Vintage Sligh

  • #1
    Is there a Vintage Sligh thread around? I seem to find a bunch of Burn threads...and their is a decent RGb beats competitive thread with a similar build to my Vintage Sligh deck. If I am posting in the wrong place, or someone knows of a better thread, please point me in the right direction.

    Anyway, here is my build of Vintage Sligh; comments and suggestions appreciated.

    Vintage SlighMagic OnlineOCTGN2ApprenticeBuy These Cards
    Lands
    6 Mountain
    4 Bloodstained Mire
    4 Wasteland
    4 Wooded Foothills
    1 Strip Mine

    Creatures
    4 Grim Lavamancer
    4 Simian Spirit Guide
    4 Jackal Pup
    3 Magus of the Moon
    2 Goblin Cadets
    2 Gorilla Shaman

    Spells
    4 Lightning Bolt
    4 Null Rod
    4 Price of Progress
    3 Chalice of the Void
    2 Shattering Spree
    2 Red Elemental Blast
    2 Pyroblast
    1 Mox Ruby



    The spot I keep toying over in my head is Goblin Cadets...I like Hellspark Elemental too.
    Last edited by Yug: 7/2/2009 4:33:10 AM
  • #2
    At what number do you set chalice to? While 0 is an option, isn't 11 cards that kill moxen a bit much?

    "Sometimes, the situation is outracing a threat, sometimes it's ignoring it, and sometimes it involves sideboarding in 4x Hope//Pray." --Doug Linn

  • #3
    Chalice is a metagame choice. I just recently added the Shattering Spree to stop Chalice at 1 against me. Now that I have Spree main I could drop Chalice out completely I guess. Probably adding 3 Hellspark!?!?
  • #4
    make sure you focus more on the hate then they speed. That's my advise....

    oh, gathan raiders is really good
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  • #5
    LastManStanding made an excellent point: turn 1 cadets may seem exciting, but just won't cut it in Vintage. You have to focus on being able to keep the four main decks (Drain, Ritual, Bazaar and Workshop) in check long enough to allow your cheap, efficient creatures to win the game. You'll need artifact-, grave- and combo-hate to do that. You can handle the artifacts (though that artifact destroy spell with flashback could be interesting), but the other three decks will destroy you. 4 Tormod's Crypt isn't enough to beat Ichorid, you should add some Pithing Needles or something as well. You'll need more disruption to beat Ritual decks and something to beat Drain.
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  • #6
    I think the reason there are no Vintage Sligh threads is that it just isn't viable in Vintage nowadays. To help out properly I think we need to know:

    1) Are you trying to build a competitive deck or is this more for theme/fun?
    2) Will you be playing in tournaments or against friends? What's your meta like?
    3) Are you committed to this deck? Would you be willing to try more competitive mono-red decks?
  • #7
    How do you stop a CoV set at 1 with Shattering Spree a card with converted mana cost of 1?

    There's a Goblin that's hybrid but I can't put my finger on it........Half red/Green and he must attack each turn if able 2/1.......he's a must over the Cadets.

    Those Simian's seem like a waste of 4 slots, and this is sleigh so you might not ever need the mana {Your hand drops fast regradless}........or there over costed body frame.

    I can understand the Null Rod's, but find a way to get Black Lotus in the deck.

    Price of Progress
    Pyroblast
    Shattering Spree
    Chalice of the Void {this one is pointless to main considering your deck}
    are all sideboard cards at best, but I do like the 2x Red Elemental Blast and I did run 2 of those towards the end of my sleigh days.

    With that in mind you open alot of room up for cards that would give you a competitive chance in vintage bud.

    S.M.




