Most of us (including myself) run the Swords of X and Y, and Jitte.
I'm still working on my set of 5 swords actually, and have a bit of space. I'm running Loxodon Warhammer as a placeholder, thinking about Grafted Wargear, and I thought this would be good as a larger discussion.
How many of you are ONLY running Swords & Jitte for Equipment? Anybody not running any of them at all? How many "middling equipments" (IE non-sword / jitte equipments) are people running on top of Swords and Jitte? At what cube size? How would you rank them against each other?
And some of the pseudo-equipment commonly run: Batterskull Skullclamp
This thread isn't really about these cards; they're staples, but don't really function as traditional equipment.
Truly strong equipment cards are few and far between - after way overdoing it during the first Mirrodin (with the swords in particular), they realized the error of their ways and trimmed way back in subsequent sets.
So most of the decent "middling" equipment can be found in Mirrodin. Some ones you don't mention here: Horned Helm - A very cheap equip cost and the relevant trample make this a decent re-usable buff. The ability to equip during combat is occasionally relevant too. Specter's Shroud and Mask of Memory - These give fairly powerful "saboteur" effects at a cheap cost. Shroud has a nice +1 power to boot. Vulshok Morningstar - Just a solid stat boost, makes any dude relevant. Machete may be slightly better, but the +2 toughness is a good buff. Empyrial Plate - My favorite underutilized equipment card. With just two cards in hand, it's a Morningstar. With 4-6 (which is not impossible to do), it's a force to be reckoned with. I've won many a casual game off of a turn one Soltari Foot Soldier, turn two Plate, turn three equip, turn four Armageddon. T3 Troll Ascetic, Mirran Crusader, or similar into turn four play and equip plate can be a huge swing as well.
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I am running the whole sword cycle, Jitte, Grafted Wargear, Batterskull, Skullclamp, Bonesplitter and the Greaves. I'm fine with those and I don't think any other equipment would help to power the cube. Maybe Mortap Pod could be fine at 720. It add a sac-outlet that brings some utily to the board but seems a bit fair to me. I've already try Loxodon Warhammer and wasn't a huge fan of it. Cost a lot of mana while being pretty easy to handle for your opponent.
This seems to be plenty, but since aggro decks seem to want equipment the most if I wanted more equipment in my cube I'd add Trusty Machete and Darksteel Axe, and in that order. Both of these equipment were great for me as budget placeholders until I complete the Sword cycle.
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Bonesplitter comes down early and does a lot of work. Greaves and Wargear are nice because they're free to equip (albeit with a downside for Wargear). Warhammer's lifelink + trample is a nice boost.
As others have said, truly powerful equipment is far and few between. If I were to try and categorize, it would go something like this:
Top Tier (I don't run any of this in my lower powered environment):
Jitte, Clamp, Swords, Batterskull
Middle Tier (still good enough for high powered environments):
Grafted Wargear, Bonesplitter, Lightning Grieves, Loxodon Warhammer, Basilisk Collar (IMO anyway)
Everything else IMO is lower powered and meta dependent.
Bonehoard for example is pretty good in a graveyard centric cube (and ridiculous in multi-player). I run and like this card a great deal. Sword of Vengeance is super bad compared to the broken swords, but reusable +2/+0, Vigilance, First Strike, Trample, Haste is no joke and turns pretty much anything you play later in the game into an instant threat that can't easily be blocked favorably in combat. MortarPod is perfectly serviceable especially if you need more sac outlets. Adventuring Gear is pretty cool as well but requires you put some energy into making the landfall trigger reliable. You can also use exploration type effects along with fetches to get explosive turns. It can actually be better than bonesplitter since the +2 toughness can often be relevant in combat. It's a very fun piece of equipment in my experience.
I recently cut Loxodon Warhammer when I added the three Swords from Scars of Mirrodin block (previously had only the Darksteel ones since they are my favourites). It's slow but generally causes sizable life swings when it connects. It was a pet card of sorts, if my Cube was bigger I'd have kept it.
I currently have the Swords, Umezawa's Jitte, Batterskull, Skullclamp, Grafted Wargear, Bonesplitter, Lightning Greaves and I feel that's plenty for a 360 cube. Even the non-broken ones have good uses.
Fireshrieker and Armor are close to being cut (there are so many effects handing out double strike now, that I can probably find something better than Fireshrieker, and Argentum Armor is too slow, even in my Multiplayer environment). I am a big fan of Whispersilk Cloak, though - that card has helped produce some impressive wins. If you run it, it will be Lesson A in why you should maindeck artifact removal.
I also note that none of the Peasant/Pauper guys have trundled in here yet to point out that Cranial Plating is basically a first-pick in their environment.
