I saw your post and got me interested to say the least. I have been mulling the deck concept in my head and first tweaked what you had to this list here.
I cut the the vengeance, and upped the Reforge to 4. The incremental damage is nice from the vengeance but the Stake or Play usually should deal lethal any. Also upped the Plunge to increase the amount of rituals available going off as well.
From the solo trials i tried I always wanted this card to fuel going off. I think we could go down to 3 Past in flames, and still be alright since we dump so much of the deck in the yard.
I tweaked the manabase since at times i couldn't get blue so i added another sulfur falls.
Now another option or direction we can go is to implement green cards such as Mulch and Tracker's Instinct.
In its current form this deck cant go off till turn 6 and is very problematic in the current format. I think with m13 has potential cards that we can take advantage of, but until fully spoiled dont know for sure. Hope this helps gets the community ball rolling. This seems like a great FNM deck.
U/R Vengeance
A Standard Magic deck, by Kyle McDaniel
24th place at a Innistrad Standard tournament in Indianapolis, Indiana, United States on 2011-10-02
I am going to have to say that Kor Sanctifiers is going to be better than the Hammer of Ruin because you will nuke the opposing artifact and have a creature to continue to establish board presence, which is vital for this deck to win efficiently and effectively.
I don't think that the Punishing Fire is not worth it because most of the time your creatures except for Plated Geopede just invalidate because they are white and swing for huge most of the time.
Hey guys, last night for Wednesday Night Magic at my shop, I went 3-0-1 for store credit. I played Gerry T's list with a little different sideboard. I beat Vamps, Jund, and Bant Mythic.
Vs. Vamps 2-1
Lose game 1, sideboard ruins him. Card quality in the deck outshined anything he had.
Vs. Jund 2-1
Same round one. Blazing fast starts game 2-3.
Vs. Bant Mythic 2-1
Win game one with fast start, He goes turn 3 Baneslayer game 2 with me not having removal, and game three me with a turn 4 kill.
I have to say Gerry T's list is good but the land draws can be very awkward, but the deck is resilient. I played through 2 board sweeps from jund and still killed him. For some reason he was using Jund Charm in the board. Each of these matchups are relatively easy except for the Bant Mythic if the come out fast on you.
Hey guys I thought I would share my list that I went 5-1 with at last FNM. I lost round 1 against Jund, then played against 2 RDW and Vamps. In top8 I played the Jund again and beat it, then beat the Finest Hour Bant list. I would have played top2 vs. UW Control but we ran outta time. As a sidenote, I threw this together just before and must say wasn't expecting much from it. I also boarded in Cunning Sparkmage with Collar every game, as it just wrecks all of the aggressive decks. The RDW matchup is difficult but the Sparkmage, Collar, and Firewalker give you a really big edge in this matchup. Vamps was easy, especially post board. Bant Wagon is beatable but difficult if they get board presence early.
First, all little deck introduction. This is my idea and untested list for a Big Red deck and is meant to burn and control the board until I win through big burn spell, planeswalker, or maybe one of my guys. I am looking for suggestions/comments that will help the deck out. I should also note that my FNM is not that competative with only 1 to 2 people actually play or have Baneslayers/Jwar Jwar Sphinx.
The mainboard I think should be pretty strong and the sideboard has answers to Kor Firewalker, Baneslayer, and Celestial Purge, as well as, faster aggro decks if they were to show up.
The maindeck chalice is this decks mana ramp that will help us get to the more mana to play the bigger spells.
I would like to bring to the attention of everyone that I believe the deck needs to have 3 Plains. I base this on my testing against Eldrazi Greem and that has access to Acidic Slime or Mold Shambler. I lost two games because they blew up the plains and I couldn't use have of my mass removal and subsequently lost.
Testing Results
5cc Cascade
7-1
Eldrazi Green
6-2
will test more later with my updated list and post results.
hey everyone I thought I would post my list that I have worked on. I am really loving this deck.
