MTG Salvation

Quote from labarith »

What is Blue/White's evergreen keyword?

Flying, maybe flash (though that is more UG) The only modern blue vigilance cards are from Planar Chaos which shouldn't be used as precedence.

Updated the Visual spoiler, RB has got a real makeover, lots of new flavor and white's commons have had a pretty large overhaul.

PUSH IT TO THE LIMIT

Onslaught of the Void Strong but probably about right considering Mardu Ascendency
Void Prowler reads fairly badly even though its probably ok.
Void Harrier A bigger, more variable Brood Monitor is a decent yet not overwhelming rare.
Voidpull love it.
Harbinger of the Void cute callback card and feels GU which is hard for a devoid card.

Oh boy, Been a while since we have had a Bad Cards are the worst fanboy. Reminds me of the Xyx and Gmail stupidness

First lets get a couple of things clear before I address your points directly:

1. Casual Constructed followed by Standard and Limited are by far the most popular and important formats. This must be kept in mind when designing the vast majority of products.
2. A set has to appeal to a large variety of different audiences, and not all cards will be for everyone.
3. Developing a set for limited is a time consuming task that dictates the majority of decision made at common. We have talked on our Bad Cards podcast how cards like Defensive Stance are deliberately made as bad cards because blue was too strong in limited late in development and so they didn't have time to rebalance all the blue commons. Thus a single bad blue card made the set better by evening out the colors. Which we have seen is important from the way green behaved in BFZ.
4. If I have a card made for limited it is irrelevant that it obsoletes a card from another set as those cards will nearly never be played together.

Ok now to rebut your points:

What's to stop someone from printing a 3/1 for W? A 6/1 for W? 9/1 trample firstrike haste deathtouch for W? Power creep is the enemy; but power-normalization is good. Bringing up cards that wouldn't see play to levels where they would is a good thing.

The needs of the different formats are what stops this as a 6/1 for W would be damaging to limited, standard and possibly older formats. However Elite Vanguard is firstly both not that playable in standard (or even some limited formats), so as Dryad Militant appears to be made for standard because of the flashback and graveyard themes of the previous black then pushing what was just below playable to fringe playable while supporting the multicolor themes of RTR block and being a safety valve to snapcaster or other flashback cards. Now your right that it could of been a 1/2 or maybe a 0/4 but thats risks the cards missing its design goal of being a standard player. Also note that as a card for standard that Elite Vanguard wasn't legal in that same standard environment and thus is both less relevant and a potential reason that they wanted the dryad as a 2/1 rather than a 1/2.

Quote from labarith »

1) All The Cards Cannot Be Good
Response: Take any given list of standard-playable decks, a set constructed out of entirely those cards would be entirely standard playable. Hence all cards CAN be good.

This argument has a few issues:
1): Within standard you have sideboard cards, niche cards, janky combos that are only good against specific decks etc. So even within the context of standard cards will be bad in relation to each other, or are you arguing that Virulent Plague is just as good as Siege Rhino?
2): Sets have to be designed for all formats in mind, not just standard. As I said before some cards are designed to make limited better, others are made for standard, some like Dark Petition see Legacy play without really touching standard.

Quote from labarith »

2) Different Cards Appeal to Different Players
Response: Sure. Find someone who will take my Mindless Nulls off my hand 100:1 for a dual land and we've got a deal. Wait, no one wants Mindless Null? So this card doesn't appeal to anybody, gotcha.

Putting aside how "bad" cards can make limited more balanced and thus are appealing to those who play that format, As SecretInfiltrator mentioned he found the card appealing, the fact that he won't trade it for a duel land isn't relevant as cards have diminishing returns on their value as your never going to play with your 101st copy. Like no matter how many Pithing Needles you offer me I'm unlikely to to trade for them despite liking the card as I don't need more than 4-8 copies.
Also the "tradability == appeal" argument breaks down even more when it comes to limited format cards as while I enjoy picking up an Isolation Zone in OGW draft and the card has brought me a lot of enjoyment I wouldn't trade for them.

Quote from labarith »

3) Diversity of Card Powers is Key to Discovery
Response: Tell ya what, if Mindless Null is a counterexample to your position I'll just post Mindless Null. Mindless Null

Note how you are not at all refuting this point, just making a little joke and pretending it doesn't exist.
Here's an example I've experienced first hand with my Sister of the appeal of discovery. A card like Boulder Salvo is a good card to someone who plays limited.. However she is using her Boulder Salvo in her casual Constructed deck (which remember is the most popular format.) and then found a Flame Slash in the Bulk commons of the LGS. That was a fun moment where she learnt about a new card and got a sense of progression as now her deck is slightly more powerful. Its worth keeping in mind here that printing Flame Slash in OGW is likely to make the set less appealing overall as most likely would skew the power balance in limited while robbing her of the achievement.

Quote from labarith »

4) Power Levels Are Relative
Response: Birds of Paradise vs llanowar elves vs Skirk Prospector. These cards are all playable in different formats. Mindless Null is playable in no formats.

