Just gave the cube a test run 6 man draft tonight and the new cards are pretty insane. Heirloom Blade and RidgeScale Tusker were two favorites from my deck. Seems like I may have to make aggro a bit stronger but I'll give it a few more runs before I change anything. Monogreen sproutswarm deck also almost won! However, I was able to pull off the win in the end.
To get some discussion going, what are some cards from y'alls last draft that performed excellently, and in what decks?
The card that just keeps overperforming for me is Tooth Collector. Somehow, every time I draw him there is a really important target to nick. Variance of course, but I can't not be affected I don't think.
Does anyone else feel like green three drops kind of suck? There are a few good ones like Eternal Witness and Reclamation Sage, but non of them really feel like what I want to be playing down on turn three to start beating down in a midrange or aggro deck. What do yall think?
So you think I should include manaplasm? The idea of it being so vulnerable is a bit scary to me, and also it making you have to play your cards before combat.
There's also Abzan Beastmaster, but it's nothing spectacular. I have had games where it's just a vanilla 2/1 for a turn or two, but I've also drawn (I think) at most, 2 cards.
Curving Manaplasm > 4 drop > 2+3 or 5 is huge game, as it essentially becomes a 3 mana 5/5 or bigger. It does die to any removal spell, but as far as aggressive 3s go it's not too much more vulnerable. Playing spells before combat doesn't really matter most of the time, and it's a small cost in order to have so much damage on a 3 drop.
Like, yes there's a nut draw with it (when your very aggressive green deck hits it on T3 then has more land drops and the right curve of more expensive spells), but it's just a high variance pile which averages out to approximately a Hungry Spriggan.
With only ~35 cards in my cube that work with counters Revolutionary would too often be an 3/3 trample for 1GG, which is pretty bad. I rather play Trusted Forcemage in almost every deck (and I am not running that card either).
Sam Stoddard wrote some time back that they had purposefully been making green 3's kinda lacklustre over the years because they always had to develop them as if they would be played turn 2 off a turn one mana creature. I was hoping that with the move away from one-cost mana creatures in Standard that we would be seeing more sweet green threes, but it hasn't really materialised.
I still think Hungry Spriggan is one of Green's best 3 drops. Attacking with a 4/4 trampler for 3 is exactly what a green aggro deck wants. Highly recommend it if you support green aggro.
My experience with Manaplasm has been very different from _i0s. 'Averaging out' doesn't do a card like this justice. You play Manaplasm because you want to play it on turn 2 or 3. And if you do that and have a higher curve green aggro deck then it's almost always a 5/5 or larger for the following 2-3 turns. Which gives you better stats than any other playable three drop at Peasant level.
On top of that it's abusable (Bloodbraid Elf, Become Immense, Mutagenic Growth to name a few cards) and hard to predict for your opponent since every instant becomes a combat trick with it.
In top deck mode it is a bit lackluster and it's usually even a bit worse than Hungry Spriggan, but again, you don't judge Diregraf Ghoul by its turn 10 performance.
EDIT: Though I'm not even sure about top deck mode. If I reach that point with an aggro deck it's probably a board stall and I'd rather have an unpredictable, explosive creature after a few turns than something that is a 4/4 immediately, but doesn't get bigger.
'higher curve green aggro' is such a narrow thing that I don't really care how good Plasm is there. Like... I don't want it in a Jackal Pup/Bloodbraid Elf Gruul deck. I don't want it in a Pianna/Gaea's Anthem Selesnya deck. I don't want it in Simic tempo. I don't want it in the same 40 cards as Pelakka Wurm ever.
And it's not 'abusable' as much as it is randomly excellent with like 1-2% of your cube (most of which you've listed in those three cards). There's also a HUGE difference between 1-drops and 3-drops for how important it is that they work off-curve.
With only ~35 cards in my cube that work with counters Revolutionary would too often be an 3/3 trample for 1GG, which is pretty bad. I rather play Trusted Forcemage in almost every deck (and I am not running that card either).
I mean is that bad? I am not sure it is. Soulbound is in my list of terrible mechanics I don't want to use but even then forcemage is definately a worse card. I have 45 counters cards though so its a little higher for me and there is my abundance of tokens that makes trample way more useful than otherwise.
I mean hungry spriggan is certainly very similiar in power but it can't block, even if you drafted aggro you aren't always the fastest deck particularly for green. Revoultionaries biggest issue is that it is double green.
Funny you mention Jungle Lion -- I cut Lion since green aggro couldn't ever really stomach a 'cant' block' idiot, and that's exactly why I've really disliked Manaplasm. The problem isn't having a high enough curve, it's that you're not aggressive enough.
Like... as you say, you still play mana dorks and ramp in aggressive green decks. Your deck is often about 50% mana, in fact (16 lands, 4 other cards). When you draw your good stuff at 3-4-5-6 mana, you need it to work in a lot of settings -- as a top deck and on defense, notably, and Plasm is so bad at that.
Yeah I feel like 2/1's for 1 just generally aren't what aggressive green decks are trying to do. Mana dorks are so much better in the one drop slot for that kind of deck.
To get some discussion going, what are some cards from y'alls last draft that performed excellently, and in what decks?
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There's also Abzan Beastmaster, but it's nothing spectacular. I have had games where it's just a vanilla 2/1 for a turn or two, but I've also drawn (I think) at most, 2 cards.
Like, yes there's a nut draw with it (when your very aggressive green deck hits it on T3 then has more land drops and the right curve of more expensive spells), but it's just a high variance pile which averages out to approximately a Hungry Spriggan.
Imperious Perfect isn't really much of an aggro card but really needs an answer or it wins on its own.
I guess the issue is most of them need to built around.
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'higher curve green aggro' is such a narrow thing that I don't really care how good Plasm is there. Like... I don't want it in a Jackal Pup/Bloodbraid Elf Gruul deck. I don't want it in a Pianna/Gaea's Anthem Selesnya deck. I don't want it in Simic tempo. I don't want it in the same 40 cards as Pelakka Wurm ever.
And it's not 'abusable' as much as it is randomly excellent with like 1-2% of your cube (most of which you've listed in those three cards). There's also a HUGE difference between 1-drops and 3-drops for how important it is that they work off-curve.
I mean is that bad? I am not sure it is. Soulbound is in my list of terrible mechanics I don't want to use but even then forcemage is definately a worse card. I have 45 counters cards though so its a little higher for me and there is my abundance of tokens that makes trample way more useful than otherwise.
I mean hungry spriggan is certainly very similiar in power but it can't block, even if you drafted aggro you aren't always the fastest deck particularly for green. Revoultionaries biggest issue is that it is double green.
Pioneer:UR Pheonix
Modern:U Mono U Tron
EDH
GB Glissa, the traitor: Army of Cans
UW Dragonlord Ojutai: Dragonlord NOjutai
UWGDerevi, Empyrial Tactician "you cannot fight the storm"
R Zirilan of the claw. The solution to every problem is dragons
UB Etrata, the Silencer Cloning assassination
Peasant cube: Cards I own
Like... as you say, you still play mana dorks and ramp in aggressive green decks. Your deck is often about 50% mana, in fact (16 lands, 4 other cards). When you draw your good stuff at 3-4-5-6 mana, you need it to work in a lot of settings -- as a top deck and on defense, notably, and Plasm is so bad at that.
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