My Naya list isn't running Copter, but it's running plenty of ways to deal with copter, and that's what it all comes down to, I suppose: play copter if your deck allows it, or be prepared to play against it.
All my local players are experimenting things trying to find what works and what doesn't, so this is me following suit. Let me know what you think about it.
I vote for adding Oath of Chandra. It's a decent rate for early creatures. Not so good against vehicles, but as far as having early plays go, you could do worse things.
You play 6 sweepers Gideon into Fumigate is back breaking for any opponent
I have to agree here. Even if it doesn't take care of vehicles, it should still put you ahead to the point where you can just keep dropping even more walkers and ride the advantage to a win.
I'm considering returning to walking the Naya Walkers route, but the (implied) prevalence of Smuggler's Copter renders that strategy pretty null. Harnessed Lightning, Nahiri, the Harbinger and Stasis Snare are all attractive options to play against it, but I'm just not as convinced. I like sticking to the Legendary plan and adding Verdurous Gearhulk, but I'm also considering a more spell-heavy version to bring back Goblin Dark-Dwellers into play.
The color combination really gives a lot of choices to dig from.
People keep talking about sequencing Arlinn correctly. Does anyone have any gouge to share about this? Any scenarios that stick out to you?
In my own experience, she's not the type of walker that can take over a game on her own in the way that Gideon can, and the fact you have to plan ahead your plus abilities is really the biggest deal: the + numbers aren't really the focus, but rather, do you want your big guys to trample, or do you want your next player to be hasted/vigilance? To me, Arlinn does her best not at T4, but at T5 or T6+, where she can support what you have on the board as opposed to making a board by herself. She pairs well with the creatures Jund plays, so that's another plus.
I'm taking a break from Jund right now, but I have to agree: mainboard Duress is where you want to be. Also, don't quickly dismiss Tireless Tracker without trying it out first. It's true that the stats on paper aren't the greatest, but if left unchecked, it can really carry the game.
I've been on such a mixed bag with Arlinn: she can really push some hurt with Den Protector or Sin Prodder, but my favorite use is powering up a Hissing Quagmire. She really forces you to learn how to sequence her abilities to the best use possible, and like many people, I wish her +1s were flipped... but we take what we get.
Atarka has this problem where you cannot hit players with its ETB, but I have been immensely satisfied with Dragonlord Kolaghan. Useful against Rites, CoCo or Humans, even if she just sits there it limits their plays so much. Would be really jank if we had some sort of mill to go with it, haha. When I return to Jund, I'm moving from 1 to 2 MD.
Are you fine running that many Kommands? I would suggest upping the count of GDD or one of your draw spells... also, is 24 lands really good enough? Toying with 3 colors and that much land feels like playing with fire. Once you have Languish on the main, you can afford to cut some kill spells, I feel.
In regards to the manabase, I also strayed away from the new shadowlands. I'm down to a single Game Trail and it has worked well, but I ended up replacing it with a basic Mountain. Too many times I'm stuck with a single red source and unable to fix my colors with Wilds or Traverse because I have the single Mountain already in my hand or the field. It's also embarrassing when Nissa, Vastwood Seer comes down and you forget that all your basic Forests are already in play, hahaha.
In other news, played a game against ramp where the bro had 17 counters on his Tireless Tracker. Waiting for the Ruinous Path that was never gonna be cast because he had three Warping Wail in his hand.
I think your local meta dictates what kind of cards you should be using in this jund world. We have our obvious value cards we can't be without, but tuning it to beat the meta will give you the best opportunities. This may mean switching between card choices if you end up going to somewhere other than your favorite game store.
This is definitely the truth. If the meta is super heavy on Aristocrats, Tokens and CoCo, up your sweepers and your removal accordingly and expect a spike of difficulty against ramp and control. If the opposite is true, then push a more aggressive creature strat at the expense of a more uphill battle against other, faster aggro decks. We can't have our cake and eat it too, but at least we can choose the topping for it.
Me, I went 4-0 in last night's FNM, but ended today's Game Day at a disappointing 2-3 record... I got struck by the no-land lightning and I mulled down to 4 on three of my games. I'm cool with the guys in my LGS I played with, so I felt bad I couldn't give them an actual game of Magic. However, we kept playing after the slip was signed, and I'm NOT disappointed in the deck at all!
Let me tell you: when you're able to Traverse into a GDD, cast GDD and flashback Traverse for another GDD, it's GOLD. When you're able to Pulse, Seasons Past, Pulse again, then flashback Pulse with GDD? Insane. Comes up more often than you'd think. The grind and the removal makes it possible to get there.
