Red utility land that taps for mana AND colorless, doesn't lose me tempo, and provides extra reach! Probably my favorite in the cycle just because we finally have a good option for a red utility land. This doesn't even have the sorcery clause that most deserts have! I don't think there was enough room for the text, haha.
Reminds me of Barbarian Ring, a card I don't run. Don't think it makes the cut for me but I will follow reports closely as I tend to value effects on lands incorrectly. 5 is ALOT for 2 damage to players, I get its off a land and you don't have to use it until it wins you the game but it still feels over priced.
I actually think this is pretty terrible. Four Mana to activate is incredibly expensive for a measly two damage that can't also serve as removal. I have to sac it, so it's not a repeatable source of reach without comboing with Crucible (or the new guy, which is in a different color). I would definitely run Barbarian Ring over this and I haven't had that in my list for a very long time.
Barbarian Ring always does damage to you, doesn't support colorless, and Threshold is generally harder to obtain than getting up to 5 mana. I can see this not being too appealing for those not supporting colorless matters, but this fills in a lot of things that I've been looking for and I can probably squeeze it in at 540.
I support colorless as well, and still don't think I want anything to do with this cycle. If it was sac any land instead of a desert (which will most likely just be this card in a cube environment) maybe I could see it as colorless/Crucible support. I think they are just too overpriced for the activation to be anything much more than a basic that fixes for both a color and colorless.
Barbarian Ring always does damage to you, doesn't support colorless, and Threshold is generally harder to obtain than getting up to 5 mana. I can see this not being too appealing for those not supporting colorless matters, but this fills in a lot of things that I've been looking for and I can probably squeeze it in at 540.
I think I would prefer Shivan Gorge over this. More splash able, more repeatable, supports colourless etc.
I would prefer this to Shivan Gorge since the removal carries a lot more weight, but Shivan Gorge isn't cubeable so there's that.
This is not removal. It only domes opponents. I would 100% play Shivan Gorge over this in a cube environment. It provides the same colorless support, has a cheaper activation, and is repeatable so it'll like have more damage output in the game to fill the role as reach strapped to a land.
I like Shivan Gorge, but this tapping for red is more appealing to me.
This cycle isn't necessarily great, but I recently cut the 5 allied painlands for the AKH cycling duals, so I'll probably be testing all but the blue one. There's a lot of synergies to be had with Magus / Crucible of Worlds / Life from the Loam / Primeval Titan / colorless cards for me to ignore at 540.
I especially like the fact that this gives Primeval Titan more toys to play with, being able to search for burn / giant growth / team anthem / removal now in addition to manlands / other utility lands.
It's not that much of a bonus. I think cubes at 540 are a bit too tight to justify what are corner cases here, especially since the 'spell' is both forced to be sorcery speed and incredibly expensive. Unless I need the 2 damage for lethal or to kill a PWer, the 5 mana/turn grind for 2 damage to the face will be relevant only in a small percentage of matches, and that's the major selling point of this card.
Well steve_man I'm with you on your evaluation of these and am very high on all of them outside of the blue one for cube. They have relevant effects, tap for colorless, tap for colored, enter untapped, don't require threshold (like Barbarian Ring and Cabal Pit), and synergize with all kinds of cards that care about lands in (or going to) the yard. I was actually mildly blown away that they're printing these, and can't wait to cast my Thought-Knot Seer's and Reality Smasher's slightly more consistently in decks without mana rocks.
I would prefer this to Shivan Gorge since the removal carries a lot more weight, but Shivan Gorge isn't cubeable so there's that.
This is not removal. It only domes opponents. I would 100% play Shivan Gorge over this in a cube environment. It provides the same colorless support, has a cheaper activation, and is repeatable so it'll like have more damage output in the game to fill the role as reach strapped to a land.
It's important to note that this can pick off planeswalkers, which is the cherry on top for me when it comes to the red, green, and white (not so much) Desert.
This seems very playable in red aggressive decks. No very good in the mirror though. Low power level but low opportunity cost to play this card. Barbarian Ring always hurts you and threshold is incredibly hard to reach in a proper aggressive deck, much more so than getting to 5 mana. Shivan Gorge does not provide colored mana, so it has to compete with all the other colorless lands such as manlands. Playing this over a mountain will not have a visible drawback on most winnable games.
Obviously, these don't have a great track record, but this does something that only Barbarian Ring shares, which is replace a mountain untapped. It also doesn't always burn you, and is easier (if more expensive) to activate. If any of these lands are playable, this would be the one to add, I think.
Nevertheless, despite being a totally fine card that could seamlessly replace a mountain most red decks, this struggles to be worth a slot: it never does all that much, and it's not really a high pick.
This seems very playable in red aggressive decks. No very good in the mirror though. Low power level but low opportunity cost to play this card. Barbarian Ring always hurts you and threshold is incredibly hard to reach in a proper aggressive deck, much more so than getting to 5 mana. Shivan Gorge does not provide colored mana, so it has to compete with all the other colorless lands such as manlands. Playing this over a mountain will not have a visible drawback on most winnable games.
