I wouldn't waste too much time on specific SB hate for this deck, they are sort of similar to Esper Stoneblade, they can attack via different angles. Mulligan slow hands away and try to go under them as quick as possible. I would keep hands that have at least one of Etched Champion, Arcbound Ravager, or Cranial Plating and hope they don't have any removal.
If you play Dispatch in the MB like I do, hold onto them for Batterskull. Nothing worse than them gaining life and undoing your damage. If it gets to the mid-late game, ravager and chump blockers for their batterskull; and hope to resolve Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas to finish them off.
I think I'll take your advice on the sneak attack match up, although the O-ring can hit the enchantment itself.
The mana base changes are more complicated. I prefer going in with more resilience than explosiveness. I know affinity is all about being explosive, but it's my first tournament and I don't know if there will be wastelands all over the place or not. Besides, I love the look on ppls face when I -1 my Tezz on a citadel right away!
Sneak and Show has got to be my worst matchup; I don't think I have ever won even 1 game (auto 0-2). I'm thinking about dropping my o-rings for a couple of ensnaring bridges. This will stop them from even attacking if they get their fatty into play; I can stilll attack with my ornithopters, skirges and pest. We can then fast equip plating or use ravager shennanigans or even wait it out for Tez ultimate.
Not alot of decks (besides Jund) are running artifact hate, so I think ensnaring bridges will have good application against other creature based decks like reanimator, maverick, and even stoneblade.
I was worried about Show and Tell, but I thought that Meddling Mage would be a good SB option for it, as well as helping me vs. ANT/Storm. Chalice for 1 to shut off cantrip cards also seemed strong to me. Not sure about how to deal with the Sneak Attack aspect of the Sneak and Show though...
Not sure if I like Whipflare in the SB, as it doesn't deal with TNN. Was thinking either Zealous Persecution or Golgari Charm might be a better option, and the Charm could help me out vs. Sneak Attack.
Pithing Needle is your answer to Sneak Attack. Show and Tell on the other hand...maybe Oblivion Ring or Meekstone.
I put Sin Collector in the side when it started showing up in lists. I've never used it and I play a lot of Melira Pod. What matchup is is for? Is it really worth taking up a sideboard slot?
Its good against UWR and other decks that play alot of spells.
Would someone mind explaining why Daybreak Coronet is so essential?
I understand the qualities of the Vigilance and Lifelink in terms of beating aggro, but in a deck that sometimes has consistency issues isn't it a bit greedy to play a WW that can only help a previously-enchanted creature?
The likes of Spirit Mantle lets you nearly ignore aggro and Deathtouch creatures altogether, especially if you Spirit Link your own or one of their creatures. I'm also sometimes having issues against Tron; a Daybreak Coronet is something for my regular G/R opponent to hit with Nature's Claim or Karn.
I am aware that Daybreak Coronet is better, and must admit that budget issues are forcing me to seek alternatives. However, I still don't quite understand why the card is so vital and would appreciate any help with that.
Bogle is a beating machine with a very specfic toolbox (auras) that doesn't change much; most deck pilots will realize that the only way to beat bogle is to disrupt it or race it.
If they are racing, what better way than to chump block and swing with the rest of the team. Thats where Daybreak Coronet comes in, in your toolbox, this is your swiss army knife. It enables your creature to play both offense and defense due to its vigiliance /lifelink / first strike effect.
You're creature is always going to be bigger, and always going to come out on top in any combat situation (with First Strike -- first strike will also counter their deathtouch creatures). Even if they chump block you a few turns, you're getting a 10 life swing each attack phase (yours and your opponents). Any hope of racing bogle backfires with Daybreak on board. W
Because of the very few threats that bogles has on board, it's really important to play fetches and a copy or two of dryad arbor. Mostly due to the jund matchup. Jund has liliana of the veil which can cause you to sacrifice your creature. Having a uncracked fetch online to grab that dryad arbor to sac in place is really important.
Horizon Canopy is another important tool in your toolbox, because bogle has no real way of replenishing its hand other than a kor spiritwalker (which almost always gets killed right away), horizon canopy helps you dig one card deeper which could be the difference between winning and losing a game.
Spirit Mantle is a good card, the only enchantment that I would cut to play it would be unflinching courage. The other auras are just too essential to the bogle toolbox.
Maybe try removing the Thalias and trying a one of each (garruk relentless and elspeth knight-errant) to see which one has more impact. I have a feeling Garruk's tutoring ability would be more advantageous in our deck if hes left unanswered. His three loyaty is what irks me, he dies the most heavily played red removal lightning bolt.
A 5 mana spell is not going to help against the deck that plays a bunch of 1s and 2s.
