@LucidVision: I can see your argument for running Grim Monolith here, but I don't think it's really necessary as this deck unlocks nearly all of its spells at 4 mana, so the Talismans seem sufficient here. I wouldn't bat an eye if he decided to run with or without it though. Hoof, on the other hand, is a card that does not belong here. This deck doesn't seem like it can get to 8 mana reliably and his only other way to get it out would be to Rec Nightmare it, but he lacks the enablers to help him get it in the yard. FWIW, I would have loved if he ran Meren instead of Vraska because he wouldn't have been able to pop my Dack instantly. Meren at T3 would've been a lot easier to deal with than Vraska.
- I had Trostani / Knight of Autumn in a pool UWg pool. I almost went Bant, but ended up straight up Azorius mainly because Trostani conflicted with my Vedalken Shackles / Sower of Temptation / Treachery. Something to keep in mind with Trostani in blue shells.
- Vraska had a strong showing in a 3-0 Jund Recurring Nightmare deck I had yesterday where I forced her P1P4. The first time I cast Vraska I nuked a Dack Fayden, then my Vraska / mana dork got shot down by Arc Lightning. Was eventually able to Witness back my Vraska and just outgrinded my opponent with Vraska + Phyrexian Arnea. The other two times I cast Vraska basically sealed my opponent's fate because Vraska just buried them in card advantage. Only one showing, so far, but I see a lot of possibilities with Bitterblossom / Ophiomancer / Bloodghast / any other token generator / etc. Being able to re-use Abrupt Decay so I can hold onto my other removal spells for larger targets is big game. While I don't think Vraska is a 360 staple (I think she's #4 Golgari at best), but don't underestimate her usefulness. Abrupt Decay + Phyrexian Arena / sac outlet / incramental life gain is no joke. Will test extensively in midrange / stax / control shells.
Not main decking Grim monolith seems wrong? Mind twist, lots of colorless symbols, chance for double recurring nightmare turns etc. Probably play that and craterhoof. Cut diabolic edict and ... Arena probably? Have a lot of engines and no life gain other than vraska (holla).
I do like Vraska quite a bit in this kind of deck, though, not sure it would be better than Meren of Clan nel toth in this build
Grim Monolith was actually my P1P1 but I typically won’t play it unless I’m ramping up to 6 or have a lot of 5 drops I want to rush out. Shreikmaw and Zealous Conscripts aren’t exactly the type of 5 drops you want to play early. I already had enough ramp with mana dorks / signets to rush out my 4 drops.
Meren arguably could’ve been better in this shell, but Vraska is more versatile and can probably fit into more decks.
@LucidVision: I can see your argument for running Grim Monolith here, but I don't think it's really necessary as this deck unlocks nearly all of its spells at 4 mana, so the Talismans seem sufficient here. I wouldn't bat an eye if he decided to run with or without it though. Hoof, on the other hand, is a card that does not belong here. This deck doesn't seem like it can get to 8 mana reliably and his only other way to get it out would be to Rec Nightmare it, but he lacks the enablers to help him get it in the yard. FWIW, I would have loved if he ran Meren instead of Vraska because he wouldn't have been able to pop my Dack instantly. Meren at T3 would've been a lot easier to deal with than Vraska.
You seem focused on nut curves, but this is a grindy deck that is looking to take the game longish. I disagree pretty strongly that it struggles to get to 8 mana, especially if you run the monolith. Over half of the deck is mana sources and there's multiple sources of card draw.. A card that wins the game on the spot no matter what your opponent has out seems like great to have access to. With multiple token generators, and sticky threats it's likely to do so. The mana curve is pretty tight compared to it's mana sources, so the downside of it getting clogged in your hand in the early-mid game is relatively low, compared to when you have multiple 7-8 drops.
The more I think about it, cutting phyrexian arena is probably wrong, given how essential it is that the deck sticks a card advantage engine. There's zero big threats.. Another reason why I like the craterhoof.
Don't think either card is a criminal omission tho. Won't reply after this as to not derail thread further!
Thousand-Year Storm <- Keranos, God of Storms: Keranos doesn't really support any synergies I care about, and Storm seems like the sickest Storm enabler. I can't think of a 7-mana sequence of cube spells that doesn't just sound like Game Over.
Mardu Strike Leader <- Midnight Reaper: I know it's bad, but I like cards with overlapping Zombie Tribal and Stax support, and Strike Leader isn't quite cutting it.
