A full list of results, with all cards that received votes, can be found on this Google spreadsheet.
Thanks to all 29 voters!
Allred123, Salmo, wtwlf123, steve_ice, Bo5Dey, bondafong, Tactuz, AntiPox, willdice, voiddisciple, Visserdix, cuttups, Dhaos Dragmire, Steve_man, Ennex, Spike Rogue, Star Slayer, stonecrowe, pillar, LucidVision, Zetsu_Sensei, Shivan_Knight, Mike Pemulis, Dr.Tom, rantipole, Merfolk Magic, qlogan, calibretto, Hicham, psly4mne, sunshinesoldier, Sower of Temptation, KMAYER, Krazedkarl
Tendencies, Useless Rantings, and Facts (TURF)
* Just Missed - Arcane Savant (2.76), Mystical Tutor (2.50), Tolarian Academy (2.06)
* Returning Champions - Ancestral Recall and Time Walk remain undefeated at the #1 and #2 spots since the beginning of the Power Rankings in 2009.
* Big Hitters - Ancestral Recall, Time Walk, and Upheaval are the only Blue cards that received votes from everyone this year.
* Rookies of the Year - Mystic Confluence and Jace, Vryn's Prodigy are the only cards printed since last year's Power Rankings to crack this year's list.
* Better Late Than Never - Show and Tell and Consecrated Sphinx have been in print for years, but are appearing in the Blue Top 20 for the first time this year.
* Biggest Riser - Opposition moved from #16 in last year's Power Rankings to #9 this year.
* Fall From Grace - Vedalken Shackles and took the hardest fall (from #10 to #18) while remaining in this year's Top 20. Fact or Fiction (1.94), Phyrexian Metamorph (1.74), Venser, Shaper Savant (0.91), and Meloku, the Clouded Mirror (0.44) fell out of the Power Rankings completely this year.
* The More Things Change the More They Stay the Same - In spite of all the changes since last year Ancestral Recall, Time Walk, Tinker, Upheaval, Treachery, Snapcaster Mage, and Bribery all kept the exact same spots in the Power Rankings that they held last year.
* Is this really part of the Power 9? - Timetwister received NO votes in this year's Power Rankings.
* 46 Blue cards received votes in this year's Power Rankings
These results are really solid. I don't see much to disagree with. Although the rankings are a bit different, I only have a single card difference from my top 20 - I rated Mystical Tutor over Consecrated Sphinx.
Wooooow, are Vedalken Shackles low. WTF. I would pretty much swap Shackles with Snapcaster. Those placements would be far more accurate, imo.
Also, Arcane Savant really should have been on the list of the 20 most powerful blue cards...
Otherwise, the list is pretty much what I expected. No further complaints from me. Apart from the Snapcaster/Shackles swap, I have exactly the same cards in my top 10 and mostly with the same placements.
Snapcaster is so much better than Shackles, I don't consider those cards on the same level at all. Snap casting a Recall or Timewalk is insane and one of the many silly things you can do with Snapcaster in the large swath of decks he works in, whereas Shackles is a card that requires a *heavy* blue commitment to be good. Yeah it can be a shutdown card--made the top 20 for a reason--but Snapcaster mage really does that much more.
I agree with you Salmo. We cut Vedalken Shackles in any case, since decks with such a heavy blue commitment are hard to build when drafting Winston. Good card but I probably wouldn't have rated it top 20 anyway. Ratings seem good - if I'd voted in time, Arcane Savant would probably have made the group list!
Wooooow, are Vedalken Shackles low. WTF. I would pretty much swap Shackles with Snapcaster. Those placements would be far more accurate, imo.
Also, Arcane Savant really should have been on the list of the 20 most powerful blue cards...
Otherwise, the list is pretty much what I expected. No further complaints from me. Apart from the Snapcaster/Shackles swap, I have exactly the same cards in my top 10 and mostly with the same placements.
