It is a fine balance trying to run the right amount of fat and damage accelerants.
I'm facing more Slaughters than Forbids in my meta, so I'm not needing a Vexing Shusher yet. It is nice though that three of my four protection cards stop both!
I have considered Panglacial Wurm (and own one), but I'm going for draw power because when I'm in topdeck mode, it's gonna take more than one fatty to get the job done. It has a chance of going back in though, especially if I end up getting more fetches! (the reason why I didn't have it before was in fact before the fetch land reprint!). It is actually a solid suggestion and may bump out Wilderness Elemental if I can easily drop him at instant speed.
I think I'd play five protection spells max if needed. The fifth will probably be Vines of Vastwood. It is one-shot but it would definitely throw off my opponents calculations if done right.
Lastly, I'm editing the original post frequently. Adding stuff you might expect out of a primer. I'm hoping my Purph analysis is somewhat correct. I've never actually played against it.
People were proliferating Tibalt for the hell of it, but the ult threatened the one person with really good board presence. So naturally, the owner of said Tibalt died a horrible death.
I've had actual experience playing Mana Reflection and Vernal Bloom together. Basically, the enchantment is the source of your extra mana, not the land. So you would only add three mana per forest.
It's a good way to tell what would have been maindeck worthy if you actually had space for the options.
I haven't been paying attention to the deck lately. I traded my Jace because its price was super inflated and I'm working on making Xenagos harder to stop via the method of throwing every kill spell at it.
I have a lot of enchantment and artifact removal as is, so cutting one doesn't feel THAT bad. Acidic Slime is still a solid card and if I need to fit it back in, I will find a way. I don't normally like cutting any removal but I'm doing it for draw then I'm likely to see the other removal spells more often.
As for the primer, I need more experience fighting in the face of hate before I can feel confident about beginning the primer process. Currently the deck has no issues finding ramp and throwing down damage. It excels at both. The current issues are keeping up in card advantage for the mid-late game and making sure I can execute my plan in spite of peoples attempts to stop me. Hence I have so much focus on finding decent anti-control cards. Less so on stopping counterspells (although stopping those is a bonus!) and more for stopping point removal. I'm looking into Asceticism. It costs a lot for what it does but I might still need the effect badly enough. Archetype of Endurance costs 8 and the body is hard to abuse even in a deck like this.
As far as creature resilience goes, in this deck, you want hexproof over indestructible, and indestrucible over regen. Regen fails pretty hard to exile and a lot of old-school black removal. Indestructible fails to bounce and exile but is better against sweepers. However, this deck is naturally sweep resilient because we don't have to play more threats than necessary. So targeting denial is the best of the three.
Lastly, as my playtest buddy learned the hard way, the absolute most important decision to make is WHO TO KILL FIRST. If you pick poorly, the person you should have attacked will gear up to stop you.
Also, I'm close to completing my master playset of Khans fetches. That means I now have spares for this deck. Sure, it may not be flavorful, but you really don't want to get color screwed. Also, they aren't really THAT necessary. I just have em.
Let someone borrow the deck and he played it all day. He made a lot of sequencing errors, but I still got good data. He REALLY loves the deck. I might need to create a "budget budget" version.
I was playing a different one and got killed super hard by my own deck via a Savage Ventmaw in one turn because of Seize the Day. He almost drew 64 cards but since he killed me he didn't force the removal by attacking the person that had it to avoid a 2 for 1.
Things that tested super well: Reforge the Soul: Wheel did well. It sometimes gasses your opponents but it's a okay way for them to lay off of you for a turn (unless that person is your target). Draw density is too important. What you get out of it is essential and it sometimes wrecks peoples hands. Dense Foliage: I had to remind players numerous times that they couldn't shoot my stuff due to this card. Every time someone tries, I have to say "Nope, Dense Foliage".
Things that tested poorly: Elemental Bond: Only drew 2 cards. I don't have a 3/3 token generator to make this insane. Nissa's Revelation: I play a lower fatty density than the Xenagod decks here, so this can whiff more often. And, like See the Written, you NEVER want it to.
Things I didn't get to try: Evolutionary Leap: The theory of playing this card still seems good, but the player misplayed and didn't exploit it to its full potential. Siege Behemoth: Didn't really get to see it. But the theory is so strong that I expect to permanently keep it.
