.

    had an okay run with temur going 16-10.
    Very sad Frown

    Yep. We did very well when Abzan was king, but now that it's losing market share it might be time to head back to the drawing board.
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on [PRIMER] Sultai Control (BGU)
    Quote from HIGHfive89 »
    Ive noticed people mentioning having issues with Wingmate Roc. Hornet Queen is a great a answer to this. I have been saying and saying how this deck needs Hornet Queen. She is the best big finisher available- she is hard to deal with efficiently if at all, she is great at taking out planeswalkers, she can play partial offense while still playing defense, and completely halt the opponent's offense. She is also just about the only good way to deal with an opposing Prognostic Sphinx. People think the mana cost is prohibitive, but if you can cast Courser on turn 3 you can cast Queen on turn 6 or 7. She really will win you games you have no business winning otherwise.
    I can get behind this statement. Hornet Queen (almost just typed "Horney Queen", lol) is a pretty good card for our deck in a variety of situations. I wouldn't jam her, and I wouldn't run more than like 1-2 in the sideboard, but she is a great answer to some of those late-game threats mentioned here.
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on [Primer] Mono Black and B/x Aggro
    Quote from sworni »
    Quote from capcrash »
    my 2 cents is, stain the mind is a must of in the sideboard. Best thing we have against Elspeth
    I'd say that our best tools against Elspeth and other walkers too are Thoughtseize and Mogis's Marauder, you just have to play those with patince and not jam instantly as you draw into them. I've had numerous games when i have something like Gnarled Scarhide and Tormented Hero on board and my opponent thinks he is safe to tap out for an Elspeth. On my turn i slam Mogis's Marauder to the board and take out Elspeth and the bonus here is that i get to keep my precious removal like Hero's Downfall for later threaths.
    ^ 100% agreed. We're already fairly light on removal (we need to be, in order to maintain our threat density), so it's generally preferable to dispatch planeswalkers with attacks, if at all possible.

    That said, for one like Elsepth, who creates a HUGE problem for us by clogging the ground and by accruing card advantage by blocking our mobs with her mobs, if we can't kill her the next turn and we do have the Downfall, it's best to just do it.

    Elspeth is another reason Bile Blight should always be in our 75, because against her, it's nearly a Downfall itself.
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on [PRIMER] Sultai Control (BGU)
    Gratz bro.

    I looked at your manabase before reading your report and I was like "I be this guy is done with colorless lands after tonight..."

    LOL
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on [Primer] Monkey Grow (RUG/Temur Delver)
    I feel like DTT fits our strategy a little better than TC. UR Delver though wants TC as they have tons for 4-ofs and not a lot of singletons, at least compared to us.
    Posted in: Developing Competitive (Modern)
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    posted a message on Enchantress
    Quote from Concordant »
    Yes. Yes they do beat that fairly easily, thats my point. With Past in Flames they only need to find a single bounce spell to remove two permanents. This means that you either need tripple protection if you are trying to stop their win condition, or you need somethimg that prevents them from going off like teeg, thalia or rule of law. Chalice of the void, rest in peace and (despite my objections to the card) stony silence would fall into this second category as they interfere with the opponent even though they dont completely stop the opponent from going off.
    I thought RiP was a given here. Sheesh!

    My main wincon is Riphelm so I'd say I'm in slightly better position here than if I weren't.

    GSZ'ing for Gaddock Teeg seems risky because the first chance you get, it may already be turn 3. Not saying it's a bad idea, just wondering how the heck we could incorporate it here without murking the rest of our plans.
    Posted in: Control
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    posted a message on Temur Midrange
    Played this last night to an abysmal 1-2-drop:


    It's basically Kibler's list from a few weeks ago with a couple of tweaks.

    R1
    Beat Rabble Red in three. In game three I got him to topdeck mode and me at 4 before I killed him. A single burn spell would have been match.

    R2
    Lost to a homebrew RW Heroic deck. His guys just got too big too quick. He steamrolled me. Even with all the burn I had... The match was full of plays like this:

    Him: EOT, Defiant Strike my Favored Hoplite.
    Me: Magma Spray.
    Him: Gods Willing naming Red.
    Me: Lightning Strike.
    Him: Ajani's Presence.

    Like WTF>??? Lol

    R3
    Lost to Jeskai Tempo. I don't feel too bad about it because his list was running maindeck Suspension Field (bye bye Polukranos) and lots of counters.

    All in all, very poor showing for this deck last night. I'll stick with it for next week but if I keep dying to red I think I'll just have to do something a little less tempo-oriented.
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on GR/x Monsters
    How well does GR Monsters match up with Mardu Midrange, the builds running the Hordeling Outburst/Butcher strategy? Their post-board game looks pretty nasty for us, with their Anger of the Gods and End Hostilities. In particular, this is the Monsters build I'm leaning toward. It is basically a souped up version of Scheid's list.

    Against Anger you just try to go bigger (i.e. x/4+ creatures). You will lose your dorks but that's generally okay. Knucks is your best friend against most sweepers as you can either use his blue ability to bounce him or his green ability to put him out of range.

