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    posted a message on State of Modern Thread: bans, format health, reprints, new cards, and more!
    Quote from Heenock »
    Why control players always cry for have a tier 1 Blue deck ? There are tons of Blue based decks which are highly performing. (http://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/the-game/modern/764899-state-of-modern-thread-bans-format-health-reprints?comment=5630)

    There has never been a tier 1 white deck and no one comes to cry "white need some love, pls wizards" ....

    You want the modern to become like legacy ? meta of 80% of blue decks and boring battles of counterspells ?

    +

    Unban Preordain will help more combo decks (ad nauseam, storm, reanimator) than control decks.




    I've been playing legacy for a couple years now, and I don't think I've ever seen "battles of counterspells", Most of the time it's minusing yourself off a FOW to just not lose on the spot, or using countermagic as an attrition tool.
    I highly doubt that unbanning one decent cantrip is going to turn the format into a blue hell.

    There are also plenty of really strong decks that don't need to play countermagic, thanks to every color getting strong answers, you get tools to keep combo in check like wasteland.
    Elves, 43 lands, Death and Taxes, Aggro Loam, the new sweet RB reanimator list, Eldrazi stompy(Which is terrifying to play against), are all really good decks. Sure, meta may be skewed blue, but the difference between a tier 1 and a tier 2, or even tier 3 deck in legacy is a lot smaller than it is in modern, and every color gets to do broken stuff.

    And honestly, yeah, I do think that modern could do to be more like legacy. At the very least, you don't need to ban the best deck in legacy every 6 months.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
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    posted a message on State of Modern Thread: bans, format health, reprints, new cards, and more!
    Quote from Shinyfirefly »
    I'd love to see Umezawa's Jitte and Chrome Mox enter the format. Here is some rationale.

    Umezawa's Jitte: This equipment isn't as terrifying with damage no longer using the stack. Aggro likely will not use this card, but it will do well policing 1-toughness creatures. Risk of re-ban: 2/10

    Chrome Mox: Yeah, Chrome Mox is good. Mox Opal would have to be banned to allow this guy to see daylight. Banning Mox Opal practically neuters Cheeri0s, slows affinity a tad, and boosts Control. Control NEEDS a boost. Aggro decks like Burn don't want to exile an important burn spell to accelerate. Control and Midrange desperately needs Chrome mox to power out turn 2 Lilianas. Risk of re-ban: 6/10


    Jitte basically reads "connect once, win all creature combat for the rest of the round". For 2 and 2, I think that's too strong for the format.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
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    posted a message on State of Modern Thread: bans, format health, reprints, new cards, and more!
    Quote from sisicat »
    Wasteland needs to be printed in a Standard legal set. Maindecking Pithing Needle (naming Wasteland) should be the price to pay for cheating mana in a format like Modern. Land hate in Modern has so much drawback or it's not effective at all.


    If not straight up wasteland, something like a either a waste that has an activation cost of 1, or one that draws your opponent a card when you use it.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
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    posted a message on What format does everyone play?
    Legacy and Pauper here.
    Posted in: Magic General
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    posted a message on State of Modern Thread: bans, format health, reprints, new cards, and more!
    Quote from mapccu »
    Quote from Pummeler »
    The issue with pod is not whether or not answers exist to foil it.
    Pods problem was anytime wizards printed a really good creature it slotted directly into pod. Truly it is a shame because Birthing pod was a really fun deck with a lot of different lines of play. It just had to die because unless wizards had a change of heart and decided to stop printing good creatures the deck would just continue to get better.


    But even strong creatures can still be tutored with relative ease. eldritch evolution seems just as effective if you're gunning for a 4-6 drop with access to delve creatures. chord of calling is still just as punishing at instant speed.

    I don't feel like coco puts a ceiling on what they can stick on a 3 drop. It's also a different card type, and it's way more explosive as opposed to slow
    Advantage once you get a persist creature down.

    I'm just not sure I see the Pod argument. The card doesn't seem that oppressive to me. Does it force artificial tempo to respect a combo engine like twin or drop an obscene board state for free like pre ban eldrazi?

    Was it a consistency issue? I can kind of see that argument in that 1 sideboard hate card would always come in to play if you ran it at 4 tutors and a copy...but I'm already doing this in elves every game 2/3 with ease. I mean developing a slow grind you engine with an eventual win con compared to strats like 8 rack or storm seem pretty innocent to me.


    Yes. it was too consistent for wizards. It was a midrange toolbox deck that can instawin. Wizards has quite clearly demonstrated that they would rather you play an attrition based midrange deck rather than a toolbox one.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
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    posted a message on State of Modern Thread: bans, format health, reprints, new cards, and more!
    As long as land destruction needs to pass through standard, nothing modern playable is going to come for the foreseeable future.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
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    posted a message on How to save Modern and Standard. Two VERY simple solutions.
    I mean, in theory a diverse format is a good thing. The problem is that modern is really expensive, and is very much a sideboard format. I would think that if the goal is to create a format where some decks just randomly lose, the barrier to switching decks should be lower. That's very much not the case unless you own the entire format.
    Posted in: Magic General
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    posted a message on How to save Modern and Standard. Two VERY simple solutions.
    Alright, modern is in its current state because of the lack of strong, universal answers.
    Current legacy is regarded by just about everyone as a fantastic format because these answers keep everything in check.
    You get force and Daze in blue, and miracles is probably the best deck in the format.
    Non blue decks get Thalia, wasteland, Karakas, and Port in the case of DnT, Aggro loam and Maverick get Chalics and a Knight of the reliquary toobox.
    Modern needs a force and wasteland variant, the format has zero mana denial.

    Pauper's also a good example. There's plenty of crazy stuff in the format, Kiln Fiend combo,Elves, Affinity, Kuldotha Boros, and I'm sure I'm missing something else.
    The reason that these decks don't take over everything, is again because we have answers that are powerful.
    UW or Murasa Tron, UB Teachings, Ux delver, Bx midrange/control all have very powerful generic answers that keep the super fast decks in check.

    Your suggestion would need Valakut, all of affinity, every infect creature, Aether Vial, Tarmogoyf, lightning bolt, Ad Nauseam , probably the fetchlands, banned,
    That would lose players an insane amount of money, might even be enough to justify a lawsuit. Also, consider that these people would probably never play magic again.
    Not everyone wants to play midrange hell like Kitchen Table casual.

    If wizards decided to just up and ban an entire format, not even cut support over time, just ban, I would sell my cards in every format so fast, and sink the money into board games, firearms, 40k or some other hobby.
    Not good for consumer confidence, your proposal.


    Quote from solidscheme »
    Quote from idSurge »
    Lol, I'm sorry. But simply, I saw your first line and literally burst out laughing.

