I just disagree completely. Any deck that plays Mystical wants it badly. Because it's a second copy of the key card in the deck. A Tinker deck without a mystical tutor is only half as good as a deck with it; because you have 1 Tinker instead of 2. I think it's clutch for cubes trying to do interesting things and supporting archetype play, and less important in a "generic good stuff" cube.
I just disagree completely. Any deck that plays Mystical wants it badly. Because it's a second copy of the key card in the deck. A Tinker deck without a mystical tutor is only half as good as a deck with it; because you have 1 Tinker instead of 2. I think it's clutch for cubes trying to do interesting things and supporting archetype play, and less important in a "generic good stuff" cube.
Totally agreed. And you can substitute any key spell for Tinker, including that Wrath you need to desparately survive the aggro rush or the Upheaval you are going to use to seal the game. Mystical Tutor is an all-star!
Totally agreed. And you can substitute any key spell for Tinker, including that Wrath you need to desparately survive the aggro rush or the Upheaval you are going to use to seal the game. Mystical Tutor is an all-star!
Cheers,
rant
Yes, it's a great card because it can tutor up all those things. It increases consistency and makes those decks better. Are you suddenly unable to play those decks because you can't tutor up those cards?
I'll hold off on making the swap yet, but I just can't believe it's that vital. I cubed for years without it before finally adding it about a year ago, and it's been great and gets drafted a lot, but it just doesn't feel like something that is going to prevent anyone from drafting a good deck.
You could cut Crystal Shard, Academy Ruins, Time Spiral (less good in non-powered list), or Brainstorm. I'd definitely pick Thirst over any of those cards. As for Mystical, it gets better as combo and power-level increases. I have it in my list, but it's by no means uncuttable. I think in general I think the non-Vampiric top-deck tutors are overrated. They're not bad, but if you're talking about a slot for Thirst or one of them, I'd pick Thirst for sure.
I agree with kojiro. I don't want combo decks to be dominant, but I like when they exist as a niche deck, so I play the top-deck tutors specifically for these decks that are all about a few crucial pieces. But sure, you can play without these as well, I think it is a matter of preference (I say that a lot lately, and I like what that means for Cube as a format, smaller lists have so many viable options to chose from!)
From the list suggested by kojiro I'd probably cut Academy Ruins. I don't like Complicate much because I want to counter spells on turn two, but you already don't include Power Sink from the tempo part of the update and without Complicate you are relatively short on counters. This is really hard to tell without actually playing a list though, so that is just guesswork.
If you look further up to post 213, this is all part of a discussion that involves cutting Academy ruins already, so I can't play it, and Power Sink didn't make the inclusion even though I wanted it to, I just couldn't find enough cuts.
In that post you'll see I'm cutting thirst, and now think that is not the correct decision, so I'm trying to figure out what else to cut for those adds, and I was considering Mystical Tutor. I could see swapping complicate for power sink, definitely, but that doesn't solve my Thirst for Knowledge problem.
I'm on board with cutting complicate, but I already feel like there isn't enough countermagic in the cube, so I'm not certain I won't want to then find room for Power Sink.
I'm beginning to wonder if perhaps Faerie Conclave isn't worth it and maybe I should just not play it and then I could fit in all of those spells that I want to.
EDIT: @kojiro: Crystal Shard is a crowd favorite here, to the extent that we actually ran erratic portal for a while (I didn't like it so it eventually got cut). I don't think I could cut it or Brainstorm. Time Spiral may be the cut, I like it a lot but there are only a few drafters here that do, and it's not like blue is lacking for big things to do when it gets to that much mana, and it IS lacking in ways to get there without dying, so another 2 mana counterspell could be just what it wants.
So at this point, leaning Time Spiral or Faerie Conclave, after cutting Complicate to fit in Power Sink.
Alright, I did one in-person draft and another rotisserie draft with the proposed changes. Here's what I'm thinking now.
-Time Spiral was again completely ignored in both of them. Not because it's not good (it is), but because blue has enough big things to do with a ton of mana, and I think ultimately it just doesn't need Time Spiral to be good. I'm going to cut Time Spiral to bring Thirst back. Also, I'm going to start drafting Thirst more. That card is really good.
-There aren't enough zombies that do anything other than be 2/2s for 1 in the cube. That means Gravecrawler just doesn't have enough friends that are relevant in the late game. Messenger is great, but I think fitting in a few more relevant zombies is a good goal. I'm going to try Fleshbag Marauder and Graveborn Muse, as zombies with relevant abilities in the pox deck that are also just good cards otherwise.