Thinking about Tajic, Legion's Edge <- Nahiri, the Harbinger, since I don't run OG Eldrazi and Boros 4s are already crowded. I don't love Tajic, but he seems closer to what I want from Boros. (but TBH Renegade Wheelsmith might be closer still. :/)
Reluctant enough to drop Catacomb Sifter for Assassin's Trophy for archetype reasons that I'm letting myself get priced out.
So, I am just curious, which guilds of ravnica cards are people most excited about adding to their cubes?
I feel like my number one card from this set as far as excitement goes is Pelt Collector. I'm adding a suite of green aggro with him, and I'm super happy to be testing the next few drafts out. I'm also very excited about Tajic and Aurelia. My slot only had 1 creature in Figure of Destiny, and I'm happy to get a little more aggressive with Tajic and support RW Wildfire decks with another 5 toughness flyer (but for 4cmc!). I totally get people loving Trophy and Knight of Autumn for their raw power, but for me, those we tough, grindy cuts. I'm happy about the power upgrade, but just not "excited" to see unavoidable updates in slots where we didn't need them.
Knight of Autumn was amazing. I killed Grafted Wargear to win a game, and blew up a Wurmcoil Engine that my opponent had stolen from me. Oh and I recurred it with Reveillark. 10/10 I love this card.
Goblin Cratermaker was maindecked and slowed its opponent from being able to curve Yavimaya Elder into Natural Order. The 2/2 body was also able to get some damage through in that game.
Aurelia, Exemplar of Justice pretty much singlehandedly smashed its Gruul Wildfire opponent. Aurelia piled on the damage, both as a 4/5 and when pumping other (otherwise outclassed) creatures.
Got a good amount of GRN experience in cube. Assassin’s Trophy / Goblin Cratermaker / Knight of Autumn are all straight forward. They’re good and everybody knows it.
Legion Warboss
- Obviously solid, the question is where it lies on the totem pole of aggro 3-drops. Honestly I think it might be the worst of the bunch consisting of Hanweir Garrison / Goblin Rabblemaster / Najeela. I’m currently running all 4 at 540.
Vraska, Golgari Queen
- This was my pick for sleeper of the set and she's been performing well. She doesn’t require too much build around, and she’s a good source of removal / card draw. As I said before, she’s one of the planeswalkers that fits the Jace, Unraveler of Secrets / Ob Nixilis Reignited mold, but at 4 mana (which only JTMS / Chandra, ToD fit at 4-cmc). I think Vraska is top 4 Golgari at best. I like Deed / Trophy / Pulse more, but afterwards it’s just personal preference. I’d probably give the nod to Abrupt Decay in a powered cube over Vraska, but Vraska having that built in on top of being a card draw engine / sac outlet makes her a much more interesting card.
Trostani Discordant
- She’s somewhere between Cloudgoat Ranger and Angel of Invention. Has way more synergies than CGR and is very cubeable.
Doom Whisperer
I’ve yet to personally play Doom Whisperer, but he seems to be doing well for others who have played it in my group. It’s hard for me to gauge just how good he is because you really need to be the pilot to see exactly how valuable his Surveil ability is.
Tajic / Aurelia I have on “good enough to cube with but I don’t have the space for them.” Decided to keep my Boros section as is, but am looking forward to playing them in other cubes. Pelt Collector is also a great option, but I currently do not support green aggro.
Doom Whisperer was maindecked, but got Memory Lapsed and Reflector Maged by my UW tempo deck, and its controller was behind so he didn't pay life. Not impressed so far, though the deck that was playing the Whisperer did seem like it actively wanted the card. Will continue to test.
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Grim Monolith was actually my P1P1 but I typically won’t play it unless I’m ramping up to 6 or have a lot of 5 drops I want to rush out. Shreikmaw and Zealous Conscripts aren’t exactly the type of 5 drops you want to play early. I already had enough ramp with mana dorks / signets to rush out my 4 drops.
Meren arguably could’ve been better in this shell, but Vraska is more versatile and can probably fit into more decks.
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You seem focused on nut curves, but this is a grindy deck that is looking to take the game longish. I disagree pretty strongly that it struggles to get to 8 mana, especially if you run the monolith. Over half of the deck is mana sources and there's multiple sources of card draw.. A card that wins the game on the spot no matter what your opponent has out seems like great to have access to. With multiple token generators, and sticky threats it's likely to do so. The mana curve is pretty tight compared to it's mana sources, so the downside of it getting clogged in your hand in the early-mid game is relatively low, compared to when you have multiple 7-8 drops.