    You would kill Modern instantly with your first point.

    Your second would bury it.

    If I wanted to play the...format of Standard, I would.

    You act like Modern isn't already dying lol. Even without my input, it's turn 4 nonsense keeps over 90% of newly created cards from ever having use in the format. Modern is stagnant because of those current decks. It's far too predictable and a format that's predictable with 1000's of cards is pathetic. It's on it's way where Legacy and vintage are guaranteed.



    That is the opposite of the truth. Part of the reason pros don't like modern very much is because you have no idea what you are going to encounter in the first few rounds of an event, and the powerlevel is high enough that random decks can just stomp ya.
    Posted in: Magic General
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    posted a message on State of Modern Thread: bans, format health, reprints, new cards, and more!
    Quote from xxhellfirexx3 »
    Quote from cfusionpm »
    Relevant video that summarizes pretty well how I feel about Magic right now.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AytGwG9vZhw


    Idk standard needed those bans imo. The dredge and probe ban where warranted, and divining top needs a ban in Legacy for sure.

    Bans balance numbers even if they hurt players investments.although some bans where incorrect I admit.

    And the video does shine a light on one of wizards ban criteria in which I favor, aka, battle of sideboards.

    This next year of magic is going to be interesting as I feel a certain developer needs to be fired.....or pick up his socks.


    Nah, Top's fine. Miracles got the ban it needed when DTT got the axe.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
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    posted a message on The State of Standard
    Quote from Narvuntien »



    The standard players of today get to use thier fatal pushes in eternal formats. Fatal push is a good example of printing cards for eternal formats. They have and can continue to do so.

    .


    Regarding push, that's not really quite true, it requires quite an investment in deckbuilding and in money to really be able to use push. In modern, you really need fetchlands to use push.
    And in the eternal formats where its legal, you would want some number of wastelands.
    Posted in: Magic General
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    posted a message on What can GUW do to counter maverick cards?
    Would something like Maze of Ith be what you're looking for? You can even tutor it up with Knight of the Reliquary.
    Posted in: Magic General
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    posted a message on State of Modern Thread: bans, format health, reprints, new cards, and more!
    Quote from Aegraen »
    There are 3 good cards on the banlist that would help Control - Preordain, JTMS, and Dig Through Time (this more than the others I'd wager) - well....and Sensei's Top, but that is probably the least likely (CounterTop would be fantastic). I'm hoping we'll get one of these next unban and maybe two. Preordain and DTT would be fantastic imho helping out 2 of the big problem areas for control decks. With WoTC on about printing better answers that would be a good direction. If they're afraid of DTT in Ad Naus, then you can hit that deck. Control and the format at large shouldn't needlessly suffer because of 1 or 2 combo decks imho.


    Of those three cards, DTT is the most busted by quite a long shot. It's pretty much always 7 cards deep at instant speed for UU. And even more egregiously, it doesn't even draw the cards, it just puts em right in your hand.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
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    posted a message on State of Modern Thread: bans, format health, reprints, new cards, and more!
    Quote from xxhellfirexx3 »
    Quote from spidernova »
    Quote from xxhellfirexx3 »
    I just clearly stated that we have to work hard for our wins didn't I? Valakut tron and Eldrazi arguably suppress 2 non bgx archtypes in both control and midrange.

    Can't we have more midrange than jund? Where did tokens, coco ,dnt, hate bears go?

    If aggro is suppressing fast mana/ramp than why is it currently 20%+?

    Actually with tight play blue can barely squeeze in wins vs most decks except the ramp/fast mana ones. I doubt blue control would be oppressive without those decks around.

    Look at the top decks on mtg goldfish and tell me if my ban suggestions dont the fix blue controls issues lol

    Midrange already is the best with bgx...
    Blue control in top tier would alleviate a bit of weight bgx is pulling currently in this linear game. So yea I do want them to be the best in the game but not by much, why? Less bans , less linear, more fun


    Can't speak for the other decks, but I played hatebears for quite a while, and it's fair game gets you run over by goyfs, and the most unfair thing it can do isn't even that powerful. It lacks a clock and real disruption.
    why not add black for thoughtsieze? And maybe a sfm unban?


    I mean, in modern, mana denial just doesn't exist, and that makes it really hard to play an aether vial deck.Vial is probally the straight up strongest card in the deck, but there's this lack of cards to abuse it with. Merfolk doesn't really count, vial in that deck is just an accelerant. It also doesn't help that Thalia is pretty bad in modern,thanks to the lack of ubiquitous one mana cantrips and most of the sweet tricks you can do with vial aren't really in, or all that relevant in the format. Vial Arbiter+GQ is cute, but both those cards are really bad on their own. It really does stem back to the complete lack of mana denial in the format.
    The problem with adding thoughtseize means you need fetches, and at that point you might as well drop the arbiters and just play straight up BGX, where you have disruption, staying power, and a 2 mana 3/4.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
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    posted a message on State of Modern Thread: bans, format health, reprints, new cards, and more!
    Quote from xxhellfirexx3 »
    I just clearly stated that we have to work hard for our wins didn't I? Valakut tron and Eldrazi arguably suppress 2 non bgx archtypes in both control and midrange.

    Can't we have more midrange than jund? Where did tokens, coco ,dnt, hate bears go?

    If aggro is suppressing fast mana/ramp than why is it currently 20%+?

    Actually with tight play blue can barely squeeze in wins vs most decks except the ramp/fast mana ones. I doubt blue control would be oppressive without those decks around.

    Look at the top decks on mtg goldfish and tell me if my ban suggestions dont the fix blue controls issues lol

    Midrange already is the best with bgx...
    Blue control in top tier would alleviate a bit of weight bgx is pulling currently in this linear game. So yea I do want them to be the best in the game but not by much, why? Less bans , less linear, more fun


    Can't speak for the other decks, but I played hatebears for quite a while, and it's fair game gets you run over by goyfs, and the most unfair thing it can do isn't even that powerful. It lacks a clock and real disruption.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
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    posted a message on State of Modern Thread: bans, format health, reprints, new cards, and more!
    Quote from Jayman21 »
    Quote from bizzycola »
    Quote from Shmanka »
    It seems disingenuous to me for people to claim that Force of Will is too powerful for Modern. Those same people generally refer to Legacy and the Blue dominance that format has, yet in reality, the Blue Dominance is obviously created by Brainstorm.

    Force of Will is only as good as the decks that decide to fully dedicate themselves to a glass cannon, otherwise even in Legacy you side them out in all the fair matchups, and some decks don't even run the full four in the maindeck.