-Reanimator loves Griselbrand. It doesn't need Griselbrand to be good. I hate that I'm doing this, but I'm going to let Griselbrand go.
-Nether Traitor might be good enough, but ultimately I think the pox deck needs to do more relevant things with the recursive guys it has, more than just playing more recursive dudes.
So the additional changes I'm considering are here:
The other problem I'm running into is that after cutting the Shardslands from the cube, I don't feel like I have enough multicolor fixing anymore. I used to occasionally feel like I had too much, now I don't feel like there is enough. I really don't want to expand the size of the cube, but I feel like I need to find room for the Shardslands and maybe even the Vivids as well. Finding 5 or 10 cuts is hard though. I could go down to 58 cards of each color, which would be possible but difficult, or I could cut some artifacts.
Any thoughts on the right approach there? I guess there is no right way, but I'm pretty sure I want more manafixing than I have now, especially now that we're doing Rotisserie drafts more often.
I think you should keep Griselbrand, frankly. From what I can piece together from the tone of your posts, you really seem to enjoy the hell out of it and are only cutting it reluctantly because the hive mind has soured on it. For what it's worth, I just re-added it to my cube and hard cast it reasonably easily. I love it, and I think cutting it for some substandard zombies just to help enable Gravecrawler recursions might be a mistake.
Regarding manafixing, unless I'm misreading something (always possible), you're running the same amount that wtwlf runs, plus the signets, but with 50 fewer cards than he is. So it seems strange that you're finding yourself needing more. Maybe the fact that you're coming up short for a few drafts is just a sample size issue?
Other than that, high five on cutting Deep Analysis. Nice to know that it's not just Hicham and Fredo and me on that bandwagon.
Well I'm considering cutting Griselbrand not only because the hive mind here doesn't like him all that much, but because my playgroup seems to largely be in agreement with the hive mind. Still, if there were another cut that made sense in black to fit the cards I want in, I'd happily consider them to keep him. Any ideas? I do want to bring in those two cards.
With regards to manafixing, I actually used to run more, took a poll here to find out what other people were running, and then brought my numbers down to match everyone else. After playing with it since July, I'm pretty convinced that casting spells in my cube was better before those changes. It definitely takes up space in the cube to fit in those cards, but I think it's worth it to fit them back in. Maybe other folks and I disagree on the correct amount of manafixing to play decks, or maybe my decks are just greedier than is really appropriate, but I think more fixing will be better, and I think it based on the fact that I used to have more, and I liked it better. Still, I'm going to miss some of the awesome cards I fit into the cube when I made that change.
I'm about ready for Analysis to go as well. It's a great value card and all, but it sure does get drafted late a lot. I'm trying to get rid of those kind of cards, and have more cards that people fight over in drafts. The really cool thing about doing a bunch of rotisserie drafts now is that I have actual data about what cards are getting ignored. We're only on our second draft so I'm not basing anything off of those yet, but as we keep going I think it'll be useful to look at what cards people aren't taking.
There's a few changes I don't like, but the only ones I feel are mistakes are the losses of Deep Analysis, Time Spiral and Molten-Tail Masticore.
These 3 cards are the prime examples of cards that are good, but the cube doesn't actually need, and nobody plays. In my cube, the big blue mana decks have Jace 3, Upheaval, Consecrated Sphinx, and Tamiyo already, and those 4 cards get heavily drafted and played. Time Spiral, while great, doesn't see play. Sure, I could keep it in because it has a high power level, but people keep forcing tempo decks when I have way more top end than is necessary, and they're not playing the big mana blue cards. I could tell them "no you guys, you need to understand that these cards are good" or I could adjust the cube so that they get to play the strategies they enjoy playing.
This is a no brainer to me. Yes, the cards I'm cutting are objectively more powerful. I still think my cube playgroup will have more fun playing without them. And that, to my thinking, is the danger of the hive mind. I honestly can't remember the last time anybody but me cast any of those 3 cards. I keep drafting them and playing them and doing well with them, but anytime I play a different strategy, they go unplayed.
I'm so glad I added it back in. The hivemind hates the card, but it's such a great creature. It's neither bad nor slow, FYI.