At 555, I think I have all the equipment I need between the five Swords, Jitte, Skullclamp, Bonesplitter, Wargear, Lightning Greaves, and Batterskull. My On Deck binder currently has the following should I ever go up in size or feel the need to add more equipment for some reason.
Basilisk Collar
Sai of the Shinobi
Silver-Inlaid Dagger
Empyrial Plate
Mortarpod
Trusty Machete
Loxodon Warhammer
Another I've considered but never tested is Infiltration Lens. Basically gives unblockable unless your opponent can't take the hit, in which case it is basically clamp.
Bonesplitter
As an excellent midrange equipment. Trusty Machete
For the same reason as Bonesplitter. Mask of Memory
For value decks that want to filter their hands and to delve into their good stuff. Mortarpod
For the token decks and Goblin Sharpshooter decks. Grafted Wargear
As arguably better than a Sword of X&Y in some decks. Batterskull
Because Stoneblade is a deck. Skullclamp
It's powered cube. Who the hell wouldn't run this!?
At the moment the Sword I'm missing is Fire & Ice, so I have Jitte, Clamp, Skull, 4 Swords, Bonesplitter (pretty huge aggro card imo), and Loxodon Warhammer in place of the last sword. That's at 450.
Sounds like people enormously favor Wargear over Warhammer though, which lines up with my thoughts about swapping them (believe it or not I've never cubed with Wargear). Do you guys generally prefer Bonesplitter over Machete? I'm also surprised how many people are running Greaves, is that as a bolster to midrange (sort of a colorless fires)? Overall, it seems like my equipment count is slightly lower than average.
Sounds like people enormously favor Wargear over Warhammer though, which lines up with my thoughts about swapping them (believe it or not I've never cubed with Wargear).
I definitely recommend that swap. Grafted Wargear is so good in aggro decks. Being able to cast and equip it to a 2-drop on turn 3 and swing for 5 or 6 is a really strong play and worth the risk of the occasional 2-for-1. As far as I'm concerned Wargear is an aggro staple.
Do you guys generally prefer Bonesplitter over Machete?
Absolutely. That 1 discount on the equip cost is much more important than the +0/+1 on Machete. It means you can swing for 4 with a Jackal Pup or Diregraf Ghoul on turn 2, and moving it ties up less mana. Both of these are critical for the aggro decks that want this equipment.
I'm also surprised how many people are running Greaves, is that as a bolster to midrange (sort of a colorless fires)?
Exactly, but the shroud is also big game for midrange against control , which is where they need the help most.
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So what is actually making people shy away from Loxodon Warhammer? I've had it in my cube since the beginning but now that I actually think about it I don't think I see it played too much. Also just how good has Trusty Machete been for people? Does it do a good enough comparison to Bonesplitter and is the toughness worth the extra mana?
I hate Lightning Greaves because I feel like it never did anything. But I think the best it ever performed when I ran it was in value town decks that wanted to haste out creatures that are overpowered with haste like the titans. The Stoneblade deck actually kind-of liked it where it ideally ran Jitte, Batterskull and Greaves to protect Geist and haste out SFM. But I mean one equipment for one deck is pretty weaksauce in my book.
I play Trusty Machete because it is almost like running two Bonesplitter. They're not entirely comparable but it's a nice replacement if someone else snatched up the Bonesplitter or it didn't make it in the draft.
Lightning Greaves was almost always taken by green. Synergizes well with Kalonian Hydra, Wolfir Silverheart and the fatties. The mana dorks end up paying for themselves once you have the Greaves out too. Protects your guys from Control Magic effects. It's a really good midrange card.
So what is actually making people shy away from Loxodon Warhammer?
It's 6 mana for +3/+0, trample and lifelink. That's not an unfair cost mind you (since it's reusable on other dudes for just 3), but it's a massive tempo hit to take if you get your dude killed in response to the equip. This risk is worth it with the swords for example not just because it's 1 mana cheaper but also because the swords provide CA (or Pseudo CA) and just way way more value by comparison.
Equip cost matters. The more it is, the bigger the tempo loss so the ROI needs to be worth it.
Playing a piece of equipment is already a tempo loss since you are generally getting nothing out of it until you equip it to a body. This is acceptable in an aggressive deck if you can get that tempo back by making your dudes bigger. Warhammer does this poorly compared to other more aggressive options. Bonesplitter is +2 power for a total cost of 2 (that's twice as efficient as Warhammer). Wargear is +3 for 3. That's why they are great in aggressive decks and warhammer isn't.
Warhammer is fine in midrange strategies, but even there you'd just rather get way more value from a sword for ultimately less mana.
