I think even at 3 life it would be worth discussing. Two life does not go nearly as far against today's quality of aggro, nor does it make up for sacrificing your instant speed.
not sure what you are argueing against, since there isnt much disagreement on the cards anyway. I just give it slightly more props than your thrash rating. Besides there is a difference in playing plain suntail hawk or getting one for free. With the amount of removal the average cube runs its pretty nice to get something left on the board, especially if it has evasion.
Hinterland Drake is pretty solid and borderline already and with pump definitely above curve.
That said, back in the days it was much harder to play gold cards because there was way less fixing. Now with 3 sets of common duals, the bouncelands and various tools in green its pretty easy to splash into a third color if you provide them. Also having some "pack filler" doesnt matter at all, since you will still end up with more playables than deckslots.
We also got enough gold cards by now to easily run 3 per guild and i run 4 since an eternity and the only guild really lacking the 4th playable is golgari.
I agree with your assessment of Blade Juggler, but not with your proposed changes. I think it would be at least borderline playable with an up-front cost of 2BB instead of 4B. It looks like (for commons at least) the casting cost of spectacle cards is far above what it should be, while the spectacle cost becomes what should have been the normal cost for the effect. It's a bit out of whack with what I would expect from a cost-reduction mechanic (make the upfront cost slightly higher and the reduction slightly cheaper). It's the equivalent of a supermarket marking up its grocery prices and then discounting them in a "sale" (when the discount is really the same retail price as everywhere else )
Titanic Brawl doesn't offer much compared to Pit Fight, and even being twice as castable isn't playable these days. Throw this on the pile of +1/+1 matters cards that are not quite good enough to support the theme.
Grasping Thrull is the first real contender we have. Blind Hunter is definitely better, but I like that this further pushes Orzhov into the bleed territory while providing a playable threat. It feels bad that this is multicolor when Bloodhunter Bat is black though.
Grasping Thrull is the first real contender we have. Blind Hunter is definitely better, but I like that this further pushes Orzhov into the bleed territory while providing a playable threat. It feels bad that this is multicolor when Bloodhunter Bat is black though.
3 life bleeded would've been enough maybe.
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My 490 Pauper Cube
Modern frame only- Common on paper only - no functional copies, no strictly-betters - no subtype-matters
I actually like the juggler, it boils down to how reliable you can damage your opponent, but its spectacle cost makes it a better Phyrexian Rager
I agree that a plain old 2BB would be better (than a 3/3). Its still not too shabby. I always like cards that replace themselves. Its a great Rakdos Aggro card if you support that.
Burning Vandal is definitely better than Azra most of the time and if you can find the slot pretty cubable. Being aggressive while also filtering to gas is pretty good. Definitely mvp in rav drafts.
Brawl, meh
Blindhunter much better than Thrull and Orzhov is already an immensivly powerful drain guild with the extort stuff.
Humongolus. Great artwork. Its hexproof, so op anyway, but 2 power is a little low. At 5 I want a finisher, not a wall. So I like Soul of the Rapids more
I agree, although that probably would have put it a tiny bit over power level for current standards. I might have taken it if the lifeloss trigger was an ETB and the lifegain trigger was a deathrattle (sort of dovetailing with OG Orzhov's haunt mechanic). Sad, because Seb McKinnon's art really knocks it out of the park.
I actually like the juggler, it boils down to how reliable you can damage your opponent, but its spectacle cost makes it a better Phyrexian Rager
I agree that a plain old 2BB would be better (than a 3/3). Its still not too shabby. I always like cards that replace themselves. Its a great Rakdos Aggro card if you support that.
Blindhunter much better than Thrull and Orzhov is already an immensivly powerful drain guild with the extort stuff.
I agree with Humphry here. I like the juggler. We'll see if theres room.
I also have these same cards, and mentioned it to a friend. We agreed it might be a little better than Tithe drinker, in that it becomes outclassed very quicky and then sometimes only becomes an extort enabler. And i dont think I'd play a WB enchantment with extort on it. But it's really a hard call, because it does do work in the right decks.
I dont like Tithe that much, because its a x/1. But I also run Child of Night, because i need some early lifegain against the fast aggrodecks and draining for few points makes it totally acceptable. You could argue that Thrull is on the same powerlevel, but its a 5 drop and you need only few of those.
Pilleroy has no extort, it doesnt even drain. Its still in my Top4 Orzhov cards and I like it better than the lifegain one.
Unlike an enchantment, Tithe Drinker still presents the threat of attacking/blocking. It also comes down way earlier than Grasping Thrull, so even if it's not particularly good at surviving, it can still get some licks in and trigger extort multiple times before the Thrull even shows up. He's a fifth card at best, while Tithe Drinker is solidly in the top four for me. Don't forget Gift of Orzhova is probably a top three card that's missing from the list above.
