Once you have the legacy staples, crossing over to vintage as well is very simple. 10 proxy tournaments were huge for SCG, its not unreasonable to see these happening again in the future. Most of the vintage staples that aren't also played in legacy are very, very easy to get a hold of, power excluded.
And the amount of players playing the game only helps. The more people play the game in general, the more people there are going to be willing to shell out for vintage. No one is expecting vintage to crush standard popularity, but the return of a P9 series is a very real possibility, whether SCG puts it on, or someone else. Lest we forget vintage is also alive and well in Europe too.
First, sorry, yes I meant on site only. It never really went above 12 or 15 normally, but I meant on site. But the fact that it was onsite was kind of my point. I imagine a lot of SCG's current legacy sales are going to be on site. My point is these types of buys can benefit players to some extent for that reason.
The cards that are now super high though are usually staples. Wasteland sees so much play, as does Force. In many ways investing in these staples is very much like investing in power. They were really just undervalued before. I wish I had the time to compare the average cost of a deck like Canadian Thresh back in the day to a good legacy deck now, to a vintage deck back in the day, with say, 50% power. Then I could articulate what I mean a little clearer. I think more now, that building a legacy collection now is more like building a vintage collection was in the past, if you went for power. At any rate, you are correct about the difference in prices. Legacy is just the new vintage really. Vintage is due for a comeback though, and I expect it to happen when legacy hits the roof.
Basic economics really, something you learn in any 100 level Econ course. I think (and perhaps someone who has already posted has their Ph.D. in Economics and will put my foot in my mouth for me) that most of the people who are accusing SCG (or anyone really) of price-fixing really doesn't have a good grasp on how an economy works. If SCG ever prices things too high, people stop buying the cards. That hasn't happened yet. They sold out of Candelabras. Those things were priced 250 for NM and they had probably close to 10 in stock across various conditions. All gone. I really doubt that SCG pulled the stock on those after increasing the price. Once the prices get to high, people stop buying. For example, currently SCG has Bazaar of Baghdad at like 280 or something, where most ebay auctions are still ending under 200 (I'd say maybe 60%?). The Bazaar's aren't selling. Considering Ichorid is still the budget vintage deck, this shows that they are priced to high for current demand. (Now my personal guess is that since Bazaar's come in so rarely, they price them higher because eventually they do find buyers).
And just in case anyone forgot. In the golden age of vintage, people were showing up by the hundreds to play in SCG's power 9 tournaments. (I only ever got to play in the very last one, Ben, I know you're reading this, these need to come back! That trip (22 hour drive! though less than the 30 to GenCon) made up one of my best memories!) If you feel you are getting priced out of legacy, perhaps you need to be more patient with acquiring staples. Can you play legacy overnight? No, not really. You have to put a bit of time in acquiring these things. Ask any player with a big legacy collection, it took a while.
The idea that SCG can actually price fix is kind of silly. If other stores copy their prices and are able to sell, it means we were willing to pay that much! There is always a ceiling to what you will pay. It is magic cards we are talking about after all, not basic necessities of life. If legacy outprices you, it sucks, but if you really want to play, you'll put the work in to earning the money for the cards.
And To vouch for Ben, I did notice that most of these buy prices hadn't even changed, and even on some of the ones that had, the sell price didn't. I can remember being at the SCG tournament in Chicago for vintage, and I can say that it was a great relief to see how well stocked they were. If they had shown up with say, only 10 Tarmogoyf's that day, it would have been a catastrophe. (As it is, Illusionary Mask was the card of the day!). The only way to get 40 Tarmogoyf's in stock is to raise a buy price so people sell theirs.
Sidenote, sounds like Ben has probably the coolest job in the world. I've been studying Econ for 4 years now, about to graduate if I want (Debating taking a run at law school), and I really have no interest in most of the jobs available for it. His however, I would take in a heartbeat. Its like when you first learned that your math class could be applied to Storm Combo :).
