Delver, mana leak, thragtusk, sphinx's rev, thoughtseize, pack rats, siege rhino - none of the tier 1 threats in SOI are on the level of these former format oppressors (except for maybe CoCo - but it requires a specific deck design) I don't understand the OP at all.
Um what? Don't you remember thragtusk during inn-rtr standard? And mono b devotion during rtr-ths standard? Largely hailed as the worst standard format because of the lack of variety? Sounds like you're complaining to complain..
I was the one playing Abzan Company to the 14th place finish - my two losses were burn (played against burn 3 times) and Naya zoo. Both losses were super close and I'm convinced I missed the winning lines in both game 3s due to my inexperience with the deck. The list I played is actually my friend's deck. He handed it to me and the first time I had played Abzan company was round 1 of the classic. His thoughts were he wanted it to be a beat down deck with a combo plan B. He was also admittedly inexperienced with the deck as well and mostly copied the list from somewhere online. I didn't run into tron a single time but I saw it all around me in the beginning. As a long time tron player I'm convinced it's not currently well positioned due to the hostile nature of the format towards it.
The 8 matches I played were against:
UW sun Titan
UWR control
Burn x3 (my loss was to the guy who got 9th, he actually drew himself out of top 8)
Ad Nauseum
Naya Zoo x2 (one list was more RGw aggro and the other was more traditional GWr zoo with reliquary knights and maybe company (didn't see company) - I lost to the more aggressive RGw version)
I love the deck and I'll probably build it myself and take it to regionals next weekend.
Hornet Queen > Nylea, god of the hunt as a win con for a number of reasons. It's good on it's own, you can get value from it when you're not comboing off, and it allows you to win with infinite mana just as easily as Nylea does. The 2nd one in the board is for MUs where she shines (like against RW aggro).
4x Whisperwood Elemental > Nissa, Worldwaker in the board against control and other Ugin/board sweeper decks. You also bring in the 2 Ugins with the elementals against other G/x dev decks because it's very difficult for them to deal with.
I love having 2 disciples main deck (you can just gain virtual infinite life if you don't have an eidolon/queen/4 power dude to bounce over and over when comboing off and that should be enough to beat most decks.
The boon satyrs and Polukrano, World Eaters are big ?s for me, but I haven't come across anything that I like better. Satyrs are great for getting aggressive against control decks and synergize with eidolon and ascendancy but maybe there's something better? Polukranos can sweep up tokens or shoot down that pesky flier and is a huge roadblock on turn 3 but maybe there's something else better?
I've gone down to 3 ascendancies and up to 24 lands and I like it a lot better. I always felt this deck needed 24 lands and cutting an ascendancy hasn't made a noticeable difference. I actually prefer to hit an ascendancy off of hydra vs drawing them most of the time and going to 3 seems to forward that game plan.
The rec sages are for the doomwake giant decks mostly.
The strokes are for opposing Ugins and sweepers and the boon satyrs in the board are to get aggressive against control. I actually side out most of the combo against UB control (ascendancies and most of the voyaging satyrs) along with disciples (duh) and just side in boon satyrs, elementals, and strokes and try to beat down.
Against red sligh or heroic I found going up to 4 disciples is enough. I don't really find the need for hornet nests or any other anti aggro card.
The deck is still a work in progress but I feel like it's almost there.
If you're worried about a deflecting Palm or aetherspout ruining the 'swing for a million' part of the combo then you just need negate. You out all your dorks into play with hydra, draw cards until you have all negates, then swing for the fences with everything pumped with Nylea (except the dorks). Problem solved. There are things you can do game 1 to play around things like that so that you don't get blown out like leaving mana open via dorks (usually when combining you have to tap all your lands to get it going). With infinite mana, there are solutions to these corner case problems without having to turn to sub par, off color cards like Ol' Purhp or Claws.
My updated sideboard looks like:
2 Reclamation Sage (I'll explain my going back on my argument against this card below)
3 Negate
3 Kiora, the Crashing Wave
3 Nissa, Worldwaker
2 Nylea's Disciple
2 Whispereood Elemental
My main deck is the same one I posted a page or two back except 2 Whisperwood Elemental replaced 2 acolytes.
