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The Magic Market Index Amonkhet Set Review
 
The Magic Market Index for April 21, 2017
 
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    posted a message on State of Modern Thread: bans, format health, reprints, new cards, and more! (3/13 update)
    Stirrings is broken in the right deck and mediocre/bad in another. The fact BFZ Eldrazi came along with "colorless" made that card too good. It would be nice to scale them back some and see the card go away. They can get by with Oath of Nissa. Also, I don't care if Scrap Trawler or Lantern leave with it, they can get by with Glint-Nest Crane(a blue card).

    Also, Aquatic Stirrings would look more like this:

    U

    Look at the top 5 cards and choose an artifact, blue instant or sorcery card into your hand. Put the rest on the bottom.
    Posted in: Modern
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    posted a message on Grixis Control
    I think some of us have switched over to Grixis Shadow because the proactive game plan with huge creatures is working better. If I were to switch back to Control I would try to run mana leak in place of squall for sure. Having played Control I just did not like how squall sat in my hand as I watched threats resolve and start to kill me.

    This deck is still fine to run but I think a different configuration would be better. Too often I was fighting an uphill battle and my threats were taken out too easily (Path on Tasigur). I would try to squeeze in more threats mainboard. Cards I would consider: Gifted Aetherborn, Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet, Grave Titan, Torrential Gearhulk, or heck even Death's Shadow. Just jam some Shadow's and ignore their creatures while you Cryptic Command tap their defense down and swing in to win.
    Posted in: Tier 2 (Modern)
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    posted a message on Grixis Death's Shadow
    Took this deck to a GPT last night for a 5 round event. Did not go so well...

    Decklist

    Round 1 vs Grixis Shadow: Draw 0-0-1

    My opp was slow with his choices and that is the reason we went to time in the 3rd match. First game we were both really low in life and he just happened to have Bolt, Snap, Bolt to finish me off. Game 2 he flooded while I drew all the good stuff and killed his shadow and angler and killed him with my double shadow. Game 3 was slow and we flooded except he drew Liliana quite late but neither of us had threats to finish each other off.

    Round 2 vs Biovisionary Combo: 1-0-1

    Not much to say about this one other than I had counters and kill spells for the visionary and mirrorweave. Easy match.

    Round 3 vs WB Tokens: 1-1-1

    Tokens doing what they do best, casting spirits and virtues and flying in for lots of damage to kill me because I was killing myself for big shadows. He had Auriok Champions to block all day long. I did fetch incorrectly and was unable to cast Anger to wipe his tokens but that did not solve the Champion issue. I needed more threats to punch through his defense.

    Round 4 vs 8 Rack: 1-2-1

    Thoughtseized his bridge and rack and killed him with snap beats while he drew nothing to deal with them. Game 2 he landed bridge and some racks and I was dead after that. Game 3 went about the same as 2 except I forgot to not fetch because I left EE on top to deal with a rack and affliction. He had a bridge but I had a few answers left in deck to destroy a bridge and attack for lethal.

    Round 5 vs Scrap Trawlololololer Combo: 1-3-1

    Thoughtseize and discard did close to nothing good unless it hit KCI. He combo'd the turn before I was going to kill him with shadows. Game 2 I killed myself a lot but managed to thoughtseize and surgical away his KCI's. I failed to draw threats and he was able to kill me with Trawler and Ballista.

    Conclusion: It really sucks killing yourself and failing to find shadows to cast in this deck. I really don't like that aspect which is why the Jund version is so consistent and works well with the shadow synergy. I might take a Delver version for a spin instead. It seems like it would be a good idea to have another threat which doesn't require you kill yourself for nothing. Also to note my sideboard is missing some recommended cards but I don't have them so I had to slot other things. I would definitely try to up the count of other cards instead of spreading it out with a lot of 1 of's.
    Posted in: Tier 2 (Modern)
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    posted a message on State of Modern Thread: bans, format health, reprints, new cards, and more! (3/13 update)
    Quote from skullscorcher »
    Green is the best color in Modern.

    Ancient Stirrings would be my vote for anything to go but I also dislike banning more cards. Stirrings is a broken card in the decks that play due to having no downside (Tron, Lantern, Scrap Trawlololer Combo, Bant Eldrazi) and looking at the top 5 from lands(temple, tron lands), answer(EE, Bridge, Karn) or threats(too many to count..) is way too good.

    I'm ok with a Stoneforge or Preordain unban. Ancestral Vision did nothing but give us false hope.
    Posted in: Modern
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    posted a message on Grixis Death's Shadow
    Quote from CreativeTheo »
    I've heard talk of doing the unthinkable and replacing Lightning Bolt with 3 ofRise // Fall,

    I've been testing it out and it's been pretty solid. Snap Bolt Snap is still a great play and I'd like a single bolt somewhere in the main but having 3 more ways to get back Shadows along with other creatures, unsummoning a blocker feels great. Also, using hymn mode after a TS or IoK feels amazing. With this I no longer feel the need for the white splash,


    That was my initial thought as well. This deck looks at their hand so much you would think that Fall would favor you greatly and it is worth testing out for sure. The huge downside you will run into however is "nonland" making it feel weak if you don't get two cards for two mana. The Rise portion at times will also be problematic because it requires two targets. You may want to bounce their dork early but you don't have a creature in the yard... Like someone else mentioned earlier the card is cute. I am still running it as a one of still so it will need more testing. I implore you to try it out and report your findings.
    Posted in: Tier 2 (Modern)
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    posted a message on Grixis Death's Shadow
    Quote from thewrush »
    @westcoasthorus Thoughts on Rise // Fall? I do no own any Lily, Last Hopes. Also your findings are very helpful.


