Why do you think on the emissary? Also what would you suggest for the side if i move the rallys to the main?
With the heavy number of creatures you have emissary is actually better for you than thrall, and sense you don't have green for blisterpod you'll want to have more of that effect.
I'm in the midst of debating Emissary vs Thrall in my list as well -- for decks that run Whisperwood Emissary is obviously better, but for decks running Abomination I'm wondering if they should play Thrall instead for the ability to instantly sacrifice the Scion.
After some more testing I'm happy with 2 E-Leaps in the main and 1 in the board. If D-Command becomes too much of a problem I'd probably go 3-3 Ascendancy/Leap. I cut one Ascendancy for 1 Sorin to shore up Red deck matchups and because sometimes you end up on the wrong side of a board wipe and topdeck meaningless spells like Ascendancy. Obviously on the other hand Ascendancy is what saves you from wipes, so it's a double-edged sword. More testing is required for the perfect number.
In my opinion the Catacomb Sifters are my favorite cards in the deck and are integral to the build. Since it is a 3-drop you could cut probably 1 max, but the point of the deck is to go long and to overwhelm them with value/CA. Sifter is a respectable 2/3 blocker that also provides a chumper early game, smoothing your draws out at the same time, then late game it provides an instant cantrip with Abomination, extra bodies for Leap/Ascendancy, and again can scry you into your win condition.
The easiest card for me to cut right now would be the Qarsi High Priests, since I'm often using all of my mana every turn and don't have time to activate his ability. However, as the deck is lacking on 1 drops, and sometimes has trouble finding sac effects, I think it will be necessary to keep him in.
Played this last night to go 3-1 at a win-a-box tournament, good for 2nd place.
2-0 vs Sultai aggro w/ Sidisi: Double Anafenza g2 completely locked him out. Merciless Execution is bad vs Hangarback.
2-1 vs Atarka Red: Lost g2 due to misplay of missing triggers, other games weren't close once my swarm locked down the ground.
0-2 vs GW Aggo/Leap: Could've been a winnable matchup, but opponent drew very very well and I had to concede g2 after drawing 6 lands in a row. I probably sideboarded wrong.
2-0 vs 5-Color Bring to Light (aka 8 Rhino): Seems to be a very positive matchup -- save Charms for Rhino and laugh at the value you get when they try to wrath you.
One card I had been testing online was Smothering Abomination in place of Whisperwood. I had bought copies online but they hadn’t arrived yet, and the store was asking too much for them, so I didn’t get the chance to play them. In all honesty, I think the Abomination is a better fit. Some people have been testing Haruspex instead, but the ability to sac your Scions at any time for cards is insane. Not to mention also drawing cards for every leap activation, every husk activation, and completely ignoring cards like Anafenza which hose Haruspex. In future lists I’m going to try swapping out 2 WW (probably move them to the board for control matchups) and maybe 1 Charm (also to the board) for 2-3 Abominations. I’m also a huge sucker for E-Leap and would like to have at least 3 maindeck, but drawing 2 is obviously terrible and having so many dead cards vs aggro is sub-optimal. As I mentioned, this deck has insane triggers, and would probably be terrible to play on modo (or maybe not, since you can’t forget there). There were numerous turns in a row where I’d EOT I’d leap a creature and have triggers for manifest, 2-3 scrys, Scion ETBs, and Cutthroats all going off. One mistake I made quite a bit, realizing in retrospect) is whether to scry or manifest first from a Qarsi High Priest – I was scrying then manifesting to scry non-creatures away, but afterwards realized it was probably just better to control the draw rather than the manifest, since oftentimes I’d scry away something, manifest a spell, then draw a useless land.
Tutor T1 for a Rofellos, or later turns for Reclamation Sage / Acidic Slime for problem permanents, Prime Time for value, or Behemoth to end things.
Perhaps pact is better. I'll have to test it out. I did have Phyrexian Revoker at one point in time so that's why I had Chord.