The more I think about it, cutting phyrexian arena is probably wrong, given how essential it is that the deck sticks a card advantage engine. There's zero big threats.. Another reason why I like the craterhoof.
Don't think either card is a criminal omission tho. Won't reply after this as to not derail thread further!
Last Updated 02/07/24
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Sinister Sabotage <- Dissolve: Straight upgrade. Less weird arm/lady-butt-pose.
Mardu Strike Leader <- Midnight Reaper: I know it's bad, but I like cards with overlapping Zombie Tribal and Stax support, and Strike Leader isn't quite cutting it.
Thinking about Tajic, Legion's Edge <- Nahiri, the Harbinger, since I don't run OG Eldrazi and Boros 4s are already crowded. I don't love Tajic, but he seems closer to what I want from Boros. (but TBH Renegade Wheelsmith might be closer still. :/)
Reluctant enough to drop Catacomb Sifter for Assassin's Trophy for archetype reasons that I'm letting myself get priced out.
I think Knight of Autumn just feels like an auto-include, so flexible. Aggro, life gain, removal, she just does it all.
Maybe also, Trostani Discordant The anthem is strong, and I support white/green tokens. The Selesnya cards are so strong in this set.
Behemoth Sledge->Knight of Autumn
Ajani, Valiant Protector->Trostani Discordant
Boros Reckoner-> Tajic, Legion's Edge
I feel like my number one card from this set as far as excitement goes is Pelt Collector. I'm adding a suite of green aggro with him, and I'm super happy to be testing the next few drafts out. I'm also very excited about Tajic and Aurelia. My slot only had 1 creature in Figure of Destiny, and I'm happy to get a little more aggressive with Tajic and support RW Wildfire decks with another 5 toughness flyer (but for 4cmc!). I totally get people loving Trophy and Knight of Autumn for their raw power, but for me, those we tough, grindy cuts. I'm happy about the power upgrade, but just not "excited" to see unavoidable updates in slots where we didn't need them.
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Knight of Autumn was amazing. I killed Grafted Wargear to win a game, and blew up a Wurmcoil Engine that my opponent had stolen from me. Oh and I recurred it with Reveillark. 10/10 I love this card.
Goblin Cratermaker was maindecked and slowed its opponent from being able to curve Yavimaya Elder into Natural Order. The 2/2 body was also able to get some damage through in that game.
Aurelia, Exemplar of Justice pretty much singlehandedly smashed its Gruul Wildfire opponent. Aurelia piled on the damage, both as a 4/5 and when pumping other (otherwise outclassed) creatures.
Assassin's Trophy and Legion Warboss were maindecked, but I never saw either of them cast.
Doom Whisperer was 14th pick and not maindecked.
Tajic, Legion's Edge and Pelt Collector were not in the packs.
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Legion Warboss
- Obviously solid, the question is where it lies on the totem pole of aggro 3-drops. Honestly I think it might be the worst of the bunch consisting of Hanweir Garrison / Goblin Rabblemaster / Najeela. I’m currently running all 4 at 540.
Vraska, Golgari Queen
- This was my pick for sleeper of the set and she's been performing well. She doesn’t require too much build around, and she’s a good source of removal / card draw. As I said before, she’s one of the planeswalkers that fits the Jace, Unraveler of Secrets / Ob Nixilis Reignited mold, but at 4 mana (which only JTMS / Chandra, ToD fit at 4-cmc). I think Vraska is top 4 Golgari at best. I like Deed / Trophy / Pulse more, but afterwards it’s just personal preference. I’d probably give the nod to Abrupt Decay in a powered cube over Vraska, but Vraska having that built in on top of being a card draw engine / sac outlet makes her a much more interesting card.
Trostani Discordant
- She’s somewhere between Cloudgoat Ranger and Angel of Invention. Has way more synergies than CGR and is very cubeable.
Doom Whisperer
I’ve yet to personally play Doom Whisperer, but he seems to be doing well for others who have played it in my group. It’s hard for me to gauge just how good he is because you really need to be the pilot to see exactly how valuable his Surveil ability is.
Tajic / Aurelia I have on “good enough to cube with but I don’t have the space for them.” Decided to keep my Boros section as is, but am looking forward to playing them in other cubes. Pelt Collector is also a great option, but I currently do not support green aggro.
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Tajic, Legion's Edge was a last pick and not maindecked.
Doom Whisperer was maindecked, but got Memory Lapsed and Reflector Maged by my UW tempo deck, and its controller was behind so he didn't pay life. Not impressed so far, though the deck that was playing the Whisperer did seem like it actively wanted the card. Will continue to test.
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