Earlier in the thread we discussed Spellskite and Engineered Explosives as potential options that also help in a bunch of matches. Back To Nature is probably the best single card to fight Bogle, but that ties up SB slots for every other match. Its your call as to how much hate you need.
For me, I will be running MD Qasali Pridemage from now on, and I will also be trying Chalice of The Void. Set it at 1, and most of Bogle is un-castable! That should at least slow them down enough to win the board race.
Aether Vial is NOT necessary. In fact, I tried it before and I thought it was a poor choice for this deck. It makes the deck slower. Use those slots for more actual creatures, Time of Needs, removal spells, etc.
And one last thing... I don't think Kibler's list is good. He went 0-3 in Modern matches with that list. I highly recommend trying a different take on the list.
Thanks for responding crab. What do you think of this..
Not too sure about Time of Need, currently i don't run any legends right now. I suppose if i'm running Linvala or Teeg this could be a good second copy of them. This would probably mean wilt-leaf is gone, but i feel like cutting wilt-leaf makes my WG creatures that much weaker. Thoughts?
Right now i am running kibler's wold championship list (with a couple of minor tweaks: 1 eslpeth in place of a ooze, and the 4th canopy), i find i have alot of problems with the Rock (they have so much removal) and Bogle. Is there something i can do to make my matchups against them better?
Currently against Rock I side in 2 dismembers and 2 thruns. But i think i should of also sided in 3 mirran crusaders and 2 sowap. If they land scavenging oozes and deathrites, its really tough for me to deal with especially with all the creatures in my graveyard. They keep gaining life to offset the damage i deal to them.
Agaisnt Bogle, i'm totally lost, i side out my paths, but i think thats bad cause spirtwalker is allow to run rampant.
I'm thinking of adding some baneslayer angels to the maindeck (possibly cutting a smiter and wilt-leaf). Cutting thalia from the mb and burrenton forge-tenders in the sb for 3 qasali pridemage (2mb, 1sb) and 2 chalices (sb).
What do you guys think about adding that fourth copy of horizon canopy instead of a third forest? I know it makes us more suscepticle to blood moon, but with qasali pridesmage in the main and explosives in the sb i think we should be ok.
and skirsdag high priest, and tragic slip, and doomed traveler.
yet we have some joker in the aristocrats section of proven swearing that rest in peace doesn't hinder the deck at all.
cause you know, shutting down 20 cards is nbd.
I don't mind any graveyard hate except rest in peace. That card completely shuts down any interaction with aristocrats. If i didn't board in abrupt decay, i usually just concede the game right away.
I've been noticing that Rest In Peace popping up in a lot of decks recently, forcing me to change my sb to ray of revelation. But now i'm considering golgari charm as well, in case they side RIP out in game three, i'm not stuck with a dead card.
Knight of Infamy is an awesome card to take the slot of voice. Protection to white, exalted and can block voice, voice tokens , smiters and any other white creature all day long.
http://sales.starcitygames.com//deckdatabase/displaydeck.php?DeckID=82337
Maybe a couple of Pithing Needle for Jace, the Mind Sculptor, and if you want to stop their cantripping Chalice of the Void at 1.
I wouldn't waste too much time on specific SB hate for this deck, they are sort of similar to Esper Stoneblade, they can attack via different angles. Mulligan slow hands away and try to go under them as quick as possible. I would keep hands that have at least one of Etched Champion, Arcbound Ravager, or Cranial Plating and hope they don't have any removal.
If you play Dispatch in the MB like I do, hold onto them for Batterskull. Nothing worse than them gaining life and undoing your damage. If it gets to the mid-late game, ravager and chump blockers for their batterskull; and hope to resolve Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas to finish them off.
Sneak and Show has got to be my worst matchup; I don't think I have ever won even 1 game (auto 0-2). I'm thinking about dropping my o-rings for a couple of ensnaring bridges. This will stop them from even attacking if they get their fatty into play; I can stilll attack with my ornithopters, skirges and pest. We can then fast equip plating or use ravager shennanigans or even wait it out for Tez ultimate.
Not alot of decks (besides Jund) are running artifact hate, so I think ensnaring bridges will have good application against other creature based decks like reanimator, maverick, and even stoneblade.
Heres my revamped sb:
4 Chalice of the Void
4 Rest In Peace
3 Ethersworn Canonist
2 Ensnaring Bridge
2 Pithing Needle
Pithing Needle is your answer to Sneak Attack. Show and Tell on the other hand...maybe Oblivion Ring or Meekstone.
Its good against UWR and other decks that play alot of spells.
Bogle is a beating machine with a very specfic toolbox (auras) that doesn't change much; most deck pilots will realize that the only way to beat bogle is to disrupt it or race it.
If they are racing, what better way than to chump block and swing with the rest of the team. Thats where Daybreak Coronet comes in, in your toolbox, this is your swiss army knife. It enables your creature to play both offense and defense due to its vigiliance /lifelink / first strike effect.