I've actually upped the # of Forests to 20 and this deck mulligans a lot to fast mana. There are occasional hands that are rough but usually we have a forest/fetchland.
Zuran Orb was kind of a necessary evil for games that I had Titania and a ton of land but no other interaction. Representing insta-kills was important so I'm testing it out.
In general I'll wait until there's a land in the Graveyard. The ramp is just as important as getting tokens online if she dies.
Also, fastbond is legal in French Duel Commander... if you use fastbond... Grazing Gladehart helps negate the loss of life. If you have one on the battlefield with Sylvan Library, you can draw cards aggressively.
With all the landfall going on... Rampaging Baloths has good synergy with this deck.
How are all the one mana elves working out for you? I am not using them in my list.
I've tried out Baloths but most landfall happens before he gets out and I'll always cast Titania before him anyway. In my list almost all cards are support for Titania as drawing a hand with 6-drops and no ramp is miserable as the deck is basically dead until Titania can come out. Because Titania is so important to the deck the one mana elves are essential. Late game they can help recast Titania if she's been killed, otherwise they can pitch to Survival.
A few thoughts:
- Plow Under: more land suppression, can be quite brutal when ramped into.
- Sundering Titan: very often MLD, procs titania and is a big dumb bruiser
- city of solitude: answer to counter decks.
Thanks for the feedback!
Those cards have been on my radar but I've shied away from including them for the following reasons:
-Plow Under is a tad too slow and doesn't progress my own board like Mwonvuli Acid-Moss and Reap and Sow do. I might try it in place of Acid-Moss for a stretch.
-Terastodon is currently my 8-drop of choice because he can also answer problematic permanents like Planeswalkers and/or target my own lands to give me 33 power. Titan is very appealing, however... worth testing for sure.
-City of Solitude is not good in the deck because we like to activate abilities at instant speed (using Safekeeper to protect Titania, for instance).
I saw your games online a couple of times and it has good results. I'm curious on the weaknesses. It really perform unexpectedly. Somewhat on the same par as Azusa.
The weaknesses I briefly mentioned in the OP -- decks that can counter Titania easily (hence Dosan despite multiple ways to search Cavern) as well as decks that can go off due to Green's lack of disruption (Animar and similar). Sometimes if on the play I can go off faster than those decks but on the draw I need to find a lot of land kill, Beast Within, Mouth of Ronom or my new favorite, Arena.
Quote from "Apollo7 »
I would be curious to see how Crucible of Worlds would perform in this deck. I think it would be a great card for synergy with what you are trying to accomplish, I did a Ctrl+F search and could not find the card in your original post. I'm not sure if it is banned because I am not familiar with French rules.
Unfortunately (or maybe not as it's a broken card) Crucible is banned in French. I agree it fits perfectly with the idea of the deck though I haven't tested a regular version of this deck yet (I imagine it's as simple as taking out so mana elves and adding in mana rocks).
Hello all, first post here though some of you have played with me on Cockatrice before. I've shared this deck with many online already and would like to continue to improve it with your help.
The deck as you can see is a quite straightforward all-in aggro deck featuring the new green C15 general Titania. She is an extremely strong general utilizing both abilities to the fullest and allowing for very explosive openers as well as killing out of nowhere even on a deadlocked board.
Let's examine her two abilities shall we?
When Titania, Protector of Argoth enters the battlefield, return target land card from your graveyard to the battlefield.
The most straightforward ability and the one often misread -- the land comes directly into play, not to your hand! This additional ramp is what really sets the deck apart as even if Titania or your entire board is killed you're usually always only 1 land drop away from recasting her. This also allows for turns where you can double or triple Wasteland somebody all while developing your board.
Whenever a land you control is put into a graveyard from the battlefield, put a 5/3 green Elemental creature token onto the battlefield.