Keep in mind a lot of people play powered cubes here and are rating it from their experience with those cubes. It's going to distort certain rankings as some cards are WAY better in powered environments and others are much better in unpowered.
Vedalken shackles is better in a large unpowered cube, as there should be much less artifact destruction floating around, and the format is slower.
Snapcaster is better in a small powered cube, as flashing back blue power is very broken and a relevant part of why the card is (correctly) rated so high.
I find it crazy that despite MANY people here touting Jace, Memory Adept as "too good/unfun" for cube me and Krazedkarl were the only ones to vote on it at all...
Bumpy ride for Meloku the Clouded Mirror. It started in 2009 as 5th (higher than Tinker and Upheaval! It has been downhill since then: 2010 it was 8th, 2014 it was 15th and 2015 it was 19th.
I find it crazy that despite MANY people here touting Jace, Memory Adept as "too good/unfun" for cube me and Krazedkarl were the only ones to vote on it at all...
I can't speak for anyone else who didn't vote for it, but it wouldn't be a particularly high pick for me as a control finisher in blue because it does nothing to protect itself or its controller. If you're behind on board, casting Jace, Memory Adept does nothing to help you stabilize or pull ahead on board. It may be able to end the game in 2-3 turns, but only if you've already used other cards to help stabilize. All of the control finishers I run in my cube and voted for either help do that in some way, or at least cost less than 4 mana (e.g. Jace Beleren).
On the other hand, Sword of Body and Mind is a mill-10 card I rate quite highly because it does help stabilize the board by making Wolf tokens that can buy time while you're milling the opponent, and also by enhancing any blocker you have on board.
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I still like Shackles at lot, and I thought about voting for it, but the heavy islands requirement is bummer and kept it off my list (and I just haven't seen it dominiate any games lately).
I find it crazy that despite MANY people here touting Jace, Memory Adept as "too good/unfun" for cube me and Krazedkarl were the only ones to vote on it at all...
I don't know about other people, but I think he's good but maybe not even good enough, *and* unfun.
---
Edit: I'm not really surprised or disappointed, but I am wondering: how do you feel about Counterspell? It easily made my list, but very few other lists. I know it's a bit boring and there are (a few) other counterspells available. But the same could be said about Lighting Bolt, and I'm sure that will make the red list. Couterspell is still the best hard counter after Mana Drain, and has saved by butt sooo many times. Counterspell doesn't win games, but it keeps you from losing them, which is just as important.
I'm a big fan of tempo decks, so I rank the creature theft effects very highly. Treachery, Control Magic, and Vedalken Shackles all made my top 10. The tempo and card advantage they provide often win games on the spot, and they can help turn around a game where you're behind like few other cards do. Shackles requires a lot of Islands in the deck, but once that bar is cleared it dominates pretty much any game where the opponent isn't dropping Titans and Eldrazi (and sometimes even then) unless they have artifact removal.
I'm not really surprised or disappointed, but I am wondering: how do you feel about Counterspell? It easily made my list, but very few other lists. I know it's a bit boring and there are (a few) other counterspells available.
Counterspell made my list, and quite a few others, so it came in at #27. For any blue spell, that's not bad, but it's not as splashy as a lot of the finishers and card advantage spells, so I'm not surprised to see it not making the top 20. Unlike the spot removal in other colors, countermagic also requires a specific enough timing window in order to do anything at all, so that's another reason it might not be ranked that highly by many. Something else to keep in mind is that there are 5 other counterspell variants that were voted on that didn't make the list (Force of Will, Cryptic Command, Mana Leak, Daze, and Condescend). Just like burn spells in red and spot removal spells in any color, there are only so many slots most people are willing to devote to any one kind of effect, so in a sense the counterspells are all competing against each other as well as the rest of the cards in blue. Counterspell was voted as the 3rd best counterspell for cube, and that sounds about right to me.
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I find it crazy that despite MANY people here touting Jace, Memory Adept as "too good/unfun" for cube me and Krazedkarl were the only ones to vote on it at all...
