I played a 25-players EE trial event last weekend, playing Legacy for the first time this year (I have just moved to a NYC).
I played a very streamlined list, with Copters and Harbinger filling in the flex spots. I didn't want try to predict the meta for an event of this size, so I preferred not to play any 1-ofs.
I squeezed in the top 8 at 8th place, lost to Infect in the quarterfinals. In the swiss, I beat Grixis Delver, Big Red and BR reanimator, losing to Aluren and Grixis Delver. Overall, I thought the deck was well positioned, althouhg I could have played some games better.
Not sure how good the sideboard was, of course I only played 6 matches.
Copters were good at beating down, I was happy enough with them that I'll keep playing them. Given the match-ups I faced, Harbinger were very solid, I will keep them in for now.
The list:
4 Cursecatcher
4 Silvergil adept
4 Lord of Atlantis
4 Master of the Pearl Trident
4 True Name Nemesis
3 Phantasmal Image
3 Harbinger of the tide
4 Aether vial
4 Force of will
3 Chalice of the Void
3 Smugglers's Copter
I was very happy with playing so many islands (to fight wasteland and blood moon) and keeping wasteland in the SB was fine. I would add a fourth cavern though, was one of the cards I wanted to see most. Personally, I really want a manabase that can ensure a turn 3 TNN as often as possible.
A few words about the list: I play Tome Scour and rainbow lands since the beginning, working with iostream on the deck. The rainbow lands have minimal cost and Tome Scour really does wonder for the deck (more on this below).
About the tournament: I wanted to play Dredge for this event, as it was clear that people would be underprepared for it after a sequence of bad performances. I was right beyond any expectations and I saw no cages or RIP the whole day. Only three scoozes, one kalitas and one anger of the gods. Needless to say I had a deck advantage over 90% of the room.
I went 8-1 in the swiss so of course I had variance on my side, I drew and dredged well all day. Beyond that, the last factor that really help my finish was the mulligan strategy. I mulliganned almost systematically and won many games on 5 or even 4 cards. Really, you want to have a fast start, and it’s worth always shipping back seven card hands with only one enabler. For anyone wanting to improve with the deck, that’s a key margin to boost your win percentage.
Side note: this is exactly why Tome Scour shines. It allows to mulligan aggressively and still have playable four cards hands in a way that neonate or voice cannot guarantee. This is huge in practice, and many people underrate tome scour because this upside it’s not obvious by just looking at the card itself. End of side note.
Now the games (sorry for forgetting some details):
Round 1 - Lantern
Guy was nice but clearly had no idea how to play against dredge. He made a few small misplays, and I had a fast draw both games backed up by conflagrate.
2-0, 1-0
Round 2 - Jund
Game 1 I had a good start and he was behind the whole game, with only goyf bolt and Liliana of the Last Hope. Game 2 took a long time, where he played Kalitas twice, but I killed it twice with conflagrate and then lightning axe. I grind him out by playing gravetrolls, I had to play really tight but I finished him with zero cards left, dredging the last three to find a lethal rally.
2-0, 2-0
Round 3 - Affinity
Lost G1 to a great draw. He couldn’t beat darkblast G2. G3 I was behind the whole game, but eventually started to turn it around. I decided to tap out to flashback lootings facing a two turn clock etched champion in order to apply some pressure, but find myself dead to a topdecked plating, with grudge sitting in my yard. It was the only card that would save him, but maybe I did play too aggressively.
1-2, 2-1
Round 4 - WG Tron
G1 goes very long, I’m able to fight through karn and wurmcoil engine, but I eventually mill myself by dredging too much for no reason. Big mistake, should have thought more ahead. G2 he looses in spite of Ugin and oblivion stone, he misplayed by not playing a second O-stone. We have five minutes left for G3, but fortunately I have a great draw and run him over.
2-1, 3-1
Round 5 – Infect
G1 he mulligans and has a poor draw with only a nexus and misses a land drop after double probe. Not close. G2 he draws too many lands, and has to spend his pump spell to save blighted agent from conflagrate. I fade become immense and win next turn.