The real meat of the card and the reason this deck is [in my opinion] very good. In Magic's history, cards that reward you for doing things you were planning on doing anyway tend to be the strongest. In Legacy/Modern, Delver of Secrets, Young Pyromancer & Treasure Cruise are good because their only "requirement" is that you play spells, but even they have occasional downsides as those decks can sometimes fizzle on wincons. Titania differs in that (nearly) every magic deck requires land, and with her (nearly) every land is an additional wincon!
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The two weaknesses of Titania are her manacost (3GG) and her relatively small backside. The first weakness is compensated for by Green's affinity for ramp, and we're playing 20+ pieces of the most viable options. As with most green decks, hands that have 1+ pieces of ramp are the best so we load up on it as much as possible. Note that despite how good Lotus Cobra is in most decks it's even more broken in Titania because your t3 fetchland adds 6 mana in total and creates a 5/3 with the help of Titania.
Titania's low toughness is not as much of an issue because as I mentioned earlier we don't really mind if she dies. If they're sweeping the board we can easily rebuild with 10+ power and if they're just targeting down Titania all that does is ramp us more and provide another 5/3.
The primary weakness of the deck is most obviously graveyard hate a la Rest in Peace or Leyline of the Void. [card]Scavenging Ooze, Relic of Progenitus[/cards] and other incidental GY hate is also annoying but not nearly as backbreaking as it only shuts off the first half of Titania.
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Most often the deck kills by the following ways:
-building up a board and then Hoofing for approximately a billion
-getting out early Titania and sneaking out dmg before they can stabilize or by putting them into The Abyss by forcing them to chump block every turn
If I had to make any changes I would reexamine the "toolbox" and how much space it occupies in the deck. The creature count seems too low for Pod but I've never regretted drawing it as I am always willing to pod Titania into Primeval Titan and continue into Avenger of Zendikar and Craterhoof Behemoth. I have also questioned how much I want Chord of Calling as if I have enough creatures to convoke out a fatty I'm probably already winning.
Constant Mists was a joke card in my mind for a long time until it saved me countless times vs Animar. Arena is also in the deck for the same reason as there are decks that can just chump block my Elementals all day. For this reason I have considered Brawn.
Other cards in consideration that are on the cusp on coming in (and probably will for short time to test):
The reason for not including seemingly "must-run" cards like Scapeshift is in my testing it's been just a little too slow. I may be completely wrong about this, though and admit as much.
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Anyways, thanks for reading and I look forward to your discussion/comments.
I'm in the midst of debating Emissary vs Thrall in my list as well -- for decks that run Whisperwood Emissary is obviously better, but for decks running Abomination I'm wondering if they should play Thrall instead for the ability to instantly sacrifice the Scion.
After some more testing I'm happy with 2 E-Leaps in the main and 1 in the board. If D-Command becomes too much of a problem I'd probably go 3-3 Ascendancy/Leap. I cut one Ascendancy for 1 Sorin to shore up Red deck matchups and because sometimes you end up on the wrong side of a board wipe and topdeck meaningless spells like Ascendancy. Obviously on the other hand Ascendancy is what saves you from wipes, so it's a double-edged sword. More testing is required for the perfect number.
My current list is:
2x Qarsi High Priest
4x Sultai Emissary
4x Zulaport Cutthroat
4x Hangarback Walker
4x Catacomb Sifter
3x Nantuko Husk
2x Smothering Abomination
3x Abzan Ascendancy
2x Evolutionary Leap
3x Abzan Charm
4x Llanowar Wastes
4x Windswept Heath
4x Forest
3x Caves of Koilos
3x Sandsteppe Citadel
2x Shambling Vent
2x Swamp
1x Canopy Vista
1x Plains
3x Anafenza, the Foremost
3x Arashin Cleric
2x Felidar Cub
1x Abzan Charm
1x Sorin, Solemn Visitor
1x Evolutionary Leap
2x Murderous Cut
2x Whisperwood Elemental
In my opinion the Catacomb Sifters are my favorite cards in the deck and are integral to the build. Since it is a 3-drop you could cut probably 1 max, but the point of the deck is to go long and to overwhelm them with value/CA. Sifter is a respectable 2/3 blocker that also provides a chumper early game, smoothing your draws out at the same time, then late game it provides an instant cantrip with Abomination, extra bodies for Leap/Ascendancy, and again can scry you into your win condition.