    Rise//Fall felt just cute to us. My teammate experimented with it more than I did; I went to the Michael Majors 3 Bolt main (now 2 Bolt/1 Terminate) pretty quickly and never looked back. Like I said earlier, my philosophy with Shadow decks is I really really want to lean in on the efficiency of the cards in my deck. I want to force my opponent on the back foot as much as possible, and Rise//Fall is just a way to get more card advantage, which is not what I think the deck actually wants to be doing. Even though it can! Just like Abzan Company decks can also grind, but my philosophy with Company is that it's primarily a combo deck and you should be working towards the combo, not trying to eke out incremental advantage with things like Voice of Resurgence.

    And second @bloodyrabbit_01 on Liliana, the Last Hope. She is the Liliana that Grixis Shadow decks want and she is totally worth the investment. If you don't have her in a mirror match you are significantly behind, and as Rabbit also pointed out, Liliana helping clear spirits matters a lot because they can slow us down a ton (I lost in the quarters of a GPT this weekend to an Abzan Souls deck - Spectral Procession and Lingering Souls and Nissa voice of Zendikar and Sorin is really, really annoying, let me tell you).


    Alternatives I was considering for the time being are Electrickery and/or Izzet Staticaster. Yeah, I can see where she helps creature combat too. Your opp wants to trade and you -2/-1 their guy and now blocks look horrible for them.
    Posted in: Tier 2 (Modern)
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    posted a message on Grixis Death's Shadow
    @westcoasthorus Thoughts on Rise // Fall? I do no own any Lily, Last Hopes. Also your findings are very helpful.
    Posted in: Tier 2 (Modern)
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    posted a message on Grixis Death's Shadow
    Spreading Sea's is quicker even though it's an enchantment. I too consider Fulminator/Stone Rain/Molten Rain to be too slow. I'm not sure how you attack them. Just play more Terminate and kill spells?
    Posted in: Tier 2 (Modern)
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    posted a message on Modern Amonket discussion
    Cataracts would work with Fist of Suns I guess. Another cheat Emrakul into play deck? We don't need another one of those flavors.
    Posted in: Modern
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    posted a message on Modern Amonket discussion
    Quote from Weebo »
    Quote from sss123 »
    Quote from thewrush »
    Curator of Mysteries Do you get to scry 1 before you draw from cycle?
    No.
    Cycle means "discard a card" + " draw a card".
    This is incorrect, assuming the question is about cycling something when Curator is on board and not about cycling Curator. Abilities triggering from cycling resolve before the card draw from cycling. You activate a cycling ability (paying costs), Curator triggers, and the scry 1 goes on the stack above the cycle.


    I meant when Curator is in play, yes. So when you cycle another card you get to scry 1, then cycle happens?
    Posted in: Modern
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    posted a message on Sakashima the Impostor + Amonkhet God
    If Sakashima the Impostor were to copy say Kefnet the Mindful, he would ignore the part requiring seven cards in hand in order to attack or block right?
    Posted in: Magic Rulings
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    posted a message on Modern Amonket discussion
    Curator of Mysteries Do you get to scry 1 before you draw from cycle?
    Posted in: Modern
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    posted a message on State of Modern Thread: bans, format health, reprints, new cards, and more! (3/13 update)
    Stitched Drake, Vexing Sphinx and Illusory Angel might work. Thanks for pointing those out. Angel seems decent after you resolve AV the same turn. Sphinx could work alongside the new Curator but I don't like that it has to die at some point.
    Posted in: Modern
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    posted a message on State of Modern Thread: bans, format health, reprints, new cards, and more! (3/13 update)
    Quote from bizzycola »
    Quote from xenob8 »
    Quote from thewrush »
    I don't mind that blue doesn't get a powerful counterspell actually, I just want a playable blue creature that is worth casting besides Snap. Is there anything? If they want us to have creature threats why can't I get a blue focused one? Torrential Gearhulk costs 6 and we all know how not great control decks are in this format.


    vendilion clique? thing in the ice? delver of secrets?


    I think what he means is one that is Modern viable which would mean it has some type of natural resistance to BGx's removal. This might sound a bit extreme on the surface but in reality is essentially what any threat needs to be competitive at this point.


    Correct, I'm not looking for a blue goyf. We don't need another one of those. Give us a pushed blue creature that doesn't suck and doesn't require a bunch of setup just to match up to something else that is great after you cast it. Curator of Mysteries is fine but it costs 4 cmc and requires other cards to use his ability. I've been working on a mono blue devotion deck which tries to capitalize on enchantments and one of the key creatures is Riptide Chimera. Is that creature any good? No because he requires cheap enchantments to pay for his "cumulative upkeep." The other cards that work mediocre with him are Spreading Seas, Sea's Claim and potentially Reality Acid. Is that strategy any good? No, probably not. There isn't much of anything worth casting creature wise in blue unless I haven't looked hard enough.