2-0, 4-1
Round 6 – Valakut
My first RG Valakut opponent of the day. I believe we split the first two games, as I have a very slow G2 (possibly a one lander). G3 goes long, I gain tons of life with gnaw to the bone and he has to play defensively. I reanimate a large grave troll, and he tries to kill it with four valakut triggers only for me to regenerate it. After this misstep, he’s way too far behind to have a shot.
2-1, 5-1
Round 7 – Valakut
I’m paired against Oliver Tiu, who plays the same deck from Worlds, who he actually got from my last round opponent. I know he doesn’t have any serious hate. G1 is absurd: I mulligan down to 4 with a hand that has lands but no action (but can hardcast amalgam). I’m expecting to loose quickly has he ramps very quickly to five lands. I’m considering not playing anything beyond my copperline gorge to keep him in the dark, but when I draw lootings I decide to try the 1% win. He plays scapeshift next turn, I fully expect to die but he can’t show me enough mountains! He drew one too many and deals zero damage, loosing next turn to rally the peasants. G2 is easy as I protect my self with gnaw to the bone and beat an anger exiling triple bloodghast without much trouble. Very nice guy.
2-0, 6-1
Round 8 - Melira Company
I hope this is a win and in (turned out it will not be) and I’m not happy to face Melira combo. I have a decent draw G1 with pressure and conflagrate, but he draws enough company, chord and combo pieces to gain infinite life. G2 he keeps a one lander with birds and looses to darkblast. G3 is drawn out, I play to my outs, keeping his board as clear as possible with darkblast and conflagrate. I make a mistake on dividing the damages from the second conflagrate, not seeing that he can use the haunt ability of his pontiff to save his melira. Fortunately, he misses it too and realizes it too late. He tries not to tilt and come back in the game but I have too much pressure and win by a close margin. Pfew!
2-1, 7-1
Round 9 – Jund
We have to play, and I’m told he’s on Jund. His 75 has very little against dredge. G1 he goes Turn 2 ooze on the play, but I have darkblast in hand to kill it on my second turn. After that, he is not able to put up any defense in both games.
2-0, 8-1
Wow! From round 6 onwards, it was clear I had one of the best decks in the room for the day. Variance went my way of course, but the only match I lost was from a very close game. I was very happy with the 75 and felt I could beat anything, so I’m not really nervous going into the Top 8. Although I’m starting to get very tired….
Quarterfinal- Valakut
Two quick games, my opponent couldn’t really put anything together. Gnaw puts me far ahead in G2 and Valakut is not that good at playing defense. I think Dredge is significantly favored as long as you play a couple of Gnaw in the board.
2-0
Semifinal - Death’s Shadow Zoo (Sam Black)
I’m not very happy to play Death Shadow, as it’s probably the worst matchup for dredge among Tier 1 decks. Plus, Sam knows Dredge inside out, so can’t expect much edge there. He’s a bit slow out of the gate G1, and I don’t attack too aggressively until I can finish him off with conflagrate. No Temur Battle Rage = clean win. G2 I’m a bit slow and he finds Death’s Shadow + TBR, not very close. Note: at this point, I’ve never lost this matchup when they fail to draw TBR and always lost when they did. By the time G3 comes, I’m very tired and make the worst play of the day by not mulliganing what is essentially a one lander with a looting and an axe. Iostream thought it was a terrible keep at the time and I have to agree with him. I ended having a decent draw but I was just a tad too slow to beat death’s shadow + TBR once again.
1-2
I was a bit disappointed of not giving me the best chance in the most important game, but I didn’t beat myself too hard and it was an amazing tournament overall.
I loved the list, manabase was fine all day, never lost a game because of it. Won multiple games on the back of Tome Scour, turning a five card hand into an insane opening. The 60 is great, although I need to find room to fit Cathartic Reunion. The SB was fine, but still up in the air.