    Any of the sweepers are vulnerable to Stubborn Denial. I noticed you're not in blue, however, so it seems like your options there are limited.
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on [Primer] Mono Black and B/x Aggro
    Quote from teamDFL »
    If your 4 spiteful , 4 scarhide and 2+ boon, I am of the opinion that two Agents is the right number.

    Please ask how he gets Brain Maggot to work. I never can and would really appreciate it.
    What do you mean?

    He just steals their sweeper or whatever else might give us trouble (Rhino, Courser, etc.) and uses the information he gathered from the peek to inform his attacks and strategies.
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on [PRIMER] Sultai Control (BGU)
    Dissolve should be reserved for things like Nissa, Xenagos, Elspeth - anything that can act as a 2 for 1 upon resolution.
    ^ This. I think folks are too worried about having UU open on turn 3. Dissolve should be live, absolutely. Just not that friggin' early. We should be more worried about killing their mobs and/or sticking a Courser during those early turns than sitting on our heels trying to jam countermagic.
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on [Primer] Mono Black and B/x Aggro
    Quote from RedGauntlet »
    I kinda replaced Herald of torment for the Agent.Alot of times i had Herald in my hand i din't feel confident casting him when in a dire situation,atleast with Agent you have more safety because of his death touch.It feels that he has more board impact then Herald of Torment
    I don't know why, but people seem to think that Herald is an automatic 4-of in this deck. I disagree with that.

    There are so many other things we could be doing.

    My buddy dropped Herald for 4 Brain Maggot and hasn't looked back. In fact, he recently 4-0'ed a daily on MTGO with such a list.

    However, I'm not sure Agent is a replacement for it. Sure, the mana costs are the same, but they are fundamentally different cards.

    I believe you are safe running one Agent mainboard and some more in the side. You can also put all of them in the side if you like. That's what I'm probably going to be doing.
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on [Primer] Mono Black and B/x Aggro
    Quote from poolsharkpt »
    Hi all.

    Been going back and forth with cards in this deck and I've been thinking on a build with 4xAgent of the Fates and 4xBoon of Erebos.

    Knowing the 2 for one aspect of it, what ares your thoughts - with this in mind - to play some amount of Eternal Thirst? Look great on Agent.
    Quote from teamDFL »
    In creature heavy matchups, Agent of the Fates is great. And Boon of Erebos is the easiest way to trigger him. The problem is that without the heroic being triggered, he isn't one of the better three drops we have, so I am not convinced that going all in on Agent is the right call. But give it a try. You may find something that works that no one else has.
    Agent of the Fates is a great sideboard card if you're running some number of Boon of Erebos in your 75 and a fair amount of bestow mobs.

    Good luck everyone at your respective FNM's this evening!
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on [PRIMER] Sultai Control (BGU)
    Quote from ObnixilisNate »
    Good luck tonight everybody at your respective FNMS!
    Hey, you too! I'm playing Temur tonight but I anxiously await the reports in this thread more than anything.

    May the God(s) of Magic smile upon you.
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on Enchantress
    Quote from Concordant »
    I just showed how the storm player only needs a single bounce spell and 2 mana in addition to what they need in a goldfish win to beat 2 pieces of protection. How is this "a lot of things" that have to go right? Combo has always been a really bad matchup for enchantress; merely having 4 enchantment that give you shroud in the sideboard does not change this.
    So if I go T0 Leyline and T2 Sterling Grove, they can still beat that "easily"?

    And what if I have two T0 Leyline?

    HOW DO YOU LIKE ME NOW?!?!

    Wink
    Posted in: Control
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    posted a message on [PRIMER] Sultai Control (BGU)
    Quote from contumaz »
    Quote from Tapped Out »
    Quote from contumaz »
    Quote from Tapped Out »
    Running Bile Blight as your main insurance policy vs. aggro may mean you need to tweak your manabase. I'd start with like:

    3-4 Llanowar Wastes
    4 Temple of Malice
    4 Opulent Palace

    And go from there. We generally don't need blue until the later turns.


    mmmmm that affects a lot the dissolve you may draw or have in hand. That´s another reason for ulcerate.

    Would you share your most recent list? I might be missing something.
    You don't need Dissolve mana up on turn 3, generally. Ideally, you are saving your counterspells for the late game when they try to do something big. Plus, Sylvan Caryatid really helps out with your mana.

    My manabase is a little slower than the one I proposed. I'm generally not at a loss for colors with both four copies of Opulent Palace and Polluted Delta. BB on turn 2-3 is never usually an issue unless I've drawn a hand that's got like...two Temple of Mystery or something.

    Anyway:





    First of all, your deck is really different.

    I disagree with dissolve; i rather dissolve a T3 polukranos (phoenix or whatever) than downfall it. obviously i preffer to disdainful stroke it but i run just two. But again, your deck is pretty different.
    Different from yours? Or different from what we're doing here in general? It's very similar to Shaheen Soorani's list and ones that are close to it. Confer:

    http://sales.starcitygames.com//deckdatabase/displaydeck.php?DeckID=75983
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on [Primer] Mono Black and B/x Aggro
    Quote from teamDFL »
    I like the warrior deck, but I remain unconvinced that it will help my matchup versus Jeskai. Has anyone tested that?