You're creature is always going to be bigger, and always going to come out on top in any combat situation (with First Strike -- first strike will also counter their deathtouch creatures). Even if they chump block you a few turns, you're getting a 10 life swing each attack phase (yours and your opponents). Any hope of racing bogle backfires with Daybreak on board. W
Because of the very few threats that bogles has on board, it's really important to play fetches and a copy or two of dryad arbor. Mostly due to the jund matchup. Jund has liliana of the veil which can cause you to sacrifice your creature. Having a uncracked fetch online to grab that dryad arbor to sac in place is really important.
Horizon Canopy is another important tool in your toolbox, because bogle has no real way of replenishing its hand other than a kor spiritwalker (which almost always gets killed right away), horizon canopy helps you dig one card deeper which could be the difference between winning and losing a game.
Spirit Mantle is a good card, the only enchantment that I would cut to play it would be unflinching courage. The other auras are just too essential to the bogle toolbox.
Thanks for responding crab. What do you think of this..
MD, OUT: 4 Aether Vials, IN: 4 Qasali Pridesmage
SB, OUT: 3 Burrenton Forge-Tender, 1 Torpor Orb, IN: 2 Spellskite, 2 Engineered Explosives.
Not too sure about Time of Need, currently i don't run any legends right now. I suppose if i'm running Linvala or Teeg this could be a good second copy of them. This would probably mean wilt-leaf is gone, but i feel like cutting wilt-leaf makes my WG creatures that much weaker. Thoughts?
3 Aven Mindcensor
4 Leonin Arbiter
4 Noble Hierarch
3 Scavenging Ooze
4 Loxodon Smiter
2 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
4 Voice of Resurgence
3 Wilt-Leaf Liege
Spells: 9
4 Aether Vial
4 Path to Exile
1 Elspeth, Knight Errant
2 Forest
4 Ghost Quarter
4 Horizon Canopy
1 Plains
4 Razorverge Thicket
2 Stirring Wildwood
3 Tectonic Edge
4 Temple Garden
3 Burrenton Forge-Tender
2 Dismember
2 Kataki, War's Wage
3 Mirran Crusader
2 Sword of War and Peace
2 Thrun, the Last Troll
1 Torpor Orb
Currently against Rock I side in 2 dismembers and 2 thruns. But i think i should of also sided in 3 mirran crusaders and 2 sowap. If they land scavenging oozes and deathrites, its really tough for me to deal with especially with all the creatures in my graveyard. They keep gaining life to offset the damage i deal to them.
Agaisnt Bogle, i'm totally lost, i side out my paths, but i think thats bad cause spirtwalker is allow to run rampant.
I'm thinking of adding some baneslayer angels to the maindeck (possibly cutting a smiter and wilt-leaf). Cutting thalia from the mb and burrenton forge-tenders in the sb for 3 qasali pridemage (2mb, 1sb) and 2 chalices (sb).
Any recommendations would help. Thanks.
The current deck i am running on mtgo, without much success is as follows.
3 Doomed Traveler
3 Young Wolf
4 Blood Artist
4 Cartel Aristocrat
3 Skirsdag High Priest
4 Voice of Resurgence
3 Varolz, the Scar-Striped
Planeswalkers: 3
3 Sorin, Lord of Innistrad
Instants and Sorceries: 8
4 Lingering Souls
4 Tragic Slip
2 Gavony Township
4 Godless Shrine
4 Isolated Chapel
4 Overgrown Tomb
3 Sunpetal Grove
3 Temple Garden
4 Woodland Cemetery
1 Swamp
3 Abrupt Decay
4 Deathrite Shaman
2 Appetite for Brain
2 Blood Baron of Vizkopa
2 Ray of Revelation
2 Smite
Sideboarding Strategies I am using, albeit, it could be completely wrong are as follows..
vs AGGRO (blitz, R/G, Gruul, Naya, etc)
IN: 2 smite, 3 abrupt decay, 1 Blood Baron of Vizkopa
OUT:
vs NAYA
IN: 3 Abrupt Decay, 2 Ray of Revelation, 2 Blood Baron of Vizkopa, 2 Appetite for Brains, 2 Smite
OUT:
vs JUND
IN: 2 Appetite for Brains,
OUT:
vs ARISTOCRATS
vs ESPER CONTROl
vs BANT CONTROL
vs
I don't mind any graveyard hate except rest in peace. That card completely shuts down any interaction with aristocrats. If i didn't board in abrupt decay, i usually just concede the game right away.
I've been noticing that Rest In Peace popping up in a lot of decks recently, forcing me to change my sb to ray of revelation. But now i'm considering golgari charm as well, in case they side RIP out in game three, i'm not stuck with a dead card.