I top 4 the US wmcq, lost to Sam black on death shadow. Went 8-1 in the Swiss, almost 300 players. Deck was great, dodged the hate and drew well. I'm too tired to post a report now but here is my list:
4 bloodghast
4 narcomeaba
4 prized amalgam
4 golgari grave troll
4 stinkweed imp
3 life from the loam
1 darkblast
I think Needle is a clean answer to Sword of Fire and Ice, but I don't think Stoneblade would run that. I'm always on the fence with regards to needle, sometimes it's the best draw, sometimes it's the worst.
I would definitely keep lords and cursecatcher. I think image and harbinger are cleary worse in this matchups.
4 Cursecatcher
4 Silvergill Adept
3 Harbinger of the Tides
3 Phantasmal Image
4 Lord of Atlantis
4 Master of the Pearl Trident
4 True-Name Nemesis
4 Chalice of the Void
4 Aether Vial
2 Umezawa's Jitte
4 Force of Will
Sideboard:
2 Grafdigger's Cage
1 Pithing Needle
2 Relic of Progenitus
2 Flusterstorm
3 Swan Song
3 Wasteland
2 Dismember
I like how pretty the mainboard is The sideboard is still way up in the air.
Just an update, I played 5-6 fresh new games vs Jeskai Stoneblade today. The match was way closer, I was not steamrolled at all or I ground out wins. The sample is super small of course but I'll explain the strategy:
I sided out all the artifacts this time around:
-4 Chalice of the Void (probably okay but removing all artifacts made his artifact removal dead in his deck)
-4 Aether Vial (just dead in this attrition match up)
-2 Umezawa's Jitte (Hard to get online when he's killing each creature one at a time. Also mana intensive)
In:
+2 Relic of Progenitus (you can crack in response to removal)
+2 Dismember
+2 Flusterstorm
+1 Swan Song
+3 Wastelands (The most unexpected game changer. Either he plays duals, which in unavoidable sometimes, or he fetches basics. The Basics made my opponent's entire game plan way less flexible. For example U,U,W,R cannot even cast Supreme Verdict but he'll want double blue for Dig Through Time or casting multiple cantrips in the same turn. Wastelanding lands helped prevent him from hard casting Batterskull or Supreme Verdict. The threat of being Wastelanded slowed my opponent's game plan to our speed.)
I could be wrong about removing Chalice as he's still playing Pyroblast, Swords to Plowshares, Brainstorm, Ponder, and Bolt. It just felt so bad when he had an answer to it every game, or could Dig Through Time for one. Therefore I preferred to leave my opponent with dead cards in the deck.
Just throwing it out there for critique. Plus maybe people can give me some better sideboard ideas. My sideboard for example might not be balanced overall for the Legacy metagame for all I know. I'm also coming around to trying out Echoing Truth but it needs to be a 2x or I'm not going to bother with it
Glad to see you're getting more involved in Legacy
Some comments on your sideboard:
- with sneak and show gone, flusterstorm is much better than swan song. Easy swap IMO.
- given how the metagame evolved in the past year, I would also replace 1 cage by the 3rd relic. Relic is great agains DRS/goyf and Lands and better against Storm, and you want to draw as many copies as possible. Cage is only better against Elves and Dredge, and I feel that has become too narrow.
- i have to agree with fanattic, I don't think all these wasteland are worth it in the SB. I think the effect is powerful enough to deserve a couple of slots in the MD, but it's really just a tool to beat some cards, not an alternative plan. If you play 4 vial main, you can afford to play 2 wastelands out of your 21 lands (hmm, actually if you play that many harbinger, maybe you can afford to play only one...)
Given you build, I'd play 4 Cavern, 4 mutavault, 1 wasteland and 12 islands. And 4 vials please with all these harbingers :)!
I personally really like to fit 2 cliques in the 75: it's great against stoneforge, it's greats against show and tell, and it's great against miracles. This card is just so much better in Legacy than in Modern.
My two cents on how to SB vs stoneblade:
- I think you are over-boarding. I would keep all four chalice, I like it much better than swan song or flusterstorm. I would board out 1 image, 1 force for 2 dismember, and 1 jitte for 1 relic (maybe a second, but 3 feels like to much for me with chalice). Good sideboard cards in this matchup are cliques and venser: threats + distruption is exactly what they don't want to see.