    Right now, I want white because of Sorin, Glare of Heresy, Erase and Suspension Field. Seeker of the Way is a possibility, but what would I cut for it? Pain Seer? I would listen to experience, but Pain Seer has won me a lot of games.
    Our Jeskai matchup should be fine. It's a race. They will have to waste burn on your guys in order to not die. Thoughtseize away their creatures, or Bile Blight them, or Hero's Downfall them. Those are their only real pathways to victory against you. Try to play intelligently when it comes to life loss. One Thoughtseize early should be fine but stay off them thereafter.

    Another consideration is Whip of Erebos in the board. My buddy top 4'ed a daily on MTGO with Whip. If it lands against Jeskai they are pretty dead as you will swiftly be out of burn range and not coming back.
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on Enchantress
    Quote from Concordant »
    Contrary to popular belief, Leyline of Sanctity alone does absolutely nothing, nothing at all, agaist storm. Even when supported by a Sterling Grove the storm deck is heavily favoured. The leyline does not prevent them from going off, so they can for example tutor for Past in Flames, flashback the tutor to get another tutor, tutor for Chain of Vapor, cast and flashback Chain of Vapor to bounce both Sterling Grove and leyline and finally flashback the tutor for Tendrils of Agony.

    If they are given time to actually draw a Chain of Vapor, they dont need to spend the extra mana on tutoring. All they need is 2 extra blue mana while they are going off for the chain of vapor.

    A similar argument applies to high tide. They go off, generate 50+ mana and then wish for Repeal or similar to bounce the Leyline. Painter decks have close to 8 cards that kill the leyline once they have painter in play.

    Leyline requires double Sterling Grove to be effective and even with double grove you're not safe. Belcher and some other Burning Wish decks can wish for Reverent Silence...
    Even a single Sterling Grove will help protect you. Anything like that will buy you turns. Solitary Confinement itself is very good against them as well. It just can't come down on turn zero.

    I feel like the Storm decks need a lot of things to go right for them before they can get Chain of Vapor and start going off.

    I like it. Three wincons (Emrakul, Sigil, Helm). Very elegant.
    Posted in: Control
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    posted a message on [Primer] Jeskai Tempo
    Quote from Talroma »
    Thats is best case senario. Most of the time they will have a 2nd untapped mana for multiple things and you cant just run out a seeker. I find the matchup creature wise in the mirror and mardu is very chess like, all the while you both are flinging burn at each other begging for the other one to tap out.
    That's why it's important to not blink first when you're on the draw.

    On the play you can just keep running out guys. There is no more Doom Blade or Ultimate Price. Running out guys will force them to use their mana and cards in defensive way. It's almost a strategic "soft lock" to keep them dealing with your guys and not attaining any board presence of their own.
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on [Primer] Monkey Grow (RUG/Temur Delver)
    Quote from Lharmon11123 »
    Is there a primer for the delverless variant of this deck? If so, could someone post a link? Thanks in advance
    You mean the RUG Midrange deck that's been floating around? Here's one.
    Posted in: Developing Competitive (Modern)
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    posted a message on [PRIMER] Sultai Control (BGU)
    Quote from contumaz »
    Quote from Tapped Out »
    Running Bile Blight as your main insurance policy vs. aggro may mean you need to tweak your manabase. I'd start with like:

    3-4 Llanowar Wastes
    4 Temple of Malice
    4 Opulent Palace

    And go from there. We generally don't need blue until the later turns.


    mmmmm that affects a lot the dissolve you may draw or have in hand. That´s another reason for ulcerate.

    Would you share your most recent list? I might be missing something.
    You don't need Dissolve mana up on turn 3, generally. Ideally, you are saving your counterspells for the late game when they try to do something big. Plus, Sylvan Caryatid really helps out with your mana.

    My manabase is a little slower than the one I proposed. I'm generally not at a loss for colors with both four copies of Opulent Palace and Polluted Delta. BB on turn 2-3 is never usually an issue unless I've drawn a hand that's got like...two Temple of Mystery or something.

    Anyway:



    Quote from ObnixilisNate »
    What about a t-1 ruthless ripper?

    If they want to waste a removal or burn spell on that early instead of a pump spell and hit for 1 then pass the turn for us to deal with it or counter what's next...

    Late game it isn't entirely a dead card and makes akward attacks for the opponent. Plus late game we can push a couple more points of damage via morph.
    Ruthless Ripper is quite ill-suited to our deck. It's another cool card that belongs in Monoblack Aggro, if anywhere.
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on [PRIMER] Sultai Control (BGU)
    Running Bile Blight as your main insurance policy vs. aggro may mean you need to tweak your manabase. I'd start with like:

    3-4 Llanowar Wastes
    4 Temple of Malice
    4 Opulent Palace

    And go from there. We generally don't need blue until the later turns.
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on Enchantress
    Gaddock Teeg is soooo good vs. combo, but I feel like running him alongside 4 GSZ is extremely risky.

    You GSZ for him, and now all the rest of your GSZ's (including the one you're now shuffling back in) are dead. Unless your opponent kills him, that is.

    I contend that against most combo lists, 4 Leyline of Sanctity in the sideboard is juuuuust fine. You could also add a single copy of Orim's Chant. If they're on the Empty the Warrens plan, you already have Elephant Grass and Solitary Confinement.
    Posted in: Control
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    posted a message on [Primer] Mono Black and B/x Aggro
    Quote from teamDFL »
    The problem I have is that with 7-8 white sources, a two drop that requires white is pretty dodgy. Do I start adding plains and endanger being able to get double black on T2?