    Mono Blue Devotion Concept
    Posted in: Modern
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    posted a message on State of Modern Thread: bans, format health, reprints, new cards, and more! (3/13 update)
    Clique dies to a gust of wind, Thing requires investment, Delver requires luck. So we need to rely on creatures that require a bunch of hoops? Sounds good to me, end of discussion.
    Posted in: Modern
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    posted a message on State of Modern Thread: bans, format health, reprints, new cards, and more! (3/13 update)
    I don't mind that blue doesn't get a powerful counterspell actually, I just want a playable blue creature that is worth casting besides Snap. Is there anything? If they want us to have creature threats why can't I get a blue focused one? Torrential Gearhulk costs 6 and we all know how not great control decks are in this format.
    Posted in: Modern
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    posted a message on Modern Amonket discussion
    Yep quite easy to enable with Goyf or Death's shadow in play. Also gives either of those creatures the trample they need. More playable Green cards in this set than anything else...
    Posted in: Modern
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    posted a message on [Primer] Green Nykthos Devotion (includes Tooth & Nail)
    Although her +0 ability can fail if you don't have enough loyalty to put the creature into play. It essentially did nothing then.
    Posted in: Developing Competitive (Modern)
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    posted a message on Modern Amonket discussion
    Let's not forget about Snapcaster Maqe potentially flashing it back to hard counter. Although it would be tough and only works if your opponent forgot about it in the yard. Still, it could happen! At least it is a hard counter vs everything. I'm glad it can at least do that. I think it would work alongside Serum Visions but I guess Thought Scour can do the same thing.
    Posted in: Modern
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    posted a message on Grixis Death's Shadow
    @Spooly

    I like your deck list and choice of cards.

    Question: How would you sideboard vs Bant Eldrazi?
    Posted in: Tier 2 (Modern)
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    posted a message on Grixis Delver
    Anyone ever consider Fury Charm in Grixis Shadow? Or does Temur Battle Rage have more application?
    Posted in: Modern Archives - Established
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    posted a message on State of Modern Thread: bans, format health, reprints, new cards, and more! (3/13 update)
    Quote from wpgstevo »
    I play Knightfall so I've very on-board with creature bashing being valid gameplay. But making it the only game-play is a problem.

    I take exception to the idea that counterspells are unfun - I think they are really fun! Counter wars are some of the most compelling gameplay for myself, so the idea that counterspells are objectively unfun is simply wrong. Maybe a majority of people find it unfun, which is fine. But some people finding something unfun doesn't need to dictate what is printed - that thinking leads down a dark path where we cut any gameplay that a subset of players finds 'unfun', artificially limiting the diversity of strategies available. We saw this with land destruction, and now counterspells. How long until they come for your discard?

    If you think it's fair that black gets the most powerful disruption every set while blue/white gets basically nothing for answers, then we're going to have to disagree about what makes the game 'unfun'. Unfun to me is when one archtype/colour continually benefits from the best cards set after set.


    Well said, also worth mentioning how cost effective everything is for Black/Green. I find it unfun playing against LoTV. You just don't come back from a planeswalker like that edicting your creatures and destroying your hand turn after turn.
    Posted in: Modern
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    posted a message on Grixis Delver
    Crazy idea here, probably not going to work out well. I merged Cryptic Delver with Death's Shadow.

    "Grixis Cryptic Delver Death"

    Posted in: Modern Archives - Established
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    posted a message on Grixis Delver
    Quote from marlboro92 »
    Is here :')


    Wouldn't we be seeing more people talk about this if it were real? It looks nice but we already received word from a source that it wasn't in the set.
    Posted in: Modern Archives - Established
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    posted a message on Cruel Control: Ultimate Ultimatum
    Yeah, I see this deck needing to hit 6 lands asap to begin its crushing dominance. You mentioned an esper build and I like that idea as well. White gets a lot more flash cards(Restoration Angel, Spell Queller come to mind) in that aspect and I could see a potentially faster deck there? Although Grixis does have a faster closing speed because of bolt. Esper brings a lot of good cards with it as well like sideboard staples and Ojutai's Command.

    For the burn matchup I guess you could try Collective Brutality. I altered your list slightly by removing 1 land for the 4th Fatal Push.
    Posted in: Developing Competitive (Modern)
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    posted a message on Modern Amonket discussion
    That land art has some peculiar colors in the sky on each card. Any idea?
    Posted in: Modern
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    posted a message on Grixis Control
    More tapped lands sounds like a bad idea honestly. We already have 2 tar pits and those can affect the early turns too much as is.
    Posted in: Tier 2 (Modern)
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    posted a message on Cruel Control: Ultimate Ultimatum
    Definitely, I'm only missing the Gearhulks really. What match-ups are a struggle?
    Posted in: Developing Competitive (Modern)
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    posted a message on Cruel Control: Ultimate Ultimatum
    How good is the deck running Gen0syde86? The list does look pretty sweet. I like the Teachings into Gearhulk package or whatever else you need to find at the time. Makes it easier to find your threats. The only thing I don't like about Gearhulk is the artifact part. I think he can get destroyed fairly easily. Has that been a problem? I suppose opponents don't side in narrow artifact removal for just two of your cards?
    Posted in: Developing Competitive (Modern)
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    posted a message on Grixis Control
    Quote from tweedls »
    Very happy with this deck! First time playing it since ancestral got unbanned and I 5-0'd my locals without losing a single game. If someone would like I can post a list.