For me the main reason that I'm looking to cut Warhammer is the lack of toughness buff. Equip cost is also a concern, but it's really the combination of the two; often you pay 3 to equip only for your creature to trade (granted it'll push damage with trample and gain you some life), forcing you to either hold back your attacker or pay 3 to re-equip each turn, a huge upkeep cost compared to Bonesplitter and makes it feel VERY slow in practice (whereas Wargear seems like the opposite, quite fast, so I'd like to try it). That's been my most common experience with it in gameplay, though it's obviously great on creatures with evasion, first strike, regenerators like Troll Ascetic, etc, but that's an issue to me: general-purpose equipment like that ought to be strong on any creature in your deck.
Basically, if I'm spending 3 mana to equip I want it to improve a creature's survivability. On the other hand, not many equips offer substantial lifegain & evasion in one package.
The equip cost on Warhammer was ultimately the problem. If you can afford it, it's a strong effect. But it was too costly too often.
Bonesplitter is much better than Machete, being able to equip for less mana without sacrificing the additional pressure the card provides is key.
Wargear is a beating, and is definitely a card I'd get in there asap. It's better than some Swords are in a lot of decks.
Greaves needs to go into a deck that either has targets that you really want to protect, or targets that can abuse the haste. So ramp decks are ideally suited to take advantage of it, because it can protect your Rofellos/Treespeaker until you drop your Titan or Primus, when you can transfer the Greaves to that threat for insane profit. It's also a great way to protect fragile engine creatures that are cornerstones for your strategy like Welder, Metalworker and Fauna Shaman for their respective decks. It can be used as a pseudo Fires effect for midrange decks that curve from mana dorks into 5+ power 4-6 drops, giving each haste along the way and applying additional pressure. Lastly, it can be used to protect expensive creatures that can't defend themselves, like Baneslayer, Kalonian Hydra and Consecrated Sphinx, where it shores up their only weaknesses. It's not just an equipment you toss into any deck and profit, but it's very good in the right deck or with the right targets.
I've seen no mention to Sylvok Lifestaff yet and I have to speak up for it. Sure, it can't really be compared to the sheer efficiency of Bonesplitter, but I think it is way better than all the other cheap 1-Drop Equipment not named Bonesplitter or Skullclamp. Both the casting AND the equip cost are cheap, the +1/+0 effect is small but far from irrelevant, and the lifegain clause helps aggro race/trade against midrange, breaks the aggro mirror in half, and is a good help in heavy Black decks (it helps with all the lifeloss). It's a small and unassuming card, but it was played in Cawblade (so it has at least some tournament pedigree) and I think it is (at least) testable in medium Cubes (around 540/600) and a solid inclusion at 720.
Lifestaff is definitely a good tier 2 equipment. The lifegain was always such a huge pain to get through when it was in my cube. Any sort of token maker + lifestaff = a pain for aggro decks.
I'm still working on my set of 5 swords actually, and have a bit of space. I'm running Loxodon Warhammer as a placeholder, thinking about Grafted Wargear, and I thought this would be good as a larger discussion.
How many of you are ONLY running Swords & Jitte for Equipment? Anybody not running any of them at all? How many "middling equipments" (IE non-sword / jitte equipments) are people running on top of Swords and Jitte? At what cube size? How would you rank them against each other?
Here are a few that I'm running, thought about running, was running at one point, or might expect people to consider running:
Loxodon Warhammer
Grafted Wargear
Bonesplitter
Basilisk Collar
Sword of Vengeance
Trusty Machete
Mortarpod
Lightning Greaves
What are some good ones not listed?
And some of the pseudo-equipment commonly run:
Batterskull
Skullclamp
This thread isn't really about these cards; they're staples, but don't really function as traditional equipment.
So most of the decent "middling" equipment can be found in Mirrodin. Some ones you don't mention here:
Horned Helm - A very cheap equip cost and the relevant trample make this a decent re-usable buff. The ability to equip during combat is occasionally relevant too.
Specter's Shroud and Mask of Memory - These give fairly powerful "saboteur" effects at a cheap cost. Shroud has a nice +1 power to boot.
Vulshok Morningstar - Just a solid stat boost, makes any dude relevant. Machete may be slightly better, but the +2 toughness is a good buff.
Empyrial Plate - My favorite underutilized equipment card. With just two cards in hand, it's a Morningstar. With 4-6 (which is not impossible to do), it's a force to be reckoned with. I've won many a casual game off of a turn one Soltari Foot Soldier, turn two Plate, turn three equip, turn four Armageddon. T3 Troll Ascetic, Mirran Crusader, or similar into turn four play and equip plate can be a huge swing as well.