EDIT: And for the situation, If SCG were to show up understocked in a hot card like Wasteland, well consider that at Pro-Tour who the heck cares, I remember the story was dealers sold out so fast, by the end Loxodon Hierarch was going for $40 a pop!
I don't follow? Increase what type of support? Do you not have enough dudes to feed to therapy or something?
I also don't understand how it can underperform. I don't think I've ever really been disappointed with it. That being said I'm not sure how you use your therapies, so maybe you need to adjust what you're naming typically, or perhaps you just have a very different way of playing the deck. I play it (the deck, not therapy) a lot more conservatively usually. I therapy pretty aggressive actually.
Cabal therapy is like the best card in the deck, why in the world would you cut it?:-/ I'd even cut breakthrough before therapy.
I don't like iona for the reason you just mentioned. Most of the time you have to call their removal colour, which often leaves the stuff you really wanted to stop available.
Um... if you want to DR a fatty (which often, you do, in my opinion), you just dread return one of your Grave-Trolls... the post two above mine already mentioned troll, but then the guy after didn't mention it. Also, I hear Iona, Terrastadon, and Angel of Despair are all pretty fair targets.
And its not even really a question that Grudge is better than stifle. Bog is super easy to see coming, and you can grudge twice...
The fatestitcher plan does seem reasonable. I understood how it works, not terrible difficult to figure out. I meant dread return targets moreso than dread returns themselves, but I didn't make that clear at all. I gotta question the nature's claims though. That seems weird. Wouldn't you rather just be playing unmask? I mean, if you're on the play, with fatestitcher, you can race a turn 2 vault. If you're on the draw, were you really going to not lead with bazaar? And don't you just not care what shops do?
I think I would make your main
-1 Iona
-2 Nature's Claim
- 3 Empty slots
+ 4 Unmask
+ 1 Ichorid
+ 1 Darkblast or something (I'd love to put 4 Chalices in, but no real point in 2)
I don't see what Iona does that is relevant. By the time you can cast dread return, you should just be winning the game. Unmask is always pretty sick.
Chalices are one of the reasons you are winning game 1, though. I mean some decks don't go off very fast, so you don't need too much disruption with them, but a lot of time vault decks and storm decks race you, and race you quite well, if you don't disrupt them at all. Recently at a local vintage tournament, turn 2 infinite turns happened multiple times against these new fancy ichorid decks that don't run enough disruption. (Ironically, in once case, ichorid one G2 & 3). Just something to think about. Personally I'd cut the fancy stuff and make it as simple and straightforward as possible. Though I literally haven't played the deck since before fatestitcher. I don't necessarily hate him, since he forces you to play lands, which makes it easier to make a sideboard with more hate, and he acts as a nice board card placeholder game 1. With the fatestitchers though, do you need as much dread return? don't you basically cycle enough of your deck to find them every time, or at worst enough therapies so your opp. is topdecking to not die?
Personally I think leyline is the most removable maindeck hate, depending on what your plan for the mirror is. I like Chalice Unmask and therapy though. Especially with all the shops, gush isn't as popular, and I think chalice was only bad during gush era, just because half the decks didn't even play full moxen...
Who knows though. I think I'm buying bazaars soon though, so i'll switch back from the legacy version then, and then maybe I'll actually have some evidence to support my guessing that isn't 4 years old. In other words, take every single word I said before this paragraph with a very large grain of salt, perhaps one the size of a sugar cube.
Small report about Champs today. (Saskatchewan, 39 people, average turnout for here. Small community, but lots of decent players, multiple with pro-tour experience)
Went 4-1-1 to top 8, losing in top 8, with this list (i think, its off memory here)
Basically Todd Anderson's list with 1 extra ravine to suit my playstyle and meta, and some sideboard changes, mostly due to card availability and the amount of RDW I was expecting
Round 1 (U/B Infect)
Good local players girlfriend, seemed like she played on her own accord, and not just because they were dating, but she still has a some learning to do. She was able to catch her big mistake though.