Also, in Legacy, you want to keep Vial much more often post board than in Modern (I sometimes board out 1, max 2 in extreme circumstances - boarding out all of them is completely out of the question). It's because, relative to other decks, our deck is SO MUCH MORE clunky in this format. Even against control decks like stoneblade, we need vial to keep up with their flurry of one mana spells. Vial is our chance to play more than 1 spell per turn. Again, play four in the maindeck...
1
I played a 25-players EE trial event last weekend, playing Legacy for the first time this year (I have just moved to a NYC).
I played a very streamlined list, with Copters and Harbinger filling in the flex spots. I didn't want try to predict the meta for an event of this size, so I preferred not to play any 1-ofs.
I squeezed in the top 8 at 8th place, lost to Infect in the quarterfinals. In the swiss, I beat Grixis Delver, Big Red and BR reanimator, losing to Aluren and Grixis Delver. Overall, I thought the deck was well positioned, althouhg I could have played some games better.
Not sure how good the sideboard was, of course I only played 6 matches.
Copters were good at beating down, I was happy enough with them that I'll keep playing them. Given the match-ups I faced, Harbinger were very solid, I will keep them in for now.
The list:
4 Cursecatcher
4 Silvergil adept
4 Lord of Atlantis
4 Master of the Pearl Trident
4 True Name Nemesis
3 Phantasmal Image
3 Harbinger of the tide
4 Aether vial
4 Force of will
3 Chalice of the Void
3 Smugglers's Copter
4 Mutavault
3 Cavern of Souls
13 Islands
SB: 2 Relic, 2 cage, 2 dismember, 1 echoing truth, 2 vendilion clique, 2 wasteland, 1 surgical extraction, 2 umezawa's jitte, 1 pithing needle
I was very happy with playing so many islands (to fight wasteland and blood moon) and keeping wasteland in the SB was fine. I would add a fourth cavern though, was one of the cards I wanted to see most. Personally, I really want a manabase that can ensure a turn 3 TNN as often as possible.
Thanks, this thread is great!
1
Given that ggt is gone, neonate is less consistent as an enabler.
I have a good rainbow list for those who are looking to try. It still goldfishes extremely well:
4 bloodghast
4 narcomeaba
4 prized amalgam
4 golgari thug
4 stinkweed imp
3 life from the loam
1 darkblast
4 faithless lootings
4 tome scour
2 insolent neonate
4 cathartic reunion
2 conflagrate
1 flex (rally/Haunted dead/3rd conflagrate)
1 dakmore salvage
3 spirebuff canal
2 copperline gorge
1 mountain
4 city of brass
4 gemstone mine
4 mana confluence
The manabase has been polished for a while. The mana is quite good, although not perfect of course.
Sideboard depends on the evolution of the meta.
Thanks!
1
2
Decklist is here:
http://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/archive/wmcq-top-8-decklists/united-states-september-2016
A few words about the list: I play Tome Scour and rainbow lands since the beginning, working with iostream on the deck. The rainbow lands have minimal cost and Tome Scour really does wonder for the deck (more on this below).
About the tournament: I wanted to play Dredge for this event, as it was clear that people would be underprepared for it after a sequence of bad performances. I was right beyond any expectations and I saw no cages or RIP the whole day. Only three scoozes, one kalitas and one anger of the gods. Needless to say I had a deck advantage over 90% of the room.
I went 8-1 in the swiss so of course I had variance on my side, I drew and dredged well all day. Beyond that, the last factor that really help my finish was the mulligan strategy. I mulliganned almost systematically and won many games on 5 or even 4 cards. Really, you want to have a fast start, and it’s worth always shipping back seven card hands with only one enabler. For anyone wanting to improve with the deck, that’s a key margin to boost your win percentage.
Side note: this is exactly why Tome Scour shines. It allows to mulligan aggressively and still have playable four cards hands in a way that neonate or voice cannot guarantee. This is huge in practice, and many people underrate tome scour because this upside it’s not obvious by just looking at the card itself. End of side note.
