Has anyone had a chance to try oko, thief of crowns? Seems like a perfect fit for what this deck is trying to do.
You can turn your late game evolve creatures into elks, you can elk creatures that have +1/+1 counters to make them into 4/4's and 5/5's, You can elk troublesome creatures and artifacts like urza, lord high artificer or chalice of the void, and you can gain life to help race burn.
there's also the ultimate that lets you trade creatures, but I feel like that's probably less relevant than the other two abilities.
Hey guys. I have a u/w aggro homebrew I'm trying to make semi competitive in arena.
Right now my record against combo, B/x control, and sultai midrange is stellar. But I am getting rofl-stomped by anything playing a lot of burn spells. Mainly mono red and drakes.
So I was wondering, what are some cards in White and Blue that make red players groan? CMC not being an issue.
I've got a few spell pierce, baffling end, settle the wreckage, and one lyra dawnbringer, but I haven't had any luck with them. Either I don't draw enough spell pierces to save my dudes or myself, or I die before I can draw/cast my higher end stuff, like lyra. Any advice would be greatly appreciated.
narnam renegade is too good to give up in my opinion. It doesn't have the highest attack, but the deathtouch means it is almost always getting damage through or holding off larger creatures on the opponents side. Plus it gets your E1 to a 3/3
I've been playing a list that runs all 12 evolve creatures and it seems like pelt collector and experiment one are pretty much equal with the exception of a few specific situations. A 3/3 E1 can stand up to a bolt or assassin's trophy or a supreme verdict while pelt collector can not. However, Pelt collector is more likely to become a 4/4 with trample, but even with avatar of the resolute,vexing devil, and rhonas, the indomitable in the main, getting pelt collector to a 4/4 body has been pretty tough in my experience.
This is my current list, which I am experiencing mild success with:
The deck has become a bit more polarized with this current build. More super nutted openings of 8 power on turn 2, or a 4/4 pelt collector on turn 2 with your opponent at 16 or less, but also more mediocre or bad openings of 3 evolve creatures and no way to pump them.
Also the mana can be a bit wonky at times. Having a blue heavy hand and then drawing vexing devil feels kinda bad. As does needing all 3 colors when playing against burn or another zoo deck.
Still not sure if the red splash is optimal, 12 evolve creatures is probably too many, and bolt really needs to be in a list playing r/u/g. I'll probably shave some weaker creatures for more interaction since that is something the deck really needs.
Any thoughts or comments would be greatly appreciated
does anybody know where I can find the thread for the u/g or r/u/g version of this deck with pongify and evolve creatures? I apologize for going off topic but this is the only stompy thread I can find
Once you actually stick a predator ooze though, your chances of losing go way down. And they continue to drop as the ooze grows out of killing range from Liliana and brutality.
I once had a grixis shadow opponent scoop to a turn 2 predator ooze + turn 3 rancor.
Absolutely, predator ooze slows your game down compared to leatherback baloth, but it is so much harder to deal with and will eventually overtake any board state if given enough time. As long as you can protect it from path to exile, then it is far and away your best answer to removal heavy decks.
The only time I'd worry about death's shadow is if they run temur battle rage, which is pretty rare these days. But even if they do, vines of vastwood is a natural counter to that spell.
Hmm...I forgot about chart a course. That seems like excellent draw for a stompy list. I'll def look into playing that. I really like that the raptor has flying. I'm all about evasive or hard to kill threats in my list. But I'm unsure if playing more cards that don't add devotion is worth it, since I run 4 aspect of hydra and 2 nylea, god of the hunt. This is what I'm thinking about right now:
I've been playing elvish mystic for a while to get more explosive plays while adding devotion, but I think the birds will be even better since they're also an excellent target for aspect of hydra. Counterspells aren't really my bag, so I'm never confident which one to play. @amicdeep and @EonAon could be right in playing remand or delay instead of spell pierce. And spreading seas will be a huge help against tron and burn, especially since burn has been beating my life gain lately with the addition of rampaging ferocidon.
I have the day off from work so I'll take it for a spin on league and let you guys know what happens. At the very least, I don't think it's any worse than my previous monogreen build of stompy.
Lol I tried the simic evolve deck in standard. Was a blast to play. Didn't transfer well into modern though. The deck just wasn't as powerful or aggressive as stompy in my testing.
Ghalta, Primal Hunter looks insane. I would run at least 2-3 copies of it. 2-3 creatures and 1-2 pump spells would be enough to cheat it into play. Especially if you guys are still playing big fatties like Rhonas or Leatherback Baloth.
