The 6 mana versions are in the intro decks, not really part of the set. The 6 mana Chandra is worse than the 4 mana Chandra even if you ignore the mana cost, which probably says something.
And now there seems to be a second Chandra? Similar abilities but way worse. Same with Nissa, there's 2 of her too? Very odd.
The extra Chandra and Nissa are from the Planeswalker Decks, a new type of theme decks that come with their own (worse but still standard-legal) planeswalker cards.
The second set of planeswalkers are for the new intro standard-legal product. There will be two (bad) planeswalkers printed for each (!!!) standard legal set from here on out. There will also be one uncommon and one common printed for each of the two decks that will be standard legal, and will also be basically unplayable garbage.
Thanks everyone, I did some googling and found out about those decks but got very confused as I assumed the cards were part of the set, which I guess they are. I did think the rare which tutors and the uncommon with the extra effect based on the planeswalker being in play were gonna be very forced for the set and take up a bunch of set real-estate.
Looking for a point of comparison for Chandra's abilities:
-Her first +1 is basically unprecedented and where her real money is made. Planeswalkers that tick up for card draw at CMC <=4 generally have major conditional requirements; all Chandra asks is that you draw a spell you can cast, and if you don't you still get value. Compared to Chandra, Pyromaster's 0 ability, you're less likely to get card advantage, but more likely to get value when you can't otherwise make use of the card, and that's a fair trade-off when considering the ability is +1 instead of 0.
-Viewing that same ability through the lens of purely dealing damage, the point of comparison is Chandra, Roaring Flame: hard to do a fair evaluation of, but one plays that card explicitly because flipping it and repeatedly upticking is so powerful. It doesn't have Koth levels of upside, but not interacting in combat is a major benefit on stabilized boards.
-Her second +1 is basically the same as Garruk Wildspeaker. Less abusable with multi-tap lands, but that's still imo the best ability on Garruk, and Chandra starts out at more loyalty.
-Her -3 is exactly the same as Sarkhan, the Dragonspeaker. This was never Sarkhan's best ability, but in coming down a turn earlier your opponent will rarely have a creature that this can't kill. Other 4 CMC walkers like Ajani Vengeant, Ral Zarek, and Nahiri the Harbinger also have downtick removal; Chandra's ability is not necessarily better than these, but it is the least conditional.
-Most PW ultimates are game-winners, but Chandra's abilities highly incentivize ticking up towards it. In the manner of Liliana, the Last Hope, I expect this to be one of the most frequently ult-ed planeswalkers in the cube.
Random cube thought:
This has got to be the highest priority card to draft in a wildfire strategy (besides wildfire and power)...
-Acting as a mana rock to cast the wildfire earlier
-being able to kill bigger creatures the turn wildfire resolves (up to 8 toughness)
-A (quickly) game ending threat AND a mana rock in one for post wildfire world
Unprecedented...
In random good stuff cube deck, think she is clearly below JTMS level, but in ramp/wildfire decks I prefer her more than JTMS.
[b]In random good stuff cube deck, think she is clearly below JTMS level
What's making it clear, I don't get it. People are referring to it like if it was obvious... And again, only cube speaking, nothing to do with constructed formats.
I've played a few cube games with her, in a Mardu wildfire+planeswalker kind of deck, and she was really good. The -3 is a great panic button but leaves her seriously vulnerable. The first +1 ability is great if you cast her into an empty board, and great if you're jonesing to draw something you need, though I didn't get to use it much. The second +1 was way better than I would have expected. Two extra mana is actually a lot. I played a game where I had 4 lands and got to cast multiple 6-drops.
She's not particularly amazing at everything she does, but she just does so many things. I'm impressed so far.
Good to hear it seems like in general (not just in cube) that the RR ability's underrated, but yeah, wow, glad to finally see a red PW that works in all venues of red (I never really played Koth in nonaggro.)
I've been putting a lot of mental calories into my "You Make The Cube" submission (it's a pauper cube) and drafting it at ye olde LGS but man, this was the card that made me regret that decision to not draft the regular cube. :/
Played her today in a Boros wildfire deck and was very impressed. This walker literally helps you advance your game in every way possible. Card advantage, ramp, removal, win con. It seemed like I was always able to protect her pretty easily (ramp and draw helped a lot Iin This regard, and got her ultimate off a couple different times. I could also see her sulfuric vortex mode being really clutch in aggro decks. I don't know if we've had a walker this pushed since jms, seriously. I want to marry this card.
Just checking in on Chandra. She continues to perform very well for us in pretty much anything we throw her in; I was wondering if that WASN'T the case for anybody else.
[b]In random good stuff cube deck, think she is clearly below JTMS level
What's making it clear, I don't get it. People are referring to it like if it was obvious... And again, only cube speaking, nothing to do with constructed formats.
Sorry, I missed this...
It's hard to articulate how good the brainstorm ability is from JTMS in a deck with answers. The value/selection it generates spirals out of control significantly quicker than any other 3/4 mana planewalker if left unchecked.
Chandra doesn't take over the game at the same rate JTMS does. Also, if they are both answered the turn after they comes into play, the brainstorm leaves a bigger impact than anything chandra can do (rare exceptions exist).
The combination of an absurd value generation ability WITH the ability to protect itself, generate high loyalty AND lock out a game in a dominant board position is just so good.
