All users will need to merge their MTGSalvation account with a new or existing Twitch account starting Sept 25th. You can merge your accounts by clicking here. Have questions? Learn more here.
Dismiss
 
MTGSalvation's Deckbuilder is Here!
 
Unstable Q&A with Mark Rosewater
 
The Dos and Don'ts of Silver-Border Commander
  • posted a message on Dredgevine
    Matt Nass uploaded some very insightful (and super fun to watch) matches in preparation for GP OKC: https://www.twitch.tv/mattnassty/videos/all

    I suggest you watch the latest video if you want to check out the final version he decided on. It's very similar to my current one save a few flexspots. I'm also in the midst of testing for a bigger tournament I'm attending next month, so I'll keep you guys updated on my playgroup's findings Smile
    Posted in: Developing Competitive (Modern)
  • posted a message on Dredgevine
    Quote from Mazereon »
    The wall of text I was about to post just got deleted somehow.
    Basically what I was saying is, that after a long break from this deck without thinking to come back here again I came up with a 5 color deathvine list thanks to a friends idea.
    The SB and the manabase are still in the process of optimization but the main is pretty much settled and I really enjoy it. It can be very explosive but also fall back on a DS plan which I quite enjoy.
    I am on my phone so here is a link to my decklist. Suggestions and constructive criticism are very welcome.

    www.mtgvault.com/mazereon/decks/5-color-death-vine/


    Looks good! Do you think the blue and white splashes are worth it? Do you really ever have mana open for Denial? Is Stony Silence that much better than 2 additional Ancient Grudge?
    Posted in: Developing Competitive (Modern)
  • posted a message on Dredgevine
    There's an interesting new take on the deck, found here: https://www.channelfireball.com/videos/channel-pardee-time-modern-goryos-vinegence/

    I've been looking to replace my LolTrolls and Gravecrawlers in my Jund list and this looks like the perfect fit for that plan.
    Posted in: Developing Competitive (Modern)
  • posted a message on Dredgevine
    Nice writeup. Please do put together a matchup guide! I'm very interested in that and am sure it will be a great addition to the Primer.

    Speaking of which, maybe we should update the primer. I won't have time to do that before October, but would generally be willing to write down some things like a summary of the different versions and their up- and downsides.

    Quick reminder: I'm also going to Hamburg this Friday to play the Mkm Series and will report back next Monday.
    Posted in: Developing Competitive (Modern)
  • posted a message on Dredgevine
    I had a flexspot in my list, ever since I noticed how terrible LolTrolls are in multiples, that I decided to fill with a one-of Blood Scrivener. I'll do some testing tomorrow and hope to draw it, I guess. I'll also keep track of when it would have been live.

    Any thoughts on this tech?
    Posted in: Developing Competitive (Modern)
  • posted a message on Dredgevine
    Quote from Dramamine »


    Glad you found your way back here. The meta obviously has completely changed, so I suggest you watch some GP Top8s or just browse through the Modern Forum here on Salvation. If you want to know what this deck currently looks like, read through the couple dozen or so pages of this primer.

    Basically, there are three different 'established' Vengevine decks right now:
    A variant including dredge, centred around Stinkweed Imp, Bloodghast, Gravecrawler, Prized Amalgam, and Vengevine.
    Then there's a dredgeless r/g list running Vengevine, Hollow One, and cheap aggressive creatures like Monastery Swiftspear and Goblin Guide, as well as Temur Battle Rage, Become Immense, and Hooting Mandrills.
    Finally there's a Jund list running Hollow One, Vengevine, Tasigur, the Golden Fang, Bloodghast, and synergistic interaction like Collective Brutality.

    Hope this helps.


    Thanks for the info!

    I did look up some of the cards being thrown around this thread. Kind of unsure about wanting to keep with a dredge version really. It just doesn't do what I like enough. Probably going to look into a Jund version. What's the significance of this Tasigur, the Golden Fang? Is it just the delve or what?


    Yeah, it's a Gurmag Angler that costs one less. Those are kind of the new Tarmogoyfs in Modern right now. Turns out, 1 mana 4/5s & 5/5s are good.
    Posted in: Developing Competitive (Modern)
  • posted a message on Dredgevine
    Quote from Dramamine »
    Hi all. I've been away from Magic for a while (3-4 years) and haven't kept up with any new cards really but I've decided to come back.
    Before I left I had a great interest in Dredgevine and built a copy of it. I think my deck is probably pretty outdated but I was curious if anyone could take a look and see if there's any glaring issues/good replacements for anything.