    Quote from Yug
    Chalice is a metagame choice. I just recently added the Shattering Spree to stop Chalice at 1 against me. Now that I have Spree main I could drop Chalice out completely I guess. Probably adding 3 Hellspark!?!?
    Trade Thread EDH Thread
    Legacy:
    Taxes then Death :symw::chaos:

    Modern:
    Milk :symu::symw:
  • #8
    depending on how powered your meta is, you should probably be packing more gorilla shamans aka mox monkeys maindeck. they are really good against affinity, too. also, why aren't there any fireblasts maindeck? that card used to be the backbone of sligh..it's what gives you the t4 win. that would probably be my choice over the prices of progresses (unless you see a lot of 43 land variants...or whatever the equivalent is in vintage). also, quite a few versions run mishra's workshops to get thru counters. mutavaults are something to consider, too. I'm not sure how effective magi of the moons are in vintage. try maindecking pyrostatic pillar if you have a lot of drain combo...they'll have to deal with it to go off, and you're packing an awful lot of speed to otherwise smack them with.

    --welt


    Credit to DolZero for this awesome sig!
  • #9
    Very good points.
    I think the Moon's are a good choice these days with all the Non-basic being played {I know I hate it when my buddy sports them}.
    The Shaman idea is perfect. Why not run 4 mox monkeys and own control over the board.......nice
    The main reason I'm replying is for this key point:,
    I'm glad someone else remembers Fireblast and how powerful that sneeky card is for delivering that final blow......when they least expect it! I don't know what a good number would be for today's meta, but I used to run 4.........and probably still would today I guess.

    Quote from weltkrieg
    depending on how powered your meta is, you should probably be packing more gorilla shamans aka mox monkeys maindeck. they are really good against affinity, too. also, why aren't there any fireblasts maindeck? that card used to be the backbone of sligh..it's what gives you the t4 win. that would probably be my choice over the prices of progresses (unless you see a lot of 43 land variants...or whatever the equivalent is in vintage). also, quite a few versions run mishra's workshops to get thru counters. mutavaults are something to consider, too. I'm not sure how effective magi of the moons are in vintage. try maindecking pyrostatic pillar if you have a lot of drain combo...they'll have to deal with it to go off, and you're packing an awful lot of speed to otherwise smack them with.

    --welt
    Trade Thread EDH Thread
    Legacy:
    Taxes then Death :symw::chaos:

    Modern:
    Milk :symu::symw:
  • #10
    Quote from S.M.
    How do you stop a CoV set at 1 with Shattering Spree a card with converted mana cost of 1?


    You pay the replicate cost once, and target the Chalice with the copy as well. The Chalice will only counter the Shattering Spree that was played, not the copy created by Replicate.
    I am no longer on MTGS staff, so please don't contact me asking me to do staff things. :|
  • #11
    There would be far better options looking at it from that point of view {Smash to smitherens} SP since he stated the shatterings are in the deck to HANDLE CoV's that're set @ 1 {kinda didn't make sense then or now seeing 2 is what he still needs to spend in that situation regradless to break CoV}.
    I might be the only one who see's this, but

    Thanks for anwsering that question for me Binary.



    Quote from Binary
    You pay the replicate cost once, and target the Chalice with the copy as well. The Chalice will only counter the Shattering Spree that was played, not the copy created by Replicate.
    Last edited by S.M.: 7/9/2009 10:39:18 AM
    Trade Thread EDH Thread
    Legacy:
    Taxes then Death :symw::chaos:

    Modern:
    Milk :symu::symw:
  • #12
    Quote from Yug
    Is there a Vintage Sligh thread around? I seem to find a bunch of Burn threads...and their is a decent RGb beats competitive thread with a similar build to my Vintage Sligh deck. If I am posting in the wrong place, or someone knows of a better thread, please point me in the right direction.

    Anyway, here is my build of Vintage Sligh; comments and suggestions appreciated.

    Vintage SlighMagic OnlineOCTGN2ApprenticeBuy These Cards
    Lands
    6 Mountain
    4 Bloodstained Mire
    4 Wasteland
    4 Wooded Foothills
    1 Strip Mine

    Creatures
    4 Grim Lavamancer
    4 Simian Spirit Guide
    4 Jackal Pup
    3 Magus of the Moon
    2 Goblin Cadets
    2 Gorilla Shaman

    Spells
    4 Lightning Bolt
    4 Null Rod
    4 Price of Progress
    3 Chalice of the Void
    2 Shattering Spree
    2 Red Elemental Blast
    2 Pyroblast
    1 Mox Ruby



    The spot I keep toying over in my head is Goblin Cadets...I like Hellspark Elemental too.