Game 1 I ramp kind of slow, anticipating a mana leak, and I had no pressure on me from her. I beat in with a Ravine and eventually stick a wurmcoil. She clones it, we trade some coil's and tokens. I land a 2nd Wurmcoil. She bounces it, but screws up and plays a tapped land so she couldn't play the hard counter in her hand. At this point I'm at like 8 poison counters so I'm dead next turn to her hand. Fortunately, her error lets me attact with ravine and a somewhat withered Wurmcoil get in for lethal.
I don't bother sideboarding, seemed like an easy match for me.
Game 2 I am now on the draw, and she is on a more aggressive draw. I am a little slower, but have a lightning bolt for her big poppa poison pump guy and land a titan shortly after, obliterating her board and killing her the next turn.
I probably would have still won game 1, since I had a trap in hand.
1-0 (2-0 games)
Round 2 (U/B Jace/Removal/Wurmcoil)
Local who I've tested with, so I know what to expect. I need lots of threats, since he has lots of counters, but he will NEVER put pressure on me, so I have all year to win.
I side out some lightning bolts for some Koth.
Game 1 He doesn't have counters for my ramp spells, but does for my first 2 Wurmcoil's and a Titan. Lucky ol' me had a 2nd Titan. I win. Some more stuff may have happened, but he did like absolutely nothing relevant but counter some stuff.
Game 2 He blows all his counters on my ramp, but again, no pressure, so I just stick another Titan (I Think) and kill him the turn after. Really quick and brutal match in my favour.
2-0 (4-0 Games)
Round 3 (Mirror, oh Joy)
Another reasonably good local, who woudl also top 8 today
I Win the die roll, seemed pretty key
Game 1 we both Ramp, but I land an avenger and he can't kill me, I win. Not much else to say really, the mirror game 1 is just a race. He also screws up here, (or game 3, I cant remember), where he pops his Khalni and only deals me 1 Valakut trigger instead of 2. I saw him do this once before, so I thought maybe he didn't understand the timing of it, but then he never questioned it when I did it).
I decide not to side in Pyroclasm, since I figure he has the tempo and can probably play around it with avenger. I bring in a couple naturalize for some Khalni's, and 2 Koths, just to get rid of the god-awful bolts.
Game 2 He does stuff before I do. Again, very simple race, and he wins it.
Game 3 I mull to 5, but still manage to pull it out. he actually Titans first, which wins me the game, since my Titan blows up his. He blows up mine again, and sticks a wurmcoil, which I then blow up, and play another Titan, or something like that. I get there somehow.
3-0 (6-1 games)
Round 4 (RDW, future loss in Top8)
Alright, a repairing and I'm still stuck playing him. I think this is a tough match for me if he gets goblin guide, and I am in for a treat.
Game 1 He mulls to 5, and I keep basically the stone nuts against him (Titan, lands, explore, bolt). No Wurmcoil, but I draw it soon. He does have the guide, but turn 2 Explore into Bolt up is enough advantage for me to win at a very comfortable 14 life, after coming in with a wurmcoil, getting it killed in a 3-1 for me, and then Titaning shortly after.
I board out some Khalni's (too slow) and Summoning traps for the red Removal spells.
Game 2 I survive the early game thanks to an Arc Trail, maybe a bolt too. I stick a Titan, and he doesn't get rid of it right away, or something like that. I blow up his field, and then him. I think I win on 10 life.
4-0 (8-1 games)
Round 5
Intentionally draw with the other 4-0, another strong local.
Round 6
Scoop in another strong local friend.
4-1-1 (8-1 games)
Top 8 (Same RDW Guy)
I think I misplayed twice here, but I think his draws just had me anyways.
Game 1 I Mull, and I think keep a poor hand. I should have mulled to 5 knowing how important lightning bolt is game 1. He gets double goblin guide and wrecks me before I can stabilize. Not much I could have done here.
My boarding strategy is identical.
Game 2 I mull again, keeping an cultivate/pyroclasm hand with 3 lands and one other card I can't remember.