As far as the sages go - in testing I found that while I don't care (for the most part) what my opponent is doing unless they're beating me down or killing my things, I do (in fact) care when they start chaining doomwake triggers. Sage is basically for the Peach Garden Oath constellation deck and for the BBD/Brad Nelson/CVM GB siege deck. It has the happy side effect of slowing them down by hitting whips/coursers/Eidolons/sieges along with dealing with the main target, doomwake. This is one of the few instances where I think it's correct to bring in an answer card with a deck like this. I don't care about jeskai ascendancy or anything like that (I just want max disciples in that MU).
I'll write up my SB guide for anyone who cares some time this week. So far the deck is doing great in testing and I think I'll be abandoning my beloved Abzan Midrange for this younger/hotter model at the PTQ this weekend.
I believe the secret to beating heroic lies in 3x Kiora, 1x Ugin, and 3x Nylea's Disciple. Disciple will get you to the point where you can hydra for a kiora or Ugin long enough to stall them to combo out on them or just beat them down.
Couple more notes from matches played tonight:
-I ended up swapping the 2 acolytes out for 2 whisperwood elementals in the main and absolutely love it. I am now firmly in the 0 acolyte camp. It's still easy to assemble the combo w/o them and the elementals increase the power level of this deck IMMENSELY. Powering out a turn 3 elemental is game over against a lot of decks out there.
-The negates have been much better than stubborn denials. It's very easy for UB to play around denial (the MU where I want the counters the most), and negate is reasonable to hold up to protect your board at a pivotal point.
-I haven't seen Surrak yet against control, but I'm not counting him out. He helps you pushing through dudes, but those dudes also just die to sweepers/ugin/vault. This is another reason whisperwood is sooooooo good - protects against crux with his sac effect, protects against ugin because the manifests don't exile to it, and he provides a very quick clock (which helps to not over extend while still deading them as quickly as possible). Maybe Surrak should just be elemental #3-4 in the board.
-I don't understand the need for reclamation sages. Very rarely do you care what your opponent is doing. Against Jeskai tokens, I like to chain/bounce disciples to put myself out of reach until I combo off. Who cares if they loot a million times and cast 4 treasure cruises? Against heroic, again, I'd still rather gain large chunks of life and let them draw all the cards and swing at me all they want. The sideboard is not necessarily always supposed to be used to bring in answers to whatever your opponent is doing (although that's the common mentality regarding sideboards) -- the sideboard is supposed to be used to allow you to maximize the effectiveness of your deck in a given MU. If you're the answer deck like control or abzan midrange, throw in a bunch of answers like bile blight or glare or whatever because that maximizes the efficiency of your gameplan. If your goal is to beat down, combo out, or stall until you can execute plan A or B, throw some things in the sideboard that help you do that more effecientlyin certain MUs. I realize I'm a proponent of negates in the side board and my tangent might seem to contradict that, but in reality, negates are the most efficient way I can think to prevent the types of interaction from my opponent that I don't want (negate that Ugin or Crux or Dissolve or Vault). /end rant
-I haven't played against a deck with aggressive fliers (like the old 'Jeskai Wins' deck or whatever everyone called it), but I imagine a couple quick Mantis riders would be a bit scary if you don't hit an early disciple. -I can see the reasoning behind including a couple Arbor Colossi and maybe I'll replace the hornet nests with them. Queens might just be better against that deck so you don't run into the 'Jeskai Charm in response to monstrous on Arbor Colossus' blow-out scenario, but I imagine that's relatively easy to play around and behind able to hit colossus off a hydra for x=5 is much more reasonable in the early game (where you want that kind of effect).
@Mysterons - Are you running Kioras in the sideboard? They're great against heroic. Between her and disciple I can't imagine heroic being too difficult but I have very little experience with the MU.