    This is part of a list taken from a recent top eight list, which made third place.

    About the chalices: They may seem out of place here, but really, their only purpose is to be set at zero. If u dont have null rod, u can play this which will shut down a fatal yawg will or burst of eccel. Even if it isnt played on turn 1 it can be a decent eccel stopper for future moxen and lotus. Not to mention that if it is played on the first turn, will only leave key, time vault, mana vault, and top as the only sac outlets for tinker, which will slw down the drain playerès victory, shattering spree just doesnt cut it.

    About the jackals and cadets: I too was skeptical at first, but testing showed their usefullness. Combined with the mana disruption of null rod and chalice, this deck showed to be able to race a drain player with a combination of burn via price of prog and bolt and the weenies with only two land out. Raiders is a too slow for this deck. Magus isnt that great either as he canèt effectively race the opponent or deny them mana accumulation. While he can mana skrew them, he is only really that good vs shop or ichorid, and is even then, a little slow for ichoird, as most decks run alot more basics now.
    Last edited by Sad Clown Bad Dub: 7/9/2009 3:24:51 PM
  • #13
    This is part of a list taken from a recent top eight list, which made third place.

    About the chalices: They may seem out of place here, but really, their only purpose is to be set at zero. If u dont have null rod, u can play this which will shut down a fatal yawg will or burst of eccel. Even if it isnt played on turn 1 it can be a decent eccel stopper for future moxen and lotus. Not to mention that if it is played on the first turn, will only leave key, time vault, mana vault, and top as the only sac outlets for tinker, which will slw down the drain playerès victory, shattering spree just doesnt cut it.

    About the jackals and cadets: I too was skeptical at first, but testing showed their usefullness. Combined with the mana disruption of null rod and chalice, this deck showed to be able to race a drain player with a combination of burn via price of prog and bolt and the weenies with only two land out. Raiders is a too slow for this deck. Magus isnt that great either as he canèt effectively race the opponent or deny them mana accumulation. While he can mana skrew them, he is only really that good vs shop or ichorid, and is even then, a little slow for ichoird, as most decks run alot more basics now.


    Yep. I did net deck this list awhile back and have made a few changes to it while testing. I liked the Magus in my meta, but your right he is just too damn slow to even be a bother. The Chalices at zero are a must too. Once I removed them I started losing more often. This deck nearly relies on getting Null Rod or Chalice in play on turn one. The Simian Spirit Guides are the "power" in this deck and shouldn't be removed. CoV at one is tough against this deck and I have considered both StS and Spree. But Spree is usually more versatile. However I use StS maindeck in my Legacy Burn...so I am torn. Maybe I should just keep it with the StS in the board and not worry too much about first game CoV's at one. I would run Fireblast in the deck if I ran a burn deck. This isn't burn, this is sligh, and having only 6 mountains MD makes Fireblast nearly useless. Pup > Cadets > Tattermunge too, read the drawbacks one more time and you'll see why. the Main finisher for this deck is PoP and thats it. Relies on little crits/Grim/Bolt to get through enough times to hit a lethal PoP. Board Control of artifacts is needed throughout even to race. the deck comes out of nowhere and surprises the crap outta people.