He does nothing turn 1. Turn to he plays Kargan. Here was my dilemna. If I just play land 3, I can pass the turn, Bolt the Kargan on his turn, and cultivate the following turn. Or, I can cast cultivate, and let him swing with Kargan, and get my Titan going a turn sooner. The problem was Mark of Mutiny. AS it is, I bolt it, not cultivating that turn, and then stick titan two turns later. The turn after I cultivated, he played Koth. ****. I titan, not being able to activate valakut yet, and pass. He has the mark, takes my guy, hits me for 10, and uses koth's mana abliity to fuel the burn to kill me.
The 2 from kargan (4 if he has peaks) would have make it lethal if he mark'd my Primeval Titan no question.
I still can't decide what was better.
All in all, I feel like RDW is really winnable, and I feel like my deck kind of let me down in that top 8. (He also ripped back to back goblin guides game 1. Awesome...) Not to take anything away from him, if he reads this congrats to him, he played it fine. I just think I should be able to win that match, but I had to keep somewhat awkward hands. to be honest, I feel like I had to keep pretty awkward hands a few games today, the loss of Rampant Growth makes this deck really awkward at times. Explore was the ABSOLUTE NUT HIGH, and Todd Anderson was totally right about it. Explore was amazing.
FYI, the top 8 was 2 Ramp, 3 UW control, 1 RDW, 1 GW Aggro with Vengevines.
Small tournament to be sure, but we have lots of quality players.
Good time, second time I've played the deck (thoguh the first time I only owned 1 Avenger, and had 4 seige gange. I borrowed the avenger's today). I did play scapeshift in extended though (including one top4 of a ptq), so I had a good handle on it going in.
Deck was nutso good with even decent hands, but had too many awkward hands. Needs something to smooth out draws, but I'm not sure what. Could have just been bad luck. Oh well, another play mat :)(3rd in 4 years, and I skipped last year).
The reason I have preferred Fire//Ice is because it sets up easy 2 for 1's (Darkblast is recurrable, but you usually only get to cast it once a turn). Also, I don't really think much of the dredge potential, since you rarely dredge it anyways, most games you only have to deal with 1 Bob. I think being able to send it to Force is usually better than maybe dredging a robot. Not totally sure though, I will try the darkblast out and see what I like better.
I considered the Inkwell situation, I've gone with Sphinx because my meta currently has been very fish heavy, so I think for the time being Sphinx is correct for my situation (Tinker targets are always super meta dependant anyways, its not like they are set in stone).
REB is pretty sick right now, it would naturally be in the SB.
Jace will bounce a tinkered Sphinx, but against a lot of those decks, I would be going for Sundering Titan instead anyways, which should put them off of Jace Mana. If they already have Jace is a different story of course.
3 Frantic Search may be correct, I don't really usually want more than 1 in a game.
See above, I already explained the Drains. As soon as I shuffled up game 1, I was like "****, I forgot Mana Drain". The two trinket mages are already Mana Drains.
The reason I didn't put Gorilla Shaman is is actually because of Gush. If Gush only really spaws 1 deck, SHaman in probably still really good, but if it starts dominating, I don't think the Shaman is going to be that good. (Though the German Signed one in my binder is begging me to play it).
Tunnel Ignus seems like a reasonably card to me, but there were like 10 cards I would play that I had to cut just to get to 60, and I don't think Tunnel Ignus is going to be better than they are in this deck. I think it can see play, but not in this deck. I don't think it clicks well enough with this deck, and its a tight list to begin with. I still really kind of want Strategic Planning in here too. (Its a god awful card, but it can be really good in slaver)
I wrestled for a while on whether to do the vault combo. Its funny that I was so excited about the new announcements because it adds more non-vault decks to the format. (Vault really is a totally different beast than Will or Recall or anything, but that's not the point of this, so I'm not going to get into it here). That being said, it seemed to good to pass up. With 3 welder's (which in my experience, people don't counter nearly enough), vault combo seemed just too easy. It also let me play trinket mage, since it gets half of that combo (though I think the Mages are out for me, they don't do enough, I would rather have drain).