Testing
Pre-board vs 5 color Cascade
3-0
Post board vs. 5 color Cascade
3-0
All these games were close until we stabilize, valakut is brutal to this deck, and Armillary Sphere is actually the MVP not counting the planeswalkers against this deck to be honest. It totally made blanked Blightning several times which is important when holding burn, DoJ, and Path in hand. The key I found was to assume the role of control and force them to be the beatdown, a role they are not quite designed for. The first 3 turns of yours set up the manabase to get double white and proceed to get 1 for 1's and possible 3 or 4 for 1's when the cascade huge with DoJ. Play Conservatively and allow dudes to hit you if it sets up huge trades like above. They revolve around cascade this that after one or two sweeps and Ajani on board they just can't do much to you. I even played through the nutty Enigma Sphinx+Enlisted Wurm+Bloodbraid Elf+Blightning turn.
Haven't had time for more till this weekend since I am swamped with papers.
I am still not happy with Earthquake main, but I will defer to the majority who have been playing longer with the deck until I test the Jund matchup this weekend.
The Obelisk of Alara in the deck I wish to test since I found that 3 Chandra Nalaar is more than enough to get the job done, and I want some lifegain in the deck since every game that I have played I have normally won at 4 or less life, and feel the buffer could prove benificial, but I will test to make sure my assumption is correct.
As for the sideboard I am not running Martial Coup because I felt the need to have more spot removal and instant sweep against the field. Also the fact that double white is a pain to get to cast this. The Relic of Progenitus is a nod to the graveyard decks that I would assume roll us pretty hard based on are lists.
Questions @everyone
1. Do you see any significant flaws in my list main or sideboard against the field?
2. Act of Treason , worth it sideboard?
3. How does this deck play against Bant Midrange that seems to be showing up at Worlds?
My issue with Earthquake is that with this deck I don't think it is needed main board and we could add more effective cards against the overall meta, Heck maybe even using Celestial Purge as a 2-of in the place of earthquake especially in a Vamp/Jund/RDW heavy meta.
Other than running Earthquake I also thought about putting in Oblivion Ring. Great answer to Eldrazi Monument and Planeswalkers main other than using burn to nuke walkers and rolling over to the monument.
I was thinking instead of the 2 Earthquake main I would run 2 Pyroclasm. In my thinking this will help answer those Eldrazi decks ramping a bunch of mana elves out in the first couple turns before monument or fatty and blow them out with it as well as having a cheap wrath effect that can be helpful in killing above said fatties. I chose Pyroclasm over Volcanic Fallout because the life loss is important in the games I have played and don't think that the instant speed of fallout to be that much of a difference with the deck's 12 maindeck 1cc spot removal.
I have been looking for a deck to play at states and I think I have found it. I have put the deck together except I am trying to solidify the sideboard because the main deck you guys came up with the updated one on the opening page except I am running 4 Ajani Vengeant main. Man hear I thought Lavaball Trap sucked but man I haven't been disappointed by this card. Actually the card that I found underwhelming was Earthquake. With all the spot and mass removal, I found it just sitting in my hand, but I am still testing with it.
Basically my question is there any cards in my sideboard that are not needed and does it need something else for the current metagame. What do we need against the Eldrazi Green deck floating around. Has anyone tested that matchup and how does the deck fair against the green menace.
@entity:Thanks for the link, and comments. The need for the fetchlands is the two fold bonus of getting the proper mana as well as getting thinning the deck out. I will be proposing a fetchland manabase but I am open to suggestions as well.
@Niklaren: I will concede that Peer should be included in the list. I believe that the Lightning Bolt/Rift Bolts could be cut as well as the Swath, but I would like cohesive/synergistic replacements.
Other than Ponder I think Serum Visions could have a place in the deck. Both are extremely good so I would to discuss the following as we are continuing to construct are list for testing.
3 Past in Flames
4 Desperate Ravings
3 Infernal Plunge
4 Battle Hymn
4 Reforge the Soul
4 Gather the Townsfolk
4 Lingering Souls
1 Devil’s Play
4 Faithless Looting
4 Gitaxian Probe
4 Sulfur Falls
4 Clifftop Retreat
2 Evolving Wilds
4 Plains
4 Mountain
1 Island
1 Shimmering Grotto
I cut the the vengeance, and upped the Reforge to 4. The incremental damage is nice from the vengeance but the Stake or Play usually should deal lethal any. Also upped the Plunge to increase the amount of rituals available going off as well.
