Just as I wanted to suggest Grim Lavamancer in combination with Falkenrath Aristocrat, THAT guy gets spoilered. I'm already playing 4 Souls, if I add 4 Finks instead of the Lavamancers I think the curve will be too high...
Does anyone have an example list with Finks?
Just as I wanted to suggest Grim Lavamancer in combination with Falkenrath Aristocrat, THAT guy gets spoilered. I'm already playing 4 Souls, if I add 4 Finks instead of the Lavamancers I think the curve will be too high...
Does anyone have an example list with Finks?
As for Butcher, I'm going to test him out, but don't underestimate flying, haste and indestructable at your opponent turn 4. Dodges terminate, board wipes, including Tron's, and everything in the game that destroys creatures.
Playing Arena over Bob gives you the freedom to play higher CMC spells. The deck has enough spells to play turns 1 and 2 where you can drop an arena or a Lily and play the long game. If you can get both on the board you'll have great card advantage.
Another option is to play a version that has faithless looting, bloodghast, lily, pack rat, and lingering souls.
But for the decks posted in this thread, Bob is the right option. There's a reason why he's so expensive.
Can you talk about why you prefer Falkenrath Aristocrat over Zurgo Helmsmasher? Perhaps the pros and cons? Haste versus more power, coming down a turn earlier, erc. Also, how do people feel about Path To Exile. With all of the options we have, is it necessary? I really like Crackling Doom, it gives you extra reach if you want to burn your opponent out, and it gets around hexproof stuff. Most of the time you'll want to remove their biggest threat anyway, so I think of it is a Murder/Terminate + Shock to the face that gets around hexproof.
Sure, there are a couple of reasons I like Falkenrath better.
1) it cost 1 less mana. This means I take 1 less life loss to Bob, it can come down a turn earlier, and I have more mana open late in the game to play other spells and activate manlands. This is the biggest reason. Against a deck like Tron, they may have Wurmcoil engine out turn 5, and which is bad for Zurgo to swing into. Falkenrath can have dealt 8 plus damage after turn 5.
2) the ability to sacrifice other creatures. When I'm low on life, sacing Bob can be nice, or a finks so I gain 2 more life.
3) it can be indestructable on your turn, which makes it stick around and can make it an awesome blocker.
4) flying- Zurgo can be blocked by anyone, and Zurgo can't block celestial Collonade or any other flying creature.
About crackling doom- you're better off just playing Lily. She can make them sacrifice creatures or discard cards and they have to deal with her somehow.
Forget about Chandra, but Lily, Ajani, and Elspeth are good against every deck. Ajani is awesome against Tron, lily is awesome against American control, and Elspeth is awesome against boggles. All of them are much, much, much better than crackling doom.
It seems like we're running different decks at this point. Your deck is built around young pyromancer, my deck is built around falkenrath aristocrat. I'm not interested in debating my deck against yours, as both have advantages and disadvantages, you like your deck better, and I like my deck better.
I agree Mardu charm should be a 1 of, and I'm having a hard time deciding what it should replace as well.
What do you guys think I should cut for the charm?
It seems like 1 of the 3 drops should be cut from 4 to 3, but Lily is so good, souls has great synergy with Lily and falkenrath, and kitchen finks gains the deck back some life while having great synergy with falkenrath.
I guess my other option is to cut falkenrath from 3 to 2.
1) I'd say 6 1-drop discard is the right amount to run, so that way you can always play it turn 1. I like 4 IoK and 2 thoughtseize, because IoK covers most modern cards.
2) lightning helix I like as a 3 of so we have more variety in our removal. There are creatures who don't die to lightning bolt/lightning helix so 7 seems like the right amount, especially since against a deck like Tron or combo lightning helix isn't particularly high.
3) my deck is more aggressive than others, but I only run 3 terminate, as it's sometimes a dead draw. I figure 4 IoK, 2 thoughtseize, 4 bolt, 3 helix, 3 terminate, 4 lily, and 1 Ajani is enough removal.
4) the thing I don't like about tidehollow sculler is after he dies the opponent gets their card back, and he dies to everything.
5) more essential to the deck than anything else is 4 Bobs, so playing 5 drops is risky, especially one that can be blocked by a souls token and then killed with a bolt. I prefer Falkenrath as a finisher, but let us know how Zurgo works for you.
6) I'd say the shell should include the 3 great planeswalkers, as that's the advantage of running these colors. If you want a great removal package and big creatures, play Jund.
Ajani Vengeant is much better than elspeth sun champion, and the Dimir planeswalker, Ashiok, nightmare weaver isn't that bad. Tibault is the worst one. For 6 mana I'd much rather have Sorin Markov than Elspeth, Sun Champion.
In modern, Ajani is good against every deck, with his best matchup being Tron. I may even rank him above EKE. The good Jace is the best planeswalker in legacy, and Lily is the best planeswalker in modern.
Yeah good call. Whenever I start playing with a new deck I always have 4 of in my sideboard and them after a while make it more diversified. Although I will say that auriok champion is good against the Rock, burn, and affinity.