Mindless Null is from Zendikar which had an extremely powerful and fast BR or mono B aggressive deck, so you they to have ANOTHER insane cheap creature? Mindless Null saw minor play in limited just because the Black/X decks where so powerful that you sometimes just needed yet another body. For example in this draft thread
Its filler playable level can also be seen in certain set reviews:

After seeing this on the spoiler, I thought "Is Wotc serious?", but after drafting the set a bit, I can say it has it's uses. Blocking is less important in this format, so it's most times a grey ogre which is fine. At the end more like a filler, but still better than it looks on the paper. Better than some white and blue cards, for sure.

Quote from labarith »

5) Diversity of Power Rewards the More Skilled Player
Response: I'm pretty sure the skilled player who relies upon her opponents drafting Mindless Null is a player magic can do without. Do you disagree?

To a certain extent yes, MtG as your probably aware is a game with a huge amount of variance. Pro players can lose to an FNM newbie with the right luck which is part of what makes magic more approachable than a 100% skill based game like Chess. However limited draft is considered one of the most "skill testing" formats because of cards of weaker or higher power level. A flatter power level makes the drafting section less relevant and the format not as deep in the end.

Quote from labarith »

6) People Like Finding “Hidden Gems”
Response: Syphon Soul = "oh, wait, you can play magic with more than 2 players?" Mindless Null = "oh, wait, WOTC stole my money?" is not an acceptable discovery.

Interesting...did they hide the existence of Mindless Null in the spoiler?
Also considering the article you linked thats exactly the kinda hidden story gems behind the creation of a card that player with a design knack enjoy seeing.

Quote from labarith »

7) R&D is Only Human
Response: "My bad" is admission of guilt; do you think the person who made Mindless Null thinks of it as a mistake? Because there's an article where they explain that it was initially a mistake, but they said "Nah, we like it this way"... so not so much a "My bad" as "I'm evil, and profanity to you for spending money on my product because I'm going to print a card I know is bad because it's bad and had every opportunity to fix it and didn't because, again, profanity in your direction."

How does this make their point any less valid? If anything it could be argued it showcases exactly that they are human. Human designer enjoy little design jokes and get emotional attachment to what they create. Its hard to kill your designs and yet in the end ZEN ended up being a very popular set.

IndieGhost and Groovelord


Crippling Damp UB
Enchantment - Aura (C)
Enchant creature
Enchanted creature gets -4/-0.
At the beginning of the upkeep of enchanted creature’s controller, that player loses 1 life.

Well done Flatline for winning the January CCL. I hope its taught you a thing or two.

Groovelord, void_nothing

Kozilek's Invalidator 5C
Creature - Eldrazi (U)
Creatures you don't control can’t have or gain vigilance, flying, deathtouch, first strike or hexproof.
6/6

Quote from Solesticio »

Me too, me too It's has it has ended already to me, it's a huge difference that didn't change in 2 days.

I was without internet access on the weekend, otherwise yes I would of finished it earlier.

EDIT: Congrats Flatline!

Your initial assumption of the role of Strictly Worse/Strictly better cards seems incorrect.

How can I justify reprinting Elite Vanguard if Dryad Militant exists?

Both are in different environments, each of those environments have different needs. Sometimes I want to push the power of my 1 drop white cards, in other sets or white weenie would be too strong with Dryad Militant. Also I can't be shackled to the past, if I design a Golbin Piker then am I literally doomed forever to never make anything stronger?

I suggest reading some articles about why "Bad Cards" are a good thing.

Poll ends in 12 hours

Indighost & bravelion83

holder

Join Reuben Covington and Dan Felder for the fifty-sixth episode of Re-Making Magic, the podcast about game design and custom magic cards.

DIRECT DOWNLOAD
Podcast archive link
RSS feed
iTunes Channel
MTGcast page
Check out the Remaking Magic blog and ask us questions

In this episode:

• Dan’s super busy with Faeria, meaning we will be doing another two part ep.
• We talk about “What makes a good mechanic?”
• Critique a Card: Herald of Thorns
• We discuss encouraging or enabling players to do something they like to do.
• We highlight Solving one of the core problems of MTG

Card Renders:


Contact details:
remakingmagic.tumblr.com

Reuben Covington
Twitter: @reubencovington
Email: reubencovington@gmail.com
MTGsalvation Account: Doombringer

Dan Felder
Twitter: @DesignerDanF
Email: minimallyexceptional@gmail.com
MTGsalvation Account: Stairc

Challenge: Choose three cards designed by other contestants in previous rounds of the January CCL. Redesign and improve those card.

Entries:

Quote from Solesticio »

It was quite hard to find 3 cards that I could fix without changing them completely. Some were just good, others just too flawed, and I really wanted to respect the creators' ideas and flavor, along with the source challenge.

In the 1st round we were asked to create an iconic creature. Forestguy came up with a quite interesting design, but that needed some tweaking.

Quote from Forestsguy »

Basic Tutor1BB
Creature - Demon (R)

Flying
When Basic Tutor enters the battlefield, Search your library for a card with converted mana cost equal to or less than the number of basic lands you control, Add it to your hand then shuffle your library.