    Thank you kindly!
    Also, my mana base is very wonky. I was working with what I had at the time. Open to suggestions everywhere!



    Glad you found your way back here. The meta obviously has completely changed, so I suggest you watch some GP Top8s or just browse through the Modern Forum here on Salvation. If you want to know what this deck currently looks like, read through the couple dozen or so pages of this primer.

    Basically, there are three different 'established' Vengevine decks right now:
    A variant including dredge, centred around Stinkweed Imp, Bloodghast, Gravecrawler, Prized Amalgam, and Vengevine.
    Then there's a dredgeless r/g list running Vengevine, Hollow One, and cheap aggressive creatures like Monastery Swiftspear and Goblin Guide, as well as Temur Battle Rage, Become Immense, and Hooting Mandrills.
    Finally there's a Jund list running Hollow One, Vengevine, Tasigur, the Golden Fang, Bloodghast, and synergistic interaction like Collective Brutality.

    Hope this helps.
    Posted in: Developing Competitive (Modern)
  • posted a message on Dredgevine
    Yeah, that's tricky. Running Looting, Reunion, Neonate, and Street Wraith should be enough discard for Hollow One, but Thought Scour, although great with delve, does nothing for parts of the deck. I like it, nevertheless, because fuelling delve while also putting Vines in the gy sounds great. Snapcaster gets much worse without hand disruption, so I wouldn't run it if you decide to remove the latter. Lastly, between Tasigur, Angler, Hollow One, Neonate, and Jace you should have enough low-drops for Vengevine, so Gravecrawler might not be worth the slots. On the other hand, it's another card that would work well with Thought Scour. But then you would also need to up your zombie-count...
    Posted in: Developing Competitive (Modern)
  • posted a message on Dredgevine
    Quote from Mazereon »
    I haven't had much time lately, but I read through the last couple pages and the UBR idea really caught my eye.

    What are your thoughts of a list with cards like baby Jace, potentially thought scour (fuelling delve creatures) tasigur, angler, maybe even main deck discard or counter magic?
    Basically a grixis DS deck, just more explosives and without the DS, to conserve our lifetotal.
    As sakura maple said the list would be more versatile and slower but could put an extreme amount of power onto the board.
    I haven't had any time to test in the last couple of weeks, so I hope you guys can clarify if this could be good enough or is just not good enough.


    Edit:
    Maybe something like this:
    www.mtgvault.com/mazereon/decks/grixis-hollowvine/

    Gravcrawler could be cut for deaths shadow and with the inclusion of DS, Gurmag angler would become less appealing, and we could play Hooting mandrils instead.


    I'd eliminate green entirely and cut Gravecrawler for Snapcaster. You might also want to reconsider the discard package. The rule of thumb in Modern usually is go with 7 of them or none at all.
    Posted in: Developing Competitive (Modern)
  • posted a message on Dredgevine
    Quote from Skitzafreak »
    Second update:
    After some more playtesting, I decided to cut the Gravecrawlers as the list doesn't run enough zombies anymore. This also makes Lotleth Troll worse, so I cut one of these as well. LolTroll is still good, imo, because chaining them with a one-drop while also discarding Vines is a common line of play. Additionally, they're simply great in Modern rn and only really 'bad' in white matchups. I like running a couple.
    With 4 Crawlers and a single Troll out, I'm now running 2 Legion Loyalists and 3 Flameblade Adepts. The Adepts might be a little too cute, so maybe I'll try out Goblin Guides if I find enough time until the tournament. Adept looks promising, though. 1-4 power on a menacing one-drop should be decent in this deck.

    It's weird, part of me feels like cutting all the Gravecrawlers is a mistake. Maybe go from 4 down to 2? The Lotleth Troll + Gravecrawler Vengevine recursion plan just seems too good to completely cut out, especially if you're going to keep in at least 3 of the Trolls.