    The big problem for me is that Jeskai Aggro is the worst matchup for me and the white splash might make it worse.
    This is actually not impossible. Starting on page 30 of this thread (last page) we were talking about splashing heavily for white. You don't have to go the Warriors route, but you can. Here is where I'd start land-wise:



    There was also this, a page back, if you like Warriors:

    Quote from Tapped Out »
    Quote from JacketBoi »
    Still trying to decide. Should I splash white?
    I would. You can also go with a warriors subtheme in those colors. In addition to Bloodsoaked Champion, Tormented Hero and His Lord Sorin, you get:

    - Seeker of the Way
    - Chief of the Scale (will help immensely vs. Drown in Sorrow)
    - Chief of the Edge
    - Mardu Skullhunter

    And less relevant (but still potentially useful):

    - Mardu Hateblade
    - Mardu Hordechief
    - Paragon of Open Graves
    - Unyielding Krumar
    - Timely Hordemate (great for chaining Mardu Skullhunter)
    - Sightless Brawler (not bad with Heroic guys)
    Anyway, I contend that splashing white for Sorin is pretty good, but using the already-extant splash in your deck for still other white cards is perfectly fine as well. It opens another huge can of worms with what you can sideboard, too. You get Banishing Light, Erase, and a whole other boatload of awesome stuff.
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on [PRIMER] Sultai Control (BGU)
    Quote from ObnixilisNate »
    For those running the more typical creature based version my friend playing abzan midrange just showed me a neat piece of tech in grim haruspex
    Prone to removal but laughs at any sort of sweeper.

    Perhaps a card that might prove useful once standard gets two orzhav sweepers in jan?
    We don't really run enough guys to make Grim Haruspex profitable. That's a card that belongs in like...Mononlack Aggro or BW Warriors.

    Also, you probably want to avoid talking about upcoming cards or sets. It's against the Competitive forum rules (stupid, I know).
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on [Primer] Jeskai Tempo
    The earlier decks that played Seeker alongside Titan's Strength and Gods Willing made such better use of him.

    He's not Heir of the Wilds, that's for sure. I end up boarding him out in nearly every matchup these days. Although he is pretty stellar against control, but decks that don't play early creatures are few and far between these days, unfortunately.
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on Mardu Superfriends
    Our biggest weapon against G/x devotion decks is End Hostilities. With monogreen Garruk gone, they don't really have any way to draw extra cards. And that's perfectly fine. 2- or 5-for-ing them is a back-breaking play and I would play to that long before bringing in a bunch of subpar mobs out of the sideboard to race them (you won't win).
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on [PRIMER] Sultai Control (BGU)
    New Jace is baaaad in this deck. A one-of Garruk is probably fine, however.

    There's no reason to run Evolving Wilds over Polluted Delta or scrylands. It's probably fine as a singleton, but no more. We need to be able to play an untapped green/black source on turn two.

    Against Rabble you will always take damage. I'm of the opinion that Bile Blight is where we want to be with that. We shouldn't have a much trouble landing it, either, because Rabblemaster is CMC 3 and BB is CMC 2. We will have at least one turn to get ready and have our removal live. In light of this, Ulcerate isn't quite where you want to be. Until there is a serious CMC 1 threat in the format, at least. Monastery Swiftspear, Favored Hoplite, Soldier of the Pantheon, and Bloodsoaked Champion are all very good, but removing them isn't worth three life.

    Drown in Sorrow is huge against them too. There's a reason that well-performing lists tend to have 4 in the sideboard. You can go down to 3, but I wouldn't recommend it.

    Kiora and Nissa were both much better before KTK dropped. They're not awful, either one of them, but they're also not the all-stars that they used to be. I personally run 2 Kiora and 1 Nissa and that's probably riiiiight where I want to be. Ashiok mainboard at 2-3 (3 preferred) is also where I want to be. He is always very good. Played on T3 with Caryatid out will really present a problem for your opponent where they are forced to make bad attacks.

    Bow of Nylea is very, very good for us. Kills Hornet Queen & friends and helps out immensely in the burn matchup. There's no reason not to have two of them somewhere in your 75. If it wasn't nearly dead in the control mirror, I'd maindeck one and sideboard another. As it stands, however, two copies in the sideboard are just what the doctor ordered.

    As for Thassa and Aqueous Form, I'd stay away from both. By the time we're sitting back to play a wincon, both of them are highly unnecessary.
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on [PRIMER] Sultai Control (BGU)
    Quote from ObnixilisNate »
    Hi guys! New Poster here. Been out of Std for about a year and decided I would return with contumazes list.

    Just waiting for the cards in the mail. (Should be about a week) Smile

    Anybody playtesting against this new jeskai heroic combo deck? How's the match up?
    Personally I think it's going to be hated out of the meta very quickly.
    Shouldn't be too hard to beat between Thoughtseize, Negate, and Sultai Charm.
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on Mardu Superfriends
    Quote from csanders »
    Chained has actually been really nice. I haven't run into too many Back to Nature or Reclamation Sage yet. Against green decks, I typically side out some of the Chains and put in more sweepers/rabbles.
    You bring in Rabblemaster vs. green? Seems subpar. I'd rather have Brimaz.
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on Enchantress
    Quote from SplashBros »
    Also a question for the Gw players, how often do you keep a hand with no enchantress in it?
    Rarely. Depends on the matchup, though. Sometimes a hand with Wild Growth and Enchantress's Presence is just fine too.