Notable moments: The guy had the Kessig Wolf Run + Rapacious One combo so he precombat pumped to kill a guy for 30 damage, then an extra combat killed another guy for 60 damage. Afterwards he was sitting on 90 Eldrazi spawns. If he had another red, he would have killed a third person and had 180 Eldrazi Spawns!
Change:
- Acidic Slime: I think the card is still good enough to play, but I've been seeing far fewer Maze of Ith recently. However, if you see it often, you should still keep a decent land D package.
+ Reforge the Soul: Eight big draw spells now. Nonconditional in all forms.
Lastly, it is possible for me to eventually make this into a Primer? I may need to find some time to do some touchups and add more content.
I might just be getting unlucky in all my games because I have seven "big" draw sources in the deck. One of which is nonconditional (Wheel of Fortune)
I have about 14-15 big "threats", so for every two I find I should be getting one of those draw sources. Personally, I would ideally want ten draw sources, but that's fairly hard to do. I'll test Soul of the Harvest if I can reacquire one. I will also test Elemental Bond and Nissa's Revelation. I'll test Ohran Viper later while I scope out how often I can actually connect with it early game. Nissa's Revelation seems like the best of the options in a vacuum because it's a better late-game topdeck than the others. With how much I try and sequence my early game plays, I rarely have nothing to do early game, but a lot of my deck is also not live late game.
There's also Reforge the Soul as wheel #2. Considering that I empty my hand rather fast, wheels tend to be good here. I actually like that option too.
This is true. Managorger Hydra is at its absolute worst as a topdeck in a deck where there's a lot of bad topdecks. It's still better than something that gets a mana source in that it can act as a draw conduit or a pressure tool later, but you can't really abuse the double power + haste the turn you play it. You literally have to take a turn off, and that is a big downside compared to a card like Wilderness Elemental.
And yes, most of my simple "attackers" will grant other bonuses such as extra damage, attacks, evasive damage, or a way to advance my board position. That's why it is easy to make a case for cards like Rapacious One. The ones that don't simply do hideous amounts of damage when they connect.
These are the two that don't usually have either, and time will tell if I can find anything better in the 5-6 mana range to replace them. But I like having 3-drop plays because I can't always get a Xenagod on turn 3. A turn 4 one will give me a chance to play one of these and have it be ready to swing on turn 4.
I don't play Terra Stomper because... well.. I kind of have enough attackers that simply act as "plain beaters".. but many of them cost only three mana, grant other benefits, or just plain hit for A LOT more than just 16. And honestly, Malignus is kind of the poster child for the deck. It's pretty unplayable everywhere else, but people are scared when they see it here.
However, it's pretty serviceable and it'll do a decent job. Go try it. You definitely can cut something of yours for this card.
I'm also making one quick change I forgot to make. I still need to acquire some cards I haven't gotten from my last update.
Remove Hunter's Prowess for Hunter's Insight. Similar cards, but one costs 2 more. I have enough evasion now that I don't really need the trample bonus. I honestly wish there were simply more green card draw options, preferably power-based ones I can play postcombat. I ALWAYS end up wanting to see one. No, Life's Legacy isn't what I want. Not being able to sacrifice at instant speed is a big deal.
Lastly, 3rd time playing Managorger Hydra. Card overperformed yet again. PLAY THIS CARD. IT COSTS 3 MANA AND BECOMES BIGGER THAN TERRA STOMPER in just 1-2 turns. Ideally, you drop it before you play Xenagod for the first time, but it's not that terrible after because it costs 3 mana and you can kickstart its growth. Or just play it as the "backup fatty" and swing with another.
I will very rarely ever have three threats out at once. The only other time I'd ever have a huge number of creatures out is if I made a metric ton of Eldrazi Spawns via Rapacious One
I probably won't be playing it, but at least it does something to help a followup big guy if it shows up and your baloth is still alive.
Also added a section on why I don't play Berserk effects. However, I will admit that Temur Battle Rage does a pretty good impression of an expensive old green card. It's a legitimate card to try if your meta isn't killing everything you play on sight.
