I was actually going to skip Gatecrash altogether to put some money on Modern Masters, but those guild abilities are just so damn flavorful and the art so far is absolutely gorgeous that i'm tempted again... i like having a small pile of cards that i like the art or just making a solid collection (like having 4 of each Circle of protection even though i don't play white) so i'm looking for aways to put my hands on a nice sample of cards without having to shell out a brickload of money
So, people have advised me against Buying Boxes, it's too expensive you hardly ever get back what you payed for and it's not good enough to make decks so you have to expend more money or get stuck with tons of commons and uncommons that you don't really need or want to collect.
With all that said, i'm not overly excited to shell out more cash for gatecrash.
I was considering another strategy though, one that would allow a better cost x benefit relationship, give me a nice little set of collectables and still give me a decent enough base for decks and light play (not really into the tournament scene...)
I was instead thinking of getting Multiple Intro Decks, maybe even one of each. Since they are smaller, beginners deck that are also fun and interesting to use and come with 2 boosters each... it seemed like a decent alternative.
However, i would like some insight from people who have been doing this for a bit longer...
So i guess i would get more bang for my buck getting into a release event M14 draft than putting the cash for a booster box this time...
Hell, i'm not even sure i'll get gatecrash, i might just get the Simic Intro Pack and draft a few boosters.... just for saving money for Dragon's maze and Modern Masters really.
every now and again i see a few pebbles (and the occasional brick) tossed against core sets.
My recent return to MTG was through M13, and a single booster box that i shared with a friend, plus the green intro deck. Fun, light, interesting stuff to play with...
Ravnica was different, exciting, complex, a LOT more stuff to play with and work around.
However, i still keep seeing people saying that buying core sets is a waste of time and money... so as we approach M14, i have to wonder.... is it really a waste? And why? Is it just because it's an intro product?
So, one of the very first decks i played on Magic waaaaaaaay back in the day were classic "tap elves for X Fireball". It was fun and effective when it worked.
Now the strategies are WAY more varied and unique, and there is just a lot of ways to play and have fun, but i wanted to see what this deck would look like in today's Modern.
I hate to reference YGO again. Decks there usually have a half year shelf live and can range between $100-800. Wizards has done a great job on making cards more assessible, in my opinion. There is also more formats that people actually played in if you want to keep playing your old stuff. Legacy could use some work though, but with Modern Masters they're legitimately trying. Not everything is going to be cheap, since they are after all a corporation and trying to make money.
Y'know... i would share Wizard's burden with the player base. The mentality of the players must also be taken into consideration.
How often you seen a new or younger player that comes with a list of his favorite cards that he just happens to have, and he thought real hard about it and tried to make the best deck he could, and he comes to a forum like this one looking for help from more experienced player on how he could become a better player with his favorite deck and he is received with "Stop being stupid and running bad cards you aren't worth of my time"?
That happens. More than it should...
You know that type of player that opens a booster and immediatly tosses the commons in the trash cause "why bother" ? Those exist and they affect the game, the meta and the community.
There isn't enough support for experimentation and yet time and time again big pro tournaments get news of that "surprise deck" nobody thought of before or a new strategy found nearly by accident that changed the game...
Like, it's ok to experiment and try crazy new stuff and use more than a handful of cards or not live and die by the "play one of these 3 decks or LOSE EVERYTIME FOREVER" rule. But that's something WoTC can't touch, that comes from the player base.
WoTC are trying to do their part, i agree with that. But as the game becomes more popular and more cards and more people are put into the mixing pot, the player base needs to mature as well.
in that case i would suggest you looking into Mizzium Skin and Syncopate as cheap options, easy to get, for cards that may be helpful. Right now, your deck takes a while to get going i would assume... and even though the creatures get effective as time goes on, they are easy to remove. So having a decent counter at hand or a way to get Hexproof (beyond just Pemmin's Aura and faster than the Boots) would perhaps make your creatures resist longer on the field.
It has gain a surge of popularity in recent years. Which is good all around... and i mean internationally, not just the USA...
The PROBLEM is that going forward there must be a strategy to keep the game accessible. If people only play 30 cards out of 300 or 300 out of 15.000 , while decks for even local tournament can easily run up $50/100 bucks for a year before stuff cycling over... soon the game will become more stagnant and a bit elitist.