Maybe that was consensus when it was first revealed, but after running him for a while we found him to either be a game winner or a giant dud and not much in between. I could maybe see bringing him back at 720 or higher, but I think he's probably the second worst Jace. He's definitely not a top 20 card, in my opinion.
I'm really surprised at Bribery in the top 20. It's trash against any deck not running good targets for it, which turns out to be a large number of decks. Even when it's good, being a 5 mana sorcery is a strict limit on how good it is. I cut it from my cube years ago for being bad.
Arcane Savant, it seems, didn't make the list solely because too many people decided to disregard the vote to include draft-matters cards.
Arcane Savant, it seems, didn't make the list solely because too many people decided to disregard the vote to include draft-matters cards.
I don't think that's true. I didn't include it because I don't yet think it's a top 20 card. It's completely dependent on the cards you pick up during the draft. It's power level ranges from broken to solid to mediocre. With a range like that, it was hard for me to rank it as a top 20 blue card. With that said the card has only had a couple months of play in the cube. Maybe next year with more experience it'll be ranked higher.
Or...Bribery is consistently great for us, and we're just starting to see the power of Savant? I think that's more-so the case for a majority of people. Can't argue your experiences, but I know what mine have been as well.
You may be right. I've been consistently surprised over the years that people in different groups pick Bribery highly and consider it a good card. There was an interesting discussion on the card on Reddit a while back, the takeaway being that its power varies heavily by cube environment and matchup. My group's view was just about universal agreement that the card was too narrow.
Arcane Savant, it seems, didn't make the list solely because too many people decided to disregard the vote to include draft-matters cards.
I don't think that's true. I didn't include it because I don't yet think it's a top 20 card. It's completely dependent on the cards you pick up during the draft. It's power level ranges from broken to solid to mediocre. With a range like that, it was hard for me to rank it as a top 20 blue card. With that said the card has only had a couple months of play in the cube. Maybe next year with more experience it'll be ranked higher.
I've yet to see it be mediocre, it's baseline is solidly playable and it's ceiling is actually just winning on the spot. (There are a lot of 1 card infinite combos with it, or 1 card and any random sac outlet with a reanimation spell.) It depends on what's in the cube how consistently amazing it can be, but it really doesn't take much. When the worst reasonable case is a 3/3 Nekretaal for 5, the card is really good, and it's ceiling makes it very worthy of the top 20.
TL;DR The card is very often a one card splinter twin combo, and should be evaluated as such. (Though usually sans haste.)
EDIT: Oh, and if you thought upheaval was good, picking arcane savant makes it 1 cheaper and automatically buy itself back.
Coming back to the Snapcaster Mage versus Vedalken Shackles discussion, I have to say that Shackles is so much better than Snapcaster, I don't consider those cards on the same level at all. The former has a good one-shot effect and is only a great card because it is undercosted by 1. The latter just dominates games against any kind of fair deck. Dominates them.
Getting a second use out of an instant or sorcery and also a "free" 2/1 is great, but nothing compared to a card that straight up says to your opponent: Do you have artifact removal? No? Then you lose!
And the only thing that Shackles asks of you is to play blue as (one of) your (two) main color(s). Just run 8-10 islands (which includes dual lands with that land type and fetch lands that can get you a land of that type) and you will just crush any aggro or midrange opponent. Note that this is the normal amount of fitting lands that you would run in a normal two-color cube deck. Really no big hoop to jump through.
Vedalken Shackles is the statistically best performing non-red card in that cube.
This didn't surprise me at all. From the Channel Fireball cube videos that featured this card and from my experience with my own cube, I can only say it again: Shackles just crushes fair decks. This absolutely puts it above a good one-shot effect like Snapcaster.
I think that games are dominated by efficiently costed spells, and Snapcaster has absolutely been the better performer. Snapcaster replays the most powerful and impactful spells in your yard, in another window where they can be hugely impactful on the game. I think Shackles is a fine card, but easily only the 3rd best creature theft effect, and it fails to steal a lot of the bigger threats that unfair decks use to win games with. Shackles didn't even make my list this year.