I agree with this word for word. However, the real opportunity cost is the opportunity cost to include this card over another cube card.
It definitely would make red agro decks better over all. Is an unexciting low power low opportunity cost card the type of card you want to be supporting?
Overall this is very similar to barbarian ring in function.
I think if I was including a wastes package I'd strongly consider running these
Obviously, these don't have a great track record, but this does something that only Barbarian Ring shares, which is replace a mountain untapped. It also doesn't always burn you, and is easier (if more expensive) to activate. If any of these lands are playable, this would be the one to add, I think.
Nevertheless, despite being a totally fine card that could seamlessly replace a mountain most red decks, this struggles to be worth a slot: it never does all that much, and it's not really a high pick.
My thoughts exactly. A card I wouldn't mind having in any red aggro deck, but not a card I see pushing Anything out of my cube, or a card I see myself ever drafting unless something goes *really* wrong at the table.
I agree with this word for word. However, the real opportunity cost is the opportunity cost to include this card over another cube card.
It definitely would make red agro decks better over all. Is an unexciting low power low opportunity cost card the type of card you want to be supporting?
Overall this is very similar to barbarian ring in function.
I think if I was including a wastes package I'd strongly consider running these
Yes, that's the crux of it. The card has very low opportunity cost but low upside, so smaller cubes will not have the space for it. Wastes have very little to do with this land specifically, all commonly played colorless mana cards are not aggressive in nature like this land clearly is. In a large cube I think there is little reason not to play this. FWIW, some players here are excited for the card.
My thoughts exactly. A card I wouldn't mind having in any red aggro deck, but not a card I see pushing Anything out of my cube, or a card I see myself ever drafting unless something goes *really* wrong at the table.
I think you would be wrong not to pick this reasonably highly. You should not be hurting for playables, after all. The land should also effortlessly table back to you.
I think the lands are great and I'd definately play the red one in a aggressive deck. Having a "free" shock to face is amazing for the fast decks, but I can't see myself cutting a cube card for any of these lands.
Also really not a fan of the sorcery clause, makes them too one dimensional imo.
Red utility land that taps for mana AND colorless, doesn't lose me tempo, and provides extra reach! Probably my favorite in the cycle just because we finally have a good option for a red utility land. This doesn't even have the sorcery clause that most deserts have! I don't think there was enough room for the text, haha.
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Worse than that, the land needs to tap so I'd call it 5 mana to activate.
I think I would prefer Shivan Gorge over this. More splash able, more repeatable, supports colourless etc.
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This is not removal. It only domes opponents. I would 100% play Shivan Gorge over this in a cube environment. It provides the same colorless support, has a cheaper activation, and is repeatable so it'll like have more damage output in the game to fill the role as reach strapped to a land.
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This cycle isn't necessarily great, but I recently cut the 5 allied painlands for the AKH cycling duals, so I'll probably be testing all but the blue one. There's a lot of synergies to be had with Magus / Crucible of Worlds / Life from the Loam / Primeval Titan / colorless cards for me to ignore at 540.
I especially like the fact that this gives Primeval Titan more toys to play with, being able to search for burn / giant growth / team anthem / removal now in addition to manlands / other utility lands.
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It's important to note that this can pick off planeswalkers, which is the cherry on top for me when it comes to the red, green, and white (not so much) Desert.
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Balduvian Trading Post, Barbarian Ring, Blighted Gorge, Keldon Megaliths, Keldon Necropolis, Shivan Gorge, Stensia Bloodhall, and Leechridden Swamp.
Obviously, these don't have a great track record, but this does something that only Barbarian Ring shares, which is replace a mountain untapped. It also doesn't always burn you, and is easier (if more expensive) to activate. If any of these lands are playable, this would be the one to add, I think.
Nevertheless, despite being a totally fine card that could seamlessly replace a mountain most red decks, this struggles to be worth a slot: it never does all that much, and it's not really a high pick.
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I agree with this word for word. However, the real opportunity cost is the opportunity cost to include this card over another cube card.
It definitely would make red agro decks better over all. Is an unexciting low power low opportunity cost card the type of card you want to be supporting?
Overall this is very similar to barbarian ring in function.
I think if I was including a wastes package I'd strongly consider running these
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My thoughts exactly. A card I wouldn't mind having in any red aggro deck, but not a card I see pushing Anything out of my cube, or a card I see myself ever drafting unless something goes *really* wrong at the table.
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Yes, that's the crux of it. The card has very low opportunity cost but low upside, so smaller cubes will not have the space for it. Wastes have very little to do with this land specifically, all commonly played colorless mana cards are not aggressive in nature like this land clearly is. In a large cube I think there is little reason not to play this. FWIW, some players here are excited for the card.
I think you would be wrong not to pick this reasonably highly. You should not be hurting for playables, after all. The land should also effortlessly table back to you.
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It doesn't hit creatures, but having 2 additional direct damage ready can mean the difference between winning and losing for an RX aggro deck.
In the end, it is just as mediocre as the rest of the red utility land options. Which means it has an actual shot of getting a slot over those.
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