Just as a note, between Gush, Frantic Search, and Even preordain, I've built about 3-4 totally different archetypes in the past few weeks since the announcement, I just want to comment again at how awesome the news is. This is the first time since Time vault was erratad that playing vintage actually felt like, well, playing vintage.
Believe me, if I could in any way justify not playing Vault Combo, I would, I hate playing with it, its boring as **** to me frankly, and in vintage, why not play something you love? But it just fits SOO Well here.
With frantic search now a 4-of, I was itching to play with it, having never played the card before in my life. I took my old slaver builds, and put this together. Very rough so far, I am not sure about a few slots, which I'll talk about later.
After some quick testing, Mox Opal was actually awesome. Trinket mage was subpar, and I think the first change is -2 Trinket Mage + 2 Mana Drain. I thought getting top would be more relevant. It was, but I think I would rather just cut a card and play 2 tops. Fire//Ice is because off all of the Bobs running around. Sundering Titan is back, since both Volcs and Trops will be played. I was very happy with the reanimatable targets.
I think I still really want Fact back in the deck, perhaps the Tezzeret can be cut for him, but Tezz can be pretty cool in this deck. With the extra artifact mana, just attacking for 20 is really easy and possible.
And the amount of players playing the game only helps. The more people play the game in general, the more people there are going to be willing to shell out for vintage. No one is expecting vintage to crush standard popularity, but the return of a P9 series is a very real possibility, whether SCG puts it on, or someone else. Lest we forget vintage is also alive and well in Europe too.
The cards that are now super high though are usually staples. Wasteland sees so much play, as does Force. In many ways investing in these staples is very much like investing in power. They were really just undervalued before. I wish I had the time to compare the average cost of a deck like Canadian Thresh back in the day to a good legacy deck now, to a vintage deck back in the day, with say, 50% power. Then I could articulate what I mean a little clearer. I think more now, that building a legacy collection now is more like building a vintage collection was in the past, if you went for power. At any rate, you are correct about the difference in prices. Legacy is just the new vintage really. Vintage is due for a comeback though, and I expect it to happen when legacy hits the roof.
And just in case anyone forgot. In the golden age of vintage, people were showing up by the hundreds to play in SCG's power 9 tournaments. (I only ever got to play in the very last one, Ben, I know you're reading this, these need to come back! That trip (22 hour drive! though less than the 30 to GenCon) made up one of my best memories!) If you feel you are getting priced out of legacy, perhaps you need to be more patient with acquiring staples. Can you play legacy overnight? No, not really. You have to put a bit of time in acquiring these things. Ask any player with a big legacy collection, it took a while.
The idea that SCG can actually price fix is kind of silly. If other stores copy their prices and are able to sell, it means we were willing to pay that much! There is always a ceiling to what you will pay. It is magic cards we are talking about after all, not basic necessities of life. If legacy outprices you, it sucks, but if you really want to play, you'll put the work in to earning the money for the cards.
And To vouch for Ben, I did notice that most of these buy prices hadn't even changed, and even on some of the ones that had, the sell price didn't. I can remember being at the SCG tournament in Chicago for vintage, and I can say that it was a great relief to see how well stocked they were. If they had shown up with say, only 10 Tarmogoyf's that day, it would have been a catastrophe. (As it is, Illusionary Mask was the card of the day!). The only way to get 40 Tarmogoyf's in stock is to raise a buy price so people sell theirs.
Sidenote, sounds like Ben has probably the coolest job in the world. I've been studying Econ for 4 years now, about to graduate if I want (Debating taking a run at law school), and I really have no interest in most of the jobs available for it. His however, I would take in a heartbeat. Its like when you first learned that your math class could be applied to Storm Combo :).
EDIT: And for the situation, If SCG were to show up understocked in a hot card like Wasteland, well consider that at Pro-Tour who the heck cares, I remember the story was dealers sold out so fast, by the end Loxodon Hierarch was going for $40 a pop!
As for Chalice, your bounce spells need to be varied in casting cost. Also, counter it.