From the solo trials i tried I always wanted this card to fuel going off. I think we could go down to 3 Past in flames, and still be alright since we dump so much of the deck in the yard.
I tweaked the manabase since at times i couldn't get blue so i added another sulfur falls.
Now another option or direction we can go is to implement green cards such as Mulch and Tracker's Instinct.
In its current form this deck cant go off till turn 6 and is very problematic in the current format. I think with m13 has potential cards that we can take advantage of, but until fully spoiled dont know for sure. Hope this helps gets the community ball rolling. This seems like a great FNM deck.
A Standard Magic deck, by Kyle McDaniel
24th place at a Innistrad Standard tournament in Indianapolis, Indiana, United States on 2011-10-02
2 Wurmcoil Engine
Creatures
1 Phantasmal Image
4 Snapcaster Mage
Enchantments
4 Burning Vengeance
Instants
2 Ancient Grudge
4 Desperate Ravings
3 Forbidden Alchemy
4 Incinerate
4 Mana Leak
4 Think Twice
1 Devil's Play
3 Slagstorm
Basic Lands
8 Island
7 Mountain
Lands
1 Hinterland Harbor
4 Rootbound Crag
4 Sulfur Falls
1 Mimic Vat
2 Azure Mage
2 Ancient Grudge
2 Flashfreeze
1 Memory's Journey
3 Mental Misstep
2 Negate
1 Surgical Extraction
1 Slagstorm
Here is the list that took 24th at the 5k. With the little testing i have done it is pretty solid. What do you guys think?
Please use deck tags.
I don't think that the Punishing Fire is not worth it because most of the time your creatures except for Plated Geopede just invalidate because they are white and swing for huge most of the time.
My Sideboard
2 Kor Sanctifiers
2 Celestial Purge
4 Goblin Ruinblaster
1 Earthquake
1 Basilisk Collar
1 Stoneforge Mystic
1 Path to Exile
Vs. Vamps 2-1
Lose game 1, sideboard ruins him. Card quality in the deck outshined anything he had.
Vs. Jund 2-1
Same round one. Blazing fast starts game 2-3.
Vs. Bant Mythic 2-1
Win game one with fast start, He goes turn 3 Baneslayer game 2 with me not having removal, and game three me with a turn 4 kill.
I have to say Gerry T's list is good but the land draws can be very awkward, but the deck is resilient. I played through 2 board sweeps from jund and still killed him. For some reason he was using Jund Charm in the board. Each of these matchups are relatively easy except for the Bant Mythic if the come out fast on you.
4 Steppe Lynx
4 Kitesail Apprentice
4 Plated Geopede
3 Ranger of Eos
2 Goblin Bushwacker
3 Stoneforge Mystic
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Path to Exile
2 Adventuring Gear
1 Sigil of Distinction
1 Basilisk Collar
4 Marsh Flats
4 Scalding Tarn
1 Terramorphic Expanse
1 Tectonic Edge
5 Plains
5 Mountain
2 Manabarbs
1 Ranger of Eos
1 Journey to Nowhere
4 Cunning Sparkmage
2 Basilisk Collar
3 Kor Firewalker
2 Celestial Purge
I will be trying GerryT's list because every game I wanted Cunning Sparkmage main. Let me know what you think.
4 Kazuul, Tyrant of the Cliffs
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Searing Blaze
4 Burst Lightning
3 Chandra Nalaar
1 Chandra Ablaze
4 Earthquake
4 Everflowing Chalice
2 Lavaball Trap
1 Banefire
1 Fireball
4 Quicksand
10 Mountain
4 Scalding Tarn
2 Arid Mesa
3 Unstable Footing
4 Volcanic Fallout
2 Punishing Fire
2 Mark of Mutiny
2 Lavaball Trap
3 Ricochet Trap
The mainboard I think should be pretty strong and the sideboard has answers to Kor Firewalker, Baneslayer, and Celestial Purge, as well as, faster aggro decks if they were to show up.
The maindeck chalice is this decks mana ramp that will help us get to the more mana to play the bigger spells.
