MTG Salvation

so i actually got to do some changes today and will test tonight. it went a little like this and i plan on doing more when i can get the cards....

-tunnel vision +mystical tutor (a way better way to find what i need without the replenish gimmick)
-oath of lieges +tithe (can fetch it with forger and its one sided. will probably swap with land tax however when i get one)
-price of glory +blind obedience (people dont like land destruction, even if it doesnt ever hit them. they dont mind stall, plus i get to extort=))
-meishin, the mind cage +sunforger (i never cast it from my hand, and when i go epic i look for dovescape and humility before form. sunforger is just all around useful. pumping tokens to chump block then searching for an answer: tutors/removal/counters)

Other cards i plan to cut:
1. rule of law?- i feel like casting this makes me a target, and as ive already said about meishin, when i go epic i look for other answers.
2.star compass- i think the ramp is okay where its at in a somewhat casual multiplayer setting. plus this doesnt help with mana im missing.
3.otherworld atlas- im moving away from the group draw, and more on the one sided. the exception is temple bell as it doesnt involve some time to work/its cheaper. have to keep in one activated draw for mind over matter.
4.twincast?-dobes has a point. im not gonna wait to cast enduring ideal just so i can find this and double it. reverberate however is the same spell, and its searchable by sunforger, a new theme in my deck =) so sunforger acts as the second reverb/twincast.

Cards ill probably add:
1.enlightened tutor- uhm.. duh. i can finish off combos with this and use forger/research to find it. i can also use this to find the forger.
2.absorb-more searchable stopping power.
3.path to exile-searchable removal.
4.argivian find?-searchable recursion.
*land tax-to go in place of tithe most likely but definitely in.

after these changes i feel the deck will be more streamlined to what im seeking. i just need a sweet altered zedruu now =).

i saw this guy spoiled today and i have to make a deck with him, i love black and i dont wanna make a tribal rat deck. i however have been losing interest in non-edh formats, and coincidentally i wanted to make a sekkuar deck next. All of this seems to fit down that avenue so i will edit up my own iteration of this style deck in a few. I love the synergy between these though, seems like alot of fun!

so compared to my old listing i was considering some cuts and adds perhaps to make it less group hug, but remain with the same ideas and win-cons. I couldn't however change the general as Zedruu is extremely useful, even if you just donate tokens.

+path to exile
+absorb
+sunforger
+mystical tutor
+enlightened tutor
+blind obedience
+land tax
+tithe?
+argivian find?

-tunnel vision
-boros charm
-oath to lieges
-meishin, the mind cage
-otherworld atlas
-star compass
-price of glory

so i just need to pull out one or two more but i feel some of these cards are direct replacements in a more threatening form (oath into land tax). i dont play to many people that hate on enchantments so i dont have to worry about spot removal for all my good ones. they also tend to play decent decks with great generals so they will catch more aggro than my good deck with a decent general. I also tossed in sunforger to be able to tutor for situations including more tutors, counters, and spot removal or recurrence. lemme know what ya think about the swaps?

its not quite the same but i wish they would change zedruus art and gender.

but as for a color change kaalias one of my favorites even though i never completed her deck, but i have too many decks with partial red so id like her in esper (my favorite) or grixis would be a close runner up. Im sure this however would greatly affect her as youll lose availability to either angels or dragons.

@joey thanks alot =) some of the lines that appear white actually are from a glare from the camera as i used sharpie which seems reflective, but the small cracks are just missed spots. I need to find the perfect too to reach it, which i might just try using my paints considering i just bought some.

@serrot I've seen a lot of your works, so that's really a compliment =) i also see what you mean about the art in the box. Next i will do mana symbols from lands as i think they add great color and not much distraction. I wanna do an esper-tricolor-background with diagonally split mana boxes (i hope that made sense lol) and thanks i found the avatar on some random avatar website, it was just so hypnotizing.