Oh, and regarding the MTGO cube statistics ...last year's Legacy cube results had Riftwing Cloudskate as the blue card present the most winning lists. I'd take that information with a grain of salt.
We play fair decks, but we also play a lot of non-fair decks. Like if that's your environment then your point stands and is valid for you, but it's not ours so YMMV.
Coming back to the Snapcaster Mage versus Vedalken Shackles discussion, I have to say that Shackles is so much better than Snapcaster, I don't consider those cards on the same level at all. The former has a good one-shot effect and is only a great card because it is undercosted by 1. The latter just dominates games against any kind of fair deck. Dominates them.
Getting a second use out of an instant or sorcery and also a "free" 2/1 is great, but nothing compared to a card that straight up says to your opponent: Do you have artifact removal? No? Then you lose!
And the only thing that Shackles asks of you is to play blue as (one of) your (two) main color(s). Just run 8-10 islands (which includes dual lands with that land type and fetch lands that can get you a land of that type) and you will just crush any aggro or midrange opponent. Note that this is the normal amount of fitting lands that you would run in a normal two-color cube deck. Really no big hoop to jump through.
Vedalken Shackles is the statistically best performing non-red card in that cube.
This didn't surprise me at all. From the Channel Fireball cube videos that featured this card and from my experience with my own cube, I can only say it again: Shackles just crushes fair decks. This absolutely puts it above a good one-shot effect like Snapcaster.
You have yet to acknowledge the point I made earlier
Large Unpowered cubes without much artifact removal, shackles is the better card. Both your cube and legacy cube fit that description.
Mid sized or smaller powered cubes, snapcaster is the better card and ITS NOT CLOSE.
The "fair" decks (which is around half the field) tend to have multiple ways to deal with shackles... (or kill the opponent before it comes online).
And many unfair decks kill in a way that ignores shackles altogether.
Snapcasters versaility , mana efficiency and ability to flashback power make it an incrddible incredible card.
It's less "bomby" but it guarantees its value every time, every matchup , and flashing back power is game breaking.
You lack of understanding or acknowledgement between the differences of cube environments is crucial to the flaw in your perception of the cards.
2 Time Walk - 19.06
3 Mana Drain - 17.56
4 Tinker - 15.24
5 Jace, the Mind Sculptor - 14.85
6 Upheaval - 14.24
7 Treachery - 12.76
8 Snapcaster Mage - 11.59
9 Opposition - 10.65
10 Mystic Confluence - 8.56
11 True-Name Nemesis - 6.88
12 Jace, Vryn's Prodigy - 6.65
13 Vendilion Clique - 5.53
14 Show and Tell - 4.21
15 Dig Through Time - 4.12
16 Glen Elendra Archmage - 4.00
17 Bribery - 3.68
18 Vedalken Shackles - 3.29
19 Control Magic - 3.21
20 Consecrated Sphinx - 2.85
A full list of results, with all cards that received votes, can be found on this Google spreadsheet.
Thanks to all 29 voters!
Allred123, Salmo, wtwlf123, steve_ice, Bo5Dey, bondafong, Tactuz, AntiPox, willdice, voiddisciple, Visserdix, cuttups, Dhaos Dragmire, Steve_man, Ennex, Spike Rogue, Star Slayer, stonecrowe, pillar, LucidVision, Zetsu_Sensei, Shivan_Knight, Mike Pemulis, Dr.Tom, rantipole, Merfolk Magic, qlogan, calibretto, Hicham, psly4mne, sunshinesoldier, Sower of Temptation, KMAYER, Krazedkarl
Tendencies, Useless Rantings, and Facts (TURF)
* Just Missed - Arcane Savant (2.76), Mystical Tutor (2.50), Tolarian Academy (2.06)
* Returning Champions - Ancestral Recall and Time Walk remain undefeated at the #1 and #2 spots since the beginning of the Power Rankings in 2009.