Heh. I built a Ghoulcaller Gisa list based around the same line of thought. Play a goodstuff list that can also swarm quickly if the option is there. However, I play multiple sub-themes. I do not contribute many cards purely to the "plan A" of generating a ton of zombies in a single activation, mostly because if you're dropping an Army of the Damned per activation you don't need a huge amount of help to be threatening. I supplement it by carrying a sacrifice theme with fodder that can self-recur and my beef I prefer to have evasion when possible. The reason for this is because the theme that unites all of mine are equipment pieces like Lashwrithe, Bonehoard, and Nightmare Lash. They give me the option to make metric tons of zombies or just suit up an evader and start hitting people.
And then the plan C is drain everyone with Gary/Koko.
I actually try not to play broken tutors or necro, because like your meta, they hate me for big plays, but mostly for the "I have a boardstate that will start killing everyone in short order" plays. I could optimize the list further but I'm gonna hold off of it for quite a while.
Currently tuning Xenagos, God of Revels to an appreciable standard for the MTGS playerbase and making a silly red-base etb deck as a "low power" deck for when I want to tone my own madness down a bit.
I'm facing more Slaughters than Forbids in my meta, so I'm not needing a Vexing Shusher yet. It is nice though that three of my four protection cards stop both!
I have considered Panglacial Wurm (and own one), but I'm going for draw power because when I'm in topdeck mode, it's gonna take more than one fatty to get the job done. It has a chance of going back in though, especially if I end up getting more fetches! (the reason why I didn't have it before was in fact before the fetch land reprint!). It is actually a solid suggestion and may bump out Wilderness Elemental if I can easily drop him at instant speed.
I think I'd play five protection spells max if needed. The fifth will probably be Vines of Vastwood. It is one-shot but it would definitely throw off my opponents calculations if done right.
Lastly, I'm editing the original post frequently. Adding stuff you might expect out of a primer. I'm hoping my Purph analysis is somewhat correct. I've never actually played against it.
People were proliferating Tibalt for the hell of it, but the ult threatened the one person with really good board presence. So naturally, the owner of said Tibalt died a horrible death.
I haven't been paying attention to the deck lately. I traded my Jace because its price was super inflated and I'm working on making Xenagos harder to stop via the method of throwing every kill spell at it.
As for the primer, I need more experience fighting in the face of hate before I can feel confident about beginning the primer process. Currently the deck has no issues finding ramp and throwing down damage. It excels at both. The current issues are keeping up in card advantage for the mid-late game and making sure I can execute my plan in spite of peoples attempts to stop me. Hence I have so much focus on finding decent anti-control cards. Less so on stopping counterspells (although stopping those is a bonus!) and more for stopping point removal. I'm looking into Asceticism. It costs a lot for what it does but I might still need the effect badly enough. Archetype of Endurance costs 8 and the body is hard to abuse even in a deck like this.
As far as creature resilience goes, in this deck, you want hexproof over indestructible, and indestrucible over regen. Regen fails pretty hard to exile and a lot of old-school black removal. Indestructible fails to bounce and exile but is better against sweepers. However, this deck is naturally sweep resilient because we don't have to play more threats than necessary. So targeting denial is the best of the three.
Lastly, as my playtest buddy learned the hard way, the absolute most important decision to make is WHO TO KILL FIRST. If you pick poorly, the person you should have attacked will gear up to stop you.
Also, I'm close to completing my master playset of Khans fetches. That means I now have spares for this deck. Sure, it may not be flavorful, but you really don't want to get color screwed. Also, they aren't really THAT necessary. I just have em.
- Mountain
- Forest
+ Windswept Heath
+ Bloodstained Mire
I was playing a different one and got killed super hard by my own deck via a Savage Ventmaw in one turn because of Seize the Day. He almost drew 64 cards but since he killed me he didn't force the removal by attacking the person that had it to avoid a 2 for 1.
Things that tested super well:
Reforge the Soul: Wheel did well. It sometimes gasses your opponents but it's a okay way for them to lay off of you for a turn (unless that person is your target). Draw density is too important. What you get out of it is essential and it sometimes wrecks peoples hands.
Dense Foliage: I had to remind players numerous times that they couldn't shoot my stuff due to this card. Every time someone tries, I have to say "Nope, Dense Foliage".
Things that tested poorly:
Elemental Bond: Only drew 2 cards. I don't have a 3/3 token generator to make this insane.
Nissa's Revelation: I play a lower fatty density than the Xenagod decks here, so this can whiff more often. And, like See the Written, you NEVER want it to.
Things I didn't get to try:
Evolutionary Leap: The theory of playing this card still seems good, but the player misplayed and didn't exploit it to its full potential.