    FoW, Daze, Brainstorm are all the reason why blue is so dominate with out each other they each are slightly diminished. I don't board out FoW against countertop which is a fair control deck, etc.. yes in the delver v delver(lets get real those are the fair decks) you board it out because card advantage is more important and you both run daze etc.. so it just becomes less crucial.

    If modern cannot handle Metal Misstep a card that only counters 1c.c. spells for free how does it make any sense to say a card that can counter any card for free as long as it doesn't say "cannot be countered" would be safe.


    Miracles is hardly a fair deck. It is a prison combocontrol deck. The only fair decks in legacy Delver and bug decks.


    What about Jund, Maverick,DnT, Merfolk?
    Posted in: Modern Archives
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    posted a message on State of Modern Thread: bans, format health, reprints, new cards, and more!
    Quote from bizzycola »
    Quote from genini2 »
    Quote from idSurge »
    But thats what I'm saying. Other than Twin, nobody had their deck killed, and one could even (well someone could, I couldnt) argue that Kiki-Mite or Kiki-Resto is still 'like Twin'.

    So those FNM magic folks have lost very very very little over the last 2 years, unless they played Twin, like me.

    EDIT: Essentially what I'm saying is its a non-issue, because 9 times out of 10, the deck lives. Twin is the exception.


    Not hurt severely? Pod turning into a collected company deck that sees no play is about as bad as Twin now having to slot Kiki-jikki over splinter twin.

    This is what I came in to say. I know personally many Pod players who did NOT move to Company. In fact, many of them grudgingly sold their pieces from their decks at quite the discount and then never wanted to play Company at all.

    Likewise with Bloom Titan. Most former Bloom Titan players I know don't even want to touch the deck now. It's like when you were taking steroids and lifting, but now you're just lifting without the "boost."

    @AK - Eldrazi decks were popping up (there were Processor decks), but they still had a somewhat poor Twin matchup. Despite running Path to Exile, Dismember, and discard, Twin could easily grind you out. (I ran BW Processors until the Eldrazi menace was just better to play)


    This sounds like your describing people who want to play the best deck. Yes some people only play busted decks because they are busted and when they are no longer busted want nothing to do with them, just look at Eldrazi when it was busted and got a ban lots of people left the deck. Bant Eldrazi is still a powerful deck and many stuck with it and the same was true with company decks lots of people who liked Pod play Company now, but the segment of players who just want to play the most busted best deck I don't feel for them. Pod was bad for the format, as simple as that. It was to good at being the best creature deck and one of the two best combo decks at the same time. Company gets to be a great creature deck while having access to some level of the combo without it being a matter of procedure like it was for Pod.


    Man, I just wish that wizards had given some indication that a pod kind of replacement was coming, or had waited to ban until after it had been released. I sold the deck because it looked like the only way to play a midrange deck in modern at that point was to shell out a grand for goyfs and lilianas.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
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    posted a message on If I sort of stink at HEARTHSTONE, should I even bother with MAGIC??
    It's a different game. Hearthstone relies on randomness to a much greater extent than MTG goes, depending on format.
    Posted in: Magic General
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    posted a message on Why can't we have products like pokemon has?
    Quote from idSurge »
    Modern is not too steep, you really need to stop that line. $500-$700 is nothing to jump into a hobby.

    Also, in one of those fat packs or whatever, I pulled 2 Torrential Gearhulk are they good? Dont know. :p


    In terms of other non-40k tabletop hobbies, it absolutely is.
    Posted in: Magic General
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    posted a message on Why is Aether Vial worth so much?
    At least in legacy DnT, you mostly use it to abuse symmetrical effects. Wasteland and Rishadan port both require you to use your lands instead of casting stuff. Vial lets you keep up pressure without needing to spend mana on it. Not to mention that you need to respond to the vial activation, so you can get nasty nasty phyrexian revoker plays.
    Posted in: Magic General
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    posted a message on I wanna dip into a new format
    Quote from idSurge »
    Huh, if Brainstorm is so clutch, how is it a $1 card? lol

    Maybe I should look into Legacy. :p


    What makes brainstorm so good is fetchlands. You get to dig three cards deep, at instant speed for 1 blue. After that, you then put the two worst cards in your hand on top, and crack the fetch. It's not quite an ancestral recall, but it's pretty close.
    Posted in: Magic General
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    posted a message on Banlist change for 1/9/2017
    Quote from CharonsObol »
    Quote from h0lydiva »
    I don't understand this idea that everything that doesn't follow the Good Old Accepted Rules Of Fair And Good Magic has to be taken out of Modern. Like, why? Modern has always had free mana, has always had delve and phyresian spells, has always had Tron lands, why does it have to be different?
    The short answer: because that's what WotC wants for the format, and it's what they have wanted since its inception.

    The long answer: In the Modern era, WotC has been too inconsistent with the power levels of the cards that they print. The Modern era has given us powerful spells and powerful creatures, but there is clearly an upper echelon of powerful cards. However, most of those powerful cards are aggressive creatures or combo-enabling spells; there are no comparably powerful police cards in Modern. The end result is that Modern can't actually police itself. Thoughtseize and Blood Moon alone aren't keeping Modern a turn-four format. That's the ultimate irony and misfortune of Modern: despite being sold by WotC as a slower format than Legacy, significantly more Modern games than Legacy games are decided on the earlier turns, de facto making Modern a faster format than Legacy. And the difference between the two formats is a lack of strong police cards, which, as you allude to, don't exist because WotC considers them "unfun". Police cards serve an important purpose in the health of a metagame, and without comparably strong police cards in Modern, WotC can only rely on the banhammer to "fix" the format.

    Quote from h0lydiva »
    Many of those cards and mechanics have been present in tens of decks from the start of the format, they ARE a part of the format, and I don't know why that has to change and why some people is constantly asking for Modern to be turned into some ***** "standard but with better cards" format, where the second someone does something different from playing Tarmogoyfs and Bolts, one land per turn, kill your stuff you kill my stuff and we keep playing stuff and killing our stuff, there's endless cries and appeals to some vaporous concepts about how Magic is supposed to be played and what is "fun" or "not fun".
    You're absolutely right, but you should have been complaining about this for five years. Control players have been. The irony of your statement is that classic control and prison decks have never been allowed to exist in Modern because WotC considers them "unfun", but it takes the banning of a combo-enabler to elicit this kind of response from the community.

    WotC has narrowed the range of playable strategies in recent years, not only in Modern, but in Standard. They've presumably got marketing research pertaining to what players do and do not like, and they've been gradually pushing the game towards accessibility (simplicity) as opposed to complexity (nuance). But the end result is that the game as a whole plays in ways that you're lamenting.