The easiest card for me to cut right now would be the Qarsi High Priests, since I'm often using all of my mana every turn and don't have time to activate his ability. However, as the deck is lacking on 1 drops, and sometimes has trouble finding sac effects, I think it will be necessary to keep him in.
2x Qarsi High Priest
4x Sultai Emissary
4x Zulaport Cutthroat
4x Hangarback Walker
4x Catacomb Sifter
3x Nantuko Husk
2x Whisperwood Elemental
4x Abzan Ascendancy
2x Evolutionary Leap
4x Llanowar Wastes
4x Windswept Heath
4x Forest
3x Caves of Koilos
3x Sandsteppe Citadel
2x Shambling Vent
2x Swamp
1x Canopy Vista
1x Plains
3x Arashin Cleric
2x Felidar Cub
1x Abzan Charm
2x Sorin, Solemn Visitor
1x Evolutionary Leap
2x Murderous Cut
2x Dromoka’s Command
Played this last night to go 3-1 at a win-a-box tournament, good for 2nd place.
2-0 vs Sultai aggro w/ Sidisi: Double Anafenza g2 completely locked him out. Merciless Execution is bad vs Hangarback.
2-1 vs Atarka Red: Lost g2 due to misplay of missing triggers, other games weren't close once my swarm locked down the ground.
0-2 vs GW Aggo/Leap: Could've been a winnable matchup, but opponent drew very very well and I had to concede g2 after drawing 6 lands in a row. I probably sideboarded wrong.
2-0 vs 5-Color Bring to Light (aka 8 Rhino): Seems to be a very positive matchup -- save Charms for Rhino and laugh at the value you get when they try to wrath you.
One card I had been testing online was Smothering Abomination in place of Whisperwood. I had bought copies online but they hadn’t arrived yet, and the store was asking too much for them, so I didn’t get the chance to play them. In all honesty, I think the Abomination is a better fit. Some people have been testing Haruspex instead, but the ability to sac your Scions at any time for cards is insane. Not to mention also drawing cards for every leap activation, every husk activation, and completely ignoring cards like Anafenza which hose Haruspex. In future lists I’m going to try swapping out 2 WW (probably move them to the board for control matchups) and maybe 1 Charm (also to the board) for 2-3 Abominations. I’m also a huge sucker for E-Leap and would like to have at least 3 maindeck, but drawing 2 is obviously terrible and having so many dead cards vs aggro is sub-optimal. As I mentioned, this deck has insane triggers, and would probably be terrible to play on modo (or maybe not, since you can’t forget there). There were numerous turns in a row where I’d EOT I’d leap a creature and have triggers for manifest, 2-3 scrys, Scion ETBs, and Cutthroats all going off. One mistake I made quite a bit, realizing in retrospect) is whether to scry or manifest first from a Qarsi High Priest – I was scrying then manifesting to scry non-creatures away, but afterwards realized it was probably just better to control the draw rather than the manifest, since oftentimes I’d scry away something, manifest a spell, then draw a useless land.
Perhaps pact is better. I'll have to test it out. I did have Phyrexian Revoker at one point in time so that's why I had Chord.
I've actually upped the # of Forests to 20 and this deck mulligans a lot to fast mana. There are occasional hands that are rough but usually we have a forest/fetchland.
Zuran Orb was kind of a necessary evil for games that I had Titania and a ton of land but no other interaction. Representing insta-kills was important so I'm testing it out.
In general I'll wait until there's a land in the Graveyard. The ramp is just as important as getting tokens online if she dies.