Anybody suggesting something that is not a heavily green permanent needs a very strong justification, because this is mono-green devotion and grows in power with every pip of green mana cost, and declines in power with every point of non-green mana cost.
100% Agree - and I'd like to add onto this statement:
A common pitfall when developing a new archetype (especially true for a deck with a combo) is trying to figure out how to do more with it. These types of exercises can be beneficial, but they're usually a waste of time. The goal when developing a deck should be to make it 'lean' (efficient and consistent). After that, you get to know how matches against the major archetypes in the meta typically play out and tune it based on your findings (while still keeping to the 'lean' concept). Sure, it's possible to find a bunch of cute interactions with different cards, but really consider if they actually add anything to the deck (other than a dynamic that is not needed).
Thassa - not green and doesn't provide enough of a benefit to cost a card. Nylea gives you all the 'evasion' you need in the form of trample.
@YoYoJunkie - Surrak is better against disdainful stroke, Nylea is better in almost every other situation. This makes him better suited for sideboard duty.
I'm a fan of the idea of winning without attacking, as fog effects are in the format. Hence the Purphoros in the OP. Once you have infinite mana and a Hydra, I would just go get Purphoros and end the game. Altar works just as well, however, Purphoros can win the games sometimes without comboing, just because we are dropping so many creatures and can bounce at will. It's three mana for two damage with a Mystic and it doesn't take too many turns early to kill with that combo.
Eh... There aren't any fog effects that see serious play...
Cards like this just dilute the deck. To be successful in any meaningful tournament, you need to have at least a plan A, a plan B, and a consistent and efficient way to execute them.
I feel like this is a good jumping off point for the deck. The numbers feel solid and this appears to be what I imagine a 'stock' version of this deck to look like (basically functional without all the 'cute' stuff). You can beat down, draw cards, and go infinite in a number of ways. The combo is basically Temur Ascendancy and Sabertooth (duh), but the flavor is either voyaging satyr + 5 dev + nykthos, or acolyte + 7 dev to get infinite mana. With infinite mana you can draw your deck if you have another sabertooth or eidolon, make a huge dude with only Nylea, put your entire deck into play with a hydra, gain infinite life so that you can last until you draw a wincon with disciple, or wipe the board and swing with poly. No need to play boon satyrs or commune with the gods or hornet queen or singing bell strike or any of that nonsense. This deck has legs and I love it. It's a little soft to aggro (where the hornet nests and disciples shine) and can struggle against control (reason for the nissas, surraks, and negates in the board). I haven't tested against heroic yet (kiora being in the board for that MU), though I imagine you should be able to combo out very quickly against a deck that doesn't interact. The mana feels fine (used the 11th place deck's mana base and it seems solid). Against removal heavy decks I like to bring in negates, but most of the time it feels like this deck has so much velocity/card draw/raw power that it fights through 1 for 1 removal very well and even resists sweepers in the form of sabertooth.
One thing to get used to: Sabertooth's ability does not target, and it also does not require you to bounce the creature as a cost. So when you activate the ability, you put it on the stack and pass priority, you don't have to announce the creature that you're going to pick up, you don't pick up the creature until the ability resolves (if the original creature you want to pick up is removed before resolution, you can pick another creature), AND, it's a 'may' ability (which means if they remove the kitty cat in response, you don't have to pick up a dude upon resolution if you don't want to, although you still can). Those are just a few important tips regarding how to use that card in a competitive REL tournament.
Just started testing this deck today - I was going through gatherer to see what other permanents could help with this strategy and came across... Surrak Dragonclaw. Alone and forgotten, this lil' guy seems absolutely amazing in this strategy. You can replace Nylea with him because he gives trample, can be hit off of hydra, triggers ascendancy, and protects from disdainful stroke. Granted, he is more susceptible to downfall/cut than Nylea (no single burn spell can kill him though), but the flash plus making everything uncounterable is big game.