Dark Petition was great against the ramp matchup in order to fetch out Infinite Obliteration and flash it back with GDD. Bonus points if you can land it before the first World Breaker.
At the last second, I changed my SB: -2 Duress, +1 Languish and +1 Dragonmaster Outcast. I only considered Outcast because of Traverse fetching, but he was worth every single turn. There might be other utility creatures to consider.
There's a real issue against GW Tokens: Blisterpod and Hangarback Walker don't care about your non-Kalitas, non-exile sweepers, and neither do Nissa and Gideon. I might have to up one more Ruinous Path somewhere in the 75, or maybe something like To the Slaughter.
Against BG Aristocrats, my games got completely taken over by Ulvenwald Mysteries. When I saw all the advantage that card was generating them, I looked at my lack of enchantment removal and cried. Might have to consider Caustic Caterpillar with Traverse support or Natural State. One of the two.
I learned a lot from this Game Day. F*** Blisterpod.
The card balance has enabled Delirium for me about... 6-7 times out of 10 by just casting Mindwrack, on average. I usually want Traverse tutoring by turn 6+ for GDD so I can have a body on the field and flashback tutor for Kolaghan, so by natural course of the game, it's not super impossible to achieve.
I think Ruinous Path might be a bit slow for what we want to do, but it's a necessary evil so the board doesn't clog with Nissa and Gideon tokens. Also plays nice with Advocate whenever you Awaken.
If you decide to try my list or similar, let me know how it goes!
Just tried Dragonlord Kolaghan on my list, and holy moly it was a BEATING. Helped me win every game in tonight's SCG to a 3-0 finish. Just one is enough to be tutored with Traverse when the time is right, and it was a great play every single time. Plays nice with all of our creatures. Anyone else on the same boat?
GDD's utility fits almost every shell as long as you're able to actually cast him: Jund, Mardu, G/R, U/R, etc. He's stronger in green shells because of recursion cards like Pulse and Den Protector, which can be easily abused to repeat his ETB. White also has good interactions in Eerie Interlude and Eldrazi Displacer. He's never been in a bad spot, as long as you have the required cards to make the best use of his ability.
1x Chandra, Torch of Defiance
1x Arlinn Kord
1x Nahiri, the Harbinger
1x Chandra, Flamecaller
4x Sylvan Advocate
4x Servant of the Conduit
2x Archangel Avacyn
2x Verdurous Gearhulk
2x Bristling Hydra
3x Fleetwheel Cruiser
2x Tireless Tracker
2x Declaration in Stone
4x Harnessed Lightning
3x Oath of Nissa
2x Attune with Aether
3x Forest
1x Mountain
2x Cinder Glade
1x Fortified Village
2x Needle Spires
1x Game Trail
2x Inspiring Vantage
2x Canopy Vista
4x Aether Hub
3x Evolving Wilds
2x Radiant Flames
1x Cataclysmic Gearhulk
1x Pulse of Murasa
1x Fumigate
2x Stasis Snare
1x Quarantine Field
2x Appetite for the Unnatural
2x Gisela, the Broken Blade
1x Linvala, the Preserver
1x Bruna, the Fading Light
1x Sigarda, Heron's Grace
All my local players are experimenting things trying to find what works and what doesn't, so this is me following suit. Let me know what you think about it.
I have to agree here. Even if it doesn't take care of vehicles, it should still put you ahead to the point where you can just keep dropping even more walkers and ride the advantage to a win.
The color combination really gives a lot of choices to dig from.
In my own experience, she's not the type of walker that can take over a game on her own in the way that Gideon can, and the fact you have to plan ahead your plus abilities is really the biggest deal: the + numbers aren't really the focus, but rather, do you want your big guys to trample, or do you want your next player to be hasted/vigilance? To me, Arlinn does her best not at T4, but at T5 or T6+, where she can support what you have on the board as opposed to making a board by herself. She pairs well with the creatures Jund plays, so that's another plus.
I've been on such a mixed bag with Arlinn: she can really push some hurt with Den Protector or Sin Prodder, but my favorite use is powering up a Hissing Quagmire. She really forces you to learn how to sequence her abilities to the best use possible, and like many people, I wish her +1s were flipped... but we take what we get.
Atarka has this problem where you cannot hit players with its ETB, but I have been immensely satisfied with Dragonlord Kolaghan. Useful against Rites, CoCo or Humans, even if she just sits there it limits their plays so much. Would be really jank if we had some sort of mill to go with it, haha. When I return to Jund, I'm moving from 1 to 2 MD.