This is what I run
2 thoughtseize
4 inquisition of Kozilek
4 lightning bolt
3 lightning helix
3 terminate
4 lingering souls
Planeswalkers
4 Liliana of the veil
1 Ajani Vengeant
1 Elspeth, knight-errant
Creatures
4 dark confidant
4 kitchen finks
3 falkenrath aristocrat
1 lavaclaw reaches
1 vault of the archangel
2 blackcleave cliffs
2 fetid Heath
4 marsh flats
4 arid Mesa
1 blood crypt
1 sacred foundry
1 godless shrine
2 mountain
2 plains
2 swamp
2 zealous persecution
1 rakdos charm
2 Mirran crusader
2 surgical extraction
2 stony silence
2 Aven Mindcensor
2 fulminator Mage
2 wrench mind
As for Butcher, I'm going to test him out, but don't underestimate flying, haste and indestructable at your opponent turn 4. Dodges terminate, board wipes, including Tron's, and everything in the game that destroys creatures.
Another option is to play a version that has faithless looting, bloodghast, lily, pack rat, and lingering souls.
But for the decks posted in this thread, Bob is the right option. There's a reason why he's so expensive.
Sure, there are a couple of reasons I like Falkenrath better.
1) it cost 1 less mana. This means I take 1 less life loss to Bob, it can come down a turn earlier, and I have more mana open late in the game to play other spells and activate manlands. This is the biggest reason. Against a deck like Tron, they may have Wurmcoil engine out turn 5, and which is bad for Zurgo to swing into. Falkenrath can have dealt 8 plus damage after turn 5.
2) the ability to sacrifice other creatures. When I'm low on life, sacing Bob can be nice, or a finks so I gain 2 more life.
3) it can be indestructable on your turn, which makes it stick around and can make it an awesome blocker.
4) flying- Zurgo can be blocked by anyone, and Zurgo can't block celestial Collonade or any other flying creature.
About crackling doom- you're better off just playing Lily. She can make them sacrifice creatures or discard cards and they have to deal with her somehow.
It seems like we're running different decks at this point. Your deck is built around young pyromancer, my deck is built around falkenrath aristocrat. I'm not interested in debating my deck against yours, as both have advantages and disadvantages, you like your deck better, and I like my deck better.
I agree Mardu charm should be a 1 of, and I'm having a hard time deciding what it should replace as well.
What do you guys think I should cut for the charm?
4 Inquisiton of Kozilek
2 thoughtseize
4 lightning bolt
3 lightning helix
3 terminate
4 lingering souls
Planeswalkers 6
4 Liliana of the veil
1 Ajani Vengeant
1 Elspeth, Knight Errant
Creatures 11
4 dark confidant
4 kitchen finks
3 falkenrath aristocrat
2 blackcleave cliffs
2 fetid Heath
1 godless shrine
1 sacred foundry
1 blood crypt
3 bloodstained more
3 arid Mesa
3 marsh flats
1 lavaclaw reaches
1 vault of the archangel
1 Urborg, tomb of yawgmoth
2 plains
2 swamp
3 Mirran crusader
2 stony silence
2 fulminator Mage
2 Aven Mindcensor
2 rakdos charm
2 surgical extraction
2 wrench mind
It seems like 1 of the 3 drops should be cut from 4 to 3, but Lily is so good, souls has great synergy with Lily and falkenrath, and kitchen finks gains the deck back some life while having great synergy with falkenrath.
I guess my other option is to cut falkenrath from 3 to 2.
IMHO the 1 drops and 2 drops are untouchable.
2) lightning helix I like as a 3 of so we have more variety in our removal. There are creatures who don't die to lightning bolt/lightning helix so 7 seems like the right amount, especially since against a deck like Tron or combo lightning helix isn't particularly high.
3) my deck is more aggressive than others, but I only run 3 terminate, as it's sometimes a dead draw. I figure 4 IoK, 2 thoughtseize, 4 bolt, 3 helix, 3 terminate, 4 lily, and 1 Ajani is enough removal.
4) the thing I don't like about tidehollow sculler is after he dies the opponent gets their card back, and he dies to everything.
5) more essential to the deck than anything else is 4 Bobs, so playing 5 drops is risky, especially one that can be blocked by a souls token and then killed with a bolt. I prefer Falkenrath as a finisher, but let us know how Zurgo works for you.
6) I'd say the shell should include the 3 great planeswalkers, as that's the advantage of running these colors. If you want a great removal package and big creatures, play Jund.
-instant speed duress that can be played in response to them drawing a card.
-destroy courser of kruphix, loxodon Smiter, celestial Collonade, ect.
-put in 2 dorks that work well as blockers or can be saced to falkenrath aristocrat.
-instant speed duress. Can be played in response to them drawing a card.
-instant speed deal 4 damage to target creature. Bye-bye Courser of Kruphix, Loxodon Smiter, Celestial Collonade, ect.
-instant speed 2 tokens that have 1st strike until end of turn. Great as blockers or guys to sac. For falkenrath.
This deck is going to match up very well with the meta with the new fetches coming out.
Based on the abilities of keyrunes in the RTR block, which share abilities with 3 out of the 5 keyrunes, IMHO the abilities would be:
Black-White: lifelink
Black-Green: deathtouch
White-red: double strike
Green-Blue: hexproof
Blue-red: whenever, this creature deals damage to a player, draw 2 cards, then discard a card.
IMHO hexproof would be too strong of an ability for a man-land, maybe shroud instead? What are your thoughts?
In modern, Ajani is good against every deck, with his best matchup being Tron. I may even rank him above EKE. The good Jace is the best planeswalker in legacy, and Lily is the best planeswalker in modern.