Thank you for the advice folks. Regarding the money cards mentioned, I already have Daze, Witness, BBE and city, and it seems that the price point for Peasant isn't problematic (I guess the priciest thing I would potentially look at is FoW, but that doesn't seem to promising outside of powered cubes or at least combo cubes).
I will probably sit on this info until after christmas, but in the new year I will likely look at making the upgrades. I will document this process if people are interested for future reference, and to direct others looking to do the same thing towards.
Thank you for the advice folks. Regarding the money cards mentioned, I already have Daze, Witness, BBE and city, and it seems that the price point for Peasant isn't problematic (I guess the priciest thing I would potentially look at is FoW, but that doesn't seem to promising outside of powered cubes or at least combo cubes).
I will probably sit on this info until after christmas, but in the new year I will likely look at making the upgrades. I will document this process if people are interested for future reference, and to direct others looking to do the same thing towards.
Yeah, there's not a whole lot of expensive must haves for Peasant Cube. I am pretty liberal with my classification of what is legal for peasant cube and I include U2's, Renaissance printings, and online releases. I have a handful of higher dollar rares in mine:
Of these the ones I'd miss the most in a budget build would be Demonic Tutor, Enlightened Tutor, Imperial Recruiter, Mana Drain, and Land Tax..but you can do just fine without them. Demonic Tutor and Enlightened Tutor are definitely worth splurging for and open up a lot of possibilities in deckbuilding.
Path to Exile is also a must have that's a few bucks.
I was flicking through cards and saw Cumber Stone. I know some people have the opinion that Ghostly Prison and Propaganda aren't always good for cube because they nerf aggro too much.
I run a 720... This means I run Briarhorn along with his inferior descendant, Briarpack Wolf.
A lot of people run briarpack alpha at my size and lower.
I've run cumber stone. It's fine but mainly an aggro hoser. Use at your own risk? Much fairer than the prisons. It also wins midrange battles on its own at times, so it isn't entirely narrow.
I still don't like enlightened tutor but then again I'm not running skullclamp or the hammers.
I think Top is is run in fewer or around 50% of lists from the regulars, Io.
I'm glad Top is 25 bucks because it's absolutely unplayable.
Force, on the other hand, is awesome. It's not at all a GREAT card in a vacuum since you're only countering other uncommons, but there are more than enough 2-for-1s in our cubes to make it sweet for aggro/tempo decks.
Cumber Stone is definitely a fairer Propaganda. It's a little slow if your cube has an optimized aggro section. Coming down on 4th turn is clunky and a little slow to be very effective against an aggro deck. I'll gladly have you tap out on 4th turn so I can drop my keldon champion and swing in with my borderland marauder and company.
Sensei's Divining Top is far from unplayable. It's pretty insane alongside ramp (which is the most prevalent shuffle effect in peasant cube). It's also good in the spells matters deck, but I'm also running Mystical Tutor, Imperial Recruiter, Illusory Angel, and Empty the Warrens. It also a big card in the 4+ color control decks. I can think of other fringe applications like White based control with Land Tax, Enlightened Tutor, and fetch lands, but those are the most common here.
Yeah I wouldn't call top unplayable, but it's just narrow enough that I can not miss having it in my drafts. It's not worth the price tag if you don't own one already.
Unplayable was certainly an exaggeration, but I'm never inclined to use it without 4+ shuffle effects in my deck, which basically means green, which makes it more or less a second, lesser version of Sylvan Library since it can't actually generate card advantage.
Yea, With folks I play with Sensei's Divining Top and Sylvan Library would make turns take forever. (I was part of this problem too.) If you have the take forever type players then I wouldn't put them in.
You need to mill yourself for, what, 12 cards for that card to work as a win-con on T10? Two Darkblast dredges and Forbidden Alchemy plus flashback??
Since the average deck will have 23 cards in the library (40 deck - 7 opener - 10 draws) before account for anything unusual that would make it smaller. Say they cast one Cultivate and one Sign in Blood, now 19 cards left in deck. A control deck might reasonably have binned 7 cards (casting spells, creatures dying) at that point.
Still sounds waaaaaaaaay too narrow. I'm not using a Cube slot for "control vs slow deck ultra late game finisher that needs very specific enablers".