    Frankly, as a Death & Taxes player, I agree with you. I would like to be the format police so that you can pilot your combo deck without overrunning the rest of the format. But WotC doesn't want to give control players the tools they need, and as a result, they have to ban powerful cards that can't be interacted with by aggro decks.



    I'm with you there. I'm a legacy Death and Taxes player, and in that format, we have the tools to punish decks that do unfair things, and we have creatures that are powerful enough to present a decent clock. Modern DnT has none of those things. Ghost quarter+leonin arbiter is cute, but neither of those cards on their own are really all that playable. Thalia just gets goyfed, you don't have mom or sfm, I could go on. I personally think modern could adapt to wasteland, not port though, but even a version of tec edge with the "4 or more" restriction removed, could go a long way to keeping modern more sane.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
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    posted a message on How to teach someone to become a better magic player?
    Untap-upkeep-draw.

    Fundamentals of how the game functions are more important than decisions made during play.
    I saw this really neat mat at FNM the other day that had a step by step flowchart kind of thing of all the different phases, something like that seems like it would a colossal help to new players.
    Posted in: Magic General
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    posted a message on Banlist change for 1/9/2017
    Yeah, that was my thinking of the troll ban. I would bet that part of the reason is so they can go "see, we told you so", and not take other cards off the list.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
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    posted a message on Banlist change for 1/9/2017
    Its also kind of worth noting that the fair decks that never or rarely get banned are also the ones that tend to be the most expensive.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
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    posted a message on how Wizard ruin MTG in two years
    I mean, I traded out of modern after they banned 2 tier one decks of mine in rapid succession. The twin ban sealed my decision to never come back. I'm sorry wizards, I played hatebears for a year, and I am never doing that ever again, especially as you banned pod and bloom right when I finished them. Legacy and pauper all the way, baby, control decks are actually good in those formats.
    Posted in: Magic General
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    posted a message on Would removing or reworking "New World Order" fix MTG?
    Correct me if I'm wrong, but don't more mechanically complex cards tend to be almost strictly better because of a greater degree of versatility? The fact that I can perma-exile stuff with oblivion ring and fiend hunter makes those cards better than banishing light and banisher priest.
    If you can shift those better cards to higher rarities, you get to sell more boosters.
    I would love more powerful commons, and I think NWO is the wrong direction, but new players are the target audience, and I think that WOTC is aiming for a 5th grade reading level(Which is honestly disheartening), at least from what I remember from the article where Maro explains NWO.
    I mean, I'm not going to get a hexproof finisher for my UW pauper tron deck ever for the sole reason that new players find hexproof confusing.

    Posted in: Magic General
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    posted a message on "What Deck Should I Play" thread
    Merfolk for sure. A taxes deck really needs more mana denial than exists in modern to be good.
    Posted in: Modern
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    posted a message on Selesnya vs Golgari EDH
    I would think that G is the more important color of the options for survival, GZS,ramp,sylvan library,tooth and nail, etc, and both have it.
    It also depends on the commander. The first commander who comes to mind for GW is Sisay, and i'm pretty sure she's much more powerful than the GB options.
    Posted in: Magic General
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    posted a message on State of the Meta Thread. Talk about modern as a whole; Bans, health reprints and more.
    Quote from Khanth »
    There are many good white creatures that haven't really found a home. Thalia, Guardian of Thraben has a really powerful effect, but don't see play outside hatebears/D&T. There are many more, just being outclassed by sheer power of things like Tarmogoyf or Snapcaster Mage.


    The problem with Thalia is that modern is just much more creature based than legacy. In legacy, you play 8+ cantrips to dig for lands, and a 2cc brainstorm, ponder or preordain, can lose the game. In modern, she doesn't really do anything, because the general larger creatures in modern don't let you present a clock.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
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    posted a message on "Better" or "Higher Tier" Decks Criteria
    I'll go with the even match, I play DnT in legacy, and while it generally has decent matchups across the board, it doesn't really get free wins, even against decks you should beat, you still can just lose.
    Posted in: Magic General
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    posted a message on Should I trade Infect for Bant Eldrazi?
    Go with the deck that has both super pushed creatures and sol lands.
    Posted in: Modern
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    posted a message on State of the Meta Thread. Talk about modern as a whole; Bans, health reprints and more.
    Have you played with port?
    As a DnT player, port is much much more powerful than Wasteland, it may even be the best single card in the deck. It gives free wins against infect, permanently locks down shocklands unless you pay 2 life, and has no place in a format that is sorely lacking in instant speed 1cmc utility effects. If they miss a land drop and you have an active port, the game is basically over, unless they have some really strong threat on board. I mean, imagine playing against scapeshift with port: Eot port down your blue sorce, untap, port down your other land, scapeshift. Or tron that tutors up ports with maps.
    Port would also be at least a three of of in every fair deck in the format, probably a lot of the combo decks too, and we know wizards would print it at mythic. Enjoy your 300 dollar land.
    Card would also never ever get through standard. It is the very embodiment of anti-fun.

    I can see modern surviving wasteland mostly intact, you can play around wasteland, and as much as modern players hate to adapt, i'm sure they would. I cannot see the format surviving port, card is 100% nuts.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
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    posted a message on State of the Meta Thread. Talk about modern as a whole; Bans, health reprints and more.
    Quote from Grumsh »
    If control players could play more than just Lantern as a prison strategy, would that make them happy?

    I've been playing around Magus of the Tabernacle strategies, and if anyone has a good idea of how to get around my Trinisphere/Goblin Dark Dwellers non-bo I'd be ecstatic.



    I doubt it. I think draw-go control is what people what instead of just locking someone out of the game.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
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    posted a message on State of the Meta Thread. Talk about modern as a whole; Bans, health reprints and more.
    We also don't really have a good tempo deck in the format at this point. People talk about miracles in legacy, but have you tried playing a combo deck against a delver variant? It's a nightmare for them. Delver tends to lose to fair decks as they hemmorage cards to force and daze. Delver just does't work without free counterspells. `
    We also don't have any U based midrange decks either, as GB has all of the good value cards, and countermagic is so mediocre in modern.
    Delver tends to lose to fair decks as they hemmorage cards to force and daze.
    In modern, it really seems like WOTC is using the banlist so they can avoid having to print good countermagic,as countermagic makes new players angry.
    I think that unbanning Ponder/Preordain would be good. Give people a reason to play U midrange, and W gets a lot better, as thalia is no longer useless weight a lot of the time. Or, print a pushed creature for white at the same power level of Goyf/Snap. Or print baleful strix.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
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    posted a message on State of the Meta Thread. Talk about modern as a whole; Bans, health reprints and more.
    Quote from Djoron »
    You also have tier 1 Abzan, tier 2 Jeskai, the company and chord decks and Ad Nauseam.
    Sure, they aren't mono-white, but fish aside, no colour is really represented in a mono- or two-colour deck.