    Words of War is indeed the solution to Spirit of the Labyrinth. You can also run Gut Shot if you expect to see it a lot.
    Posted in: Control
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    posted a message on GR/x Monsters
    Quote from Pushkin »
    Tapped Out, I've been playing and tweaking this deck since the second week of the format and I really like where my list is currently at. It's pretty close to yours actually. I'll try to explain my reasoning below.



    I'm 100% sold on the maindeck at this point and will not be making any tweaks this time around. I've slowly increased the number of Elvish Mystics and Ashcloud Phoenixes while trimming down the spell count (and a Stormbreath Dragon). A lot of people have expressed interest in going down to 2 or 3 elves but I think thats a mistake. What they are feeling is the need to keep the 4+ power threat dense really high and I think the proper solution to that is to trim the spells down to the bare minimum.

    The only slots I'm not sure about are the SB Temur Charm and the 4th Hunt the Hunter. Disdainful Stroke felt too narrow for a third copy when Mana Leak Charm is almost the same card but can counter cheaper things sometimes while having additional applications. The 4th Hunt the Hunter because you ALWAYS want to draw at least 1 vs g/x devotion and probably don't mind drawing 3. It's such a blowout.

    Stormbreath Dragon is constantly over-performing and by now I wouldn't even consider playing Sarkhan.

    I cut one Mana Confluence because drawing 2 of them is bad. Also having to play a confluence on turn 1 is bad. I've made one of the scrylands u/g and added an additional basic Mountain to compensate. The consensus seems to have landed on 6 taplands and I find myself agreeing with that.
    5-6 taplands are where you want to be in these colors. And four of them must be Frotier Bivouac. I ran six last Friday and found myself doing fine.

    I disagree about cutting a Mana Confluence. While hands that open on two of them suck, they are rare. One of the good things about this deck is that it mulligans just fine due to the fact that it's not a deck full of 1-of's and miscellaneous cards that don't affect the board, e.g. Dig Through Time.

    Sarkhan vs. SBD...ah, the age-old debate. I like them both and for different reasons. Sarkhan is hard for them to remove but SBD is even harder. That said, SBD will eat a Hero's Downfall in your attack step while Sarkhan will at least get 4 in. And sometimes his -3 is actually just what the doctor ordered.

    I really don't like either of them as haymakers, honestly. Crater's Claws does that better and more frequently. But we don't have a whole lot to choose from.

    I'm really thinking of cutting Temur Charm entirely. Its modes are mostly useful, that's true, but I don't like it as much as I want to for the same reason Kibler gave: it doesn't help you when you're behind.

    Quote from lugger »
    A couple things on the mana base for GRx Monsters.

    Tap lands feel very bad. However, at least 4 are very necessary given the nature of our mana base. Depending on how aggressive you want your deck to be, I think the less the better. I've found 5 to be the sweet spot with a white splash. This also lets me run a full set of Elvish Mystic since there are fewer tap lands to take up my turn 1 play. As you play more taplands to compensate either a higher curve or worse mana base, the value of Elvish Mystic is greatly reduced. This was the case last year with Jund Monsters. Ketter's original list ran 5 tap lands (not counting shocks -- which are flexible). Later, as the deck spilled into Jund, there were times when the deck would run 7. There are varying values of running 7 scrylands. It makes Courser of Kruphix great, but it reduces the deck's aggressiveness. With CVM's Jund Monsters playing Goblin Rabblemaster update, CVM was back to the original 5 scry(tapped) lands in attempt to allow for his mana base to keep up with his deck's aggressiveness.

    Your mana base restricts your aggressiveness. I like scry lands as they're powerful. However, they restrict the liklihood that I play Goblin Rabblemaster on turn 2 or 3. They also restrict the liklihood that you play your Savage Knuckleblade (w/ haste) earlier than turn 4. Taplands are less aggressive than painlands, fetchlands, and basics. Your creature package should be as fast as your mana base. Your 3 color, no-creature-greater-than-4cmc, should not be dallying with 7-8 tap lands. I think 5 is the max a lot of decks should be looking at, but I like jamming threats as fast as possible. If you're dallying in 7-8 tap lands, you should be playing some BOMBS! Like, "get out the way", 6 cmc "you lose" cards coming.

    When building your mana base, you also have to take into account your mana dorks. Tap lands and 2 cmcm mana dorks are good friends. The play, "t1 tapland, t2 mana dork," is obvious and aggressive. However, taplands and Elvish Mystic are not friends. Of note, TappedOut's list only runs 3 Elvish Mystics while running 6 tapped lands. This makes sense since Elvish Mystic is really only powerful turn 1. It's ok turn 2 and gets (obviously) subsequently worse. If he were running 7-8 tapped lands, he might even want to run only 2 cmc mana dorks.