My initial thoughts on the deck (for what they're worth) after a little testing:
-Singing bell strike = yuck. Get outta here! Sure it's another way to allow acolyte to combo w/o sabertooth but it's a pretty underwhelming spell to be casting in the format otherwise. Having them get stuck in your hand or temporarily pinning down a rhino or rabblemaster (gross) or whatever else is scary enough that you have to blow the strike on seems sub par. I'd rather the deck be full of combo pieces that also win w/o having to combo.
-Main deck nylea's disciple (at least 1) should be required. It does wonders to help buy time to reach that critical mass of combo pieces and/or beaters and it's only really truly dead against UB control (and sacrificing 1 spot seems worth it). I definitely like at least 2 more in the board.
-Queen seems pointless in this deck - it's a great card and stops a lot strategies in their tracks, but it seems unnecessary.
-Polukranos as a 2-of feels perfect.
-On the subject of 3 or 4 acolytes, I like the idea of 3 more. They're amazing once you have a board presence but I don't like the idea of getting flooded on them in the early game.
-Prophet of Kruphix anyone? Probably unnecessary but being able to combo at instant speed against a removal deck sounds delicious!!
-This is complete theory-crafting and has 0 testing to back it, but what about 2-3 Chord of Callings in the deck? I know most of the creatures already tap for mana, but I'm thinking of those situations where you have the acolyte, devotion, and ascendancy and just need that sabertooth. I know, I know - that's what Genesis Hydra is for - but I really like the idea of Chord as Hydra numbers 5-6 or 5,6,7. Obviously they're not the same, but in a general sense they would serve a similar purpose. It would also allow you to grab that disciple to live 1 more turn or some of the post board hate creatures like reclamation sage. Ok I'm done ranting, this will require testing for sure.
-Speaking of the sideboard, boy what a mess (looking at Page's list from the deck tech). In a deck like this, I would personally favor permanents over spells. Setessan tactics? Get outta here! Hunt the hunter? KUH-MAWN MAN! We can do much better than that. I like Kiora for the heroic MU (U/W, I don't think the R/W has any more legs than it did before, but time will tell). I like Nissa for the heavy removal MUs. I like that they can both be hit off of Hydra. But those spells (hunt the hunter and tactics) seem like a 'well, I can't think of anything better to do' type of inclusion. Let's go through the list of permanents that we can put in the board to help us out in our weaker MUs:
-Circle of Flame (tokens/aggro)
-Bow of Nylea (attrition/lifegain/deathtouch+trample combo) cute and a bit weak admittedly, more of an idea that probably won't pan out, still a permanent that hydra can hit and adds to devotion.
-Ugin, the Spirit Dragon Yes, I know, this was in the SB of the list that got 11th - might be worth it might not - still better than hunt the hunter.
-Arbor Colossus (blocks fliers... ok this is a super weak suggestion, I'll admit)
-This completely contradicts my permanents > spells in the sideboard rant I just went on, but I really like the idea of stubborn denial and/or negate in the sideboard. I feel the aggro and control MUs need the most help and some sort of counter is crucial against control.
-I have no real opinion on Elvish Mystics or no Mystics. I've read discussion about how they speed up the deck, but they also fill it with more air (unless you're cutting on voyaging satyrs, which might be correct) or caryatids (which doesn't seem correct considering the fixing they provide). I know Satyrs are great with nykthos, but I don't have enough experience to know whether they're completely necessary (my gut tells me that most of the time acolyte + 1 nykthos activation is enough to get the ball rolling through a hydra, and otherwise, you don't need that much mana). Maybe 4 mystic, 4 caryatid, 2 satyr could be correct? I'm just spitballing here.
-I have no idea what the mana base should look like, but I know Page's felt not quite there. On the surface, Toepfner's looks solid though.
That's really it, this deck seems fun and can combo out of no where - I'd really like to tune it and get to know how it function against the major archtypes in the meta. Who knows, maybe I'll take it to the last PTQ I'll ever attend this weekend (but probably not, I don't think I have big enough balls).
I'm curious as to what cards you saw in Jund and Pod made you want to bring in Nature's claim? Don't get me wrong, I love the card as well, but in those 2 matchups, I don't know if it is better than cards in the maindeck? I suspect you brought it in against the Birthing Pod itself in Pod, but is it really that important?