    Sure, also list your meta. I've been going 1-3 and 2-2 mostly...It's a little frustrating at times. I've been looking to move Countersquall to the side because Mana Leak counters anything and I need that to prevent getting too far behind in the beginning. Anyone running 4 fatal push main?
    Posted in: Tier 2 (Modern)
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    posted a message on [Primer] Green Nykthos Devotion (includes Tooth & Nail)
    Maybe that rare niche case where you are playing vs slivers and their sliver enters with only one target being their own Aether Vial? I really don't see any benefit running the Harmonic Sliver.
    Posted in: Developing Competitive (Modern)
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    posted a message on Grixis Delver
    Quote from Sonnenrad »
    If you've been watching Michael Major's stream, a really neat card that I picked up a few up back in the day but never really used was Rise // Fall. A lot of the top decks in modern run very few lands (especially Death's Shadow decks) so a lot of times it can be a Hymn to Tourach. The Rise mode is also insane - it provides a ton of value in drawn out matchups with the ability to return a Snapcaster as well as a dead DS or even another Snapcaster.


    Where is his stream?
    Posted in: Modern Archives - Established
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    posted a message on [Primer] Green Nykthos Devotion (includes Tooth & Nail)
    Here is a nifty tidbit of information, Rishkar, Peema Renegade lets Wall of Roots tap to add green while it has a 0/-1 counter! His text only states the creature has to have a "counter." What is really cool about this archetype is that there are soooooo many different ways to build it and they all can be successful.

    What's so hard right now for me is I don't know which deck I want to play. I want to play them all!
    Posted in: Developing Competitive (Modern)
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    posted a message on Grixis Delver
    I don't think Ancestral Vision and Delver work too well together. For card draw you could try either Painful Truths or Pain's Reward (this card just spiked). Probably only play 1 of's.
    Posted in: Modern Archives - Established
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    posted a message on [Primer] Green Nykthos Devotion (includes Tooth & Nail)
    In my testing, Nissa, Voice of Zendikar has been great. She is basically the Gavony Township in Mono-Green Devotion. Easy to cast and makes all our dorks better at going offensive/defensive also -2'ing her is the most frequent mode I've used. If the opp wants to waste an attack on her at 1 loyalty that is fine since I play 4 Eternal Witness to recur and do the same thing again. I only have a one of but every time I've played her she made a big difference. I recommend her.
    Posted in: Developing Competitive (Modern)
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    posted a message on Grixis Delver
    Stone Rain is less mana intensive and see's no play. If you're reaching down to Ghost Quarter level might as play GQ then?
    Posted in: Modern Archives - Established
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    posted a message on Cruel Control: Ultimate Ultimatum
    I like your list Grimble. Has anyone in this thread had great success with this style of deck? I've been wanting to try something different from the other Grixis Control. It's a neat deck but it just loses to itself when it can't draw or deploy threats soon enough. This style doesn't rely on graveyard as much and can play different creatures other than Tasigur. Plus Cruel Ultimatum just feels so dirty to cast late game.
    Posted in: Developing Competitive (Modern)
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    posted a message on Grixis Control
    Quote from janozimek »
    Death's shadow is all the temur rage atm.

    Fixed.

    Death's shadow is great in Modern because it doesn't have access to Swords to Plowshares. There are some cards in white that do something similar but people still aren't playing them (hi Condemn!). Also the strategy of being proactive and powerful discard outweighs reactive and draw go. Not to mention there is also shocklands which synergize well with the life loss into a huge 1 CMC threat. I should have seen this coming sooner but failed to test/realize its power. The good news is the strategy isn't oppressive just powerful.


    I don't think Control has too much problem dealing with DS though. We have late game Cryptic Command locks and can burn them out if needed. You are right though with the Jund version being the best.
    Posted in: Tier 2 (Modern)
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    posted a message on [[Official]] Modern Prices Discussion
    You don't have to buy a playset of something or the deck all at once. You can acquire the cards over time and at reasonable amounts. I think a lot of people don't plan out their purchases thoroughly enough. When I started getting into Modern I was taking my time bidding on Merfolk cards at lower than average prices. I eventually got some sweet deals (Aether Vials x4 for $45) and it worked out great. I had a deck (non T1 mind you) eventually and got to play when I finished it. I can't say the same for Tier 1 decks because they have already been proven and will cost you more. That doesn't mean you can't be patient and find good deals.
    Posted in: Modern
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    posted a message on Grixis Control
    Went to TNM last night and did not do well. Resolved plenty of AV but did not draw threats. Got Blood Mooned out in one game as well. Matches were Affinity(Draw), Grixis Delver(Loss), UW Gifts Tron(Draw) and WB Tokens(Win). Against Delver game 1 I could not for the life of me find a threat, just drew control cards all game and milled Tasigurs/Snaps/Kolaghans. Game 2 he dropped Blood Moon and eventually landed a one of Chandra, Torch of Defiance. He Molten Rained my only swamp as well. Not a good night.

    My list is not the same as one in the signature either. Did not have time to make changes before leaving.
    Posted in: Tier 2 (Modern)
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    posted a message on Grixis Control
    How do you all feel about playing a Keranos, God of Storms in the SB to add extra grindy-oomph to the midrange matches?

    I think it's worse in the Cryptic Command versions, but maybe in the Blue Jund versions? Thoughts?