    For aggressiveness, it helps when your 3 drops (and two drops) are not mana intensive. Goblin Rabblemaster is not mana intensive. Savage Knuckleblade is very mana intensive. You have to assume that you're getting your "money's" (aka life loss or feasible tempo loss) worth off of Savage Knuckleblade. I think Knuckleblade is very worth it turns 2 through 3. You'll have moments when it doesn't work out -- but I think Savage Knuckleblade is worth it for most Temur lists. I mean, both Rabblemaster and Knuckleblade sorta suck as the game goes on. However, Knuckleblade is certainly better than Rabblemaster post turn 5. However, keep in mind that given Knuckleblade's mana cost restrictions, it's apparent that Knuckleblade is typically going to be less aggressive. It's also worth mentioning Elvish Mystic's synergy with these guys. Mystic is the reason you can play t2 Rabblemaster or Knuckleblade. Rattleclaw Mystic (while cool) only facilitates a hasty t3 Knuckleblade.

    However, your 4 drops are why you play your 2 cmc mana dork. There is no denying the power of a t3 Polukranos, World Eater. t2 mana also is more mana positive (in the fixing sense) than Elvish Mystic. Ashcloud Phoenix and Polukranos in the same deck can be a bit hopeful. But with 2 cmc mana dorks, playing t3 Phoenix or Polukranos is a piece of cake.

    Here's what to take away from this.

    1. Painful manabase = faster deck. Don't bother with pain lands if you're not trying to be fast. You should absolutely bother if you're playing aggressive 3 drops.

    2. Dorks helps certain points on your curve. Elvish Mystic helps your aggressive 3 drops. Rattleclaw Mystic and Sylvan Caryatid facilitate your aggressive 4 drops.

    3. Your mana dorks and taplands work in cohesion. Don't run 8 tap lands and 4x Elvish Mystic. If you're running 8 tap lands, you should be running 6+ 2 cmc mana dorks, fewer 3cmc beaters, and more 4+cmc beaters.
    The cards that really helped ease my mana concerns with colors were Boon Satyr and Fanatic of Xenagos. They make hands that you'd have to throw back, because of color concerns such as your only blue source being a Rattleclaw, keepable. Fanatic is really quite a force too. One of my Abzan opponents was so scared of it that he Thoughtseized it over Knuckleblade on turn 2 once.

    Some folks like Rabblemaster here but I don't.

    I didn't get restricted at all by having an awkward hand with taplands. There were zero times where I *had* to go T1 Mystic or die. More often it was T1 tapland into T2 Rattleclaw or Heir. And those starts are fine.

    Anyway, for the most part, I agree with everything you said. Do you have a list of your own?

    Quote from lugger »
    What sort of bombs did you have in mind


    Basically that. Maybe Surrak. Depends on the flavor of the month. You can also play Hornet Queen, Arbor Colossus, and Genesis Hydra but meh.

    is that list the proper configuration to run said bombs?


    I have no idea. That list needs more removal. By going bigger, you're conceding the early portions of the game to developing your mana, so you have to make sure that when Abzan goes long, you can as well.

    Though, honestly, RUG is not well developed for the grindy game. If you're going to be playing those colors, play fast and low to the ground (a la Temur Tempo).
    I'm thinking of adding a Surrak to my sideboard. But if I want him to be a part of my alt plan then it seems like I will need two.
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on [Primer] Jeskai Tempo
    What I'm hearing a lot of people say is that Seeker of the Way isn't cutting it any more. I just dies too quickly or is simply blanked by Courser and friends.

    So, what do we do? Just drop it and play something else in its place? Monastery Swiftspear? Or do we just drop it perio and load up on burn.

    I'd love to get folks' thoughts on how to solve this unfortunate riddle.
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on Enchantress
    Quote from SplashBros »
    How has the exploration worked for you?
    I like it a lot. It's one of those low-key all stars. It allows me to go ham with Emrakul a lot earlier than I could without it. What I mean is you can make some absurd plays with another copy of Serra's Sanctum in your hand.

    For a while I was considering Gaea's Touch, because it seems to make a lot of sense (its sacrifice to get GG is probably pretty useful), but I haven't had the opportunity to try it out.
    Posted in: Control
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    posted a message on [Primer] Mono Black and B/x Aggro
    Quote from Loreleaf »
    Okay. Thanks for clarifying! I sure was scratching my head about this initially...

    Anyway, congratulations on your finish! Did you ever bring in Stain the Mind or Erebos, God of the Dead? And if you did, did you ever get to use them? How'd they work?


    I did bring in StM, but never saw it, I was hoping to pull Ensoul Artifact in Match 1 and in one of the other matches. What I should have done in my last game is pulled in Erebos also.
    Right on. So you never got to cast it at all?

    Depending on the list, there are better targets in Ensoul lists than Ensoul itself. Crippling Blight makes their cool 5/5 Darksteel Citadel into a waste of cards. Just seems like there are better answers!
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on [Primer] Jeskai Tempo
    Yeah, I don't think Wingmate Roc belongs in this list. Jeskai Tokens is another deck entirely.

    Congrats @ thisissafety. I take it you prefer SBD over the planeswalkers? Can I ask why? Also, can you elaborate on your sideboard choices Eidolon of Rhetoric and Prognostic Sphinx?
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on [PRIMER] Sultai Control (BGU)
    There's nothing wrong with some number of Kiora in your mainboard, IMO.