    Here is the orginal deck and i have seen it top 8 myself in several powered metas (this is the deck I want to try to make better...not sure how to do that though):

    Mono Red BeatsMagic OnlineOCTGN2ApprenticeBuy These Cards
    Creatures (21)
    3 Goblin Cadets
    2 Gorilla Shaman
    4 Grim Lavamancer
    4 Jackal Pup
    4 Mogg Fanatic
    4 Simian Spirit Guide

    Instants (12)
    4 Lightning Bolt
    4 Price of Progress
    2 Pyroblast
    2 Red Elemental Blast

    Artifacts (8)
    3 Chalice of the Void
    1 Mox Ruby
    4 Null Rod

    Lands (19)
    4 Bloodstained Mire
    6 Mountain
    1 Strip Mine
    4 Wasteland
    4 Wooded Foothills

  • #14
    Quote from S.M.
    There would be far better options looking at it from that point of view {Smash to smitherens} SP since he stated the shatterings are in the deck to HANDLE CoV's that're set @ 1 {kinda didn't make sense then or now seeing 2 is what he still needs to spend in that situation regradless to break CoV}.


    Odds are if they're playing Chalice they're playing other artifacts as well, and Shattering Spree can hit multiple targets.
    I am no longer on MTGS staff, so please don't contact me asking me to do staff things. :|
  • #15
    I couldnt get my hands around the Ruby...so this is what I am rolling with so far, and it is nasty. I am thinking about changing the name to HaterRed. I am still debating between Fanatic/Hellspark/Magus of the Moon. They all work, but all seem underpowered against various decks.

    Vintage SlighMagic OnlineOCTGN2ApprenticeBuy These Cards
    Lands
    6 Mountain
    4 Bloodstained Mire
    4 Wasteland
    4 Wooded Foothills
    1 Strip Mine

    Creatures
    4 Grim Lavamancer
    4 Simian Spirit Guide
    4 Jackal Pup
    3 Goblin Cadets
    2 Mogg Fanatic
    2 Gorilla Shaman

    Spells
    4 Lightning Bolt
    4 Null Rod
    4 Price of Progress
    3 Chalice of the Void
    3 Shattering Spree
    2 Red Elemental Blast
    2 Pyroblast

  • #16
    fanatic blows up welders, confidants, and attacks. hellsparks come back once (meh), and magus of the moon slows you down, rather than your opponents. if you're that worried about nonbasics, then pack a couple of crucible of worlds and recur your wastelands. that's probably a better way to deal with it.

    --welt


    Credit to DolZero for this awesome sig!
  • #17
    I prefer smash to smithereens, as it can kill at instant speed if your opponent atempts to vault key all in one turn, while the three points of damage is amazing with the rest of your burn. U normally will end up with and average of 3 land a game with this deck, and the third land could be a waste, do u really think spree would be that great in here?
  • #18
    I prefer smash to smithereens, as it can kill at instant speed if your opponent atempts to vault key all in one turn, while the three points of damage is amazing with the rest of your burn. U normally will end up with and average of 3 land a game with this deck, and the third land could be a waste, do u really think spree would be that great in here?


    I tend to agree with ya. I run 2x StS main in my Legacy Burn deck and it does well enough. i already had it in the board, but I could probably switch the numbers around. I will be testing both main to see how often I hit multiple targets with the Spree vs. the 3 dmg from Smash. Both work, just a meta preference in my opinion. If u seen tons of brown, play the spree.
  • #19
    Goblin Cadets seem worse then Tattermunge Maniac to me. Once they have a Bob or something out, the Maniac can still attack.
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  • #20
    Quote from burek
    Goblin Cadets seem worse then Tattermunge Maniac to me. Once they have a Bob or something out, the Maniac can still attack.


    Play both out first. In most situations the Cadets is better. I would kill the Bob first and then attack. But lets say they play a larger crit than Bob, while Maniac HAS to attack into them and die, I can hold back Cadets, wait until the opponent attacks me, and then attack into them for 2 the next turn. Much more versatile.
  • #21
    Quote from Yug
    Is there a Vintage Sligh thread around? I seem to find a bunch of Burn threads...and their is a decent RGb beats competitive thread with a similar build to my Vintage Sligh deck. If I am posting in the wrong place, or someone knows of a better thread, please point me in the right direction.

    Anyway, here is my build of Vintage Sligh; comments and suggestions appreciated.