Siege Behemoth: Didn't really get to see it. But the theory is so strong that I expect to permanently keep it.
Notable moments: The guy had the Kessig Wolf Run + Rapacious One combo so he precombat pumped to kill a guy for 30 damage, then an extra combat killed another guy for 60 damage. Afterwards he was sitting on 90 Eldrazi spawns. If he had another red, he would have killed a third person and had 180 Eldrazi Spawns!
Change:
- Acidic Slime: I think the card is still good enough to play, but I've been seeing far fewer Maze of Ith recently. However, if you see it often, you should still keep a decent land D package.
+ Reforge the Soul: Eight big draw spells now. Nonconditional in all forms.
Lastly, it is possible for me to eventually make this into a Primer? I may need to find some time to do some touchups and add more content.
Just don't eat a Massacre Wurm while you have this out and things will be fine.
I have about 14-15 big "threats", so for every two I find I should be getting one of those draw sources. Personally, I would ideally want ten draw sources, but that's fairly hard to do. I'll test Soul of the Harvest if I can reacquire one. I will also test Elemental Bond and Nissa's Revelation. I'll test Ohran Viper later while I scope out how often I can actually connect with it early game.
Nissa's Revelation seems like the best of the options in a vacuum because it's a better late-game topdeck than the others. With how much I try and sequence my early game plays, I rarely have nothing to do early game, but a lot of my deck is also not live late game.
There's also Reforge the Soul as wheel #2. Considering that I empty my hand rather fast, wheels tend to be good here. I actually like that option too.
However, neither that nor Rupture really work with the devourer.
And yes, most of my simple "attackers" will grant other bonuses such as extra damage, attacks, evasive damage, or a way to advance my board position. That's why it is easy to make a case for cards like Rapacious One. The ones that don't simply do hideous amounts of damage when they connect.
These are the two that don't usually have either, and time will tell if I can find anything better in the 5-6 mana range to replace them. But I like having 3-drop plays because I can't always get a Xenagod on turn 3. A turn 4 one will give me a chance to play one of these and have it be ready to swing on turn 4.
However, it's pretty serviceable and it'll do a decent job. Go try it. You definitely can cut something of yours for this card.
Gaea's Revenge I don't play precisely because there is no trample and the haste text is practically irrelevant in the deck.
Miren, the Moaning Well is not a bad card, but my list has a LOT of colorless lands already. I am currently playing
Kessig Wolf Run, Skarrg, the Rage Pits, Reliquary Tower, Strip Mine, Tectonic Edge, Haven of the Spirit Dragon.
If I wanted a seventh, it would be Ancient Tomb
I'm also making one quick change I forgot to make. I still need to acquire some cards I haven't gotten from my last update.
Remove Hunter's Prowess for Hunter's Insight. Similar cards, but one costs 2 more. I have enough evasion now that I don't really need the trample bonus. I honestly wish there were simply more green card draw options, preferably power-based ones I can play postcombat. I ALWAYS end up wanting to see one. No, Life's Legacy isn't what I want. Not being able to sacrifice at instant speed is a big deal.
Lastly, 3rd time playing Managorger Hydra. Card overperformed yet again. PLAY THIS CARD. IT COSTS 3 MANA AND BECOMES BIGGER THAN TERRA STOMPER in just 1-2 turns. Ideally, you drop it before you play Xenagod for the first time, but it's not that terrible after because it costs 3 mana and you can kickstart its growth. Or just play it as the "backup fatty" and swing with another.
So, Thunderfoot Baloth is pretty average on the Terra Stomper Scale
I probably won't be playing it, but at least it does something to help a followup big guy if it shows up and your baloth is still alive.
Also added a section on why I don't play Berserk effects. However, I will admit that Temur Battle Rage does a pretty good impression of an expensive old green card. It's a legitimate card to try if your meta isn't killing everything you play on sight.
And then the plan C is drain everyone with Gary/Koko.
I actually try not to play broken tutors or necro, because like your meta, they hate me for big plays, but mostly for the "I have a boardstate that will start killing everyone in short order" plays. I could optimize the list further but I'm gonna hold off of it for quite a while.
Mirrorworks + torpor orb so that you can pay 2 for redundant torpor orbs in case you want to play around removal that isn't stuck on a creature?