Now the games (sorry for forgetting some details):
Round 1 - Lantern
Guy was nice but clearly had no idea how to play against dredge. He made a few small misplays, and I had a fast draw both games backed up by conflagrate.
2-0, 1-0
Round 2 - Jund
Game 1 I had a good start and he was behind the whole game, with only goyf bolt and Liliana of the Last Hope. Game 2 took a long time, where he played Kalitas twice, but I killed it twice with conflagrate and then lightning axe. I grind him out by playing gravetrolls, I had to play really tight but I finished him with zero cards left, dredging the last three to find a lethal rally.
2-0, 2-0
Round 3 - Affinity
Lost G1 to a great draw. He couldn’t beat darkblast G2. G3 I was behind the whole game, but eventually started to turn it around. I decided to tap out to flashback lootings facing a two turn clock etched champion in order to apply some pressure, but find myself dead to a topdecked plating, with grudge sitting in my yard. It was the only card that would save him, but maybe I did play too aggressively.
1-2, 2-1
Round 4 - WG Tron
G1 goes very long, I’m able to fight through karn and wurmcoil engine, but I eventually mill myself by dredging too much for no reason. Big mistake, should have thought more ahead. G2 he looses in spite of Ugin and oblivion stone, he misplayed by not playing a second O-stone. We have five minutes left for G3, but fortunately I have a great draw and run him over.
2-1, 3-1
Round 5 – Infect
G1 he mulligans and has a poor draw with only a nexus and misses a land drop after double probe. Not close. G2 he draws too many lands, and has to spend his pump spell to save blighted agent from conflagrate. I fade become immense and win next turn.
2-0, 4-1
Round 6 – Valakut
My first RG Valakut opponent of the day. I believe we split the first two games, as I have a very slow G2 (possibly a one lander). G3 goes long, I gain tons of life with gnaw to the bone and he has to play defensively. I reanimate a large grave troll, and he tries to kill it with four valakut triggers only for me to regenerate it. After this misstep, he’s way too far behind to have a shot.
2-1, 5-1
Round 7 – Valakut
I’m paired against Oliver Tiu, who plays the same deck from Worlds, who he actually got from my last round opponent. I know he doesn’t have any serious hate. G1 is absurd: I mulligan down to 4 with a hand that has lands but no action (but can hardcast amalgam). I’m expecting to loose quickly has he ramps very quickly to five lands. I’m considering not playing anything beyond my copperline gorge to keep him in the dark, but when I draw lootings I decide to try the 1% win. He plays scapeshift next turn, I fully expect to die but he can’t show me enough mountains! He drew one too many and deals zero damage, loosing next turn to rally the peasants. G2 is easy as I protect my self with gnaw to the bone and beat an anger exiling triple bloodghast without much trouble. Very nice guy.
2-0, 6-1
Round 8 - Melira Company
I hope this is a win and in (turned out it will not be) and I’m not happy to face Melira combo. I have a decent draw G1 with pressure and conflagrate, but he draws enough company, chord and combo pieces to gain infinite life. G2 he keeps a one lander with birds and looses to darkblast. G3 is drawn out, I play to my outs, keeping his board as clear as possible with darkblast and conflagrate. I make a mistake on dividing the damages from the second conflagrate, not seeing that he can use the haunt ability of his pontiff to save his melira. Fortunately, he misses it too and realizes it too late. He tries not to tilt and come back in the game but I have too much pressure and win by a close margin. Pfew!
2-1, 7-1
Round 9 – Jund
We have to play, and I’m told he’s on Jund. His 75 has very little against dredge. G1 he goes Turn 2 ooze on the play, but I have darkblast in hand to kill it on my second turn. After that, he is not able to put up any defense in both games.
2-0, 8-1
Wow! From round 6 onwards, it was clear I had one of the best decks in the room for the day. Variance went my way of course, but the only match I lost was from a very close game. I was very happy with the 75 and felt I could beat anything, so I’m not really nervous going into the Top 8. Although I’m starting to get very tired….