I've had Spiral sleeved up and ready to cube for a long time because my UB control and reanimator decks have often just milled themselves out with looters and forgotten alchemy and have randomly lost before games even really kicked off.
I keep wussing out of actually sticking it in, because the fact that it seems like it would work so well feels like a gaffe that I'd rather hide than embrace (a gaffe in that Psychic Spiral is probably a more efficient finisher for the reanimation deck than something like Artisan of Kozilek). But it does look like it would be insane in the decks that it's good in and would allow control decks to just operate on a different axis...
Not that I'm advocating Psychic Spiral....it could be decent. I would want a few effects to run in tandem with it that synergize with the mill idea without being mill cards.
R/w Aggro
Well put together, it was fast had some reach, mostly a bunch of x/1 creatures, pump, and burn.
Had the double strikers, boros charm. He titan's strength a fencing ace, that even feels good to watch.
what deck won out? how have the conspiracies been for you? too powerful?
The tokens deck won, but it may have been because of the power of Double Stroke.
I don't think most of the conspiracies are to powerful, but the ones that can recur can get out of hand.
how have the conspiracies been for you? too powerful?
Advantageous Proclamation Good card, helps fringe decks, decks that need to be streamlined, and that deck that mono colored deck that's just too stretched.
Double Stroke I may need to cut it, it's often paired with a card that makes it to good.
Unexpected Potential This card is great, it makes the draft more fun, and never feels OP. Want to run a card but not have to splash for it? Want to run Squirrel Nest in W/b tokens? Did you hate draft Baleful Strix, but now want it in your R/w deck?
The cards that need "packs" Agent of Acquisitions It's okay, I find it's used more for the last 4 or so cards of a pack, than from the first pick.
Cogwork Librarian This card is fun, and gets more people the cards they need for the deck they want.
Lurking Automaton Vanilla, and a bit of a pain to draft with, but it's fun to watch a table play chicken/hot potato with it.
I know that with Worldly Tutor, my biggest gripe has been that the basic card disadvantage and the mana spent without putting a body on the field have made it pretty weak in decks that aren't ramp-oriented. Mwonvuli Beast Tracker seems like it would have about the same upside (a second copy of the game-ending closer in Ramp and a tutor for answers in midrange) but would also have that body to make it relevant in midrangier decks, but would come with an extra body, and fill a weak point in green decks' mana curves.
Beast tracker is too narrow for now, but it may become playable in the near future when we get 3-4 more decent targets. Obviously being a creature opens up a lot more opportunities to abuse it (blink, bounce, recursion), but there's not an adequate amount of depth in the targets to make it worthwhile at the moment.
I have also been playing these same conspiracies (plus Immediate Action, which has been fine card to help aggro decks), and I have mostly the same comments. Double Stroke is in the running with Sol Ring as the most powerful cards in the cube. It's sometimes just really good if the spell is paired with is cheap, but it's mostly insane. I've seen it win games outright with Fireblast, Brimstone Volley, Lingering Souls, even Fact or Fiction. I don't cut for power level, so it stays.
The most fun card for me has also been Unexpected Potential. I do a lot of two-person drafts, where it really shines since you always end up with good cards you wouldn't have in your deck. It also lets you fill curves in unusual ways if taken early. My favorite use came with drafting Wild Nacatl in a Boros deck. 1-mana 3/3s are very powerful, but it IS a two draft pick combo, so it feels okay.
I hope this is allowed here (and if not please mods let me know X.X!) but I recently finished my common/uncommon cube on Cubetutor and would love for others to draft it to get a feel for it. http://www.cubetutor.com/cubeblog/656
Its 515 and I have no real banned cards, I feel a good designer can balance aggression versus control and not have to avoid fun cards like grafted wargear and loxodon warhammer.
Also I love unexpected potential, the card is sweet.
I will probably sit on this info until after christmas, but in the new year I will likely look at making the upgrades. I will document this process if people are interested for future reference, and to direct others looking to do the same thing towards.
Yeah, there's not a whole lot of expensive must haves for Peasant Cube. I am pretty liberal with my classification of what is legal for peasant cube and I include U2's, Renaissance printings, and online releases. I have a handful of higher dollar rares in mine:
http://www.cubetutor.com/viewcube/13878
I'd possibly run a Library of Alexandria and Bazaar of Baghdad if I had them.