More than likely though I see this card being abused in decks like death's shadow and hollow one/vengevine. But it doesn't mean it couldn't work for us too!
I'm trying out a blue splash in my stompy deck for some sideboard answers to combo and tron. Are there any good aggro blue or blue/green cards that you guys know of? I'm considering pongify since I run a lot of undying/persist/indestructible creatures. I like that it doubles as either creature or removal. But I don't like that it doesn't add devotion. Also considering vapor snag and simic charm. Would really appreciate some suggestions!
So I've been playing the 2-man tournaments online since day before yesterday and I'm 8-1. My only loss being to tron. The very last matchup I played was the mirror, mono green agro. I attached a screenshot of the winning board state and of our conversation.
thinking about side board cards a lot recently. thoughts on tower above? 3 mana is a lot but it does so much for just one card. damage, evasion, and removal.
act of aggression has been pretty good against big mana decks. I'm currently trying it out as a 2 of in the board.
considering something simple like slaughterhorn to help speed me up against non-interactive decks. this card in particular has the added bonus of not being a dead topdeck.
hope everyone's testing has been going well! Is anyone preparing for any big tournaments coming up soon? I would love to take this deck somewhere huge.
I agree. Metagame and matchups should def be updated. To me, when matchups for splinter twin and birthing pod are still listed, it comes across to new players as an archetype that people have given up on and isn't worth trying. Which we all know isn't the case with stompy. The deck is damn good bang for your buck.
Speaking of matchups. What are people side boarding for our bad matchups?
Specifically tron variants, eldrazi variants, and combo decks that don't use the graveyard.
It'll be a few weeks before I can afford to splash a second color. Until then, I'm considering just accepting these matchups as an autoloss, rather than waste sideboard slots to slightly improve a miserable matchup.
I think aether hub is a trap here. What happens when you draw hub and forest in your opener and everything in your hand is 1-2 green? You wont always have greenbelt and hub together, and even if you did, you might still habe to spend mana on greenbelt just so you can turn aetherhub back on. and with such a low land count, expect an average of 2 land in your opener.
Either play more green sources or drop it. Otherwise you'll end up mulling more frequently
I'll agree. MTGO is irritating as **** to play on. Most people I run into are nice, or don't say anything at all, but the interface itself is very poor, since my laptop is not very fast or powerful, it tends to run slowly or crash while I'm playing. That being said, the convenience of being able to test homebrews as many times as I want at my leisure is totally worth it. You get reliable feedback so much faster than having to wait once a week for maybe 4-5 matches at an fnm. I can play three times as many games in that same timeframe online.
But I totally understand, being a parent makes testing at home difficult I'm sure.
I forget what the exact title of the thread was, but there is 100% a discussion on the topic of winding constrictor + hardened scales in modern. I'm not sure why stompy and g/b snake are separate threads since they're both green based efficient agro decks, but you will likely find what you're looking for there. Either way, I'm really interested to hear your results.
What would a stompy snake list look like for you?
I think the inclusion of black would greatly improve your game against combo
It seems like the krasis could have potential in a +1/+1 counter heavy deck. Maybe even try out hardened scales and servant of the scale or nissa voice of zendikar. If you can't find much discussion here, you may want to try the hardened scales deck discussion instead, since that focusses more on counters.
I come up with wacky ideas all the time and sometimes it's really difficult to get a discussion started on it. When that happens, I just fire up MTGO and test it out to see if it's any good. If you wanna take a run at a league or play several games in the tournament practice area, then you can post your results here once you're done. The prices of cards are usually much cheaper on MTGO, and it's free to download. But more importantly, results will always be more valuable than speculation. If you wanna get krasis noticed, then go see for yourself and tell us what you find!
I caught a lot of flack for running wasteland viper in the first list I posted. But when I showed it won me three games alongside rancor, I managed to convert my first believer
@thefluff
It's so nice to see the viper getting some love. It's not as aggressive as narnam renegade, but it's more flexible. And I must confess, I've always had a weakness for cards that serve multiple purposes.
I'll keep testing the stag on MTGO to see if how it plays against bolt. But, mainly because chameleon colossus is 20$ a pop. It's only 2$ in real life though, so I may get a set just for funsies.
Kitchen finks on the other hand is just the opposite. It's 2-3$ on MTGO but 20$ in real life. So, technically, I still paid around 20$ for my entire deck. Not to be nitpicky
@amicdeep
That's cool your deck has been doing so well! I really like rhonas and hooting mandrills in your list. I may try to fit those in later
Kitchen finks is an all-star. Especially if you play it on turn two. It makes burn, aggro, and removal heavy decks much easier to play against. The reason I play it over leatherback baloth is mainly because I'm tired of losing to fatal push decks.