    Took him out since Jeskai Nahiri was a thing and so did a lot of others. Would need to put him back in and see if a sorcery bolt / draw additional card at upkeep guy is worth bringing back in. Maybe with all the different variations of control coming around it might be worth taking another look at.
    Posted in: Tier 2 (Modern)
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    posted a message on Grixis Control
    It also depends what type of tournament scenes you frequent. Big 200+ player requires a whole range of cards and it is best to start with Corey's list since it is crafted that way. Now when you only expect to play small tournaments you can customize it however you want. Test some cards out, do something non standard. You can throw a lot of people off who know the general construction of the deck. Adding variations will confuse people and make them play differently. Nothing wrong with making a slightly different deck. Just make sure you play your variation heavily so you know the ins and outs.

    Right now my list is stock but I decided to throw in a Dark Petition to see if helps any. Yeah it is totally off the wall and the only 5 cmc spell but the text on the card offers something to me that I like. I feel that this deck lacks finding specific answers and I want to address it somehow. Spell mastery seems easily achievable too.

    Some scenarios I tried to come up with:

    - Petition for Engineered Explosives, cast for 1 with activation ready or cast for 0, activate and also cast Push
    - Petition for Tasigur, the Golden Fang or Gurmag Angler, cast using all 3 black or use it with combination of Fatal Push and or Terminate (requires an open red for terminate) afterwards
    - Petition for Damnation and cast (requires 6 mana though)
    - Petition for Fulminator Mage and cast
    - Petition for Surgical Extraction
    - Petition for Collective Brutality and cast
    - Petition for Kolaghan's Command and cast (requires an open red and 6 mana)
    - Petition for Snapcaster Mage or Fatal Push (6 mana total with one blue open) and do a combination of Push, Snap, Push. Something totally crazy.

    Don't have to necessarily find a black card, you might have it in your hand already. So you could find something to cast next turn and still cast something with black during the turn. Niche case scenarios at best. Sorcery might not be the best game plan but finding answers or threats seems like a good idea to me. Gifts Ungiven or Mystical Teachings could be leagues better.



    Posted in: Tier 2 (Modern)
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    posted a message on Grixis Control
    Quote from EdguFonseca »
    What you think about Goblin Dark Dwellers I'm playing two main deck


    I think he is fine but 5 cmc is pretty high. He is a decent threat and can cast those AV from the yard but I think some people have tried him then took him out? If he is working for you then great! If you can add some feedback about playing them it would also be helpful. My thoughts are a 4/4 with menace and reusing a terminate, fatal push, KCommand or AV is fantastic but the body might not be good enough that late in the game. He also taps you out while this style of deck plays re actively with cheap threats. Maybe just play as a 1 of?
    Posted in: Tier 2 (Modern)
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    posted a message on Grixis Control
    Essence Scatter vs any creaure heavy deck. We lose to hoards of them no? And we don't run too many board wipes in the side. Why not have a generic hard counter? Mana leak isn't reliable late game which this deck grinds out towards. Our only other counters are CC, negate, and countersquall usually. Some don't run leak either. It is odd not seeing a creature only counter. It should at least be brought up. Not to mention the the easy mana cost.

    Singing-Bell was just an idea as an alternative psuedo lock down. Perhaps not usuable in this shell. It will defintely get some wierd looks when it's played. No one will bring in enchantment removal either.

    Take into custody same as above except maybe better reserved for a delver shell. Just tossing ideas out there. Sometimes control comes in different forms. You can't play draw go and win and sometimes things slip through and you need ways of handling them differently. Opponents know the decklist and will find ways of baiting our counters to let better answers through.

    To me bouncing cheap threats or ones with ETB effects just isn't a good strategy for blue anymore. I'm looking to counter or lock them down effectively and ignore them. Reason I like tap effects is so Tasigur can push damage through instead of waiting for a cryptic. A lot of talk in the current state of Modern thread about how blue is terrible but no one is bringing up possible answers. I thought it might be a good idea to share my own.
    Posted in: Tier 2 (Modern)
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    posted a message on Grixis Control
    Overlooked cards:
    Take into Custody
    Singing-bell strike
    Essence Scatter

    Anyone thought of running these? I know they don't fix the problem but they should at least be looked at and considered right? Scatter seems the mostly likely one you would want to use. Only downside to Singing is it is an enchantment.


    Posted in: Tier 2 (Modern)
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    posted a message on Grixis Delver
    A card I have been looking to include as a 1 of for testing: Hands of Binding. If bouncing and trying to counter creatures isn't something that blue is effective at, why not try to "freeze" something down? I like the card in the deck because we have Delver of Secrets to cipher it on. You can also snap cipher it later as well, the spell will exile but the encode portion will allow you to do it since it is meeting the exile clause. It being a sorcery is the only downside I see. As an example:

    T1: Play Delver
    T2: Delver flips. Cast Hands of Binding on their creature(taps it) encode it and attack with Delver dealing combat damage to tap down another creature(if any). Those two creatures won't untap on opp's turn.
    T3: Delver connects but this time he can only keep locking one down.

    The good part about this spell is the continuing free portion of it when you keep connecting. I know killing or countering is better but I could see some potential using this.
    Posted in: Modern Archives - Established
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    posted a message on Grixis Control
    Quote from Ym1r »
    Quote from thewrush »
    What if this deck ran Death's Shadow? It constantly hovers at low life the entire game. I'm sure some have had them in the sideboard at one point, but I can see playing them as an extra cheap threat.

    On a side note I was pretty disappointed with the GP results. Hardly any Blue representation minus Merfolk. Modern is so dominated by Black, Green, Red it seems. Green is obviously one of the best colors and makes me feel like if I'm not playing green I deserve to lose. Anyway, been seeing some Grixis control popping up in the 5-0's still. At least that is still happening.