    And white even is, in Death'n Taxes, which is a super varied strategy in itself, between WB, W, WG, WBC, etc.


    So.. what glaring issues do you see there, or rather, what would want for White?
    WhiteWeenie tier 1?

    (Not saying White doesn't need help, it kinda is "Path and 1W sideboard enchantments".colour ^^ )


    I personally would love to see a Mono-w DnT strategy in tier 1. Kinda fills a control niche, while being creature based enough that wotc cant complain about it. I guess that LD that doesn't suck isn't in the spirit of the modern format though. The real problem with the deck is that it doesn't have the disruption to beat the real unfair decks, and it doesn't have the creature game to beat the dedicated fair decks in modern, aka goyf.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
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    posted a message on is modern worth getting into?
    I'm of the opinion that Modern has passed the jumping on point for newer players in terms of price. I'm sure that you can play a brew and do reasonably well at a FNM, but I don't think it's that unreasonable to expect a deck that can compete at high levels for your investment
    Perhaps i'm just being leery of bans after being burned pretty badly already.

    If you are willing to spend a decent amount more, you can build a very good legacy deck(reanimator, DnT, UR delver come to mind as good places to start) and in legacy, even the tier 2 and 3 decks can compete with the tier decks. Legacy also is a much more stable format too. Duals are stupid expensive, true, but you often don't need more than 2 thanks to your fetches.
    If you have a very small budget, then have you considered pauper on modo? It's very high power, and due to only commons being allowed, it's quite cheap.

    Quote from Jayman21 »
    Modern imo is the best eternal format. Interaction is a bit on the weak side but it is not as bad as people make it seem. If you want to play interactive you have to back it up with a compact proactive plan such as goyf or delver with young pyro. This is true about all eternsl formats though. Vintage control has always been combo control hybrids and miracles is a control prison/combo deck. Everything is viable in modern except pure durdle control like sphinx's rev control and 5 color control from standard formats.

    Minor nitpick, but modern's not an eternal format.

    Posted in: Modern
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    posted a message on Current Modern Banlist Discussion (9/26/2016 update - No changes!)
    I think that instead of banning fetchlands, printing some stronger land destruction would help with that.
    I'm not asking for wasteland, but something like tec edge with the stupid "4 or more" clause removed.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
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    posted a message on Opinions on land destruction
    Legacy here. LD is an important part of the game, and a valid resource to attack.
    Posted in: Opinions & Polls
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    posted a message on What is the cost of drafting at your LGS?
    12 dollar drafts at my shop.
    Posted in: Magic General
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    posted a message on Conceding before Lethal
    How does it make the game break down? Mechanically its no different from blocking and then sacrificing to deny damage.
    Posted in: Magic General
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    posted a message on Conceding before Lethal
    I'm of the opinion that the person who swings out and is entirely contingent upon the cooperation of the person he/she is killing is a bad magic player. It might be Legacy, and years of 4x/wargames talking here, but its usually better to play conservatively. Don't give your opponents the chance to screw you over. Don't commit everything to kill a person who can screw you over with their dying breath, like whatshisname in Game of Thrones.

    I mean, it's in my best interests to at least convince the group that I would in fact be willing to scoop, screwing over my attacker. This way, I am less likely to be attacked. If the group knows that I am going to always let the attacker be rewarded, then they have more motivation to single me out if i'm ever in a position of weakness.
    I'm generally willing to let people rewind when they realize that I do have that option though.

    Also, if EDH is a politics format, and all y'all are talking about group rules and peer pressuring people into acting a certain way, I honestly don't see that much of a difference between that and scooping for the purpose of screwing over a player, or threatening to kick people out of your house or something.
    Posted in: Magic General
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    posted a message on Making A White/Blue Control Deck Any Card Recs?
    Standard I'm guessing?
    If you want to play pure draw go control, Teachings, UW tron, and Snowglobe in pauper are pretty fun.
    Posted in: Casual & Related Formats
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    posted a message on White too powerful in MTG(not just about standard)?
    Quote from crimhead »
    Quote from squarlsquad »
    Although to be fair, lands would be an easy matchup for Mono White.
    Lands vs D&T is pretty close to 50/50.


    Preboard, Loam and P-fire are a nightmare. Dark Depths really isn't that much of a problem, you have 11 outs to the token. I guess it's the standard DnT problem of needing to draw the right half of your deck.
    Once you bring in the RIPs, and the tutor, it gets a lot better.
    Posted in: Magic General
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    posted a message on Does not competitive FNM really exist? Casual events organized by shops are still competitive?
    Quote from motleyslayer »
    Quote from The Fluff »
    Quote from Warangel88 »
    Hi guys. I know you probably know my impression about FNM and why I should avoid it. But still when FNM events are the only ways to play magic or the related events are in the same way as FNM (competitive).

    I just want to discuss about the possibility that shops organize non competitive events. I honestly dislike the way people/organizers tell you:

    1. that you should play the game that fast so that you can finish 3 games
    2. that you need to concentrate on the game and not to talk anything else
    3. that you are not allowed to talk with other players that are playing


    Referring to 3

    3. I would be annoyed if someone disturbed me while I'm playing, as it can distract from what's happening in the game. I tend to keep track of how many cards an opponent has in their hands, permanents in play, etc. Socializing and talking about other fun things can all be done after a game is finished. Smile


    at the same time too, it is also annoying if my opponent spends too much time focusing on outside factors other than the game that can wait until the game is finished. Things such as trading, texting/using phone for social media/whatever, talking to other people.

    Quote from spidernova »
    Is it just me, or has this thread been made at least 4 times?

    That said, I cannot stand casual magic. It's way too easy for pure casual to degenerate into a arms race of who has more money. Formats and 'competitive magic" exist to keep everyone on the same level.
    Also, if i'm paying 5ish dollars to compete, I would like an event where I can play against people who don't need to have a judge called on them when I vial in a revoker.
    No, you let the vial resolve, you cannot respond to the revoker. No, that's a key part of my deck, you cant rewind it.


    yeah I've found some "casual" decks can be quite broken. I find some people just use "casual" so that it doesn't fit into a specific format's banlist. I mean there are some people who just wanna play tabletop, fun Magic and not play competitively.


    Exactly, "casual" can either mean powered yagstorm, or it could mean crawurm.dek.
    Posted in: Magic General
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    posted a message on Does not competitive FNM really exist? Casual events organized by shops are still competitive?
    Is it just me, or has this thread been made at least 4 times?