Things like "Modern Masters" are efforts to bring in new players while not pissing off veterans and collectors. The same with Pauper and Commander. So, going forward, we are going to see more stuff like that, and if WoTC does their thing right, it will be even more popular.
can you tell a little about what is your strategy with the deck? What is your angle to playing it and such... also, are you running basic mana only or are you looking for Uncommon lands too?
I'd first suggest you pick a win con. Do you want to win with mill, poison, or damage? If the point of the deck is to win a different way every time, that is fine, but as of right now, you've got too many cards going too many directions. Secondly, if you're going to run mono-black, might I suggest Cabal Coffers and Urborg, Tombof Yawgmoth instead of, or in addition to the Urza lands? Expedition Map might be a card to consider if you're planning to run all of this.
Until you decide a direction, that is about all the help I can give you.
Cabal Coffers makes this a Legacy deck, as i'm trying to keep this stricly Modern. That's why it wasn't in before...
For Urborg... i don't really see the point? I mean, it's a decent replacement for Chromatic Lantern since it's a land and doesn't cost mana to put on the table, but it is also a $15 card against a $2 card, since all creatures are pretty cheap there is really no need to pump up mana to justify that cost... if the deck was running on heavier creatures perhaps... but the costlier one is BBB and it's Mid-End game stuff.
As for Expedition Mapa, again... good. But what's the real upside for a deck like this? I Need 2 mana and 2 turns to use it (or 3 manas to use it right away) and in a Deck with a low mana ramp, this would only be useful if by turn 3-4 i had only black cards in my hand and only Urza lands on the table, Which is a highly unlikely probability to justify dropping another card to put this on in it's place...
As for the direction, yeah... it is a 3 Way to Victory type of deck. You can win by Milling, Poison Counters or just the classical way with creatures (so, really... it's 2 options since any deck, in theory, can win with creatures) Poison and Milling in Monoblack. Plan A and Plan B, so you're never stuck.
The idea is pretty simple "Kitchen Table" magic, drain the opponents deck dry, while holding him off with decent cannon fodder, plowing Poison counters all over him and continuously bleeding him out with effects and creatures.
1 Urza set is 7 Mana on 3 Lands, works nicely with Sands of Delirium and as the game progresses makes sure that you always have some mana for something or for poking the opponent from multiple places at once. And at mid game, makes sure you can make the opponent discard anywhere from 3 to 20 cards each turn.
So you have 21 lands for a total of 30 Possible mana ( 9 Black 21 colorless) but at any point of the game with this deck the most you'll need is 3 Black Mana avaliable, and for added precaution, you have Chromatic Lanter. But you can get to work early even with just colorless mana due to the Artifacts untill you can get your ball rolling.
Vault of Whisper doubles as a black mana source and a decent anchor to use for Phylactery Lich with, Pulse Tracker and Disciple of the vault are there to make sure that you can always put at least some pressure on the opponent together with Stab Wound. While Typhoid Rats are decent Cannon fodder to take out anything bigger the opponent might have.
meanwhile Gruul Draz Vampire is just right there waiting for the opponent to ignore your winnie creatures to become a problem. With the Lich being able to jump in at anytime and have presence.
Of course, all of this is for your other spells to have room to work. Caress of Phyrexia and Decimator Web can even be used together with 3 Urza Lands Plus 2 Black, that's 5 Lands for 9 Mana going for 4 Poison Counters, 5 Life Loss, 6 Discard and 3 Draw in a single blow by turn 5-6. ANd memory sluice and Destroy the Evidence are always there to make sure you can erode the opponentes mana base and take some more cards from the reach of his draw.
So anyways, that's the concept i'm starting from. Any suggestions are greatly appreciated. And if anybody wants to try this deck out, please post your results with it!
EDIT:
I'm adding 5 "First Hand" Simulations, done with Deckstats.net i think it adds a better level of information on a deck
HAND 1
Sands of Delirium
Vault of Whispers
Disciple of the Vault
Urza Mine
Chromatic Lantern
Vault Whispers
Swamp
HAND 2
Decimator Web
Memory Sluice
Destroy the Evidence
Memory Sluice
Swamp
Caress of Phyrexia
Chromatic Lantern
HAND 3
Memory Sluice
Disciple of the vault
Sands of Delirium
Urza's Mine
Caress of Phyrexia
Caress of Phyrexia
Urza's Tower
HAND 4
Phylactery Lich
Vault Whispers
Stab Wound
Sands of Delirium
Urza's Tower
Caress of Phyrexia
Typhoid Rats
HAND 5
Vault of Whispers
Thyphoid Rats
Urza's Mine
Destroy the Evidence
Urza's Tower
Vault of Whispers
Caress of Phyrexia
Depending on your deck's composition you could do worse than augur of bolas if you need card draw.