You can turn your late game evolve creatures into elks, you can elk creatures that have +1/+1 counters to make them into 4/4's and 5/5's, You can elk troublesome creatures and artifacts like urza, lord high artificer or chalice of the void, and you can gain life to help race burn.
there's also the ultimate that lets you trade creatures, but I feel like that's probably less relevant than the other two abilities.
although trading your dryad arbor for a mantis rider does seem really sweet haha
Right now my record against combo, B/x control, and sultai midrange is stellar. But I am getting rofl-stomped by anything playing a lot of burn spells. Mainly mono red and drakes.
So I was wondering, what are some cards in White and Blue that make red players groan? CMC not being an issue.
I've got a few spell pierce, baffling end, settle the wreckage, and one lyra dawnbringer, but I haven't had any luck with them. Either I don't draw enough spell pierces to save my dudes or myself, or I die before I can draw/cast my higher end stuff, like lyra. Any advice would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks in advance for your replies!
I've been playing a list that runs all 12 evolve creatures and it seems like pelt collector and experiment one are pretty much equal with the exception of a few specific situations. A 3/3 E1 can stand up to a bolt or assassin's trophy or a supreme verdict while pelt collector can not. However, Pelt collector is more likely to become a 4/4 with trample, but even with avatar of the resolute,vexing devil, and rhonas, the indomitable in the main, getting pelt collector to a 4/4 body has been pretty tough in my experience.
This is my current list, which I am experiencing mild success with:
4 Experiment one
4 Cloudfin raptor
4 Pelt collector
4 Narnam renegade
4 Young wolf
4 Vexing devil
4 Strangleroot geist
4 Avatar of the resolute
1 Rhonas, the indomitable
4 Pongify
4 Rapid hybridization
Lands: 19
4 Botanical sanctum
10 fetches
2 Breeding pool
1 Stomping ground
1 Forest
1 dryad arbor
4 Spell pierce
4 Damping sphere
4 Shapers' sanctuary
1 Life goes on
2 Coordinated assault
The deck has become a bit more polarized with this current build. More super nutted openings of 8 power on turn 2, or a 4/4 pelt collector on turn 2 with your opponent at 16 or less, but also more mediocre or bad openings of 3 evolve creatures and no way to pump them.
Also the mana can be a bit wonky at times. Having a blue heavy hand and then drawing vexing devil feels kinda bad. As does needing all 3 colors when playing against burn or another zoo deck.
Still not sure if the red splash is optimal, 12 evolve creatures is probably too many, and bolt really needs to be in a list playing r/u/g. I'll probably shave some weaker creatures for more interaction since that is something the deck really needs.
Any thoughts or comments would be greatly appreciated
Deathtouch and indestructible creatures block death's shadow all day. And creatures with indestructible/undying/persist blank most of their removal.
This is especially true for predator ooze, which is one of the best creature against death's shadow (second only to [card]chameleon colossus/card]).
In order for them to kill the ooze, they need a very well timed collective brutality, discard spell, or Liliana, the last hope. You are playing enough creatures that Liliana of the veil shouldn't be an issue, and fatal push does nothing to the ooze.
Once you actually stick a predator ooze though, your chances of losing go way down. And they continue to drop as the ooze grows out of killing range from Liliana and brutality.
I once had a grixis shadow opponent scoop to a turn 2 predator ooze + turn 3 rancor.
Absolutely, predator ooze slows your game down compared to leatherback baloth, but it is so much harder to deal with and will eventually overtake any board state if given enough time. As long as you can protect it from path to exile, then it is far and away your best answer to removal heavy decks.
The only time I'd worry about death's shadow is if they run temur battle rage, which is pretty rare these days. But even if they do, vines of vastwood is a natural counter to that spell.
Seriously. Try the ooze. It's delicious.
4 birds of paradise
4 narnam renegade
4 strangleroot geist
3 scavenging ooze
4 predator ooze
4 kitchen finks
2 nylea, god of the hunt
4 Vines of vastwood
4 aspect of hydra
3 pongify
Enchantments:
4 rancor
Lands:
11 Fetches
2 breeding pool
5 forest
2 treetop village
4 spreading seas
2 relic of progenitus
2 chart a course
4 spell pierce
3 reclamation sage
I've been playing elvish mystic for a while to get more explosive plays while adding devotion, but I think the birds will be even better since they're also an excellent target for aspect of hydra. Counterspells aren't really my bag, so I'm never confident which one to play. @amicdeep and @EonAon could be right in playing remand or delay instead of spell pierce. And spreading seas will be a huge help against tron and burn, especially since burn has been beating my life gain lately with the addition of rampaging ferocidon.