    Vintage SlighMagic OnlineOCTGN2ApprenticeBuy These Cards
    Lands
    6 Mountain
    4 Bloodstained Mire
    4 Wasteland
    4 Wooded Foothills
    1 Strip Mine

    Creatures
    4 Grim Lavamancer
    4 Simian Spirit Guide
    4 Jackal Pup
    3 Magus of the Moon
    2 Goblin Cadets
    2 Gorilla Shaman

    Spells
    4 Lightning Bolt
    4 Null Rod
    4 Price of Progress
    3 Chalice of the Void
    2 Shattering Spree
    2 Red Elemental Blast
    2 Pyroblast
    1 Mox Ruby



    The spot I keep toying over in my head is Goblin Cadets...I like Hellspark Elemental too.


    I used this deck as a base for my vintage burn deck, I made a few addition and such.

    Creatures 13

    4x Grim Lavamancer
    2x Gorilla Shaman
    4x Ball Lightning
    4x Mogg Fanatic

    Spells 28

    4x Lightning Bolt
    4x Incinerate
    4x Fireblast
    4x Magma Jet
    2x Shattering Spree
    3x Chalice of the Void
    4x Pithing Needle
    2x Crucible of the Worlds
    1x Fork

    Lands 19

    4x Wasteland
    1x Stripmine
    14x Mountain

    I used Pithing Needle instead of Null Rod because I found Pithing Needle was able to do more than just artifact hate, at 1 less mana too!

    I put in 2 Crucible of the Worlds to keep reusing those wastelands and stripmines, helps me not need to sideboard price of progress, so 4 extra card spots

    Added a BUNCH more burn so Everlasting Torment was needed to add wither to my burn spells.

    I would like to see how this deck would work with a splash of blue maybe for more card drawing Ancestral Recal and possibly the intuition and AK combo.

    Lastly, what do you all think about Right of Flame, with 4 of these and Intuition you could make some major mana excell.
  • #22
    Im not big fan of disruption in Type 1 sligh i like to race

    this is my list:

    4 Bloodstained Mire
    4 Wooded Foothills
    2 Badlands
    10 Mountains

    4 Grim Lavamancer
    4 Mogg fanatic
    4 Dark Confidant

    4 Lightning Bolt
    4 Chain Lightening
    4 Lava spike
    4 Rift bolt
    4 Price of Progress
    4 Flame rift
    4 Fire Blast
    "My power is as vast as the plains,
    my strength is that of mountains,
    Each wave that crashes upon the
    shore thunders like the blood in my
    veins." --Memoirs
  • #23
    The problem is that Sligh is a little slow to win the race consistantly, without disruption. When you have Dredge decks that can kill as early as turn 2 on a regular basis how is 4 mogg fanatics going to be enough for protection? In addition you are running no acceleration, so your typical best turn 1 play will be either mountain - bolt or mountain - fanatic.

    You list looks more like a legacy deck than a vintage deck.
  • #24
    sligh can work, at least in my opinion, but it would be served well with something like a mox ruby and maybe a black lotus, of course, I'm crazy enough to add in things like the one wheel of fortune I'm allowed as well. playing out my few burn spells and then going to see if I can find the game ending fireblast is often how that works out. dangerous if you're not ready to win,t hough. I'd also go with a better sligh curve. I generally play the most dangerous cards I can in their slots, which would include goblin guide, jackal pup, lightning bolt, etc. just make sure you can use all your mana every turn.


    Credit to DolZero for this awesome sig!
  • #25
    This is a super necro here but I am trying to make an almost competitive type one burn deck. I have a strong legacy build and I want to make it more vintage. What would you consider for a decklist for vintage now compared to over a year ago?
    Quote from Zsehaelax
    This thread is for competitive decks only. Your deck is not Grixis Control, as you said yourself. A serious decklist with shroud and counterspells belongs here, not a for fun/casual decklist with bad discard. Sorry, but your princess is in another castle.


    my alters http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pid=3671687&id=520387877#!/album.php?aid=162472&id=520387877&page=2
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