    That said, I cannot stand casual magic. It's way too easy for pure casual to degenerate into a arms race of who has more money. Formats and 'competitive magic" exist to keep everyone on the same level.
    Also, if i'm paying 5ish dollars to compete, I would like an event where I can play against people who don't need to have a judge called on them when I vial in a revoker.
    No, you let the vial resolve, you cannot respond to the revoker. No, that's a key part of my deck, you cant rewind it.
    Posted in: Magic General
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    posted a message on White too powerful in MTG(not just about standard)?
    Lets see, in modern, White is played for path and sideboard stuff. In legacy, its played for swords, stoneforge,miracles and DnT. I mean white doesn't really have ways to interact with the stack, and that kind of murders you in eternal formats.
    Posted in: Magic General
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    posted a message on What makes magic boring or interesting to you?
    Quote from motleyslayer »
    Quote from Ebonclaw »
    Interesting? The art, the lore. The power of a deck that offers several different paths to take at any given time and the technical expertise needed to identify and execute the best play.
    Boring? The constant "chase the latest standard deck" grind. Standard just isn't my bag I guess, I tried it for a while, but I only ever truly enjoyed playing caw-blade, for the reasons mentioned above and never really got into a deck that wasn't the oddball homebrew.
    Both? Sensei's Divining Top. Incredibly boring card when your opponent(s) have one. Incredibly interesting when you do.


    the fact that you always have to essentially learn a new deck in standard is what I enjoy about standard, you're forced to pick up a new deck almost every rotation

    modern is sweet because you can just play the same deck for years but learning a new deck is also sweet


    Not if multiple decks get banned out from under you.


    Personally, I like complex board states, and being able to keep opponents from playing.
    Posted in: Magic General
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    posted a message on In light of recent discussion of the RL, how would you feel if the RL were broken as a player? As a collector?
    Why do people want a tier 1 deck you ask? I don't know about you, but if I drop 600 dollars on a mana base and another few hundred on the cards, I want a deck that wins. Based on the amount of money that magic costs, in any format, I don't really think that's an absurd thing to ask. Also, the power gap between tier 1 and tier 2 in modern is much higher than it is in legacy. Even janky legacy decks in legacy have absurdly powerful unfair options like foodchain,enchantress,aluren,brainstorm, that can steal wins. In modern, you need to work really really hard for something unfair, and if its good enough, it's just going to get banned.



    I wonder if wizards does this on purpose. A lot of the unfair cheese decks tend to be a lot cheaper, and bans tend to hurt budget players a lot more as a result. I mean, in terms of powerlevel, you could absolutely make a case for LOTV being banned in modern.
    Posted in: Magic General
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    posted a message on [Deck] Death and Taxes
    Played 2 in the board. Was fantastic whenever it dropped. Rug and shardless got trashed by her.
    Posted in: Control
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    posted a message on "Eternal" Format (a.k.a. "No Reserved List Legacy") -- a Matter of "How", Not "If" and/or "When"
    You probably would have to ban wasteland and price of progress in this format. When you tack a bolt onto your waste, that gets free wins,especially in a grindy format.
    Posted in: Magic General
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    posted a message on In light of recent discussion of the RL, how would you feel if the RL were broken as a player? As a collector?
    As a player, I would like more people to play with.

    As a collector, well, I only own non blue duals, and not that many, but I would be perfectly fine with the value tanking.

    Down with the reserve list
    Posted in: Magic General
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    posted a message on Magic's newest "player": Martin Shkreli. Good for the reserved list case?
    They absolutely have the right, but in my mind, they need to either kill the reserve list, or kill sanctioned legacy.
    Posted in: Magic General
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    posted a message on Magic's newest "player": Martin Shkreli. Good for the reserved list case?
    You are drastically overrating the price of the kind of machine you need to play CS go. You don't really need more than a 500 dollar PC to get more than 60 frames per second.
    Also, imagine if a gun company hosted a shooting event, where you had to use particular guns and then the company refused to manufacture those guns.
    It's also a bit of an apples to oranges comparison. Higher end computers have more transistors in them, better guns or cameras have more precise machining. Better magic cards do not cost more to make. Its artificial scarcity at its finest.

    Honestly, I'm not surprised that people are turning to counterfeits.It's the market's attempt to address a problem in the supply.

    Posted in: Magic General
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    posted a message on Magic's newest "player": Martin Shkreli. Good for the reserved list case?
    Quote from ElAzar »
    The problem is not only that.

    Its also very unsportsmanlike. Why? Because some people play real cards, but are still on a budget. They got their duals, but still no Tabernacle, or they play Merfolk without Wasteland, or are still missing that grim tutor. Not every legacy player has all the cards he needs.

    Someone who simply uses counterfeits has no such restrictions. At what point do you belive just getting counterfeits to play becomes cheating for getting such an advantage over your opponent restricted by the cards he actually owns?


    You're right. The person who has more money should have a strict mechanical advantage of several percentage points over people who have less.I just love getting free wins when I get to wasteland a fetch+shockland.
    Posted in: Magic General
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    posted a message on [Deck] Death and Taxes
    Elves is gross, you have to do everything exactly right, and they have to stumble somewhere to have even a shot at winning.
    Posted in: Control
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    posted a message on Magic's newest "player": Martin Shkreli. Good for the reserved list case?
    I'm the opinion that MTG is basically one giant pyramid scheme right now. Wotc sells boosters to casuals and new players, who in turn get sharked out of their cards. The problem is that thanks to wotc both massively increasing print run thanks to the influx of new players, and at the same time powering down everything, it's really really hard to trade up from standard. RL is kinda saying, Oh, didn't start 10 years ago? Better drop the price of a crappy car for a good deck. Am I the only one who thinks that this is just a little absurd?

    I would be perfectly happy eating a massive loss of value on my duals if it meant new people would come to play legacy.

    Edit- To be fair, I don't really have all that many duals, just enough to be able to switch from DnT to maverick or aggro loam if I feel like it.
    Posted in: Magic General
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    posted a message on Friday Night Magic
    Drafts are better for new players with smaller collections. Depends on the store, but in general, you can expect to see decks copypasted from top8 finishes. Constructed is 5-6 dollars on average, draft should be 10-12 dollars.
    Posted in: Magic General
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    posted a message on What's the consensus on new Legacy players?
    Quote from TRBobal »
    spidernova, DnT was one of the decks I was seriously interested in. Can you tell me a bit about your experiences with it?