Of these the ones I'd miss the most in a budget build would be Demonic Tutor, Enlightened Tutor, Imperial Recruiter, Mana Drain, and Land Tax..but you can do just fine without them. Demonic Tutor and Enlightened Tutor are definitely worth splurging for and open up a lot of possibilities in deckbuilding.
Path to Exile is also a must have that's a few bucks.
Has anyone tried Cumber Stone? How differently does it play out when compared to Ghostly Prison and Propaganda?
A lot of people run briarpack alpha at my size and lower.
I've run cumber stone. It's fine but mainly an aggro hoser. Use at your own risk? Much fairer than the prisons. It also wins midrange battles on its own at times, so it isn't entirely narrow.
I still don't like enlightened tutor but then again I'm not running skullclamp or the hammers.
I think Top is is run in fewer or around 50% of lists from the regulars, Io.
My CubeCobra (draft 20 card packs, 2 packs.)
430, Peasant, Very Unpowered
Why you should take your hybrids out of your gold section
Manamath Article
Force, on the other hand, is awesome. It's not at all a GREAT card in a vacuum since you're only countering other uncommons, but there are more than enough 2-for-1s in our cubes to make it sweet for aggro/tempo decks.
I haven't tried Cumber Stone, but I do like Haunter of Nightveil quite a bit.
My 720 Peasant Cube
Sensei's Divining Top is far from unplayable. It's pretty insane alongside ramp (which is the most prevalent shuffle effect in peasant cube). It's also good in the spells matters deck, but I'm also running Mystical Tutor, Imperial Recruiter, Illusory Angel, and Empty the Warrens. It also a big card in the 4+ color control decks. I can think of other fringe applications like White based control with Land Tax, Enlightened Tutor, and fetch lands, but those are the most common here.
My CubeCobra (draft 20 card packs, 2 packs.)
430, Peasant, Very Unpowered
Why you should take your hybrids out of your gold section
Manamath Article
Since the average deck will have 23 cards in the library (40 deck - 7 opener - 10 draws) before account for anything unusual that would make it smaller. Say they cast one Cultivate and one Sign in Blood, now 19 cards left in deck. A control deck might reasonably have binned 7 cards (casting spells, creatures dying) at that point.
Still sounds waaaaaaaaay too narrow. I'm not using a Cube slot for "control vs slow deck ultra late game finisher that needs very specific enablers".
I keep wussing out of actually sticking it in, because the fact that it seems like it would work so well feels like a gaffe that I'd rather hide than embrace (a gaffe in that Psychic Spiral is probably a more efficient finisher for the reanimation deck than something like Artisan of Kozilek). But it does look like it would be insane in the decks that it's good in and would allow control decks to just operate on a different axis...
My CubeCobra (draft 20 card packs, 2 packs.)
430, Peasant, Very Unpowered
Why you should take your hybrids out of your gold section
Manamath Article
Not that I'm advocating Psychic Spiral....it could be decent. I would want a few effects to run in tandem with it that synergize with the mill idea without being mill cards.
Like wight of precinct six and jace's phantasm...but that's not enough.
If these cards will creature a spike in the number of games going to turn 15, I'm not interested even more than I'm already not interested.
My CubeCobra (draft 20 card packs, 2 packs.)
430, Peasant, Very Unpowered
Why you should take your hybrids out of your gold section
Manamath Article
Decks:
R/U spells
Tons of two for ones and counters, Treasure Cruise was ancestral recall
(this deck as far as I could tell had 2 win cons Shrine of Burning Rage, and Control Magic)
W/B Tokens
Curse of Shallow Graves, Raise the Alarm, Spectral Procession, Intangible Virtue and aDouble Strokeed Lingering Souls which is basically cheating.
If this deck got one of it's token generators it was hard to deal with.
R/w Aggro
Well put together, it was fast had some reach, mostly a bunch of x/1 creatures, pump, and burn.
Had the double strikers, boros charm. He titan's strength a fencing ace, that even feels good to watch.
U/W Blink
Wing Splicer, Master Splicer, Triskelion, Epochrasite, all the blink.
It can out midrange midrange.
B/U Pile? Graveyard Shenanigans? I don't know what this deck was doing.
Ulamog's Crusher, Baleful Strix, Reassembling Skeleton, Haunted Crossroads, Twisted Abomination.