    I still don't care for Nissa, however. But I will continue to run one and see what happens!

    Kamahl, I take it Liliana has been doing work in your list?
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on Enchantress
    Quote from SplashBros »
    hmm.. maybe i will cut the # of GSZ, can someone post one of their GW lists?
    Here you go. I run a singleton GSZ because sometimes it comes in handy for an extra Enchantress:

    Posted in: Control
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    posted a message on Mardu Superfriends
    Quote from Cumeau »
    Quote from Mindrotted »
    Have you had a chance to do any testing yet? I've put together a similar list that I want to get more walkers in, but I've only had a chance to play against mono black aggro. The list performed pretty well, but you can't really take away too much from one match up.

    Here's the list I'm starting with:


    So far I've really liked Crackling Doom as a way to get a threat off the board and to get in for a little bit of damage. Crater's Claw also really surprised me by just winning games out of no where. The look on your opponent's face when you top deck this late game and dome them for 10 is wonderful. Haunted Plate Mail did some work too by activating it after a wrath and swinging. I even got to live the dream one time with it, by strapping it to a dragon Sarkhan and swinging for 8 in the air with pseudo vigilance! Plate Mail was really just a place holder until I rounded up some other cards, but fun to mess around with. Like I said, I think upping the amount of walkers will go a long way, but I think Mardu control has real potential.


    Amazing.

    I was just going to leave a message on how Haunted Plate Mail fits his list.

    That card needs some more love.
    Haha. I want to like it...

    I just think at CMC 4, we are definitely better served with Chandra or Ashcloud Phoenix.
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on [PRIMER] Sultai Control (BGU)
    Quote from Meyou »
    Sultai deck by Riley Curran placed 17th at SCG Open. It says 64th under the deck tech, but the standings has him just missing the top 16.

    Sultai Control
    Ooooo I really like that list. I wish I could watch the video, but I'm at work Frown

    Hornet Queen in the sideboard...interesting. Alternate wincon?

    Also, no Nissa to be found. I think it's time, unfortunately, to seal the vault on her usefulness in this deck...
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on [Primer] Mono Black and B/x Aggro
    Yeah, it seems like our default targets for StM are probably lifegain effects or board wipes. We're not in an environment where we just auto-name Sphinx's Revelation and go on our merry way. It requires thought now!

    Here's what I'd see myself naming, in order of frequency:

    Anger of the Gods
    Drown in Sorrow
    End Hostilities
    Nylea's Disciple
    Courser of Kruphix (debatable)

    There are probably others depending on what deck you're facing. Against Constellation I'd probably name Doomwake Giant. Against Abzan, Siege Rhino or Wingmate Roc are also possible targets.

    That said, I still feel like the card is subpar for us. As Karloski stated, it probably makes more sense in a tokens list where you can actually get it off turn 3 without problems.
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on Enchantress
    Quote from SplashBros »
    So im new to the site, and recently built Enchantress. Heres my list id like feedback if possible and would appreciate it greatly. Also dont know how to format O_O so please forgive me.

    2 Helm of Obedience
    2 Abundant Growth
    3 Elephant Grass
    4 Enchantress's Presence
    3 Mirri's Guile
    1 Oblivion Ring
    2 Rest in Peace
    3 Solitary Confinement
    2 Sterling Grove
    4 Utopia Sprawl
    4 Wild Growth
    4 Argothian Enchantress
    1 Emrakul, the Aeons Torn
    1 Gitaxian Probe
    4 Green Sun's Zenith
    10 Forest
    1 Karakas
    1 Plains
    4 Serra's Sanctum
    4 Windswept Heath

    Sideboard
    4 Leyline of Sanctity
    3 Stony Silence
    2 Oblivion Ring
    1 Choke
    1 City of Solitude
    1 Karmic Justice
    3 Carpet of Flowers
    Format it using the "deck" tags. you just use [ and ] with the word "deck" in the middle at the beginning, then at the end you use [ and ] with /deck in the middle to close it.

    How has Carpet of Flowers been working for you?
    Posted in: Control
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    posted a message on [Primer] Jeskai Tempo
    Quote from Michaud339 »
    So far I'm happy having both in my sideboard and running Keranos mainboard. Chandra mainboard (which I have done the past few weeks) has been too situation specific, so I'd rather have her ONLY be situation specific and live in the sideboard.
    Yes! This is exactly why I moved mine to sideboard, and there they shall stay. I like her against aggro and control, but she usually meets a bad end against midrange lists.

    EDIT: Has anyone used Dauntless River Marshal at all? He seems somewhat relevant and can help you lock something down before an Alpha Strike. Some of the earliest lists for this deck had him and I just wonder what happened to make folks not play him anymore.
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on Enchantress
    Quote from Concordant »
    Tescrin, you are exactly right. Thats how this mess started. Now we are at weird subargument where WeaponX thinks that knowing the top of the library isn't useful, that I am incompetent to play this game and that I can't do math. We're not even debating whether Mirri's Guile is better than Sylvan Library anymore.
    I can't speak directly for WeaponX, but I don't think anyone thinks you are foolish or that you can't play this deck because of your viewpoint on Mirri's Guile.