Not really on need of card advantage, but it is always good... it's just a fun "with friends" deck that runs on a very slim mana curve, it is actually quite fast with Jace's PhantasmVampire NighthawkHarbor Bandit and Kraken Hatchling but i could use some more efficient 2 drops, and actually any of these Strix would do a fantastic job it seems...
With all that said, i'm not overly excited to shell out more cash for gatecrash.
I was considering another strategy though, one that would allow a better cost x benefit relationship, give me a nice little set of collectables and still give me a decent enough base for decks and light play (not really into the tournament scene...)
I was instead thinking of getting Multiple Intro Decks, maybe even one of each. Since they are smaller, beginners deck that are also fun and interesting to use and come with 2 boosters each... it seemed like a decent alternative.
However, i would like some insight from people who have been doing this for a bit longer...
Hell, i'm not even sure i'll get gatecrash, i might just get the Simic Intro Pack and draft a few boosters.... just for saving money for Dragon's maze and Modern Masters really.
My recent return to MTG was through M13, and a single booster box that i shared with a friend, plus the green intro deck. Fun, light, interesting stuff to play with...
Ravnica was different, exciting, complex, a LOT more stuff to play with and work around.
However, i still keep seeing people saying that buying core sets is a waste of time and money... so as we approach M14, i have to wonder.... is it really a waste? And why? Is it just because it's an intro product?
Now the strategies are WAY more varied and unique, and there is just a lot of ways to play and have fun, but i wanted to see what this deck would look like in today's Modern.
So, Fireball, Lighting Bolt and Arc Lighting are my go-to cards at first.
i'm not really looking for something overly fancy, just effective and that preserves the idea of Elven Fireball, but with Modern cards.
So, suggestions would be greatly appreciated!
Y'know... i would share Wizard's burden with the player base. The mentality of the players must also be taken into consideration.
How often you seen a new or younger player that comes with a list of his favorite cards that he just happens to have, and he thought real hard about it and tried to make the best deck he could, and he comes to a forum like this one looking for help from more experienced player on how he could become a better player with his favorite deck and he is received with "Stop being stupid and running bad cards you aren't worth of my time"?
That happens. More than it should...
You know that type of player that opens a booster and immediatly tosses the commons in the trash cause "why bother" ? Those exist and they affect the game, the meta and the community.
There isn't enough support for experimentation and yet time and time again big pro tournaments get news of that "surprise deck" nobody thought of before or a new strategy found nearly by accident that changed the game...
Like, it's ok to experiment and try crazy new stuff and use more than a handful of cards or not live and die by the "play one of these 3 decks or LOSE EVERYTIME FOREVER" rule. But that's something WoTC can't touch, that comes from the player base.
WoTC are trying to do their part, i agree with that. But as the game becomes more popular and more cards and more people are put into the mixing pot, the player base needs to mature as well.
It has gain a surge of popularity in recent years. Which is good all around... and i mean internationally, not just the USA...
The PROBLEM is that going forward there must be a strategy to keep the game accessible. If people only play 30 cards out of 300 or 300 out of 15.000 , while decks for even local tournament can easily run up $50/100 bucks for a year before stuff cycling over... soon the game will become more stagnant and a bit elitist.
Things like "Modern Masters" are efforts to bring in new players while not pissing off veterans and collectors. The same with Pauper and Commander. So, going forward, we are going to see more stuff like that, and if WoTC does their thing right, it will be even more popular.
Cabal Coffers makes this a Legacy deck, as i'm trying to keep this stricly Modern. That's why it wasn't in before...
For Urborg... i don't really see the point? I mean, it's a decent replacement for Chromatic Lantern since it's a land and doesn't cost mana to put on the table, but it is also a $15 card against a $2 card, since all creatures are pretty cheap there is really no need to pump up mana to justify that cost... if the deck was running on heavier creatures perhaps... but the costlier one is BBB and it's Mid-End game stuff.