    Sure. You don't really have any horrible matchups aside from elves, elves is really really bad, if you lock out the combo, they just make a billion elves, and if you start going after their creatures,you get hoofed. Your mana denial plan is strong, and your fair game is decent. Jitte outright wins creature matchups if it connects once. Vial is my favorite magic card ever. Generally name Deathrite on a revoker, if you have to play it totally blind. Karakas is really really good, espcially with a thalia and vial. Flickerwisp is also really sweet. Deck plays like a control deck more than midrange, pass turn, eot vial. Get your vial activation priority right, and don't ever let someone cheat you out of something after they said vial activation resolved. Mulling is hard too, all of the hands you draw tend to look mediocre at absolute worst. You hardcast batterskull a lot more than you would think. The big goal is to keep your opponent from winning, after that, you kind of win incidentally. Take it slow, you are a control deck, not an aggro deck. Casting catacyslm against miracles or Jund feels super good.

    Deck has a few weaknesses tho. You don't really auto-win anything, and you can't make mistakes ever, as you don't have brainstorm to dig you out of holes. You also can draw the wrong half of the deck sometimes. I don't want my mirran crusaders against storm, and my thalias aren't fantastic against Jund.
    Deck is tier1 good, but you need to play it really tight, and sometimes you just lose particular games through no fault of your own.


    Ideally the progression is
    T1 vial
    T2 waste+path/port/thalia, eot vial in mom
    t3 two drop/mana denial, eot vial in revoker/sfm/thalia/serra
    t4, keep up mana denial, start beating face
    Posted in: Magic General
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    posted a message on What's the consensus on new Legacy players?
    Quote from Gish »
    Quote from spidernova »
    The biggest reason i'm playing legacy right now is that i've had three modern decks banned out from under me. I wish I could afford dual lands, but wizards has seen to that, so DnT forever it is.


    Not a bad choice, DnT is a lot more fun than many decks with duals!

    Every Legacy player I've personally met has been very friendly. I don't play much anymore, but years ago when I first got into the format I built some budget mono B decks to try out. My opponents had tier 1 decks but we still had good games and I learned a lot. Everyone was supportive and I got some advice but nothing overbearing. I got addicted to the format and quickly built some better decks but the awesomeness of my (now sadly defunct) Legacy community stuck with me.

    I'd say 90% of my bad experiences in Magic have been with Standard, the other 10% Modern.


    Yeah, i've had the deck for about a year, and it's nice actually getting to have decent mana denial.

    My horrible experiences with magic have been EDH or kitchen table magic.
    Posted in: Magic General
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    posted a message on What's the consensus on new Legacy players?
    The biggest reason i'm playing legacy right now is that i've had three modern decks banned out from under me. I wish I could afford dual lands, but wizards has seen to that, so DnT forever it is.
    Posted in: Magic General
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    posted a message on Current Modern Banlist Discussion (4/4/2016 - Eye of Ugin banned, Ancestral Vision/Sword of the Meek unbanned)
    Quote from bocephus »
    Quote from xxhellfirexx3 »
    Quote from ktkenshinx »

    The banlist thread cycle continues! As usual, Moon is fine. It doesn't even see play in any of the top-tier decks today, or at least sees extremely minimal and sporadic play in a few of their sideboards. The card is neither dominant nor format warping (plenty of top-tier decks are playing Moon-vulnerable manabases), and cards aren't banned because we dislike playing against them and they beat up our deck.
    no, but some of the cards from 8th and 9th aren't what I would call fun magic, and that is a criteria for what wizards wants for this format. a turn 2 ssg into blood moon on the draw, or an affinity deck puking out there hand and then a turn 2 blood moon on the play from opal, is something I wouldnt allow if I had any say. based off of this, If i had a say, Id ban opal and ssg immediately, maybe even become immense. then, see what the format looks like after words. the format would then probably slow down which would cause tron to take up too much meta share, I would then hit tron lands, and be very happy with the new modern. And im sure everyone else would be who enjoy actual games of magic, the end.

    Many of us like the type of magic that you're decrying - the game (and this format specifically) exist for all the people who don't want to be bound to the current design philosophies and restrictions. If you don't want to deal with blood moons (or other 'unfun' cards like Ensnaring Bridge), a LITTLE bit of fast mana, and some occasional combos, then go play standard.


    Not saying I disagree with you entirely, but your argument could be turned around on you, and someone could tell you if you like to play that kind of Magic, go play Legacy. Just saying.

    I believe the Modern format was created for the newer player. Look where they started it. Its when the up tick in attendance started to rise again. With the way they have maintained the format I also think Wotc is leaning away from what you desire for the 'good old' days.

    I believe modern exists in the midpoint between Legacy and Standard - and as such both sides of the equation need to make concessions towards the other side. Some combo, 'unfun' prison stuff and fast mana from legacy exist alongside the more midrangey sorts of standard strategies.

    I don't think the modern format was created specifically for the newer player at all. I think it's intended to be a more universal format where many wayward players can find a home.


    Not to mention a format where they can at least pretend to reprint staples.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
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    posted a message on Buy a Box Promo - Thalia
    This seems really good in Legacy DNT. Plays nice with mana denial and aether vial, slots right into the three drop slot if you cut a wingmare/crusader and a wisp, lets me wasteland fetches, and ruins Show and Tell, Entreat, and some other stuff too. The fact that she's legendary is just icing on the cake for karakas.
    Posted in: The Rumor Mill
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    posted a message on Current Modern Banlist Discussion (4/4/2016 - Eye of Ugin banned, Ancestral Vision/Sword of the Meek unbanned)
    Quote from Equinox2793 »
    Quote from DHamlin »
    Quote from Equinox2793 »
    I don't know why this discussion is only about twin. The metagame is significantly more interactive right now and there are more legal decks. The ban accomplished what it was set out to do. If you want to play twin play Sneak and show in legacy it's similar. The only card I would want on the ban list is choke. It is a narrow hatecard that punishes people for just playing magic with the color blue in their deck. No good magic is promoted by the card's existence.

    Lol, Choke is annoying, but the decks it affects can usually play around it. Would be worse for them if everyone ran Boil.


    Choke flat out wins games by itself and it encourages players fetching for non island cards early on so they don't get blown out. Seeing a basic forest makes me want to fetch for something else just because of the threat of the card. That is the definition of unhealthy magic the gathering.


    How is that unhealthy? You perceive a potential threat, and play around it. Mana bases are just another aspect of the game that can be targeted, nothing sacred about them.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
  • 1

    posted a message on Full Set List is Up
    I would hardly call DnT cancer. Its the fairest deck in legacy.
    Posted in: The Rumor Mill
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    posted a message on New Format on Its Way Edit No it's not.
    If you have a legacy without the reserve list, Price of Progress has to go. Probably wasteland too.