More than anything though, I'm excited to finally have answers to cards like goblin electromancer, eldrazi displacer, urza lands, and combo pieces.
I have the day off from work so I'll take it for a spin on league and let you guys know what happens. At the very least, I don't think it's any worse than my previous monogreen build of stompy.
Of course, I was splashing red for hellspark elemental and crack the earth. Living the dream was turn 2 young wolf + crack the earth against my opponent's tapped celestial colonnade.
Perhaps a strictly u/g version wouldn't be so janky. Could be worth testing.
More than likely though I see this card being abused in decks like death's shadow and hollow one/vengevine. But it doesn't mean it couldn't work for us too!
I'm trying out a blue splash in my stompy deck for some sideboard answers to combo and tron. Are there any good aggro blue or blue/green cards that you guys know of? I'm considering pongify since I run a lot of undying/persist/indestructible creatures. I like that it doubles as either creature or removal. But I don't like that it doesn't add devotion. Also considering vapor snag and simic charm. Would really appreciate some suggestions!
I 100% believe predator ooze and kitchen finks to be the superior 3 drops. Main deck vines of vastwood has also been very crucial. at least in this meta.
Because in a world of fatal push, the ooze is king.
Oh, and I'm still undefeated against death's shadow. This deck ******* crushes.
act of aggression has been pretty good against big mana decks. I'm currently trying it out as a 2 of in the board.
considering something simple like slaughterhorn to help speed me up against non-interactive decks. this card in particular has the added bonus of not being a dead topdeck.
hope everyone's testing has been going well! Is anyone preparing for any big tournaments coming up soon? I would love to take this deck somewhere huge.
Speaking of matchups. What are people side boarding for our bad matchups?
Specifically tron variants, eldrazi variants, and combo decks that don't use the graveyard.
It'll be a few weeks before I can afford to splash a second color. Until then, I'm considering just accepting these matchups as an autoloss, rather than waste sideboard slots to slightly improve a miserable matchup.
Either play more green sources or drop it. Otherwise you'll end up mulling more frequently
But I totally understand, being a parent makes testing at home difficult I'm sure.
I forget what the exact title of the thread was, but there is 100% a discussion on the topic of winding constrictor + hardened scales in modern. I'm not sure why stompy and g/b snake are separate threads since they're both green based efficient agro decks, but you will likely find what you're looking for there. Either way, I'm really interested to hear your results.
What would a stompy snake list look like for you?
I think the inclusion of black would greatly improve your game against combo
It seems like the krasis could have potential in a +1/+1 counter heavy deck. Maybe even try out hardened scales and servant of the scale or nissa voice of zendikar. If you can't find much discussion here, you may want to try the hardened scales deck discussion instead, since that focusses more on counters.
I come up with wacky ideas all the time and sometimes it's really difficult to get a discussion started on it. When that happens, I just fire up MTGO and test it out to see if it's any good. If you wanna take a run at a league or play several games in the tournament practice area, then you can post your results here once you're done. The prices of cards are usually much cheaper on MTGO, and it's free to download. But more importantly, results will always be more valuable than speculation. If you wanna get krasis noticed, then go see for yourself and tell us what you find!
I caught a lot of flack for running wasteland viper in the first list I posted. But when I showed it won me three games alongside rancor, I managed to convert my first believer
It's so nice to see the viper getting some love. It's not as aggressive as narnam renegade, but it's more flexible. And I must confess, I've always had a weakness for cards that serve multiple purposes.
I'll keep testing the stag on MTGO to see if how it plays against bolt. But, mainly because chameleon colossus is 20$ a pop. It's only 2$ in real life though, so I may get a set just for funsies.
Kitchen finks on the other hand is just the opposite. It's 2-3$ on MTGO but 20$ in real life. So, technically, I still paid around 20$ for my entire deck. Not to be nitpicky
@amicdeep
That's cool your deck has been doing so well! I really like rhonas and hooting mandrills in your list. I may try to fit those in later
Kitchen finks is an all-star. Especially if you play it on turn two. It makes burn, aggro, and removal heavy decks much easier to play against. The reason I play it over leatherback baloth is mainly because I'm tired of losing to fatal push decks.