Against pod you have the namesake card that you want to hit with claim. Against Jund, I usually cut cards that don't do much like spellskite and some number of clasm (especially against the version with obliterators that I encountered), and when I don't know exactly what to bring in, I usually default to claim. At worst it can gain me life in response to a removal spell (which, usually, isn't irrelevant), at best it answers some sideboard card that I didn't think they would bring in.
@Lord Seth - The Tron list that top 16'd at Atlanta is actually mine. I actually lost my win an in to angel pod to a series of unfortunate draws (the MU is actually favorable in my experience). A couple notes about the list - it's one that I haven't changed in a few years (as evidenced by city of brass over mana confluence). The main deck spellskites were adopted when infect was a much larger part of the meta (early 2013) and has survived revisions because of how good it is against twin game 1 (which was super popular earlier this year). I'm not sure how good it is currently (I frequently boarded them out in Atlanta, but I didn't play against twin/bogles/infect), but I suspect they can be cut down to 1 or 0 in the main considering the current meta. I feel like Slaughter games isn't as strong as it used to be and ill probably replace them with boil. I've seen a few lists adopt sundering Titan in the side and I like so ill probably adapt that. Nature's claim came in every single match I played (Jund, abzan, GW hate bears, pod, UWr, and burn) and are easily the best card in the sideboard. My 61st card is a mountain that I like because of path and ghost quarter. It's surprising how much that comes up and having that extra land has been relevant more than it hasn't. That said, ill probably cut down to 19 lands (-2 city +1 grove) because I'm probably going to cut games from the board. I like rule of law against storm/ascendancy but I'm not convinced it's necessary.
I definitely need to cut the list down to 60 and comb through the SB but I think I'll end up playing this at PT Fate Reforged. There aren't that many sowing salts out there so I feel Tron is fairly well positioned, and I'm very familiar with the deck, which means a lot in modern.
It's a little bit reanimator with whip and rescue and a little bit dredge with cut and empty but mostly just value. Maybe it should be in a different thread, not sure, it's abzan colors and deals with the GY that's why I posted it here.
@nerv - Drown in some number is mostly likely correct in the board, I still want some number of blights though. I don't like more than 1 whip main because of how much of your deck you sift through it's easy to find whip, there isn't much room for more and I think more is just a waste of spots anyway (same with empty). The nyx weavers can grab whip if it's been destroyed or milled if you really need (which most of the time you don't).
The 8 matches I played were against:
UW sun Titan
UWR control
Burn x3 (my loss was to the guy who got 9th, he actually drew himself out of top 8)
Ad Nauseum
Naya Zoo x2 (one list was more RGw aggro and the other was more traditional GWr zoo with reliquary knights and maybe company (didn't see company) - I lost to the more aggressive RGw version)
I love the deck and I'll probably build it myself and take it to regionals next weekend.
4 Yavimaya Coast
4 Frontier Bivouac
4 Wooded Foothills
4 Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx
1 Temple of Mystery
6 Forest
1 Mountain
Mana Dorks: 10
4 Elvish Mystic
4 Voyaging Satyr
2 Sylvan Caryatid
4 Courser of Kruphix
4 Eidolon of Blossoms
4 Temur Sabertooth
4 Genesis Hydra
3 Temur Ascendancy
Wildcards/Wincons: 7
2 Boon Satyr
2 Polukranos, World Eater
2 Nylea's Disciple
1 Hornet Queen
4 Whisperwood Elemental
2 Nylea's Disciple
2 Reclamation Sage
2 Boon Satyr
2 Ugin, the Spirit Dragon
2 Disdainful Stroke
1 Hornet Queen
Couple notes about the deck/sideboarding:
The deck is still a work in progress but I feel like it's almost there.