I also don't understand how it can underperform. I don't think I've ever really been disappointed with it. That being said I'm not sure how you use your therapies, so maybe you need to adjust what you're naming typically, or perhaps you just have a very different way of playing the deck. I play it (the deck, not therapy) a lot more conservatively usually. I therapy pretty aggressive actually.
I don't like iona for the reason you just mentioned. Most of the time you have to call their removal colour, which often leaves the stuff you really wanted to stop available.
And its not even really a question that Grudge is better than stifle. Bog is super easy to see coming, and you can grudge twice...
I think I would make your main
-1 Iona
-2 Nature's Claim
- 3 Empty slots
+ 4 Unmask
+ 1 Ichorid
+ 1 Darkblast or something (I'd love to put 4 Chalices in, but no real point in 2)
I don't see what Iona does that is relevant. By the time you can cast dread return, you should just be winning the game. Unmask is always pretty sick.
Personally I think leyline is the most removable maindeck hate, depending on what your plan for the mirror is. I like Chalice Unmask and therapy though. Especially with all the shops, gush isn't as popular, and I think chalice was only bad during gush era, just because half the decks didn't even play full moxen...
Who knows though. I think I'm buying bazaars soon though, so i'll switch back from the legacy version then, and then maybe I'll actually have some evidence to support my guessing that isn't 4 years old. In other words, take every single word I said before this paragraph with a very large grain of salt, perhaps one the size of a sugar cube.
Went 4-1-1 to top 8, losing in top 8, with this list (i think, its off memory here)
3 Avenger of Zendikar
3 Wurmcoil Engine
4 Summoning Trap
4 Cultivate
3 Harrow
3 Khalni, Heart Expedition
4 Explore
4 Lightning Bolt
8 Forest
12 Mountain
2 Raging Ravine
4 Valakut
2 Evolving Wilds
4 Pyroclasm
3 Arc Tail
4 Naturalize
2 Fog
2 Koth of the Hammer
Basically Todd Anderson's list with 1 extra ravine to suit my playstyle and meta, and some sideboard changes, mostly due to card availability and the amount of RDW I was expecting
Round 1 (U/B Infect)
Good local players girlfriend, seemed like she played on her own accord, and not just because they were dating, but she still has a some learning to do. She was able to catch her big mistake though.
Game 1 I ramp kind of slow, anticipating a mana leak, and I had no pressure on me from her. I beat in with a Ravine and eventually stick a wurmcoil. She clones it, we trade some coil's and tokens. I land a 2nd Wurmcoil. She bounces it, but screws up and plays a tapped land so she couldn't play the hard counter in her hand. At this point I'm at like 8 poison counters so I'm dead next turn to her hand. Fortunately, her error lets me attact with ravine and a somewhat withered Wurmcoil get in for lethal.
I don't bother sideboarding, seemed like an easy match for me.
Game 2 I am now on the draw, and she is on a more aggressive draw. I am a little slower, but have a lightning bolt for her big poppa poison pump guy and land a titan shortly after, obliterating her board and killing her the next turn.
I probably would have still won game 1, since I had a trap in hand.
1-0 (2-0 games)
Round 2 (U/B Jace/Removal/Wurmcoil)
Local who I've tested with, so I know what to expect. I need lots of threats, since he has lots of counters, but he will NEVER put pressure on me, so I have all year to win.
I side out some lightning bolts for some Koth.
Game 1 He doesn't have counters for my ramp spells, but does for my first 2 Wurmcoil's and a Titan. Lucky ol' me had a 2nd Titan. I win. Some more stuff may have happened, but he did like absolutely nothing relevant but counter some stuff.
Game 2 He blows all his counters on my ramp, but again, no pressure, so I just stick another Titan (I Think) and kill him the turn after. Really quick and brutal match in my favour.