In other news, played a game against ramp where the bro had 17 counters on his Tireless Tracker. Waiting for the Ruinous Path that was never gonna be cast because he had three Warping Wail in his hand.
This is definitely the truth. If the meta is super heavy on Aristocrats, Tokens and CoCo, up your sweepers and your removal accordingly and expect a spike of difficulty against ramp and control. If the opposite is true, then push a more aggressive creature strat at the expense of a more uphill battle against other, faster aggro decks. We can't have our cake and eat it too, but at least we can choose the topping for it.
I would input that Clip Wings and Ruinous Path are near-necessities among all the options, as well as Dark Petition and Virulent Plague.
As a side note, does anyone think Atarka's Command has a spot in a more aggro Jund list?
Me, I went 4-0 in last night's FNM, but ended today's Game Day at a disappointing 2-3 record... I got struck by the no-land lightning and I mulled down to 4 on three of my games. I'm cool with the guys in my LGS I played with, so I felt bad I couldn't give them an actual game of Magic. However, we kept playing after the slip was signed, and I'm NOT disappointed in the deck at all!
Let me tell you: when you're able to Traverse into a GDD, cast GDD and flashback Traverse for another GDD, it's GOLD. When you're able to Pulse, Seasons Past, Pulse again, then flashback Pulse with GDD? Insane. Comes up more often than you'd think. The grind and the removal makes it possible to get there.
Dark Petition was great against the ramp matchup in order to fetch out Infinite Obliteration and flash it back with GDD. Bonus points if you can land it before the first World Breaker.
At the last second, I changed my SB: -2 Duress, +1 Languish and +1 Dragonmaster Outcast. I only considered Outcast because of Traverse fetching, but he was worth every single turn. There might be other utility creatures to consider.
There's a real issue against GW Tokens: Blisterpod and Hangarback Walker don't care about your non-Kalitas, non-exile sweepers, and neither do Nissa and Gideon. I might have to up one more Ruinous Path somewhere in the 75, or maybe something like To the Slaughter.
Against BG Aristocrats, my games got completely taken over by Ulvenwald Mysteries. When I saw all the advantage that card was generating them, I looked at my lack of enchantment removal and cried. Might have to consider Caustic Caterpillar with Traverse support or Natural State. One of the two.
I learned a lot from this Game Day. F*** Blisterpod.
3x Goblin Dark-Dwellers
3x Sylvan Advocate
2x Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet
1x Dragonlord Kolaghan
1x Nissa, Vastwood Seer
3x Traverse the Ulvenwald
3x Radiant Flames
3x Read the Bones
2x Ruinous Path
3x Grasp of Darkness
1x Ultimate Price
1x Pulse of Murasa
2x Fiery Impulse
1x Kolaghan's Command
1x Dead Weight
1x Sinister Concoction
1x Chandra, Flamecaller
4x Evolving Wilds
3x Llanowar Wastes
2x Hissing Quagmire
3x Cinder Glade
1x Game Trail
4x Swamp
3x Forest
1x Mountain
1x Chandra, Flamecaller
1x Ob Nixilis Reignited
1x Seasons Past
1x Dark Petition
3x Transgress the Mind
1x Virulent Plague
2x Rending Volley
1x Languish
1x Clip Wings
2x Duress
1x Infinite Obliteration
The card balance has enabled Delirium for me about... 6-7 times out of 10 by just casting Mindwrack, on average. I usually want Traverse tutoring by turn 6+ for GDD so I can have a body on the field and flashback tutor for Kolaghan, so by natural course of the game, it's not super impossible to achieve.
I think Ruinous Path might be a bit slow for what we want to do, but it's a necessary evil so the board doesn't clog with Nissa and Gideon tokens. Also plays nice with Advocate whenever you Awaken.
If you decide to try my list or similar, let me know how it goes!
-recast a Fiery Temper or a Exquisite Firecraft,
-recast a Ruinous Path or a Read the Bones,
-recast a Pulse of Murasa or a Traverse the Ulvenwald,
-recast a Declaration in Stone or a Hallowed Moonlight,
-recast a Anticipate or a Just the Wind,
-recast a Dromoka's Command or a Kolaghan's Command.
GDD's utility fits almost every shell as long as you're able to actually cast him: Jund, Mardu, G/R, U/R, etc. He's stronger in green shells because of recursion cards like Pulse and Den Protector, which can be easily abused to repeat his ETB. White also has good interactions in Eerie Interlude and Eldrazi Displacer. He's never been in a bad spot, as long as you have the required cards to make the best use of his ability.