    Edit: I didn't take the time to go through anything non top 8. I see Corey made it to 19th which is awesome news really and another in 32nd place by Andy Wilson. There were also some Esper variants in Brisbane. Not bad I guess.
    There were also 2 grixis control decks at the SCG combined weekend, a Corey like list and a more midrangey one that ended up 2nd.


    Ahh, thank you for pointing those out. I was unaware of the team constructed event. I do like that 2nd place deck design by Asa. Zero AV and a few more creatures along with mainboard damnation does look pretty sweet.
    Posted in: Tier 2 (Modern)
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    posted a message on State of Modern Thread: bans, format health, reprints, new cards, and more!
    In my opinion, blue is bad because:

    • Counterspells are narrow and conditional. You don't get them at the right time.
    • Uncounterable spells have made their way in to some degree. There aren't many of them, but that leads to..
    • Cavern of souls, which is also situational and can only be played in tribal decks basically. Eldrazi being the most broken one doesn't help.
    • Bouncing things isn't a good idea anymore which blue is known for. Which leads me to...
    • Creatures have become more powerful and more efficient now and bouncing them back to hands is a bad play no doubt. I don't want my opponent to reuse a creature with a spell stapled on it.
    • Card draw and filtering has been toned down and it doesn't help that Green has seemingly better options now (restrictive but more powerful in the right shell obviously, traverse and ancient stirrings).
    • No blue creatures are amazing other than Snapcaster Mage.

    I was a tad disappointed with the GP results. It was a bummer to not see more Blue strategies in the top 8. I did notice there were a few blue control variants beyond 9+ though so all hope is not lost. As much as I hate saying it a Twin unban might be ok despite hating that deck for its power level. But there has to be something other than a combo deck to represent it.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
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    posted a message on Grixis Control
    What if this deck ran Death's Shadow? It constantly hovers at low life the entire game. I'm sure some have had them in the sideboard at one point, but I can see playing them as an extra cheap threat.

    On a side note I was pretty disappointed with the GP results. Hardly any Blue representation minus Merfolk. Modern is so dominated by Black, Green, Red it seems. Green is obviously one of the best colors and makes me feel like if I'm not playing green I deserve to lose. Anyway, been seeing some Grixis control popping up in the 5-0's still. At least that is still happening.

    Edit: I didn't take the time to go through anything non top 8. I see Corey made it to 19th which is awesome news really and another in 32nd place by Andy Wilson. There were also some Esper variants in Brisbane. Not bad I guess.
    Posted in: Tier 2 (Modern)
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    posted a message on Bant Eldrazi
    In case someone is looking for an alternate version because they do not own any Nobles yet. I replaced Noble with 4 of Birds of Paradise, 1 Boreal Druid, (5th bird in this case) and 2 Qasali Pridemages for the Exalted trigger and mainboard Artifact/Enchantment removal. Not ideal but it is still an option.


    Link to deck @ TappedOut.net
    Posted in: Tier 1 (Modern)
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    posted a message on Grixis Control
    On the topic of Grixis Control with discard. This list just sprung up conveniently.

    https://www.mtggoldfish.com/deck/573717#paper

    Just remands and counterfluxes.
    Posted in: Tier 2 (Modern)
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    posted a message on Grixis Control
    Quote from Tiemuuu »
    I thought I'd share my recent league match-ups for *****s and giggles:

    burn W
    bogles W
    eldrazi tron W
    eldrazi tron L
    eldrazi tron L

    burn W
    junk W
    eldrazi tron L
    burn L
    naya zoo L

    bant eldrazi L
    eldrazi tron W


    Burn and Tron, such a diverse meta...At least paper is different or so I think. Is it time to run spreading sea's in this new world? Need more land disruption looks like.
    Posted in: Tier 2 (Modern)
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    posted a message on [Primer] Green Nykthos Devotion (includes Tooth & Nail)
    Well the Lab Maniac win appears to be a secondary option. I'm pretty sure you just smash them with a bunch of angry Omnath elementals.
    Posted in: Developing Competitive (Modern)
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    posted a message on Grixis Control
    Looks like Abzan has made a resurgence and that gives this deck a bit of a fit honestly. A tougher matchup than Jund for sure. This has got me thinking, would Echoing Decay be worthwhile for us? Just thinking out loud here. Bile Blight does exist but getting BB is tougher.

    Pros
    • Instant, can be snapped back
    • Only 1 Black in cost
    • Can kill or weaken duplicate creatures like lingering souls
    • Decent vs. Burns creature suite
    • Decent vs. other aggressive decks (zoo?)

    Cons
    • Doesn't help vs our worst matchups like Eldrazi, Tron, Ramp etc.
    • Doesn't kill enough problematic creatures
    • Contends with Collective Brutality to a degree

    I would probably try this card out in place of Jace, AoT
    Posted in: Tier 2 (Modern)
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    posted a message on [Primer] Green Nykthos Devotion (includes Tooth & Nail)
    Found this spicy something or other while browsing https://mtgdecks.net/deck/face_to_face_toronto_1k_sunday_showdown/modern/genesis_wave_christos_kaldis/668299/.