As for Expedition Mapa, again... good. But what's the real upside for a deck like this? I Need 2 mana and 2 turns to use it (or 3 manas to use it right away) and in a Deck with a low mana ramp, this would only be useful if by turn 3-4 i had only black cards in my hand and only Urza lands on the table, Which is a highly unlikely probability to justify dropping another card to put this on in it's place...
As for the direction, yeah... it is a 3 Way to Victory type of deck. You can win by Milling, Poison Counters or just the classical way with creatures (so, really... it's 2 options since any deck, in theory, can win with creatures) Poison and Milling in Monoblack. Plan A and Plan B, so you're never stuck.
Thanks for the opinions though!
4 Urza's Tower
4 Urza's Power Plant
4 Vault of Whispers
5 Swamp
4 Memory Sluice
2 Destroy the Evidence
2 Stab Wound
4 Decimator Web
4 Sands of Delirium
1 Chromatic Lantern
2 Guul Draz Vampire
2 Pulse Tracker
4 Disciple of the Vault
4 Typhoid Rats
The idea is pretty simple "Kitchen Table" magic, drain the opponents deck dry, while holding him off with decent cannon fodder, plowing Poison counters all over him and continuously bleeding him out with effects and creatures.
1 Urza set is 7 Mana on 3 Lands, works nicely with Sands of Delirium and as the game progresses makes sure that you always have some mana for something or for poking the opponent from multiple places at once. And at mid game, makes sure you can make the opponent discard anywhere from 3 to 20 cards each turn.
So you have 21 lands for a total of 30 Possible mana ( 9 Black 21 colorless) but at any point of the game with this deck the most you'll need is 3 Black Mana avaliable, and for added precaution, you have Chromatic Lanter. But you can get to work early even with just colorless mana due to the Artifacts untill you can get your ball rolling.
Vault of Whisper doubles as a black mana source and a decent anchor to use for Phylactery Lich with, Pulse Tracker and Disciple of the vault are there to make sure that you can always put at least some pressure on the opponent together with Stab Wound. While Typhoid Rats are decent Cannon fodder to take out anything bigger the opponent might have.
meanwhile Gruul Draz Vampire is just right there waiting for the opponent to ignore your winnie creatures to become a problem. With the Lich being able to jump in at anytime and have presence.
Of course, all of this is for your other spells to have room to work. Caress of Phyrexia and Decimator Web can even be used together with 3 Urza Lands Plus 2 Black, that's 5 Lands for 9 Mana going for 4 Poison Counters, 5 Life Loss, 6 Discard and 3 Draw in a single blow by turn 5-6. ANd memory sluice and Destroy the Evidence are always there to make sure you can erode the opponentes mana base and take some more cards from the reach of his draw.
So anyways, that's the concept i'm starting from. Any suggestions are greatly appreciated. And if anybody wants to try this deck out, please post your results with it!
EDIT:
I'm adding 5 "First Hand" Simulations, done with Deckstats.net i think it adds a better level of information on a deck
HAND 1
Sands of Delirium
Vault of Whispers
Disciple of the Vault
Urza Mine
Chromatic Lantern
Vault Whispers
Swamp
HAND 2
Decimator Web
Memory Sluice
Destroy the Evidence
Memory Sluice
Swamp
Caress of Phyrexia
Chromatic Lantern
HAND 3
Memory Sluice
Disciple of the vault
Sands of Delirium
Urza's Mine
Caress of Phyrexia
Caress of Phyrexia
Urza's Tower
HAND 4
Phylactery Lich
Vault Whispers
Stab Wound
Sands of Delirium
Urza's Tower
Caress of Phyrexia
Typhoid Rats
HAND 5
Vault of Whispers
Thyphoid Rats
Urza's Mine
Destroy the Evidence
Urza's Tower
Vault of Whispers
Caress of Phyrexia
Not really on need of card advantage, but it is always good... it's just a fun "with friends" deck that runs on a very slim mana curve, it is actually quite fast with Jace's Phantasm Vampire Nighthawk Harbor Bandit and Kraken Hatchling but i could use some more efficient 2 drops, and actually any of these Strix would do a fantastic job it seems...