So i finally get to put up my first additions to the thread!
These are my first so take it easy
The first is an act of treason i did. 3-d style with a raised border and text boxes. This was my very first and i think i only used about 3 or 4 acts in the entire thing.
The next is my second 3-d, and first abacus. Its a mash-up of mind rot and brainstorm, with a spectral flight as the background for the abacus.
(their in a spoiler because their big!)
Of course i think they look cooler in real life but let me know what you guys think. My next attempt will be some altering with paints so i hope thats as straight-forward.

its already been mentioned more than once but i too would love a male zedruu. i like the card just not the art

on a silly note i found this:
the theme fits the colors but im sure another american could be used that would seem more "greathearted". its especially funny as the deck is filled with control of the masses and political moves. maybe even some sort of justice figure would do:rolleyes:

Quote from darkeshrine

Armageddon? Nice... well... U I'll bounce half of my lands?

It also seems like it could be a pretty good political tool.

This seems like the most feasible thing to me, and maybe even a reason TO use it. At first i thought of the combos you could pull with an animar or jenara etb abuse deck, which also wouldnt be bad, but a land may be a hefty cost to cast more than a few times. In that case there are more useful cards(cloudstone curio or crystal shard, and that also goes for opposition bounce (draw from roil or overload from rift).

But being able to return half of your stuff from a wipe may set them back way more than anticipated. Id have a hard time finding a spot for it in any of my blue decks but its definently a multi-use card id think, which would make it at least mediocre in the format? just my .02 but im a returning player so it may not even be worth that.

id definitely check dechs_kaison's thread. it sounds right up your alley. i even made one very similar to his after reading about it when i had planned on making a bug goodstuff. its fun, strong, and uniqe.

Quote from Dechs Kaison

Try the Boros Charm before you cut it. Maybe your meta sees more Austere Command effects than mine. Like I said, it's an absolute blowout when you get to use it, and Wild Research does let you search for it. Just try it and let me know how your experience goes.



Yes, Hive Mind into Pact does seem like a dick move, which is why I don't run it. Here's another one that you might find fun though: Final Fortune. From Gatherer:

"If multiple "extra turn" effects resolve in the same turn, take them in the reverse of the order that the effects resolved."

Everyone gets one turn to kill you.

I finally got to test it out last week... and all i can say is wow. this deck is so much fun, consistent and powerful. both were against my grim-grin tribal which isnt competitive but i wouldnt say its completely casual either. it blew it out of the water one game without even going epic, paradox haze+ humility+ assemble the legion. not even getting up to 10+ zombies a turn with endless ranks could keep up. and those were 1v1s, i couldnt imagine how fun this will be with multiple players.

with that being said i never even got boros charm, and i do like how its tutorable,but so is a counter. quite honestly i feel i might scrap it but time will tell when i actually draw it. asfor tunnel vision im kicking that out for mystical tutor most likely. its frustrating not getting enduring ideal and not being able to use wild research to find it or an enchantment or spell that can get it.

that final fortune trick is neat, i may make a side-deck for swapping or an mtgo version that uses all the dick combos and see how that goes lol. if i did that id take out all group hug and replace with numot, which ive still been thinking of. i hate to say it but i just dont like the chick Minotaur. ive also considered getting one altered maybe or doing a simple picture swap with numots in place =). maybe using numot for looks+ defense and less 'friendly' spells would eliminate the need for zedruu. with enough ramp artifacts i might be able to run something cool like progenitus just for the odd chance to cast him some game.

in the end i like how this deck runs but i feel myself more inclined to lean towards solo-development cards. i always cringe letting my opponent draw a card thinking it can be my doom.

so far i was thinking of a few changes but i wouldnt know what to cut yet as everything seems useful

- tunnel vision

+mystical tutor-another chance to go epic, and u can tutor for this with wild research
+enlightened tutor- same as above but for any enchantment i may need at a given time
?+gisela, blade of goldnight- i feel like this is a great stax card especially if its out after going epic. doubles your dmg and halves incoming.
?+ensnaring bridge-i feel like having another pillowfort will be beneficial but honestly i had one or two both games and it was enough
?+land equilibrium/land tax-better than everyone getting land right?
?+blind obedience-sets them back that much more plus a neat little plus with extort

Quote from Dechs Kaison

I like how your deck looks. You're lighter on enchantments than I run, so things like Sphere of Safety might not work as well, but you'll have less eggs in one basket.