I'm hoping I am able to keep it in. I suspect I'm about to cut 5 cards to get more manafixing back, and it's the chopping block card in green at the moment. I had it in my deck last week and it was really fun. Of course, I had 3 fetchlands, but it was a solid splashable two drop.
Thinking about it more I'll probably keep Kudzu, but I'm about to let Fastbond go. It's created a ton of "almost got there" stories, and not nearly enough "actually got there" stories.
I dont like the cuts of Academy Ruins, Deep Analsysis, Gifts Ungiven,Time Spiral, Venser, Abrupt Decay (though I think Shaman is really good), Molten-Tail Masticore and Lodestone Golem.
Concerining adds I dont like Power Sink, Coralhelm Commander (not at 450, I think he is fine at 540), Graveborn Muse, Vinelasher Kudzu (I know wtw added him, but IMO he is just so bad and slow), Lyev Skyknight and Relic.
I don't like cutting Abrupt Decay either, but people are clamoring for for more graveyard interaction, and I've been enjoying Dreg Mangler too much to cut it. Same with Relic. Graveyard decks are 4-0 and 5-0ing my cube drafts regularly, and people want more interaction available to them.
Graveborn Muse I don't know if it'll work out, but the Pox deck is having a problem if the opponent ever gets to 4 mana, because it just doesn't have any creatures that really DO anything once the opponent is able to do what they want. Part of the reason for that is that the deck has to run like 7 or 8 one drops in order to play enough Zombies, and that's actually too many one drops for the deck. Therefore, I'm trying to play other relevant zombies, and I think Graveborn will do interesting things. I'm keeping my eye on it as a potential underperformer.
Masticore and Lodestone Golem - I understand that you don't like the cuts, but can you articulate why you think my reasoning is bad? They're not getting played because EVERY color has gamebreaking 4 drops nowadays, and they just aren't necessary. Almost every deck I draft I have to cut 4 and 5 drops from in order to make it work, and these guys are often on the receiving end of those cuts. Additionally, the artifact deck actively wants more cheap artifacts to animate with tezzeret or tinker away. This is a kill two birds with one stone thing.
Thinking about it more I'll probably keep Kudzu, but I'm about to let Fastbond go. It's created a ton of "almost got there" stories, and not nearly enough "actually got there" stories.
I had the same experience.
Quote from JeffDerek »
These 3 cards are the prime examples of cards that are good, but the cube doesn't actually need, and nobody plays.
If this were the case for me, I wouldn't have recommended keeping them.
We play a lot of big mana blue (artifact.dec, UG ramp, etc) where Time Spiral is a complete bomb. There's close to nothing I'd rather cast after dumping my ramp hand than a Time Spiral.
Deep Analysis is splashable 4-for-1 card advantage that gets value even if it's discarded in another way. I don't think there's a more impacting draw spell in the cube that doesn't end in the word Recall.
Molten-Tail Masticore provides reach, removal and outs to planeswalkers for a ton of non-red decks that need it. It's one of my favorite aggro curve-toppers, and I love it in creature-heavy UG decks, because all three functions of the activation plug gaps in what that color combination struggles against.
Quote from JeffDerek »
And that, to my thinking, is the danger of the hive mind.
If your group doesn't like them, fine. It's not a "danger of the hive mind" for folks to throw in their $0.02 about what cards they don't want to see cut. These were just three of mine. If there's a real problem with the hivemind's opinion, why post and discuss? The point of the forum is to share and receive feedback, because there's information out there that can help improve and streamline your cube list.
My apologies, I didn't mean to sound like I don't value the input y'all are providing. I do. When I refer to the "danger of the hive mind" I'm talking about playing cards that people online say I should play, but my group doesn't enjoy. That's where it gets bad, because everyone on the forums is in agreement that a certain card is good and should be played, and they've all had those opinions reinforced by others, and it gets to be where 'of course you have to play X card', and then I go back to my cube group and nobody likes the card. The danger there is in forcing what the online community says instead of listening to your playgroup.
In my playgroup, for example, U/G decks don't play Molten-Tail Masticore for the problems of the color combination, they splash red or black or white for that. My group enjoys multicolor decks a lot, and instead of playing Masticores, they'd rather play other removal from the colors that are more efficient at it. I don't think either one of those is necessarily the correct way to approach the deck, but it is telling as to why people here don't like Masticore as much.