Also, I keep seeing Harsh Sustenance pop up in some lists, even though it looks super bad compared to the stacked removal in both black and white. Is it mostly win-more, throw-at-the-opponent's-face rather than actual removal? Because that card looks to me like a case of cubers maybe trying to go a little too deep on the bleed theme
Seeing as how there aren't enough hybrids to categorize in pauper, I'm curious to hear your solution on where you'd put Gift of Orzhova - if you even have a solution at all.
You may find it irrelevant to give your lifelink creature evasion. That's a major component in my evaluation since it helps win the race when your lifelink creature that puts you ahead gets to, you know, actually connect.
I agree with Gift being outclassed by Cartouche. I was pretty hyped when it got downshifted, but outside of the occasional drop on Guardian it was not that great and cartouche at least doing something makes up for the 2:1 potential.
Grotesque is pretty good still and Id never mind to run two specters. Its just that Orzhov doesnt neccessarily want that effect and has more identity with the above cards.
im totally fine with the hardcore balance approach, but as i said, you overrate the imbalances those cards create. I mean you even "cheated" yourself with the "rainbow" section you put those hybrids in.
Id say having a 10-15 card "rainbow" or flexsection is totally fine and saves some headaches. I definitely dont want to cut strong cards or add bad cards just to have a slightly cleaner guildbalance.
Im sometimes even fine to move monocolored "gold" cards like Ape into red, although thats a stretch i try to avoid. id be totally down to add hybrids into monosections, I only try to avoid that because it looks "bad" in the visualspoiler lol.
That said, im much more strict on my T1 and pretty lose on the T2. Dimir has like 6 cards there, while other guilds only have 1
If you want to take another extreme, you could count the amount of colored mana each has in the cube and balance around that
Gift imo fits a great spot for more casual/less drafted cubes. Another Armadillo Cloak is usually a desirable effect, and being B/w makes ppl think.
These are usually stories after the draft like: "I thought about it, but...". Then they lose to it.
Best BW? Nope. But it reminds me of what MtG was like when I stopped going to events.
My approach to hybrids is moving towards considering them something separated from pure gold cards, but putting them in guild sections in cubetutor and when storing my physical cube, for the sake of convenience.
I have a 480 cube, that is now modern-paper-common only, so it is different from most here. But I have 6 guild slots per guild, with 4 "pure gold" cards (including flashback costs among them) and 2 hybrid cards per guild.
As I have 2 sets of guild lands in the cube but those are in the colorless section, you could just put the lands in the guild section and the hybrids in the colorless section, but in my experience the way I do it makes storing the cards in the correct pile way easier for the people that helps you store everything when the game ends.
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Holiday Armadillo... Cloak
My 490 Pauper Cube
Modern frame only- Common on paper only - no functional copies, no strictly-betters - no subtype-matters
My Cube (DeckStats)
My Pauper Cube: 540 (CubeTutor link!)
Level 1 Judge
Draw 2
Gain 2 Life
Addendum- Gain 2 life
Imo, amazing. Because a 4cc instant that is 2 colors better do more than "be good as a sorcery". Hell, Surge was a better mechanic in blue than this
That terrible Kiss of _____ would be better at common-
4UW- Sorcery
Draw 2, Gain 7
Loose Change Pauper Cube-cast
Pauper Cube Article #1
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Hinterland Drake is pretty solid and borderline already and with pump definitely above curve.
That said, back in the days it was much harder to play gold cards because there was way less fixing. Now with 3 sets of common duals, the bouncelands and various tools in green its pretty easy to splash into a third color if you provide them. Also having some "pack filler" doesnt matter at all, since you will still end up with more playables than deckslots.
We also got enough gold cards by now to easily run 3 per guild and i run 4 since an eternity and the only guild really lacking the 4th playable is golgari.
T2 powpercube Value https://cubecobra.com/cube/list/37t
Not good. It should be at least 3/3 or let you draw 2 cards and lose 2 life.
I like this. If you need support for madness, this is good. If you don't, borderline.
Bad green removal is bad (and green).
Blind Hunter is way better, right?
My 490 Pauper Cube
Modern frame only- Common on paper only - no functional copies, no strictly-betters - no subtype-matters
Burning-Tree Vandal - I was considering Azra Bladeseeker, this is potentially a lot better.
Titanic Brawl doesn't offer much compared to Pit Fight, and even being twice as castable isn't playable these days. Throw this on the pile of +1/+1 matters cards that are not quite good enough to support the theme.
Grasping Thrull is the first real contender we have. Blind Hunter is definitely better, but I like that this further pushes Orzhov into the bleed territory while providing a playable threat. It feels bad that this is multicolor when Bloodhunter Bat is black though.
My Cube (DeckStats)
My Pauper Cube: 540 (CubeTutor link!)
Level 1 Judge
I really like this. Better than Soul of the rapids, if you want just one of those at that cmc.
My 490 Pauper Cube
Modern frame only- Common on paper only - no functional copies, no strictly-betters - no subtype-matters
3 life bleeded would've been enough maybe.
My 490 Pauper Cube
Modern frame only- Common on paper only - no functional copies, no strictly-betters - no subtype-matters
I agree that a plain old 2BB would be better (than a 3/3). Its still not too shabby. I always like cards that replace themselves. Its a great Rakdos Aggro card if you support that.