    Draw your deck with a combination of Genesis Wave into Greater Good and win with Lab Maniac Grin
    Posted in: Developing Competitive (Modern)
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    posted a message on State of Modern Thread: bans, format health, reprints, new cards, and more!
    It's time for Jace, The Mindsculptor to be freed from his prison! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sENM2wA_FTg

    Of course we really need some extensive testing done here. He could be a good candidate for a MM17 reprint too.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
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    posted a message on Sultai Delver
    Grisly Salvage playable in this type of deck? Digs for a threat, land or fills the yard for SCM/Delve.
    Posted in: Deck Creation (Modern)
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    posted a message on Grixis Control
    I just finished getting my 4th AV(2 TSP and 2 DD version same card frame) and each of them were between $30 - $38 (not even close to $50) from eBay. After receiving them them all were SP - NM. Just keep your eye out and you'll acquire them eventually. Although with the recent popularity of the deck I could see them going on average for a tad more...
    Posted in: Tier 2 (Modern)
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    posted a message on Colorless EldraziTron (1/2016 - 1/2017)
    Playtesting showed I didn't draw either creature at the right time to benefit from the +1 counters on scions. Now that I think about it Eldrazi Mimic serves the same purpose being a 2 drop but is easier to cast than Metallic. Exiling cards for processing was decent but I don't think Blight herder made any difference. Reality smasher x4 is still better in that regards. It was a fun idea but I don't think it will pan out. When it comes to sideboarding you don't get to swap out too many cards without diluting the processor function. I guess you could board out Herders?

    TL:DR Overall fun idea but its not better than the current stock list in the end.
    Posted in: Modern Archives - Established
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    posted a message on Colorless EldraziTron (1/2016 - 1/2017)


    Janky idea incoming... I saw Metallic Mimic and wanted to make it useful and then I remembered Blight Herder exists. So here is a first rough draft with a build. The janky part is using Pyxis of Pandemonium to exile then Herder will process those cards giving them little to none and you can activate it if you need to and drop in all your exiled stuff. I wonder if it is better to run 4 Pyxis and 2 relic instead? There might not be enough exile effects in the deck.
    Posted in: Modern Archives - Established
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    posted a message on Grixis Control
    @Momsie 11 Grixis Control?! Does that include Delver variants? Seems like a lot of Grixis Mages in one tournament :p I did get to watch the stream for a bit and saw two Grixis players lose in the top 8. I was cheering for them but they had bad matchups. The Burn matchup is indeed horrid and I have no idea what can be done to fight it other than suggest Vampiric Link, Collective Brutality, Sun Droplet or even Bottle Gnomes?

    Once you lose life you never gain it back so a lot of tight play comes with playing this deck. I've read some of the Cruel Control thread and someone has an interesting deck with 4 Snapcaster Mages, 2 Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet as creatures. The only delve card is Logic Knot. You play main board sweepers in Damnation and Cruel Ultimatum. More or less the same Grixis package but instead more lands as well. I'm tempted to run something like that for a try.

    Deck for reference: http://www.mtgvault.com/davidgaz/decks/ubr-control/
    YouTube channel: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCGX4DfQPDykn-UnBopPxyBQ
    Posted in: Tier 2 (Modern)
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    posted a message on Grixis Control
    Quote from rogue_LOVE »
    This is a pretty janky idea, but I've thought a bit more on the question of how we can get that bit of extra reach when our Tasigurs/Tar Pits/Snapcasters/Bolts just aren't quite getting there. And I thought, "Hey, why not try a Mindswipe?"

    It's horrible with Snapcaster, and it's mana-intensive as a counter, but we're often sitting on a ton of mana and I'd bet we can usually counter and burn face pretty hard with one of those. (Remember that it burns the spell's controller even if they pay through it.) Granted, I don't think we'd ever want to see more than one, but I might swap out one of my counter slots for a one-of and see how it goes.


    I remember seeing this card and thought it might be good. I wasn't playing Grixis at the time though, so I was unsure which deck it would slot into. The card is worth testing for sure, I'm constantly annoyed by the conditional counters we play since they never show up at the right time when you need them. Plus this damages their face or can be used to keep a Planewalker in check (a frequent problem this deck can have IMO). I don't want to waste a bolt just to keep a walker from ultimating.

    I would agree, just test it as a 1 of for now.
    Posted in: Tier 2 (Modern)
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    posted a message on Grixis Control
    Thanks for the idea's. I'm thinking of adding Vendilion Clique now. Possibility for a pseudo thoughtseize effect, flying, flash, and hand information. Can always target yourself to remove a dead AV or extra Tas. Only running 3 AV though and waiting to get a 4th for now. Just got 2 Scalding Tarns so I'm pretty happy about that. Currently running this fetch package:

    4 Polluted Delta
    2 Scalding Tarn
    1 Bloodstained Mire
    1 Flooded Strand

    I'll give the Clique a go and see if I like them. It is a sweet card though, flying is something this deck struggles with. Oh and I forgot my list is nearly identical to the Burkhart one. Just a tad different land base.
    Posted in: Tier 2 (Modern)
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    posted a message on Grixis Control
    I have problems closing the game out, sometimes Tas doesn't show up soon enough. Sometimes you just take too much damage and you are to far behind to take the lead. This deck needs a strong finish card or something that helps prevent us from dying. Kalitas looks fine but he is a 4 drop and won't be too good after push. 6 six drops look like they could help but there is no room for them. I keep wanting to run Grave Titan or Aetherling even as a 1 of. Maybe Liliana the last hope? Anyone else think we need a card like those to help?
    Posted in: Tier 2 (Modern)
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    posted a message on [Primer] Green Nykthos Devotion (includes Tooth & Nail)
    Strengthening Ballista is indeed sweet for a big mana deck such as this one. Definitely should be a sideboard card since it can help vs all kinds of aggro decks and gives green a machine gun type of damage outlet.