2-0 (4-0 Games)
Round 3 (Mirror, oh Joy)
Another reasonably good local, who woudl also top 8 today
I Win the die roll, seemed pretty key
Game 1 we both Ramp, but I land an avenger and he can't kill me, I win. Not much else to say really, the mirror game 1 is just a race. He also screws up here, (or game 3, I cant remember), where he pops his Khalni and only deals me 1 Valakut trigger instead of 2. I saw him do this once before, so I thought maybe he didn't understand the timing of it, but then he never questioned it when I did it).
I decide not to side in Pyroclasm, since I figure he has the tempo and can probably play around it with avenger. I bring in a couple naturalize for some Khalni's, and 2 Koths, just to get rid of the god-awful bolts.
Game 2 He does stuff before I do. Again, very simple race, and he wins it.
Game 3 I mull to 5, but still manage to pull it out. he actually Titans first, which wins me the game, since my Titan blows up his. He blows up mine again, and sticks a wurmcoil, which I then blow up, and play another Titan, or something like that. I get there somehow.
3-0 (6-1 games)
Round 4 (RDW, future loss in Top8)
Alright, a repairing and I'm still stuck playing him. I think this is a tough match for me if he gets goblin guide, and I am in for a treat.
Game 1 He mulls to 5, and I keep basically the stone nuts against him (Titan, lands, explore, bolt). No Wurmcoil, but I draw it soon. He does have the guide, but turn 2 Explore into Bolt up is enough advantage for me to win at a very comfortable 14 life, after coming in with a wurmcoil, getting it killed in a 3-1 for me, and then Titaning shortly after.
I board out some Khalni's (too slow) and Summoning traps for the red Removal spells.
Game 2 I survive the early game thanks to an Arc Trail, maybe a bolt too. I stick a Titan, and he doesn't get rid of it right away, or something like that. I blow up his field, and then him. I think I win on 10 life.
4-0 (8-1 games)
Round 5
Intentionally draw with the other 4-0, another strong local.
Round 6
Scoop in another strong local friend.
4-1-1 (8-1 games)
Top 8 (Same RDW Guy)
I think I misplayed twice here, but I think his draws just had me anyways.
Game 1 I Mull, and I think keep a poor hand. I should have mulled to 5 knowing how important lightning bolt is game 1. He gets double goblin guide and wrecks me before I can stabilize. Not much I could have done here.
My boarding strategy is identical.
Game 2 I mull again, keeping an cultivate/pyroclasm hand with 3 lands and one other card I can't remember.
He does nothing turn 1. Turn to he plays Kargan. Here was my dilemna. If I just play land 3, I can pass the turn, Bolt the Kargan on his turn, and cultivate the following turn. Or, I can cast cultivate, and let him swing with Kargan, and get my Titan going a turn sooner. The problem was Mark of Mutiny. AS it is, I bolt it, not cultivating that turn, and then stick titan two turns later. The turn after I cultivated, he played Koth. ****. I titan, not being able to activate valakut yet, and pass. He has the mark, takes my guy, hits me for 10, and uses koth's mana abliity to fuel the burn to kill me.
The 2 from kargan (4 if he has peaks) would have make it lethal if he mark'd my Primeval Titan no question.
I still can't decide what was better.
All in all, I feel like RDW is really winnable, and I feel like my deck kind of let me down in that top 8. (He also ripped back to back goblin guides game 1. Awesome...) Not to take anything away from him, if he reads this congrats to him, he played it fine. I just think I should be able to win that match, but I had to keep somewhat awkward hands. to be honest, I feel like I had to keep pretty awkward hands a few games today, the loss of Rampant Growth makes this deck really awkward at times. Explore was the ABSOLUTE NUT HIGH, and Todd Anderson was totally right about it. Explore was amazing.
FYI, the top 8 was 2 Ramp, 3 UW control, 1 RDW, 1 GW Aggro with Vengevines.
Small tournament to be sure, but we have lots of quality players.
Good time, second time I've played the deck (thoguh the first time I only owned 1 Avenger, and had 4 seige gange. I borrowed the avenger's today). I did play scapeshift in extended though (including one top4 of a ptq), so I had a good handle on it going in.