    I actually don't run either of them because I don't really find the effect to be useful. But if I did, I'd probably play Library because there are times when I might want to pay the 4 or 8 life to get those extra cards.

    Posted in: Control
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    posted a message on [PRIMER] Sultai Control (BGU)
    Why is it that nobody can use deck tags?

    I picked Sultai back up for the winter IQ's, the deck is not really a known force and I want to try and get under the radar with it in the next couple of IQ's. I believe the deck to be fairly well positioned at higher levels of play where strategies are a bit more focused. The deck has a really good midrange game, a decent aggro game and a solid control game. I really am just hoping to dodge Mono Red and Mono black aggro.

    I am also back on the AEtherspouts plan with Perilous Vault in the board. AEtherspouts is good coverage or the combo deck I feel.
    My friend played my list last night at an FNM event and went 1-3 drop. LOL. It might just be that she's not used to control decks at all, and specifically Sultai.

    I agree, Kamahl, that no one is looking to see this list. I think one of the best things about it is our charm. It's hands-down the best one out there right now.

    My friends and I were having a debate about which charm was best. A lot of them felt that Abzan was best because it has a deck. Then I posed the question, "What if Sultai Charm was in Abzan colors?" and that sort of settle the argument. Haha.

    Anyway, what's your latest list? Mine hasn't changed much since I last posted it here.

    I agree that Aetherspouts is well-positioned currently, with no one really playing around it. I think we can leverage this fact to work in our favor, as no one is expecting it.
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on Mardu Superfriends
    Quote from csanders »
    Ran this list at FNM last night, went 3-0-1 (went to time with Jeskai Aggro in rd 1)



    Originally, Mogis and Ashcloud were supposed to be filler until I can find more Chandra and a couple of Sarkhan... but they were really good in a heavily Jeskai field (I faced it 3/4 games, with the 4th being UW Heroic). Ashcloud is a must-answer threat that typically takes two removal spells (at least) to kill off, and Mogis is a potent clock when you've managed to keep all of their creatures away. I'm still looking to add at least one more Chandra and at least one Sarkhan.

    Any thoughts?
    How did Chained to the Rocks work out for you? I'm so scared to run it in a meta filled with Reclamation Sage and Back to Nature...
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on [Primer] Jeskai Tempo
    Quote from Michaud339 »
    Went 4-1 last night and finished 2nd overall against a really diverse meta at one of my LGS. My only loss was to complete and utter mana-screw two games in a row, so....just the luck of magic.



    My wins last night were against Sidisi Whip, Naya Walkers, U/W Heroic and last match was against a Temur Aggro build.
    My loss was against a Jeskai Tokens that I should've beat, but I drew a hand with two land (both games) and proceeded to not draw another land until 4-5. It didn't go well Frown I had anger of the gods in hand, but just couldnt play it to wipe out 6 tokens Frown

    Keranos is a card I just traded for last night, and I like having him mainboard. With scrylands he's very powerful and I was always happy to have him in hand.
    Rabblemaster won multiple games for me using Jeskai Charm to bounce blockers and using the goblin tokens to case stoke to avoid running into blockers so I could bounce them the next turn and attack for 6 with rabble and two tokens. That move happened at least 3 different times.
    I feel good about a single hushwing gryff in the main. Even if it doesnt shut anything down most people aren't running a lot of flyers and it's good to get in some easy damage, if nothing else. Either way, I prefer having the single gryff over a fourth Seeker.
    Seeker still isn't doing much for me, but I'm happier having a few more targets for removal. If they arent in the board the removal is saved for my mantis and rabblemaster, and that's absolutely not what I want.

    The only sideboard cards that did much for me (and by much, I mean anything) were End Hostilities and Prognostic Sphinx (mostly for the scry 3).

    I dropped Gods Wiling in favor of a fourth Magma Jet and didnt miss it tonight, but I do like the card. I'll probably put 2, or at least 1, Gods Willing in the sideboard.

    Were there an situations in which you brought in the rest of your planeswalkers? What were they, and how did they perform?
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on [Primer] Mono Black and B/x Aggro
    Quote from Loreleaf »
    I learned from the first game that was his only Morph Creature, and he cast it as a morph each time and did not have mana to support morphing it up. So when he dropped it in morphed, I Downfall-ed it.
    Okay. Thanks for clarifying! I sure was scratching my head about this initially...

    Anyway, congratulations on your finish! Did you ever bring in Stain the Mind or Erebos, God of the Dead? And if you did, did you ever get to use them? How'd they work?
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on [Primer] Mono Black and B/x Aggro
    Quote from Loreleaf »
    *Snip*
    When you said you held back your Hero's Downfalls for his Sagu Mauler...did he play it morphed or something? It has hexproof...just trying to understand.
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on [Primer] Jeskai Tempo
    Quote from moxruby »
    I'm putting the deck together, and can't decide whether or not I need to invest in Brimaz. What's the consensus on him?
    Some folks like him and some folks don't. I'm of the former camp and I believe Brimaz is best as a mainboard card than a sideboard one.
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on [Primer] Mono Black and B/x Aggro
    Quote from sworni »
    MBA made it to top8 in SCG Columbus! #stoked
    Love ittttt.
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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