I think the game plan was stall until he could hard cast Ulamog's Crusher, and hope any deck that was willing to take that long didn't have a counter, or removal.
All in all a good night for the cube.
The tokens deck won, but it may have been because of the power of Double Stroke.
I don't think most of the conspiracies are to powerful, but the ones that can recur can get out of hand.
Advantageous Proclamation Good card, helps fringe decks, decks that need to be streamlined, and that deck that mono colored deck that's just too stretched.
Double Stroke I may need to cut it, it's often paired with a card that makes it to good.
Iterative Analysis This is the less OP version of Double Stroke, more often than not it's paired with an Enlightened Tutor or something like that. It only feels like cheating when it is on a Darkblast, or a Raven's Crime.
Muzzio's Preparations If it's on most creatures it's fine, oh your Reassembling Skeleton is always a 2/2, okay. But when it's on Murderous Redcap or Kitchen Finks it's unfun.
Power Play A bit bland, fine card, helps aggro.
Sentinel Dispatch A bit bland, fine card, helps against aggro.
Unexpected Potential This card is great, it makes the draft more fun, and never feels OP. Want to run a card but not have to splash for it? Want to run Squirrel Nest in W/b tokens? Did you hate draft Baleful Strix, but now want it in your R/w deck?
The cards that need "packs"
Agent of Acquisitions It's okay, I find it's used more for the last 4 or so cards of a pack, than from the first pick.
Cogwork Librarian This card is fun, and gets more people the cards they need for the deck they want.
Lurking Automaton Vanilla, and a bit of a pain to draft with, but it's fun to watch a table play chicken/hot potato with it.
Looking through cubeable or commonly-cubed cards that he tutors up, I'm seeing:
Mono-Green:
2 Ambush Viper
2 Deadly Recluse
2 Garruk's Companion
2 Heir of the Wilds
2 Leafcrown Dryad
2 Thornweald Archer
3 Hungry Spriggan
4 Penumbra Spider
4 Yavimaya Ants
5 Acidic Slime
5 Nessian Asp
5 Sentinel Spider
5 Spitting Spider
5 Stingerfling Spider
6 Hooting Mandrills
6 Thundering Thanadon
7 Pelakka Wurm
7 Penumbra Wurm
Other colors:
6 Pale Recluse
Blue
4 Assault Zeppelid
4 Horizon Chimera
5 Fleetfeather Cockatrice
6 Skaab Goliath
2 Baleful Eidolon
2 Thrill-Kill Assassin
3 Nyx Weaver
3 Stinkweed Imp
3 Vampire Nighthawk
2 Hellspark Elemental
3 Fanatic of Xenagos
4 Bloodfray Giant
4 Ghor-Clan Rampager
5 Scuzzback Marauders
6 Thunder Brute
I know that with Worldly Tutor, my biggest gripe has been that the basic card disadvantage and the mana spent without putting a body on the field have made it pretty weak in decks that aren't ramp-oriented. Mwonvuli Beast Tracker seems like it would have about the same upside (a second copy of the game-ending closer in Ramp and a tutor for answers in midrange) but would also have that body to make it relevant in midrangier decks, but would come with an extra body, and fill a weak point in green decks' mana curves.
Double Stroke is in the running with Sol Ring as the most powerful cards in the cube. It's sometimes just really good if the spell is paired with is cheap, but it's mostly insane. I've seen it win games outright with Fireblast, Brimstone Volley, Lingering Souls, even Fact or Fiction. I don't cut for power level, so it stays.
The most fun card for me has also been Unexpected Potential. I do a lot of two-person drafts, where it really shines since you always end up with good cards you wouldn't have in your deck. It also lets you fill curves in unusual ways if taken early. My favorite use came with drafting Wild Nacatl in a Boros deck. 1-mana 3/3s are very powerful, but it IS a two draft pick combo, so it feels okay.
https://cubecobra.com/cube/list/peasantsnowcube
-- Updated with Outlaws of Thunder Junction
The PioneWer Peasant CUbe
https://cubecobra.com/cube/list/pionewer
-- Updated with Murders at Karlov Manor
Its 515 and I have no real banned cards, I feel a good designer can balance aggression versus control and not have to avoid fun cards like grafted wargear and loxodon warhammer.
Also I love unexpected potential, the card is sweet.
Cheers!