My updated sideboard looks like:
2 Reclamation Sage (I'll explain my going back on my argument against this card below)
3 Negate
3 Kiora, the Crashing Wave
3 Nissa, Worldwaker
2 Nylea's Disciple
2 Whispereood Elemental
My main deck is the same one I posted a page or two back except 2 Whisperwood Elemental replaced 2 acolytes.
As far as the sages go - in testing I found that while I don't care (for the most part) what my opponent is doing unless they're beating me down or killing my things, I do (in fact) care when they start chaining doomwake triggers. Sage is basically for the Peach Garden Oath constellation deck and for the BBD/Brad Nelson/CVM GB siege deck. It has the happy side effect of slowing them down by hitting whips/coursers/Eidolons/sieges along with dealing with the main target, doomwake. This is one of the few instances where I think it's correct to bring in an answer card with a deck like this. I don't care about jeskai ascendancy or anything like that (I just want max disciples in that MU).
I'll write up my SB guide for anyone who cares some time this week. So far the deck is doing great in testing and I think I'll be abandoning my beloved Abzan Midrange for this younger/hotter model at the PTQ this weekend.
Couple more notes from matches played tonight:
-I ended up swapping the 2 acolytes out for 2 whisperwood elementals in the main and absolutely love it. I am now firmly in the 0 acolyte camp. It's still easy to assemble the combo w/o them and the elementals increase the power level of this deck IMMENSELY. Powering out a turn 3 elemental is game over against a lot of decks out there.
-The negates have been much better than stubborn denials. It's very easy for UB to play around denial (the MU where I want the counters the most), and negate is reasonable to hold up to protect your board at a pivotal point.
-I haven't seen Surrak yet against control, but I'm not counting him out. He helps you pushing through dudes, but those dudes also just die to sweepers/ugin/vault. This is another reason whisperwood is sooooooo good - protects against crux with his sac effect, protects against ugin because the manifests don't exile to it, and he provides a very quick clock (which helps to not over extend while still deading them as quickly as possible). Maybe Surrak should just be elemental #3-4 in the board.
-I don't understand the need for reclamation sages. Very rarely do you care what your opponent is doing. Against Jeskai tokens, I like to chain/bounce disciples to put myself out of reach until I combo off. Who cares if they loot a million times and cast 4 treasure cruises? Against heroic, again, I'd still rather gain large chunks of life and let them draw all the cards and swing at me all they want. The sideboard is not necessarily always supposed to be used to bring in answers to whatever your opponent is doing (although that's the common mentality regarding sideboards) -- the sideboard is supposed to be used to allow you to maximize the effectiveness of your deck in a given MU. If you're the answer deck like control or abzan midrange, throw in a bunch of answers like bile blight or glare or whatever because that maximizes the efficiency of your gameplan. If your goal is to beat down, combo out, or stall until you can execute plan A or B, throw some things in the sideboard that help you do that more effecientlyin certain MUs. I realize I'm a proponent of negates in the side board and my tangent might seem to contradict that, but in reality, negates are the most efficient way I can think to prevent the types of interaction from my opponent that I don't want (negate that Ugin or Crux or Dissolve or Vault). /end rant
-I haven't played against a deck with aggressive fliers (like the old 'Jeskai Wins' deck or whatever everyone called it), but I imagine a couple quick Mantis riders would be a bit scary if you don't hit an early disciple. -I can see the reasoning behind including a couple Arbor Colossi and maybe I'll replace the hornet nests with them. Queens might just be better against that deck so you don't run into the 'Jeskai Charm in response to monstrous on Arbor Colossus' blow-out scenario, but I imagine that's relatively easy to play around and behind able to hit colossus off a hydra for x=5 is much more reasonable in the early game (where you want that kind of effect).
What does your list look like?
100% Agree - and I'd like to add onto this statement:
A common pitfall when developing a new archetype (especially true for a deck with a combo) is trying to figure out how to do more with it. These types of exercises can be beneficial, but they're usually a waste of time. The goal when developing a deck should be to make it 'lean' (efficient and consistent). After that, you get to know how matches against the major archetypes in the meta typically play out and tune it based on your findings (while still keeping to the 'lean' concept). Sure, it's possible to find a bunch of cute interactions with different cards, but really consider if they actually add anything to the deck (other than a dynamic that is not needed).