Deck was nutso good with even decent hands, but had too many awkward hands. Needs something to smooth out draws, but I'm not sure what. Could have just been bad luck. Oh well, another play mat :)(3rd in 4 years, and I skipped last year).
I considered the Inkwell situation, I've gone with Sphinx because my meta currently has been very fish heavy, so I think for the time being Sphinx is correct for my situation (Tinker targets are always super meta dependant anyways, its not like they are set in stone).
REB is pretty sick right now, it would naturally be in the SB.
Jace will bounce a tinkered Sphinx, but against a lot of those decks, I would be going for Sundering Titan instead anyways, which should put them off of Jace Mana. If they already have Jace is a different story of course.
3 Frantic Search may be correct, I don't really usually want more than 1 in a game.
Tunnel Ignus seems like a reasonably card to me, but there were like 10 cards I would play that I had to cut just to get to 60, and I don't think Tunnel Ignus is going to be better than they are in this deck. I think it can see play, but not in this deck. I don't think it clicks well enough with this deck, and its a tight list to begin with. I still really kind of want Strategic Planning in here too. (Its a god awful card, but it can be really good in slaver)
I wrestled for a while on whether to do the vault combo. Its funny that I was so excited about the new announcements because it adds more non-vault decks to the format. (Vault really is a totally different beast than Will or Recall or anything, but that's not the point of this, so I'm not going to get into it here). That being said, it seemed to good to pass up. With 3 welder's (which in my experience, people don't counter nearly enough), vault combo seemed just too easy. It also let me play trinket mage, since it gets half of that combo (though I think the Mages are out for me, they don't do enough, I would rather have drain).
Just as a note, between Gush, Frantic Search, and Even preordain, I've built about 3-4 totally different archetypes in the past few weeks since the announcement, I just want to comment again at how awesome the news is. This is the first time since Time vault was erratad that playing vintage actually felt like, well, playing vintage.
Believe me, if I could in any way justify not playing Vault Combo, I would, I hate playing with it, its boring as **** to me frankly, and in vintage, why not play something you love? But it just fits SOO Well here.
Thanks for the feedback Urweak.
With frantic search now a 4-of, I was itching to play with it, having never played the card before in my life. I took my old slaver builds, and put this together. Very rough so far, I am not sure about a few slots, which I'll talk about later.
3 Polluted Delta
3 Flooded Strand
3 Underground Sea
2 Volcanic Island
2 Island
1 Tolarian Academy
Creatures
2 Trinket Mage
1 Triskelion
1 Sundering Titan
1 Sphinx of the Steel Wind
3 Goblin Welder
Artifacts
1 Mox Emerald
1 Mox Pearl
1 Mox Ruby
1 Mox Sapphire
1 Mox Jet
2 Mox Opal
1 Sol Ring
1 Mana Vault
1 Mana Crypt
1 Black Lotus
1 Time Vault
1 Voltaic Key
1 Sensei's Divining Top
1 Mindslaver
1 Demonic Tutor
1 Time Walk
1 Tinker
1 Merchant Scroll
1 Ponder
1 Yawgmoth's Will
Instants
4 Force of Will
4 Frantic Search
1 Brainstorm
1 Ancestral Recall
1 Mystical Tutor
1 Vampiric Tutor
1 Thirst for Knowledge
1 Fire//Ice
1 Gifts Ungiven
1 Hurkyl's Recall
1 Tezzeret, the Seeker
After some quick testing, Mox Opal was actually awesome. Trinket mage was subpar, and I think the first change is -2 Trinket Mage + 2 Mana Drain. I thought getting top would be more relevant. It was, but I think I would rather just cut a card and play 2 tops. Fire//Ice is because off all of the Bobs running around. Sundering Titan is back, since both Volcs and Trops will be played. I was very happy with the reanimatable targets.
I think I still really want Fact back in the deck, perhaps the Tezzeret can be cut for him, but Tezz can be pretty cool in this deck. With the extra artifact mana, just attacking for 20 is really easy and possible.
The Frantic Searches have impressed me so far.