    And that would make a lot of people really really mad, especially the people who just went out and bought EM wastes.
    Posted in: The Rumor Mill
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    posted a message on Current Modern Banlist Discussion (4/4/2016 - Eye of Ugin banned, Ancestral Vision/Sword of the Meek unbanned)
    DRS was banned for the same reason that GSZ was. It's a 1 drop that is always a fantastic topdeck, especially in a format without swords to plowshares. Apples to oranges comparing it to stoneforge.

    My gut tells me that stoneforge is really more of a control/prison card than a midrange one, but that might be my legacy experience talking.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
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    posted a message on Current Modern Banlist Discussion (4/4/2016 - Eye of Ugin banned, Ancestral Vision/Sword of the Meek unbanned)
    Even the fair decks all have some borderline "unfair" cards.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
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    posted a message on Current Modern Banlist Discussion (4/4/2016 - Eye of Ugin banned, Ancestral Vision/Sword of the Meek unbanned)
    Quote from FZA »
    Quote from solidscheme »
    Quote from FZA »
    Quote from solidscheme »
    So you're telling me all of the artifact disruption in Modern is not able to stop an equipment that doesn't do anything until after damage? Turn three 4/4 gets beat by 1,2,3-mana spells. Abrupt Decay, Reclamation Sage, Path to Exile, Terminate, Echoing Truth, Ancient Grudge, Pithing Needle, Dismember, Beast Within, Stony Silence? That's just the minimum. Dude, this not standard. Those banned cards are no where near as effective as they use to be. You can be comboed-out or poisoned on turn three/four.


    If you think that Abrupt Decay or Path to Exile "beat" Stoneforge Mystic than you must be pretty off on some key fundamentals of Magic.

    SFM doesn't past the lightning bolt test. You get an equipment that stays in your hand unless manually put it down or find a way to keep another SFM safe for a turn. Tell me what I'm missing especially since you picked only TWO cards out of all the options?


    You're missing the fact that even if SFM is killed, you still got to tutor for an equipment. So I spent one card to kill your card which replaced itself. You got a 2 for 1, and all I got was a very marginal tempo gain (if I killed it with a bolt).

    The only cards that profitably answer SFM are either too narrow to be played main deck (Ancient Grudge) or cost more than 2 mana (Kolaghan's Command).

    Honestly though if you're going to cite cards like Pithing Needle or Beast Within (lol) as reasons that SFM is safe to unban, it suggests you're pretty out of touch with the format.



    All I want to say is that the swords are unplayable if you need to hard cast them. Tapping 3 mana for sword of what and ever can lose you a game easy. They also require a boardstate.

    Posted in: Modern Archives
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    posted a message on Current Modern Banlist Discussion (4/4/2016 - Eye of Ugin banned, Ancestral Vision/Sword of the Meek unbanned)
    I honestly think that JTMS and SFM would be perfectly fine. Based on my legacy experience, Jitte is just too absurdly strong.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
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    posted a message on [[Official]] Modern Prices Discussion
    Quote from jackad7 »
    I feel like it's good to not reprint items in mass quantity. No I don't like expensive cards and yes I like reprints but if we stop back there are some good things. It encourages people to make new decks and makes special sets like modern masters more fun. The biggest downside to no reprints is people take advantage of it like speculators and stores likr scg that control the market.


    The best way to get people to make new decks is not to make the strictly best cards 100x times the price of the next best one. Especially with lands, i'm not going to play with a sub optimal mana base.
    Posted in: Modern
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    posted a message on Current Modern Banlist Discussion (4/4/2016 - Eye of Ugin banned, Ancestral Vision/Sword of the Meek unbanned)
    Quote from solidscheme »
    Question: Why is Stoneforge Mystic, Jace, The Mind Sculptor banned? SFM has soooo many answers to it and it's equipment. Jace is extremely lackluster for a turn four play especially in this aggro and combo environment. Jace never even set foot in Modern. He was banned straight from Standard all because that format at the time had limited answers to planeswalkers and activated abilities. All it needed was Pithing Needle and Caw Blade wouldn't be much of a threat. Modern on the other hand is filled with answers.

    Other cards that have many answers for them in Modern are Umezawa's Jitte, Dread Return and Second Sunrise.

    What gives?


    Jitte I can answer. If the equipped creature connects with anything once, it basically becomes impossible to beat the jitte controller with creatures. At absolute worst it gains you a bunch of life.
    Jitte might as well read 2c, win all creature combat for the rest of the game. Stoneforge is banned because a 4/4 vigilance lifelinker at the end of t3 is too strong for the format.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
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    posted a message on Current Modern Banlist Discussion (4/4/2016 - Eye of Ugin banned, Ancestral Vision/Sword of the Meek unbanned)
    I think JTMS would be perfectly fine, honestly. My experience with the card has been that you need to stabilize before he takes over the game, dropping a Jace onto a board with more than one creature or threat gets him killed. Midrange creature decks get an insane amount of power at the four drop slot, with all these versatile creature cards.I also find it very hard to imagine that JTMS would push Jund or Coco out of tier 1.
    But really, I think a lot of the problem is that threats are more powerful than answers, and control doesn't really have a game ending superthreat, and even a lot of the more controling decks in the format, like grixis, or UWR, play a lot closer to what I would call midrange.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
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    posted a message on Current Modern Banlist Discussion (4/4/2016 - Eye of Ugin banned, Ancestral Vision/Sword of the Meek unbanned)
    Quote from ed06288 »
    I feel modern will continue to have linear decks until fair decks are pushed. I like the possibility of unbanning bloodbraid elf, stoneforge, maybe jace. I still feel that jund is too clunky despite having a larger meta game share now.

    I could be opening a can of worms here, but why isn't sinkhole played more in legacy? Maybe land destruction could be better in modern. Stronger stone rains or ghost quarters could be good.


    Double black on turn 2 is rough, and the attrition decks that would want sinkhole would rather be casting a Hymm, Jund just wants to rip your hand apart and beat face with a goyf, Shardless wants to do borderline unfair things with agent, Maverick has the rough mana base, and plays a hatebears game. DnT cant do the mana base needed for that.
    I agree that having ghost quarter as our default LD is really lame, but good LD is "unfun", and symmetrical effects are always the most broken.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
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    posted a message on [[Official]] Modern Prices Discussion
    Quote from TheAller »
    Nahiri, the Harbinger is spiking. Not sure why.

    I believe that someone posted about it being very strong in legacy miracles.
    Posted in: Modern
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    posted a message on Current Modern Banlist Discussion (4/4/2016 - Eye of Ugin banned, Ancestral Vision/Sword of the Meek unbanned)
    At least as far as I understand it, GSZ is banned because its too good at every stage of the game, much like deathrite
    Posted in: Modern Archives
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