"First the basics ..."
2/2

Nightshade Demon 2BB
Creature - Demon (R)
Flying
When Nightshade Demon enters the battlefield, if you cast it from your hand, you may search your library for a card with converted mana cost less than or equal to the number of Swamps you control, reveal it, and put it into your hand. Then shuffle your library.
Your void of knowledge is as dark as my mind.
3/3

In the 3rd round, we needed to create a hybrid design, that would fit both colors as a mono-colored card. Koopa did a good job on this one, but there were some concerns regarding 0 mana creatures.

Quote from Koopa »

Blundering Mastodon (G/W)
Creature - Elephant (U)
When Blundering Mastodon enters the battlefield, return a creature you control to its owner's hand.
"As graceful as a mastodon" - Abzan saying for "A disaster on legs".
3/3

Blundering Mastodon (G/W)
Creature - Elephant (U)
When Blundering Mastodon enters the battlefield, return a green or white creature you control to its owner's hand.
"As graceful as a mastodon" - Abzan saying for "A disaster on legs".
3/3

Finally, in one of the toughest rounds ever, we had to design a bleed and a break card. Asrama designed one of my favorite breaks, but most players detected a major flaw I missed as well: it's almost impossible to get rid of this (Dovescape too, but at least it's much cheaper). I also felt that red should leave creatures alone, so I added two clauses instead of one.

Quote from Asrama »

Break:

Immolate the Æther 2RRR
Enchantment (R)
Whenever a player casts a spell, counter it. Immolate the Æther deals damage equal to that spell's converted mana cost to target creature or player of that spell's controller choice.
Raya could feel the rage bubbling within her. "What will we do now?", asked Attama. "Burn it", came the answer. "Burn it all".

It should be pretty obvious: Red does not get to counter spells. Much like other red pie-breaking cards like Final Fortune, and Form of the Dragon, the flavor allows it do something that it otherwise wouldn't. Countering here isn't about control or preventing your opponent from achieving their goals, but rather turning the spells into pure energy that fans greater and greater flames.

Immolate the Æther 1RRR
Enchantment (R)
Whenever a player casts a noncreature spell, if it doesn't target Immolate the Æther, counter it. Immolate the Æther deals damage equal to that spell's converted mana cost to target creature or player of that spell's controller choice.
Raya could feel the rage bubbling within her. "What will we do now?", asked Attama. "Burn it", came the answer. "Burn it all".

Quote from Flatline »

The fix is in....

I'm starting off with my favorite card from the month (Hemlock's round 3 entry). I am applying the change I suggested when the discussion was had as to whether or not the card is too powerful. I think this is an excellent way to tone it down a bit.

Quote from Hemlock »

Gentle Rain
Sorcery (U)
Untap target land.
Draw a card.
"When the sky breaths life into the earth, no flower can resist the joy"

Gentle Rain
Sorcery (U)
Untap target basic land.
Draw a card.
"When the sky breaths life into the earth, no flower can resist the joy"

Next, let's take netn10's blue take on Genesis Wave from round 2 and make it work in blue...

Quote from netn10 »

Genesis Wave

Imagine into Reality XUUU
Sorcery (Rare)
Reveal the top X cards of your library. You may put any number of permanent cards with converted mana cost X or less from among them onto the battlefield. Then put all cards revealed this way that weren't put onto the battlefield into your graveyard.

Mass Produce
Sorcery (R)
Reveal the top X cards of your library. You may put any number of artifact cards with converted mana cost X or less from among them onto the battlefield. Then put all cards revealed this way that weren't put onto the battlefield into your graveyard.

Last, let's look at Koopa's color bleed entry from the Top 8 round. I felt his card was a bit efficient for repeated mono-green creature removal. I've powered the card down quite a bit here by making it require Jund colors to get the full effect. Also, the card is no longer a color bleed(break?).

Quote from Koopa »

Whiptail Scorpion 2G
Creature - Scorpion (R)
Deathtouch
2G, T: Whiptail Scorpion deals damage equal to it's power to another target creature.
I don't think even Zegana could manufacture a more efficient killing machine.
1/1

Flametail Scorpion 1BG
Creature - Scorpion (R)
Deathtouch
2R, T: Flametail Scorpion deals 1 damage to target creature.
"The Dragon swarms of Jund may be impressive, but it is often the less awe inspiring creatures that lead to one's demise."
1/3

Bravelion83 & Guesswork (Shouldn't be instant at this cost but otherwise this is great.)

Displacement 2W
Instant (C)
Exile up to two target creatures, then return them to the battlefield tapped under their owner's control.

Quote from Reality_Glitch »

I've had an idea for a dreamworld set myself as well and have been having trouble because I'm coming at it bottom-up and am having trouble with flavor and feel. You would you mind me or us making a bottom-up Return to Noctus set/block?

Thats fine as long as you include a reasonably prominent acknowledgement.

However I'm a big proponent of working on smaller projects such as a Duel Deck to start off, this can allow for easier playtesting and iteration of ideas.
This can then be expanded into a full set later if it goes well.