    On a side note, Oath of Ajani got me thinking recently. I think a build utilizing Genesis Wave / Cloudstone Curio could be made .If you are going the enchantment route you could maybe play Commune with the Gods and run cards like (going Bant of course):

    Posted in: Developing Competitive (Modern)
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    posted a message on [Primer] Green Nykthos Devotion (includes Tooth & Nail)
    I'm somewhat skeptical of the Expertise card. To me it sounds like "Pay 4GG, Draw 0/1/2, Cast BTE/Eternal Witness/Garruk Wildspeaker" since it seems unlikely to have our 1 of's on board (or in hand) when we cast this. I'd be more inclined to play Harmonize to draw 3. Playtesting extensively will tell us for sure. Otherwise yes, it is a sweet card. You would want to play Primal Command in a deck with this because X spells won't work.

    Also, I just put my Mono-Green Devotion deck back together since Shaun Mclaren was streaming with it and showing people the fun times it can bring. He was Primal looping his tron opponent 4 turns in a row which prevented them from getting anywhere and was extremely satisfying to watch.

    My build is all in on devotion consisting of:
    4 BTE
    4 Selkie
    4 Nykthos
    4 Primal
    1 Nissa, Voice of Zendikar (wow she is sweet!)
    Posted in: Developing Competitive (Modern)
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    posted a message on [[Official]] Modern Prices Discussion
    Think Engineered Explosives and Ancestral Vision will be reprinted in MM3 (Modern Masters 2017)? I'm debating whether or not to pick up a few of each right now. I'm not sure if AV will continue to go up with upcoming Yahenni's Expertise (casts AV for free late game) coming from Aether Revolt.
    Posted in: Modern
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    posted a message on Grixis Delver
    Anyone consider a 1 of Sword of the Meek in this deck? Free when it's milled by Thought scour and returned by a Delver of Secrets or Young Pyromancer token.
    Posted in: Modern Archives - Established
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    posted a message on Grixis Control
    @rogue_LOVE

    I like the list man, it plays out like a Blue Jund deck. I'd say if it is working out for you then roll with it. Whatever helps you stabilize and get to the lategame is the best configuration.

    Vs. Burn main deck collective is so good that you may want to add more and forego the droplets altogether? What would you bring Pack Rat in vs? Maybe add a Darkslick Shores for more turn 1 black?
    Posted in: Tier 2 (Modern)
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    posted a message on Grixis Control
    Quote from Esgares1 »
    Will this deck work with Bloodstained Mire and without Ancestral Vision?


    Yes, I'm running it configured that way right now. The difference between Tarn and Mire/Strands is not the end of the world. You may lose an extra point of life or two but it works. If you don't have any Ancestral Vision just fill up the slots with other cards like Mana Leak, Remand, Spell Snare, Electrolyze.

    I've been running 1 Negate, 2 PnK, 1 Steam vents in place of four AV. Eventually, I will acquire all four.
    Posted in: Tier 2 (Modern)
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    posted a message on [Official] Altered Art Thread (56k Beware)
    So in case someone was looking for inspiration on alters I came up with what I think would be cool. The theme I am suggesting is Full Metal Alchemist alters on the following cards (specifically a modern Grixis deck):

    Just some idea's mostly. Oh and I really dig that Princess Mononoke alter!
    Posted in: Artwork
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    posted a message on [Primer] MonoU Tron - "The well-oiled machine"
    I play U tron to crush Jund players. Plain and simple. Their $2k deck vs our $300 deck is so satisfying IMO. I don't care if I don't win all my matches. Also, I like the surprised look on people's faces when you play Island + Urza Land. Also Mindslavering people and wrecking them with their own cards is fun.

    I was playing vs. a friend in the store while we waited for a draft to start. Another frequent player(he only plays tier 1 decks) sat down to watch and took note of the decks we were playing. The game goes by and he asks me "Why not play the better Tron deck?, what are your win conditions even?" I replied "Mindslaver." He shook his head and walked away... I say to my friend "Guess he doesn't like watching tier 3 decks." We both shrug.

    Moral of the story: Just play something you enjoy.
    Posted in: Developing Competitive (Modern)
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    posted a message on [Primer] MonoU Tron - "The well-oiled machine"
    Aether Revolt spoilers!

    Yet another mage has emerged to reward us even more.


    Trophy Mage 2U
    When Trophy Mage enters the battlefield you may search your library for an artifact card with 3 CMC, reveal it, put it into your hand, then shuffle your library.

    Can fetch up O-stone, Filigree Familiar, Crucible of Worlds, Swords. The blue Stoneforge basically.

    Scrap Trawler 3
    Whenever Scrap Trawler or another artifact you control is put into a graveyard from the battlefield, return to your hand target artifact card in your graveyard with lesser converted mana cost.
    Posted in: Developing Competitive (Modern)
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    posted a message on Grixis Control
    Quote from motleyslayer »
    watched a bit of Burkhart's stream and now I really wanna start playing something very similar to his as it makes me miss playing Grixis Control, has anyone had success with his version of the deck?


    Which stream would that be? Nevermind, found it.

    http://www.channelfireball.com/videos/channel-burkhart-modern-grixis-control/
    Posted in: Tier 2 (Modern)
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