Burning Vandal is definitely better than Azra most of the time and if you can find the slot pretty cubable. Being aggressive while also filtering to gas is pretty good. Definitely mvp in rav drafts.
Brawl, meh
Blindhunter much better than Thrull and Orzhov is already an immensivly powerful drain guild with the extort stuff.
Humongolus. Great artwork. Its hexproof, so op anyway, but 2 power is a little low. At 5 I want a finisher, not a wall. So I like Soul of the Rapids more
T2 powpercube Value https://cubecobra.com/cube/list/37t
Loose Change Pauper Cube-cast
Pauper Cube Article #1
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I agree, although that probably would have put it a tiny bit over power level for current standards. I might have taken it if the lifeloss trigger was an ETB and the lifegain trigger was a deathrattle (sort of dovetailing with OG Orzhov's haunt mechanic). Sad, because Seb McKinnon's art really knocks it out of the park.
My Cube (DeckStats)
My Pauper Cube: 540 (CubeTutor link!)
Level 1 Judge
T2 powpercube Value https://cubecobra.com/cube/list/37t
I agree with Humphry here. I like the juggler. We'll see if theres room.
I also have these same cards, and mentioned it to a friend. We agreed it might be a little better than Tithe drinker, in that it becomes outclassed very quicky and then sometimes only becomes an extort enabler. And i dont think I'd play a WB enchantment with extort on it. But it's really a hard call, because it does do work in the right decks.
Pilleroy has no extort, it doesnt even drain. Its still in my Top4 Orzhov cards and I like it better than the lifegain one.
T2 powpercube Value https://cubecobra.com/cube/list/37t
Also, I keep seeing Harsh Sustenance pop up in some lists, even though it looks super bad compared to the stacked removal in both black and white. Is it mostly win-more, throw-at-the-opponent's-face rather than actual removal? Because that card looks to me like a case of cubers maybe trying to go a little too deep on the bleed theme
My Cube (DeckStats)
My Pauper Cube: 540 (CubeTutor link!)
Level 1 Judge
You may find it irrelevant to give your lifelink creature evasion. That's a major component in my evaluation since it helps win the race when your lifelink creature that puts you ahead gets to, you know, actually connect.
I haven't played Shrieking Grotesque since 2011. That's what usually happens when you get obsoleted by a monocolor card.
My Cube (DeckStats)
My Pauper Cube: 540 (CubeTutor link!)
Level 1 Judge
Grotesque is pretty good still and Id never mind to run two specters. Its just that Orzhov doesnt neccessarily want that effect and has more identity with the above cards.
T2 powpercube Value https://cubecobra.com/cube/list/37t
im totally fine with the hardcore balance approach, but as i said, you overrate the imbalances those cards create. I mean you even "cheated" yourself with the "rainbow" section you put those hybrids in.
Id say having a 10-15 card "rainbow" or flexsection is totally fine and saves some headaches. I definitely dont want to cut strong cards or add bad cards just to have a slightly cleaner guildbalance.
Im sometimes even fine to move monocolored "gold" cards like Ape into red, although thats a stretch i try to avoid. id be totally down to add hybrids into monosections, I only try to avoid that because it looks "bad" in the visualspoiler lol.
That said, im much more strict on my T1 and pretty lose on the T2. Dimir has like 6 cards there, while other guilds only have 1
If you want to take another extreme, you could count the amount of colored mana each has in the cube and balance around that
T2 powpercube Value https://cubecobra.com/cube/list/37t
These are usually stories after the draft like: "I thought about it, but...". Then they lose to it.
Best BW? Nope. But it reminds me of what MtG was like when I stopped going to events.
Loose Change Pauper Cube-cast
Pauper Cube Article #1
Pauper Cube Article #2
Personal Enjoyment Cube
I have a 480 cube, that is now modern-paper-common only, so it is different from most here. But I have 6 guild slots per guild, with 4 "pure gold" cards (including flashback costs among them) and 2 hybrid cards per guild.
As I have 2 sets of guild lands in the cube but those are in the colorless section, you could just put the lands in the guild section and the hybrids in the colorless section, but in my experience the way I do it makes storing the cards in the correct pile way easier for the people that helps you store everything when the game ends.
My 490 Pauper Cube
Modern frame only- Common on paper only - no functional copies, no strictly-betters - no subtype-matters
Is this any good? Seems like 6 is a lot, but the counters stay...
My 490 Pauper Cube
Modern frame only- Common on paper only - no functional copies, no strictly-betters - no subtype-matters
T2 powpercube Value https://cubecobra.com/cube/list/37t
Yup, nothing to see here. Just putting up the other commons
Loose Change Pauper Cube-cast
Pauper Cube Article #1
Pauper Cube Article #2
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Borderline worst repulse is borderline.
My 490 Pauper Cube
Modern frame only- Common on paper only - no functional copies, no strictly-betters - no subtype-matters
Adapt can be used again if the counters are removed/transfered.