Quarterfinal- Valakut
Two quick games, my opponent couldn’t really put anything together. Gnaw puts me far ahead in G2 and Valakut is not that good at playing defense. I think Dredge is significantly favored as long as you play a couple of Gnaw in the board.
2-0
Semifinal - Death’s Shadow Zoo (Sam Black)
I’m not very happy to play Death Shadow, as it’s probably the worst matchup for dredge among Tier 1 decks. Plus, Sam knows Dredge inside out, so can’t expect much edge there. He’s a bit slow out of the gate G1, and I don’t attack too aggressively until I can finish him off with conflagrate. No Temur Battle Rage = clean win. G2 I’m a bit slow and he finds Death’s Shadow + TBR, not very close. Note: at this point, I’ve never lost this matchup when they fail to draw TBR and always lost when they did. By the time G3 comes, I’m very tired and make the worst play of the day by not mulliganing what is essentially a one lander with a looting and an axe. Iostream thought it was a terrible keep at the time and I have to agree with him. I ended having a decent draw but I was just a tad too slow to beat death’s shadow + TBR once again.
1-2
I was a bit disappointed of not giving me the best chance in the most important game, but I didn’t beat myself too hard and it was an amazing tournament overall.
I loved the list, manabase was fine all day, never lost a game because of it. Won multiple games on the back of Tome Scour, turning a five card hand into an insane opening. The 60 is great, although I need to find room to fit Cathartic Reunion. The SB was fine, but still up in the air.
Thanks for reading! This thread is great!
1
4 bloodghast
4 narcomeaba
4 prized amalgam
4 golgari grave troll
4 stinkweed imp
3 life from the loam
1 darkblast
4 faithless lootings
4 insolent neonate
4 tome scour
2 tormenting voice
1 rally the peasants
2 conflagrate
2 dakmore salvage
2 shivan reef
2 copperline gorge
1 mountain
4 city of brass
4 gemstone mine
4 mana confluence
Sideboard
4 lightning axe
3 ancient grudge
2 gnaw to the bone
2 darkblast
1 rally the peasants
2 collective brutality
1 natural state
Tome scour was great all day.
1
I would definitely keep lords and cursecatcher. I think image and harbinger are cleary worse in this matchups.
1
Glad to see you're getting more involved in Legacy
Some comments on your sideboard:
- with sneak and show gone, flusterstorm is much better than swan song. Easy swap IMO.
- given how the metagame evolved in the past year, I would also replace 1 cage by the 3rd relic. Relic is great agains DRS/goyf and Lands and better against Storm, and you want to draw as many copies as possible. Cage is only better against Elves and Dredge, and I feel that has become too narrow.
- i have to agree with fanattic, I don't think all these wasteland are worth it in the SB. I think the effect is powerful enough to deserve a couple of slots in the MD, but it's really just a tool to beat some cards, not an alternative plan. If you play 4 vial main, you can afford to play 2 wastelands out of your 21 lands (hmm, actually if you play that many harbinger, maybe you can afford to play only one...)
Given you build, I'd play 4 Cavern, 4 mutavault, 1 wasteland and 12 islands. And 4 vials please with all these harbingers :)!
I personally really like to fit 2 cliques in the 75: it's great against stoneforge, it's greats against show and tell, and it's great against miracles. This card is just so much better in Legacy than in Modern.
My two cents on how to SB vs stoneblade:
- I think you are over-boarding. I would keep all four chalice, I like it much better than swan song or flusterstorm. I would board out 1 image, 1 force for 2 dismember, and 1 jitte for 1 relic (maybe a second, but 3 feels like to much for me with chalice). Good sideboard cards in this matchup are cliques and venser: threats + distruption is exactly what they don't want to see.
Also, in Legacy, you want to keep Vial much more often post board than in Modern (I sometimes board out 1, max 2 in extreme circumstances - boarding out all of them is completely out of the question). It's because, relative to other decks, our deck is SO MUCH MORE clunky in this format. Even against control decks like stoneblade, we need vial to keep up with their flurry of one mana spells. Vial is our chance to play more than 1 spell per turn. Again, play four in the maindeck...