* Big Hitters - Ancestral Recall, Time Walk, and Upheaval are the only Blue cards that received votes from everyone this year.
* Rookies of the Year - Mystic Confluence and Jace, Vryn's Prodigy are the only cards printed since last year's Power Rankings to crack this year's list.
* Better Late Than Never - Show and Tell and Consecrated Sphinx have been in print for years, but are appearing in the Blue Top 20 for the first time this year.
* Biggest Riser - Opposition moved from #16 in last year's Power Rankings to #9 this year.
* Fall From Grace - Vedalken Shackles and took the hardest fall (from #10 to #18) while remaining in this year's Top 20. Fact or Fiction (1.94), Phyrexian Metamorph (1.74), Venser, Shaper Savant (0.91), and Meloku, the Clouded Mirror (0.44) fell out of the Power Rankings completely this year.
* The More Things Change the More They Stay the Same - In spite of all the changes since last year Ancestral Recall, Time Walk, Tinker, Upheaval, Treachery, Snapcaster Mage, and Bribery all kept the exact same spots in the Power Rankings that they held last year.
* Is this really part of the Power 9? - Timetwister received NO votes in this year's Power Rankings.
* 46 Blue cards received votes in this year's Power Rankings
Many thanks again to everyone who participated!
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Also, Arcane Savant really should have been on the list of the 20 most powerful blue cards...
Otherwise, the list is pretty much what I expected. No further complaints from me. Apart from the Snapcaster/Shackles swap, I have exactly the same cards in my top 10 and mostly with the same placements.
Uril, the Miststalker RGW -- Ulamog, the Infinite Gyre C -- Vhati il-Dal BG -- Jor Kadeen, the Prevailer RW -- Animar, Soul of Elements URG
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Keep in mind a lot of people play powered cubes here and are rating it from their experience with those cubes. It's going to distort certain rankings as some cards are WAY better in powered environments and others are much better in unpowered.
Vedalken shackles is better in a large unpowered cube, as there should be much less artifact destruction floating around, and the format is slower.
Snapcaster is better in a small powered cube, as flashing back blue power is very broken and a relevant part of why the card is (correctly) rated so high.
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I can't speak for anyone else who didn't vote for it, but it wouldn't be a particularly high pick for me as a control finisher in blue because it does nothing to protect itself or its controller. If you're behind on board, casting Jace, Memory Adept does nothing to help you stabilize or pull ahead on board. It may be able to end the game in 2-3 turns, but only if you've already used other cards to help stabilize. All of the control finishers I run in my cube and voted for either help do that in some way, or at least cost less than 4 mana (e.g. Jace Beleren).
On the other hand, Sword of Body and Mind is a mill-10 card I rate quite highly because it does help stabilize the board by making Wolf tokens that can buy time while you're milling the opponent, and also by enhancing any blocker you have on board.
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Shackles is good, but I like Treachery and Control Magic more, and didn't have room for a 3rd effect of that ilk on my top 20 list.
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I don't know about other people, but I think he's good but maybe not even good enough, *and* unfun.
---
Edit: I'm not really surprised or disappointed, but I am wondering: how do you feel about Counterspell? It easily made my list, but very few other lists. I know it's a bit boring and there are (a few) other counterspells available. But the same could be said about Lighting Bolt, and I'm sure that will make the red list. Couterspell is still the best hard counter after Mana Drain, and has saved by butt sooo many times. Counterspell doesn't win games, but it keeps you from losing them, which is just as important.