    You're probably right. I contemplated going down to 2, but that felt suuuper weird. Might be correct, though. That way it's more of a combo than an actual engine, but the few slots are worth it. I'll run a 3/2-split of LolTroll/Crawler and report back Smile
    Posted in: Developing Competitive (Modern)
  • posted a message on Dredgevine
    Quote from Silverchild »
    In exactly 4 weeks I'm going to a big tournament in Hamburg, Germany. This sadly means that I have to settle on a final list in the next one or two weeks, so that I can get all the cards I need in time. I'm planning on running a Jund list with Bloodghasts and Gravecrawler. Do any of you have final recommendations for me before I order the missing pieces? Is Lili worth a shot?


    Any update on that list?


    Also trying a jund list with bloodghasts right now.


    Second update:
    After some more playtesting, I decided to cut the Gravecrawlers as the list doesn't run enough zombies anymore. This also makes Lotleth Troll worse, so I cut one of these as well. LolTroll is still good, imo, because chaining them with a one-drop while also discarding Vines is a common line of play. Additionally, they're simply great in Modern rn and only really 'bad' in white matchups. I like running a couple.
    With 4 Crawlers and a single Troll out, I'm now running 2 Legion Loyalists and 3 Flameblade Adepts. The Adepts might be a little too cute, so maybe I'll try out Goblin Guides if I find enough time until the tournament. Adept looks promising, though. 1-4 power on a menacing one-drop should be decent in this deck.
    Posted in: Developing Competitive (Modern)
  • posted a message on Dredgevine
    Quote from Silverchild »
    Have you tried switching tasigur for gurmag angler? Tasigur has a great ability, but you lose on the zombie subtype. I think it might be more relevant and will improve your consistency in recurring the vines.


    Skitza has done some great testing on that a few pages back. I recommend everyone take a look at it!

    In short, Angler is basically uncastable on t2, whereas Tasigur is very consistent. The subtype and extra toughness are very relevant, but not enough to warrant having to wait a turn to cast it.
    Posted in: Developing Competitive (Modern)
  • posted a message on Dredgevine
    Quote from D90Dennis14 »
    About adding more zombies, why not Prized Amalgam ?
    It is trickier to get back compared to Bloodghast but offers more support for Gravecrawler and is also triggered by Vengevine.

    Also, is Flamewake Phoenix a good enough recursive threat ?
    It might be easier to get back than Prized Amalgam but isn't free and has the same problem of Bloodghast as being unable to block (an occasionally suiciding itself into bigger flyers).


    We used to run Amalgam, but I cut it because it was dead too often. It's close, but I think it's not consistent enough in this kind of deck.

    Someone tested Phoenix, I believe, but the general consensus was that it isn't good enough. A little too cute.
    Posted in: Developing Competitive (Modern)
  • posted a message on Dredgevine
    Quote from Skitzafreak »
    What I noticed is that I don't have enough zombies for Gravecrawler anymore. As mentioned before, I've been looking for a replacement, but have not settled on one yet. I'm going to start testing Flameblade Adept. I've also been super happy with the mb interaction because we need to deal with some threats to not get combo'ed out or overrun sometimes. Running black for removal and potent sb options feels great and I encourage everyone to at least try it.


    While I wouldn't run a playset of them, Legion Loyalist seems hilarious as a 1-drop for the deck if you're looking to add more. Adding the Trample and First Strike to the Vengevines is definitely relevant, and making our opponents unable to block with random Lingering Souls tokens just seems like added gravy. Honestly I'd probably run max of 2, but hey, worth a try am I right?


    Good idea, I'll test them!
    Posted in: Developing Competitive (Modern)
  • posted a message on Dredgevine
    Quote from Silverchild »
    In exactly 4 weeks I'm going to a big tournament in Hamburg, Germany. This sadly means that I have to settle on a final list in the next one or two weeks, so that I can get all the cards I need in time. I'm planning on running a Jund list with Bloodghasts and Gravecrawler. Do any of you have final recommendations for me before I order the missing pieces? Is Lili worth a shot?


    Any update on that list?


    Also trying a jund list with bloodghasts right now.


    Yes, my current list looks like this:



    I tested again today and will do a couple of gauntlets against all the relevant decks during the weekend.

    What I noticed is that I don't have enough zombies for Gravecrawler anymore. As mentioned before, I've been looking for a replacement, but have not settled on one yet. I'm going to start testing Flameblade Adept. I've also been super happy with the mb interaction because we need to deal with some threats to not get combo'ed out or overrun sometimes. Running black for removal and potent sb options feels great and I encourage everyone to at least try it.
    Posted in: Developing Competitive (Modern)
  • To post a comment, please or register a new account.