----
I will say this. I do find the "danger of the hive mind" to also include what happens when I spend a lot of time writing our reasoning as to why I'm making a change, particularly because I know that the change will be contentious, and then the response I get is "I don't like these cuts." Or even "You can't cut this card because it's so good, and here's why it's good" I understand why it's good. What I'm looking for, hopefully, is counterpoint to my original considerations. If I'm cutting Molten-Tail and Lodestone Golem because the cube is overloaded on 4 drops, telling me how good they are doens't do anything. Tell me why they're better than other 4 drops and which other 4 drops I should be cutting instead. Convincing me to keep them doesn't actually solve my problem, y'know?
If I'm cutting Molten-Tail and Lodestone Golem because the cube is overloaded on 4 drops, telling me how good they are doens't do anything. Tell me why they're better than other 4 drops and which other 4 drops I should be cutting instead. Convincing me to keep them doesn't actually solve my problem, y'know?
But the problem with this is A) we don't know what else may be on the chopping block unless YOU offer up the information, and B) you said you're cutting the cards because they're being unplayed by your playgroup. In that case, it doesn't matter if I think card X is better than card Y, because you're cutting X because your playgroup doesn't use it. There's nothing to be said. The "I'm cutting it because my playgroup doesn't like it, not because it's bad" is the perfect defense to throw up before making any change, because it's easy to hide behind. So the generic "I don't like the following cuts..." is about the only types of responses you're gonna get.
Here's what I said about Lodestone and Molten-Tail
Lodestone Golem and Molten-Tail Masticore - Every color has incredibly bomby four drops. There are so many four drops throughout the cube these guys end up cut from decks because they just aren't as good as the other options. I can't remember the last deck I played that didn't have to cut four drops when it came time to trim down to 40 cards. I want to cut these guys, but I'm looking for candidates to replace them. I could see bringing Basilisk Collar back in, but that's definitely a card that has underperformed every other time I played it. Engineered Explosives would also be a candidate. I'm also told some cubes have good luck with Zuran Orb. Assuming we bring in Orb and Explosives, I could be talked into finding space for Trinket Mage in the blue section.
Molten-Tail is one of the 4-drops that ends up bumping other 4cc cards out of my final 40. Lodestone is one of the best 4-drops available for artifact heavy builds and decks you know will disrupt your opponent's mana in any other way. If it were up to me, I'd try to find 4cc cards in other combinations to let go, and keep those guys in.
Just chiming in to agree with wtwlf regarding MTM and Lodestone. I think MTM is one of the three best artifact creatures in the cube (with Wurmcoil and Solemn Simulacrum). Unlike the others, it's a great creature for aggro decks, making it even more unique. It can just dish out a ton of damage.
Lodestone is just a solid performer and can really screw with your opponent. It's not uncuttable, but I'd still be running it if I dropped to 450.
I don't come down on one side or the other regarding the cuttability (to coin a word) of your aggro 4 drops, but since it seems people are ignoring you and just repeating arguments for why a card is good, let me try and suss things out a little bit.
Looking through your list, how sure are you that your colored options are better than the two guys you're cutting?
Of those, if I'm playing an aggro deck, the only cards for sure that I would want over MTM or LG in an aggro build are Armageddon, Elspeth, and Parallax Wave (and situationally, but not definitely, Restoration Angel).
Of those, if I'm playing an aggro deck, the only cards for sure that I would want over MTM or LG in an aggro build are Koth, Hellrider, Riders, FTK, and Hero.
You don't support green or blue aggro, so I won't consider those. In your guild section, the only card for sure I would want over MTM or LG in an aggro build is Sorin, Lord of Innistrad.
So that's 11 four-drops that I think are strictly better than LG and MTM. Presumably there are several others that we rate differently, but even being expansive, let's say you rate 15 4 drops as better. That doesn't seem like a high enough density to me to drop two really good colorless aggro 4 drops, but hey, I'm not a statistician, and you're the one with the real-world experience.
Jeff, I'm with you on the LG and MTM. I like them both a lot, but I cut Lodestone a long time ago and have never missed it, and am on the verge of getting rid of MTM as well (even though I think it's the best Masticore). I just rarely end up playing them in my decks, even in a Winston format where presumably it'd be more difficult to pick up on-color 4-drops.
In any case, I'm confident that even if you don't want to cut both, you can at least cut one. I don't think that small cubes really need to run two 4-drop colorless aggro creatures.
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Totally agreed. And you can substitute any key spell for Tinker, including that Wrath you need to desparately survive the aggro rush or the Upheaval you are going to use to seal the game. Mystical Tutor is an all-star!