I've tried out Baloths but most landfall happens before he gets out and I'll always cast Titania before him anyway. In my list almost all cards are support for Titania as drawing a hand with 6-drops and no ramp is miserable as the deck is basically dead until Titania can come out. Because Titania is so important to the deck the one mana elves are essential. Late game they can help recast Titania if she's been killed, otherwise they can pitch to Survival.
It's in there. Some reason got left out.
Thanks for the feedback!
Those cards have been on my radar but I've shied away from including them for the following reasons:
-Plow Under is a tad too slow and doesn't progress my own board like Mwonvuli Acid-Moss and Reap and Sow do. I might try it in place of Acid-Moss for a stretch.
-Terastodon is currently my 8-drop of choice because he can also answer problematic permanents like Planeswalkers and/or target my own lands to give me 33 power. Titan is very appealing, however... worth testing for sure.
-City of Solitude is not good in the deck because we like to activate abilities at instant speed (using Safekeeper to protect Titania, for instance).
The weaknesses I briefly mentioned in the OP -- decks that can counter Titania easily (hence Dosan despite multiple ways to search Cavern) as well as decks that can go off due to Green's lack of disruption (Animar and similar). Sometimes if on the play I can go off faster than those decks but on the draw I need to find a lot of land kill, Beast Within, Mouth of Ronom or my new favorite, Arena.
Unfortunately (or maybe not as it's a broken card) Crucible is banned in French. I agree it fits perfectly with the idea of the deck though I haven't tested a regular version of this deck yet (I imagine it's as simple as taking out so mana elves and adding in mana rocks).
1 Bant Panorama
1 Crystal Vein
1 Evolving Wilds
1 Hickory Woodlot
1 Jund Panorama
1 Misty Rainforest
1 Naya Panorama
15 Snow-Covered Forest
1 Terramorphic Expanse
1 Verdant Catacombs
1 Windswept Heath
1 Wooded Foothills
Land Toolbox
1 Arena
1 Cavern of Souls
1 Dark Depths
1 Dust Bowl
1 Dryad Arbor
1 Encroaching Wastes
1 Gaea's Cradle
1 Ghost Quarter
1 Homeward Path
1 Maze of Ith
1 Mosswort Bridge [so easy to turn on]
1 Mouth of Ronom
1 Petrified Field
1 Tectonic Edge
1 Thespian's Stage
1 Wasteland
1 Crop Rotation
1 Realms Uncharted
1 Sylvan Scrying
1 Life from the Loam
1 Expedition Map
1 Reap and Sow
Ramp
1 Arbor Elf
1 Harrow
1 Birds of Paradise
1 Boreal Druid
1 Burgeoning
1 Courser of Kruphix
1 Devoted Druid
1 Elvish Mystic
1 Exploration
1 Fastbond
1 Fyndhorn Elves
1 Gaea's Touch
1 Garruk Wildspeaker
1 Joraga Treespeaker
1 Llanowar Elves
1 Lotus Cobra
1 Mox Diamond
1 Mwonvuli Acid-Moss
1 Oracle of Mul Daya
1 Priest of Titania
1 Rofellos, Llanowar Emissary
1 Utopia Sprawl
1 Wild Growth
1 Acidic Slime
1 Dosan, the Falling Leaf
1 Eternal Witness
1 Fauna Shaman
1 Scavenging Ooze
1 Sylvan Safekeeper
1 Reclamation Sage
Creature Toolbox Enablers
1 Birthing Pod
1 Chord of Calling
1 Green Sun's Zenith
1 Survival of the Fittest
1 Worldly Tutor
Game Enders
1 Avenger of Zendikar
1 Concordant Crossroads
1 Craterhoof Behemoth
1 Hall of Gemstone [vs 3 color/control]
1 Nissa, Worldwaker
1 Primeval Titan
1 Terastodon
1 Zuran Orb
Catch-all Problem Solvers
1 Beast Within
1 Constant Mists
1 Song of the Dryads
1 Karn Liberated
Card Draw/Selection
1 Harmonize
1 Garruk, Primal Hunter
1 Sylvan Library
Hello all, first post here though some of you have played with me on Cockatrice before. I've shared this deck with many online already and would like to continue to improve it with your help.