Thassa - not green and doesn't provide enough of a benefit to cost a card. Nylea gives you all the 'evasion' you need in the form of trample.
This is correct, apparently I can't math.
Eh... There aren't any fog effects that see serious play...
Cards like this just dilute the deck. To be successful in any meaningful tournament, you need to have at least a plan A, a plan B, and a consistent and efficient way to execute them.
4 Elvish Mystic
4 Voyaging Satyr
2 Sylvan Caryatid
4 Courser of Kruphix
4 Eidolon of Blossoms
4 Temur Sabertooth
2 Karametra's Acolyte
2 Polukranos, World Eater
2 Nylea's Disciple
1 Nylea, God of the Hunt
4 Temur Ascendancy
LANDS: 23
6 Forest
1 Mountain
4 Wooded Foothills
4 Frontier Bivouac
4 Yavimaya Coast
4 Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx
3 Hornet Nest
1 Nylea's Disciple
2 Surrak Dragonclaw
3 Negate
3 Kiora, the Crashing Wave
3 Nissa, Worldwaker
I feel like this is a good jumping off point for the deck. The numbers feel solid and this appears to be what I imagine a 'stock' version of this deck to look like (basically functional without all the 'cute' stuff). You can beat down, draw cards, and go infinite in a number of ways. The combo is basically Temur Ascendancy and Sabertooth (duh), but the flavor is either voyaging satyr + 5 dev + nykthos, or acolyte + 7 dev to get infinite mana. With infinite mana you can draw your deck if you have another sabertooth or eidolon, make a huge dude with only Nylea, put your entire deck into play with a hydra, gain infinite life so that you can last until you draw a wincon with disciple, or wipe the board and swing with poly. No need to play boon satyrs or commune with the gods or hornet queen or singing bell strike or any of that nonsense. This deck has legs and I love it. It's a little soft to aggro (where the hornet nests and disciples shine) and can struggle against control (reason for the nissas, surraks, and negates in the board). I haven't tested against heroic yet (kiora being in the board for that MU), though I imagine you should be able to combo out very quickly against a deck that doesn't interact. The mana feels fine (used the 11th place deck's mana base and it seems solid). Against removal heavy decks I like to bring in negates, but most of the time it feels like this deck has so much velocity/card draw/raw power that it fights through 1 for 1 removal very well and even resists sweepers in the form of sabertooth.
One thing to get used to: Sabertooth's ability does not target, and it also does not require you to bounce the creature as a cost. So when you activate the ability, you put it on the stack and pass priority, you don't have to announce the creature that you're going to pick up, you don't pick up the creature until the ability resolves (if the original creature you want to pick up is removed before resolution, you can pick another creature), AND, it's a 'may' ability (which means if they remove the kitty cat in response, you don't have to pick up a dude upon resolution if you don't want to, although you still can). Those are just a few important tips regarding how to use that card in a competitive REL tournament.
My initial thoughts on the deck (for what they're worth) after a little testing:
-Singing bell strike = yuck. Get outta here! Sure it's another way to allow acolyte to combo w/o sabertooth but it's a pretty underwhelming spell to be casting in the format otherwise. Having them get stuck in your hand or temporarily pinning down a rhino or rabblemaster (gross) or whatever else is scary enough that you have to blow the strike on seems sub par. I'd rather the deck be full of combo pieces that also win w/o having to combo.
-Main deck nylea's disciple (at least 1) should be required. It does wonders to help buy time to reach that critical mass of combo pieces and/or beaters and it's only really truly dead against UB control (and sacrificing 1 spot seems worth it). I definitely like at least 2 more in the board.
-Queen seems pointless in this deck - it's a great card and stops a lot strategies in their tracks, but it seems unnecessary.
-Polukranos as a 2-of feels perfect.
-On the subject of 3 or 4 acolytes, I like the idea of 3 more. They're amazing once you have a board presence but I don't like the idea of getting flooded on them in the early game.