I'm curious to know how well the Sun Titan works out for you. It's definitely a strong card and there are a lot of things it can work on. I'm just not sure you'll see a ton of value out of it.

I've tested with Boros Charm, and I do like it a lot, but I think Counterspell is just better in its place for the versatility. Boros Charm might be used to give Eldrazi Zedruu Double Strike, but most often it's used in response to an enchantment wipe. Yes, Boros Charm will let the wipe go through and hurt everyone else, but Counterspell could also be used to disrupt someone else's combo if you need it or protect your Enduring Ideal or the hundred other things that Counterspell does. What I'm saying is I found Boros Charm to be a blowout when it works, if a bit narrow. Then again, I don't even run the Counterspell.

You're going to run into problems with Ulamog and Tunnel Vision being used in the same deck.

All that said, I like the list and I'm sure you'll have fun with it. Let me know how it goes!

Sun titan is one of those thing i just have to try if i'm running white, especially with so many targets. I've had too many good experiences with him. I also see what you mean about the boros charm. On one hand it can leave with an advantage, and on the other a counter could at least still save me and then some... Id also rather ditch the tunnel vision as its just a one-trick pony where as ulamog is a beast on his own as well as graveyard recursion.

So with - a boros charm and tunnel vision, im not really sure what id add? I don't feel the need for any more counters really, especially with bosieju. Maybe an wall of omens? I feel it would be another creature or two or at least more pillow-fort for protection. any suggestion would be cool;)

I also read about a neat trick when using the hivemind shenanigans. aside from making them go epic too, you can use it to make them copy your pact spells (mainly pact of negation). If they cant pay the colored mana cost or maybe just don't have enough sources they will auto-lose. A funny idea if your already running hivemind i guess but i feel like it falls in the unfair category.

i ended up not using sneak attack both for the cost($) and lack of creatures. but funny enough i also have assemble the legion in my list as i pulled an extra one and it seemed useful for token creation aside for mesa.
this is what i have come up with so far -testing:



i put in some counters so stop game enders before i can go off or to help some key spells pass. also added some board wipes as it seemed the fairest way to remove a bunch of stuff. i didnt take out all of the benefit-all cards, but i dont see myself donating a ton of my stuff aside from tokens maybe? i am also using the knollspine invocation so my extra spells dont become dead. i might toss in howling mine/ font of mythos, 2-3 upkeeps per turn coupled with extra draw and the ability to fling it all... sounds fun. id really like to add another tutor or two, i want to make sure i can copy my enduring ideal at least once to really maximize its epic value. i really cant wait to try this deck out, i might even have to test it against one of my own just to see how it goes.

got my deck assembled today finally. i cant wait to get together with some unknowing prey (friends). i have a good feeling they'll hate it after game one.

another card that i didnt see on the maybe's (and im not sure if it was already mentioned) is sneak attack. i put knollspine invocation in mine as i also used a few more wipes and a couple counters for some just in cases. but it seems useful to get dead creatures out of your hand without technically playing a spell right?

Quote from Dechs Kaison

Phyrexian Unlife will have a great interaction with Delaying Shield. That's been mentioned earlier in the thread, and I intend to put it in the card choices in my next update.

The choker is neat, but it's not winning games or saving my life. That's really what's been the deciding factor for deck slots. Does that make sense?

yea i must have missed the unlife combo. and after my first revision of my mayble-list i took out the chocker too.

i cant for the life of me find my decklist i had written down either:flame:
but my last two orders will be here by monday so i should have it completed and tested.

its very similar to the original list you have shown but i made a few swaps for some of the group huggish stuff. its just not in my nature but my playgroups not competitive so i can probably get away for a few more turns not casting zedruu.

how consistent does it run? do u find enough draw/tutor to make it fast or merely just overwhelm? seems a bit all over for me but really cool. its like a nice used car inside card sleeves lol.