The deck as you can see is a quite straightforward all-in aggro deck featuring the new green C15 general Titania. She is an extremely strong general utilizing both abilities to the fullest and allowing for very explosive openers as well as killing out of nowhere even on a deadlocked board.
Let's examine her two abilities shall we?
When Titania, Protector of Argoth enters the battlefield, return target land card from your graveyard to the battlefield.
The most straightforward ability and the one often misread -- the land comes directly into play, not to your hand! This additional ramp is what really sets the deck apart as even if Titania or your entire board is killed you're usually always only 1 land drop away from recasting her. This also allows for turns where you can double or triple Wasteland somebody all while developing your board.
Whenever a land you control is put into a graveyard from the battlefield, put a 5/3 green Elemental creature token onto the battlefield.
The real meat of the card and the reason this deck is [in my opinion] very good. In Magic's history, cards that reward you for doing things you were planning on doing anyway tend to be the strongest. In Legacy/Modern, Delver of Secrets, Young Pyromancer & Treasure Cruise are good because their only "requirement" is that you play spells, but even they have occasional downsides as those decks can sometimes fizzle on wincons. Titania differs in that (nearly) every magic deck requires land, and with her (nearly) every land is an additional wincon!
-----------
The two weaknesses of Titania are her manacost (3GG) and her relatively small backside. The first weakness is compensated for by Green's affinity for ramp, and we're playing 20+ pieces of the most viable options. As with most green decks, hands that have 1+ pieces of ramp are the best so we load up on it as much as possible. Note that despite how good Lotus Cobra is in most decks it's even more broken in Titania because your t3 fetchland adds 6 mana in total and creates a 5/3 with the help of Titania.
Titania's low toughness is not as much of an issue because as I mentioned earlier we don't really mind if she dies. If they're sweeping the board we can easily rebuild with 10+ power and if they're just targeting down Titania all that does is ramp us more and provide another 5/3.
The primary weakness of the deck is most obviously graveyard hate a la Rest in Peace or Leyline of the Void. [card]Scavenging Ooze, Relic of Progenitus[/cards] and other incidental GY hate is also annoying but not nearly as backbreaking as it only shuts off the first half of Titania.
-----------
Most often the deck kills by the following ways:
-building up a board and then Hoofing for approximately a billion
-getting out early Titania and sneaking out dmg before they can stabilize or by putting them into The Abyss by forcing them to chump block every turn
-chaining together land destruction spells
-alpha striking with Titania plus EOT saccing all lands to Zuran Orb or Sylvan Safekeeper
-----------
If I had to make any changes I would reexamine the "toolbox" and how much space it occupies in the deck. The creature count seems too low for Pod but I've never regretted drawing it as I am always willing to pod Titania into Primeval Titan and continue into Avenger of Zendikar and Craterhoof Behemoth. I have also questioned how much I want Chord of Calling as if I have enough creatures to convoke out a fatty I'm probably already winning.
Constant Mists was a joke card in my mind for a long time until it saved me countless times vs Animar. Arena is also in the deck for the same reason as there are decks that can just chump block my Elementals all day. For this reason I have considered Brawn.
Other cards in consideration that are on the cusp on coming in (and probably will for short time to test):
1 Greater Good
1 Tilling Treefolk
1 Scapeshift
1 Tooth and Nail
1 Natural Affinity [and other land->creature spells]
1 Village Elder [and other cute cards]
The reason for not including seemingly "must-run" cards like Scapeshift is in my testing it's been just a little too slow. I may be completely wrong about this, though and admit as much.
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Anyways, thanks for reading and I look forward to your discussion/comments.
//EunB