-Prophet of Kruphix anyone? Probably unnecessary but being able to combo at instant speed against a removal deck sounds delicious!!
-This is complete theory-crafting and has 0 testing to back it, but what about 2-3 Chord of Callings in the deck? I know most of the creatures already tap for mana, but I'm thinking of those situations where you have the acolyte, devotion, and ascendancy and just need that sabertooth. I know, I know - that's what Genesis Hydra is for - but I really like the idea of Chord as Hydra numbers 5-6 or 5,6,7. Obviously they're not the same, but in a general sense they would serve a similar purpose. It would also allow you to grab that disciple to live 1 more turn or some of the post board hate creatures like reclamation sage. Ok I'm done ranting, this will require testing for sure.
-Speaking of the sideboard, boy what a mess (looking at Page's list from the deck tech). In a deck like this, I would personally favor permanents over spells. Setessan tactics? Get outta here! Hunt the hunter? KUH-MAWN MAN! We can do much better than that. I like Kiora for the heroic MU (U/W, I don't think the R/W has any more legs than it did before, but time will tell). I like Nissa for the heavy removal MUs. I like that they can both be hit off of Hydra. But those spells (hunt the hunter and tactics) seem like a 'well, I can't think of anything better to do' type of inclusion. Let's go through the list of permanents that we can put in the board to help us out in our weaker MUs:
-Circle of Flame (tokens/aggro)
-Bow of Nylea (attrition/lifegain/deathtouch+trample combo) cute and a bit weak admittedly, more of an idea that probably won't pan out, still a permanent that hydra can hit and adds to devotion.
-Ugin, the Spirit Dragon Yes, I know, this was in the SB of the list that got 11th - might be worth it might not - still better than hunt the hunter.
-Arbor Colossus (blocks fliers... ok this is a super weak suggestion, I'll admit)
-This completely contradicts my permanents > spells in the sideboard rant I just went on, but I really like the idea of stubborn denial and/or negate in the sideboard. I feel the aggro and control MUs need the most help and some sort of counter is crucial against control.
-I have no real opinion on Elvish Mystics or no Mystics. I've read discussion about how they speed up the deck, but they also fill it with more air (unless you're cutting on voyaging satyrs, which might be correct) or caryatids (which doesn't seem correct considering the fixing they provide). I know Satyrs are great with nykthos, but I don't have enough experience to know whether they're completely necessary (my gut tells me that most of the time acolyte + 1 nykthos activation is enough to get the ball rolling through a hydra, and otherwise, you don't need that much mana). Maybe 4 mystic, 4 caryatid, 2 satyr could be correct? I'm just spitballing here.
-I have no idea what the mana base should look like, but I know Page's felt not quite there. On the surface, Toepfner's looks solid though.
That's really it, this deck seems fun and can combo out of no where - I'd really like to tune it and get to know how it function against the major archtypes in the meta. Who knows, maybe I'll take it to the last PTQ I'll ever attend this weekend (but probably not, I don't think I have big enough balls).
Against pod you have the namesake card that you want to hit with claim. Against Jund, I usually cut cards that don't do much like spellskite and some number of clasm (especially against the version with obliterators that I encountered), and when I don't know exactly what to bring in, I usually default to claim. At worst it can gain me life in response to a removal spell (which, usually, isn't irrelevant), at best it answers some sideboard card that I didn't think they would bring in.
I definitely need to cut the list down to 60 and comb through the SB but I think I'll end up playing this at PT Fate Reforged. There aren't that many sowing salts out there so I feel Tron is fairly well positioned, and I'm very familiar with the deck, which means a lot in modern.
@nerv - Drown in some number is mostly likely correct in the board, I still want some number of blights though. I don't like more than 1 whip main because of how much of your deck you sift through it's easy to find whip, there isn't much room for more and I think more is just a waste of spots anyway (same with empty). The nyx weavers can grab whip if it's been destroyed or milled if you really need (which most of the time you don't).