Chandra is better for ramp strategies (The +RR is so good) , but as a value generation engine, or an immediate game ending threat, she fails in comparison.
For those of you that are concerned about price, Chandra is currently ~$18 due to relatively little pro tour play, and is continuing to drop. I'd pick one up before any new cards are spoiled. I was able to snag a listing on TCGplayer just now at $17.74.
I think i was reading somewhere that no modern red mythic was above $10, so if I was a smart man I'd still wait on it.
Red Mythics worth over $10:
Kiki-Jiki
Sneak Attack
Red RARES worth over $10:
Goblin Guide
umm....
Okay yeah true. BUT I'd rather lose $5-7 now then wait until Q2 2018 for Kaladesh to rotate out. There's a second listing for $17.60 Chandra right now.
I bought my Chandra at pre release, my buddy who doesn't play much opened one up and got him to go down a couple bucks. I don't mind too much, he's in a tough spot right now in life and I wanted to help him out a bit.
The extra Chandra and Nissa are from the Planeswalker Decks, a new type of theme decks that come with their own (worse but still standard-legal) planeswalker cards.
BGW ABZAN WGB
BGR JUND RGB
Makes sense now.
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I'm hopeful this means more pushed 4 ability walkers in the future, maybe the four drop Liliana that will eventually come
http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=484979
-Her first +1 is basically unprecedented and where her real money is made. Planeswalkers that tick up for card draw at CMC <=4 generally have major conditional requirements; all Chandra asks is that you draw a spell you can cast, and if you don't you still get value. Compared to Chandra, Pyromaster's 0 ability, you're less likely to get card advantage, but more likely to get value when you can't otherwise make use of the card, and that's a fair trade-off when considering the ability is +1 instead of 0.
-Viewing that same ability through the lens of purely dealing damage, the point of comparison is Chandra, Roaring Flame: hard to do a fair evaluation of, but one plays that card explicitly because flipping it and repeatedly upticking is so powerful. It doesn't have Koth levels of upside, but not interacting in combat is a major benefit on stabilized boards.
-Her second +1 is basically the same as Garruk Wildspeaker. Less abusable with multi-tap lands, but that's still imo the best ability on Garruk, and Chandra starts out at more loyalty.
-Her -3 is exactly the same as Sarkhan, the Dragonspeaker. This was never Sarkhan's best ability, but in coming down a turn earlier your opponent will rarely have a creature that this can't kill. Other 4 CMC walkers like Ajani Vengeant, Ral Zarek, and Nahiri the Harbinger also have downtick removal; Chandra's ability is not necessarily better than these, but it is the least conditional.
-Most PW ultimates are game-winners, but Chandra's abilities highly incentivize ticking up towards it. In the manner of Liliana, the Last Hope, I expect this to be one of the most frequently ult-ed planeswalkers in the cube.
Cubetutor Link
This has got to be the highest priority card to draft in a wildfire strategy (besides wildfire and power)...
-Acting as a mana rock to cast the wildfire earlier
-being able to kill bigger creatures the turn wildfire resolves (up to 8 toughness)
-A (quickly) game ending threat AND a mana rock in one for post wildfire world
Unprecedented...
In random good stuff cube deck, think she is clearly below JTMS level, but in ramp/wildfire decks I prefer her more than JTMS.
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Oh damn, I didn't even think about that.
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What's making it clear, I don't get it. People are referring to it like if it was obvious... And again, only cube speaking, nothing to do with constructed formats.
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She's not particularly amazing at everything she does, but she just does so many things. I'm impressed so far.
I've been putting a lot of mental calories into my "You Make The Cube" submission (it's a pauper cube) and drafting it at ye olde LGS but man, this was the card that made me regret that decision to not draft the regular cube. :/
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Sorry, I missed this...
It's hard to articulate how good the brainstorm ability is from JTMS in a deck with answers. The value/selection it generates spirals out of control significantly quicker than any other 3/4 mana planewalker if left unchecked.
Chandra doesn't take over the game at the same rate JTMS does. Also, if they are both answered the turn after they comes into play, the brainstorm leaves a bigger impact than anything chandra can do (rare exceptions exist).
The combination of an absurd value generation ability WITH the ability to protect itself, generate high loyalty AND lock out a game in a dominant board position is just so good.
Chandra is better for ramp strategies (The +RR is so good) , but as a value generation engine, or an immediate game ending threat, she fails in comparison.
Last Updated 02/07/24
Streaming Standard/Cube on Twitch https://www.twitch.tv/heisenb3rg96
Strategy Twitter https://www.twitter.com/heisenb3rg
This is still the best place for high-power-level cube chat & debate.
Here's to many more years at MTGS *clink*
http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=484979
Red Mythics worth over $10:
Kiki-Jiki
Sneak Attack
Red RARES worth over $10:
Goblin Guide
umm....
Okay yeah true. BUT I'd rather lose $5-7 now then wait until Q2 2018 for Kaladesh to rotate out. There's a second listing for $17.60 Chandra right now.
This is still the best place for high-power-level cube chat & debate.
Here's to many more years at MTGS *clink*
Blood Moon is $30+, and Sneak Attack is not modern legal.
Also, follow us on twitter! @TurnOneMagic
I bought my Chandra at pre release, my buddy who doesn't play much opened one up and got him to go down a couple bucks. I don't mind too much, he's in a tough spot right now in life and I wanted to help him out a bit.
My High Octane Unpowered Cube on CubeCobra