Cheers,
rant
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Yes, it's a great card because it can tutor up all those things. It increases consistency and makes those decks better. Are you suddenly unable to play those decks because you can't tutor up those cards?
I'll hold off on making the swap yet, but I just can't believe it's that vital. I cubed for years without it before finally adding it about a year ago, and it's been great and gets drafted a lot, but it just doesn't feel like something that is going to prevent anyone from drafting a good deck.
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No, but the Tutor makes all of those decks significantly better in a way that no other blue card can.
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From the list suggested by kojiro I'd probably cut Academy Ruins. I don't like Complicate much because I want to counter spells on turn two, but you already don't include Power Sink from the tempo part of the update and without Complicate you are relatively short on counters. This is really hard to tell without actually playing a list though, so that is just guesswork.
"What am I looking at? Ashes, dead man."
In that post you'll see I'm cutting thirst, and now think that is not the correct decision, so I'm trying to figure out what else to cut for those adds, and I was considering Mystical Tutor. I could see swapping complicate for power sink, definitely, but that doesn't solve my Thirst for Knowledge problem.
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I'm beginning to wonder if perhaps Faerie Conclave isn't worth it and maybe I should just not play it and then I could fit in all of those spells that I want to.
EDIT: @kojiro: Crystal Shard is a crowd favorite here, to the extent that we actually ran erratic portal for a while (I didn't like it so it eventually got cut). I don't think I could cut it or Brainstorm. Time Spiral may be the cut, I like it a lot but there are only a few drafters here that do, and it's not like blue is lacking for big things to do when it gets to that much mana, and it IS lacking in ways to get there without dying, so another 2 mana counterspell could be just what it wants.
So at this point, leaning Time Spiral or Faerie Conclave, after cutting Complicate to fit in Power Sink.
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"What am I looking at? Ashes, dead man."
-Time Spiral was again completely ignored in both of them. Not because it's not good (it is), but because blue has enough big things to do with a ton of mana, and I think ultimately it just doesn't need Time Spiral to be good. I'm going to cut Time Spiral to bring Thirst back. Also, I'm going to start drafting Thirst more. That card is really good.
-There aren't enough zombies that do anything other than be 2/2s for 1 in the cube. That means Gravecrawler just doesn't have enough friends that are relevant in the late game. Messenger is great, but I think fitting in a few more relevant zombies is a good goal. I'm going to try Fleshbag Marauder and Graveborn Muse, as zombies with relevant abilities in the pox deck that are also just good cards otherwise.
-Reanimator loves Griselbrand. It doesn't need Griselbrand to be good. I hate that I'm doing this, but I'm going to let Griselbrand go.
-Nether Traitor might be good enough, but ultimately I think the pox deck needs to do more relevant things with the recursive guys it has, more than just playing more recursive dudes.
So the additional changes I'm considering are here:
Blue
-Time Spiral
-Complicate
+Thirst for Knowledge
+Power Sink
Black
-Griselbrand
-Nether Traitor
+Fleshbag Marauder
+Graveborn Muse
The other problem I'm running into is that after cutting the Shardslands from the cube, I don't feel like I have enough multicolor fixing anymore. I used to occasionally feel like I had too much, now I don't feel like there is enough. I really don't want to expand the size of the cube, but I feel like I need to find room for the Shardslands and maybe even the Vivids as well. Finding 5 or 10 cuts is hard though. I could go down to 58 cards of each color, which would be possible but difficult, or I could cut some artifacts.
Tentatively, I could see Oblivion Stone, Chromatic Lantern (or another mana rock), maybe Ratchet Bomb . . . but other than that I'm not sure what I could trim in the colorless section. I don't want to shrink the guilds, which leaves me shrinking the colored stuff. I suppose I could trim Reckless Waif, Vinelasher Kudzu, Flickerwisp, Makeshift Mannequin, and Faerie Conclave, some of which haven't even had a chance to shine, to fit in one cycle, but that seems weak.
Any thoughts on the right approach there? I guess there is no right way, but I'm pretty sure I want more manafixing than I have now, especially now that we're doing Rotisserie drafts more often.