I am still unsure if I need the Quicksand.
let me know what you guys think
Testing Results
5cc Cascade
7-1
Eldrazi Green
6-2
will test more later with my updated list and post results.
Testing
Pre-board vs 5 color Cascade
3-0
Post board vs. 5 color Cascade
3-0
All these games were close until we stabilize, valakut is brutal to this deck, and Armillary Sphere is actually the MVP not counting the planeswalkers against this deck to be honest. It totally made blanked Blightning several times which is important when holding burn, DoJ, and Path in hand. The key I found was to assume the role of control and force them to be the beatdown, a role they are not quite designed for. The first 3 turns of yours set up the manabase to get double white and proceed to get 1 for 1's and possible 3 or 4 for 1's when the cascade huge with DoJ. Play Conservatively and allow dudes to hit you if it sets up huge trades like above. They revolve around cascade this that after one or two sweeps and Ajani on board they just can't do much to you. I even played through the nutty Enigma Sphinx+Enlisted Wurm+Bloodbraid Elf+Blightning turn.
Haven't had time for more till this weekend since I am swamped with papers.
4 Arid Mesa
4 Naya Panorama
2 Plains
12 Mountain
4 Path to Exile
4 Burst Lightning
4 Ajani Vengeant
3 Chandra Nalaar
4 Armillary Sphere
1 Obelisk of Alara
2 Lavaball Trap
2 Earthquake
4 Day of Judgment
2 Banefire
4 Celestial Purge
4 Goblin Ruinblaster
3 Oblivion Ring
2 Relic of Progenitus
2 Volcanic Fallout
The Obelisk of Alara in the deck I wish to test since I found that 3 Chandra Nalaar is more than enough to get the job done, and I want some lifegain in the deck since every game that I have played I have normally won at 4 or less life, and feel the buffer could prove benificial, but I will test to make sure my assumption is correct.
As for the sideboard I am not running Martial Coup because I felt the need to have more spot removal and instant sweep against the field. Also the fact that double white is a pain to get to cast this. The Relic of Progenitus is a nod to the graveyard decks that I would assume roll us pretty hard based on are lists.
Questions @everyone
1. Do you see any significant flaws in my list main or sideboard against the field?
2. Act of Treason , worth it sideboard?
3. How does this deck play against Bant Midrange that seems to be showing up at Worlds?
Comments/Criticisms welcome
I have been looking for a deck to play at states and I think I have found it. I have put the deck together except I am trying to solidify the sideboard because the main deck you guys came up with the updated one on the opening page except I am running 4 Ajani Vengeant main. Man hear I thought Lavaball Trap sucked but man I haven't been disappointed by this card. Actually the card that I found underwhelming was Earthquake. With all the spot and mass removal, I found it just sitting in my hand, but I am still testing with it.
My sideboard as of now
4 Goblin Ruinblaster-Jund/shaky manabases
4 Celestial Purge-Jund/Vamps
3 Oblivion Ring-planeswalkers and other stuff
2 Manabarbs-other control decks
2 Relic of Progenitus-graveyard combo decks
Basically my question is there any cards in my sideboard that are not needed and does it need something else for the current metagame. What do we need against the Eldrazi Green deck floating around. Has anyone tested that matchup and how does the deck fair against the green menace.
Now lets figure the manabase.
Proposed manabase
also you wouldn't be bad if you looked up the Little Kid decklist for ideas
@Niklaren: I will concede that Peer should be included in the list. I believe that the Lightning Bolt/Rift Bolts could be cut as well as the Swath, but I would like cohesive/synergistic replacements.
Other than Ponder I think Serum Visions could have a place in the deck. Both are extremely good so I would to discuss the following as we are continuing to construct are list for testing.
So Serum Visions vs. Ponder?
And Lotus Bloom vs. Chrome Mox?
Other cards to discuss Infernal Tutor, Seething Song, Simian Spirit Guide, Chromatic Star, Chromatic Sphere, Spoils of the Vault, Lightning Bolt, and Rift Bolt.
Here is the list so far
Mainboard Spots left 21-22 cards
Proposed Preliminary 4 Color Manabase
-15 to 16 lands-
Stomping Ground or one of the other Rav Duals is in potentially especially if we include Ancient Grudge in the sideboard.