Counterspell made my list, and quite a few others, so it came in at #27. For any blue spell, that's not bad, but it's not as splashy as a lot of the finishers and card advantage spells, so I'm not surprised to see it not making the top 20. Unlike the spot removal in other colors, countermagic also requires a specific enough timing window in order to do anything at all, so that's another reason it might not be ranked that highly by many. Something else to keep in mind is that there are 5 other counterspell variants that were voted on that didn't make the list (Force of Will, Cryptic Command, Mana Leak, Daze, and Condescend). Just like burn spells in red and spot removal spells in any color, there are only so many slots most people are willing to devote to any one kind of effect, so in a sense the counterspells are all competing against each other as well as the rest of the cards in blue. Counterspell was voted as the 3rd best counterspell for cube, and that sounds about right to me.
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Maybe that was consensus when it was first revealed, but after running him for a while we found him to either be a game winner or a giant dud and not much in between. I could maybe see bringing him back at 720 or higher, but I think he's probably the second worst Jace. He's definitely not a top 20 card, in my opinion.
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Arcane Savant, it seems, didn't make the list solely because too many people decided to disregard the vote to include draft-matters cards.
I don't think that's true. I didn't include it because I don't yet think it's a top 20 card. It's completely dependent on the cards you pick up during the draft. It's power level ranges from broken to solid to mediocre. With a range like that, it was hard for me to rank it as a top 20 blue card. With that said the card has only had a couple months of play in the cube. Maybe next year with more experience it'll be ranked higher.
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I've yet to see it be mediocre, it's baseline is solidly playable and it's ceiling is actually just winning on the spot. (There are a lot of 1 card infinite combos with it, or 1 card and any random sac outlet with a reanimation spell.) It depends on what's in the cube how consistently amazing it can be, but it really doesn't take much. When the worst reasonable case is a 3/3 Nekretaal for 5, the card is really good, and it's ceiling makes it very worthy of the top 20.
TL;DR The card is very often a one card splinter twin combo, and should be evaluated as such. (Though usually sans haste.)
EDIT: Oh, and if you thought upheaval was good, picking arcane savant makes it 1 cheaper and automatically buy itself back.
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Getting a second use out of an instant or sorcery and also a "free" 2/1 is great, but nothing compared to a card that straight up says to your opponent: Do you have artifact removal? No? Then you lose!
And the only thing that Shackles asks of you is to play blue as (one of) your (two) main color(s). Just run 8-10 islands (which includes dual lands with that land type and fetch lands that can get you a land of that type) and you will just crush any aggro or midrange opponent. Note that this is the normal amount of fitting lands that you would run in a normal two-color cube deck. Really no big hoop to jump through.
Just this week, I listed to the What's In The Box podcast episode with Randy Buehler. He talks a bit about the performance of cards in the MTGO Legacy cube.
Uril, the Miststalker RGW -- Ulamog, the Infinite Gyre C -- Vhati il-Dal BG -- Jor Kadeen, the Prevailer RW -- Animar, Soul of Elements URG
Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker R -- Maga, Traitor to Mortals B -- Ghave, Guru of Spores BGW -- Sliver Hivelord WUBRG
Oh, and regarding the MTGO cube statistics ...last year's Legacy cube results had Riftwing Cloudskate as the blue card present the most winning lists. I'd take that information with a grain of salt.
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My Article - "Cube Design Philosophy"
My Article - "Mana Short: A study in limited resource management."
My 49th Set (P)review - Discusses my top 20 Cube cards from MKM!
Also, follow us on twitter! @TurnOneMagic
You have yet to acknowledge the point I made earlier
Large Unpowered cubes without much artifact removal, shackles is the better card. Both your cube and legacy cube fit that description.
Mid sized or smaller powered cubes, snapcaster is the better card and ITS NOT CLOSE.
The "fair" decks (which is around half the field) tend to have multiple ways to deal with shackles... (or kill the opponent before it comes online).
And many unfair decks kill in a way that ignores shackles altogether.
Snapcasters versaility , mana efficiency and ability to flashback power make it an incrddible incredible card.
It's less "bomby" but it guarantees its value every time, every matchup , and flashing back power is game breaking.
You lack of understanding or acknowledgement between the differences of cube environments is crucial to the flaw in your perception of the cards.
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