Blue
-Deep Analysis
-Academy Ruins
-Gifts Ungiven
-Gilded Drake
-Time Spiral
-Complicate
+Faerie Conclave
+AEther Adept
+Trinket Mage
+Into the Roil
+Coralhelm Commander
+Power Sink
Black
-Griselbrand
-Nether Traitor
+Fleshbag Marauder
+Graveborn Muse
Green
-Harmonize
+Primal Command
-Deadbridge Goliath
+Vinelasher Kudzu
Red
-Goblin Welder
+Reckless Waif
Multi
-Venser, the Sojourner
+Lyev Skynight
-Abrupt Decay
+Deathrite Shaman
-Gisela, Blade of Goldnight
+Duergar Hedge-Mage
-Lorescale Coatl
+Snakeform
Colorless
-Epochrasite
+Relic of Progenitus
-Molten-Tail Masticore
+Zuran Orb
-Lodestone Golem
+Engineered Explosives
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Regarding manafixing, unless I'm misreading something (always possible), you're running the same amount that wtwlf runs, plus the signets, but with 50 fewer cards than he is. So it seems strange that you're finding yourself needing more. Maybe the fact that you're coming up short for a few drafts is just a sample size issue?
Other than that, high five on cutting Deep Analysis. Nice to know that it's not just Hicham and Fredo and me on that bandwagon.
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With regards to manafixing, I actually used to run more, took a poll here to find out what other people were running, and then brought my numbers down to match everyone else. After playing with it since July, I'm pretty convinced that casting spells in my cube was better before those changes. It definitely takes up space in the cube to fit in those cards, but I think it's worth it to fit them back in. Maybe other folks and I disagree on the correct amount of manafixing to play decks, or maybe my decks are just greedier than is really appropriate, but I think more fixing will be better, and I think it based on the fact that I used to have more, and I liked it better. Still, I'm going to miss some of the awesome cards I fit into the cube when I made that change.
I'm about ready for Analysis to go as well. It's a great value card and all, but it sure does get drafted late a lot. I'm trying to get rid of those kind of cards, and have more cards that people fight over in drafts. The really cool thing about doing a bunch of rotisserie drafts now is that I have actual data about what cards are getting ignored. We're only on our second draft so I'm not basing anything off of those yet, but as we keep going I think it'll be useful to look at what cards people aren't taking.
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I'm so glad I added it back in. The hivemind hates the card, but it's such a great creature. It's neither bad nor slow, FYI.
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These 3 cards are the prime examples of cards that are good, but the cube doesn't actually need, and nobody plays. In my cube, the big blue mana decks have Jace 3, Upheaval, Consecrated Sphinx, and Tamiyo already, and those 4 cards get heavily drafted and played. Time Spiral, while great, doesn't see play. Sure, I could keep it in because it has a high power level, but people keep forcing tempo decks when I have way more top end than is necessary, and they're not playing the big mana blue cards. I could tell them "no you guys, you need to understand that these cards are good" or I could adjust the cube so that they get to play the strategies they enjoy playing.
This is a no brainer to me. Yes, the cards I'm cutting are objectively more powerful. I still think my cube playgroup will have more fun playing without them. And that, to my thinking, is the danger of the hive mind. I honestly can't remember the last time anybody but me cast any of those 3 cards. I keep drafting them and playing them and doing well with them, but anytime I play a different strategy, they go unplayed.
I'm hoping I am able to keep it in. I suspect I'm about to cut 5 cards to get more manafixing back, and it's the chopping block card in green at the moment. I had it in my deck last week and it was really fun. Of course, I had 3 fetchlands, but it was a solid splashable two drop.
Thinking about it more I'll probably keep Kudzu, but I'm about to let Fastbond go. It's created a ton of "almost got there" stories, and not nearly enough "actually got there" stories.
I don't like cutting Abrupt Decay either, but people are clamoring for for more graveyard interaction, and I've been enjoying Dreg Mangler too much to cut it. Same with Relic. Graveyard decks are 4-0 and 5-0ing my cube drafts regularly, and people want more interaction available to them.
Graveborn Muse I don't know if it'll work out, but the Pox deck is having a problem if the opponent ever gets to 4 mana, because it just doesn't have any creatures that really DO anything once the opponent is able to do what they want. Part of the reason for that is that the deck has to run like 7 or 8 one drops in order to play enough Zombies, and that's actually too many one drops for the deck. Therefore, I'm trying to play other relevant zombies, and I think Graveborn will do interesting things. I'm keeping my eye on it as a potential underperformer.
Masticore and Lodestone Golem - I understand that you don't like the cuts, but can you articulate why you think my reasoning is bad? They're not getting played because EVERY color has gamebreaking 4 drops nowadays, and they just aren't necessary. Almost every deck I draft I have to cut 4 and 5 drops from in order to make it work, and these guys are often on the receiving end of those cuts. Additionally, the artifact deck actively wants more cheap artifacts to animate with tezzeret or tinker away. This is a kill two birds with one stone thing.
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I had the same experience.
If this were the case for me, I wouldn't have recommended keeping them.
We play a lot of big mana blue (artifact.dec, UG ramp, etc) where Time Spiral is a complete bomb. There's close to nothing I'd rather cast after dumping my ramp hand than a Time Spiral.
Deep Analysis is splashable 4-for-1 card advantage that gets value even if it's discarded in another way. I don't think there's a more impacting draw spell in the cube that doesn't end in the word Recall.
Molten-Tail Masticore provides reach, removal and outs to planeswalkers for a ton of non-red decks that need it. It's one of my favorite aggro curve-toppers, and I love it in creature-heavy UG decks, because all three functions of the activation plug gaps in what that color combination struggles against.
If your group doesn't like them, fine. It's not a "danger of the hive mind" for folks to throw in their $0.02 about what cards they don't want to see cut. These were just three of mine. If there's a real problem with the hivemind's opinion, why post and discuss? The point of the forum is to share and receive feedback, because there's information out there that can help improve and streamline your cube list.
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In my playgroup, for example, U/G decks don't play Molten-Tail Masticore for the problems of the color combination, they splash red or black or white for that. My group enjoys multicolor decks a lot, and instead of playing Masticores, they'd rather play other removal from the colors that are more efficient at it. I don't think either one of those is necessarily the correct way to approach the deck, but it is telling as to why people here don't like Masticore as much.
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I will say this. I do find the "danger of the hive mind" to also include what happens when I spend a lot of time writing our reasoning as to why I'm making a change, particularly because I know that the change will be contentious, and then the response I get is "I don't like these cuts." Or even "You can't cut this card because it's so good, and here's why it's good" I understand why it's good. What I'm looking for, hopefully, is counterpoint to my original considerations. If I'm cutting Molten-Tail and Lodestone Golem because the cube is overloaded on 4 drops, telling me how good they are doens't do anything. Tell me why they're better than other 4 drops and which other 4 drops I should be cutting instead. Convincing me to keep them doesn't actually solve my problem, y'know?
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But the problem with this is A) we don't know what else may be on the chopping block unless YOU offer up the information, and B) you said you're cutting the cards because they're being unplayed by your playgroup. In that case, it doesn't matter if I think card X is better than card Y, because you're cutting X because your playgroup doesn't use it. There's nothing to be said. The "I'm cutting it because my playgroup doesn't like it, not because it's bad" is the perfect defense to throw up before making any change, because it's easy to hide behind. So the generic "I don't like the following cuts..." is about the only types of responses you're gonna get.
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Lodestone is just a solid performer and can really screw with your opponent. It's not uncuttable, but I'd still be running it if I dropped to 450.
Cheers,
rant
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Looking through your list, how sure are you that your colored options are better than the two guys you're cutting?
Here are the 4 drops you run in black:
Of those, if I'm playing an aggro deck, the only cards for sure that I would want over MTM or LG in an aggro build are Nether Void and Braids.
Here are the 4 drops you run in white:
Of those, if I'm playing an aggro deck, the only cards for sure that I would want over MTM or LG in an aggro build are Armageddon, Elspeth, and Parallax Wave (and situationally, but not definitely, Restoration Angel).
Here are the 4 drops you run in red:
Of those, if I'm playing an aggro deck, the only cards for sure that I would want over MTM or LG in an aggro build are Koth, Hellrider, Riders, FTK, and Hero.
You don't support green or blue aggro, so I won't consider those. In your guild section, the only card for sure I would want over MTM or LG in an aggro build is Sorin, Lord of Innistrad.
So that's 11 four-drops that I think are strictly better than LG and MTM. Presumably there are several others that we rate differently, but even being expansive, let's say you rate 15 4 drops as better. That doesn't seem like a high enough density to me to drop two really good colorless aggro 4 drops, but hey, I'm not a statistician, and you're the one with the real-world experience.
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In any case, I'm confident that even if you don't want to cut both, you can at least cut one. I don't think that small cubes really need to run two 4-drop colorless aggro creatures.