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Bonesplitter
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This seems to be plenty, but since aggro decks seem to want equipment the most if I wanted more equipment in my cube I'd add Trusty Machete and Darksteel Axe, and in that order. Both of these equipment were great for me as budget placeholders until I complete the Sword cycle.
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Bonesplitter
Lightning Greaves
Grafted Wargear
Loxodon Warhammer
Bonesplitter comes down early and does a lot of work. Greaves and Wargear are nice because they're free to equip (albeit with a downside for Wargear). Warhammer's lifelink + trample is a nice boost.
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Top Tier (I don't run any of this in my lower powered environment):
Jitte, Clamp, Swords, Batterskull
Middle Tier (still good enough for high powered environments):
Grafted Wargear, Bonesplitter, Lightning Grieves, Loxodon Warhammer, Basilisk Collar (IMO anyway)
Everything else IMO is lower powered and meta dependent.
Bonehoard for example is pretty good in a graveyard centric cube (and ridiculous in multi-player). I run and like this card a great deal. Sword of Vengeance is super bad compared to the broken swords, but reusable +2/+0, Vigilance, First Strike, Trample, Haste is no joke and turns pretty much anything you play later in the game into an instant threat that can't easily be blocked favorably in combat. MortarPod is perfectly serviceable especially if you need more sac outlets. Adventuring Gear is pretty cool as well but requires you put some energy into making the landfall trigger reliable. You can also use exploration type effects along with fetches to get explosive turns. It can actually be better than bonesplitter since the +2 toughness can often be relevant in combat. It's a very fun piece of equipment in my experience.
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http://riptidelab.com/forum/threads/retro-combo-cube.1454/
Outside of those, you can use stuff like Loxodon Warhammer, Bonehoard, Sword of Vengeance, Mortarpod and Basilisk Collar as "middling" equipments if you need more.
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I currently have the Swords, Umezawa's Jitte, Batterskull, Skullclamp, Grafted Wargear, Bonesplitter, Lightning Greaves and I feel that's plenty for a 360 cube. Even the non-broken ones have good uses.
Fireshrieker and Armor are close to being cut (there are so many effects handing out double strike now, that I can probably find something better than Fireshrieker, and Argentum Armor is too slow, even in my Multiplayer environment). I am a big fan of Whispersilk Cloak, though - that card has helped produce some impressive wins. If you run it, it will be Lesson A in why you should maindeck artifact removal.
I also note that none of the Peasant/Pauper guys have trundled in here yet to point out that Cranial Plating is basically a first-pick in their environment.
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Another I've considered but never tested is Infiltration Lens. Basically gives unblockable unless your opponent can't take the hit, in which case it is basically clamp.
http://riptidelab.com/forum/threads/modular-cube-5-colors.800/
Retro combo cube thread
http://riptidelab.com/forum/threads/retro-combo-cube.1454/
Bonesplitter
As an excellent midrange equipment.
Trusty Machete
For the same reason as Bonesplitter.
Mask of Memory
For value decks that want to filter their hands and to delve into their good stuff.
Mortarpod
For the token decks and Goblin Sharpshooter decks.
Grafted Wargear
As arguably better than a Sword of X&Y in some decks.
Batterskull
Because Stoneblade is a deck.
Skullclamp
It's powered cube. Who the hell wouldn't run this!?
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Sounds like people enormously favor Wargear over Warhammer though, which lines up with my thoughts about swapping them (believe it or not I've never cubed with Wargear). Do you guys generally prefer Bonesplitter over Machete? I'm also surprised how many people are running Greaves, is that as a bolster to midrange (sort of a colorless fires)? Overall, it seems like my equipment count is slightly lower than average.
I definitely recommend that swap. Grafted Wargear is so good in aggro decks. Being able to cast and equip it to a 2-drop on turn 3 and swing for 5 or 6 is a really strong play and worth the risk of the occasional 2-for-1. As far as I'm concerned Wargear is an aggro staple.
Absolutely. That 1 discount on the equip cost is much more important than the +0/+1 on Machete. It means you can swing for 4 with a Jackal Pup or Diregraf Ghoul on turn 2, and moving it ties up less mana. Both of these are critical for the aggro decks that want this equipment.
Exactly, but the shroud is also big game for midrange against control , which is where they need the help most.
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I play Trusty Machete because it is almost like running two Bonesplitter. They're not entirely comparable but it's a nice replacement if someone else snatched up the Bonesplitter or it didn't make it in the draft.
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It's 6 mana for +3/+0, trample and lifelink. That's not an unfair cost mind you (since it's reusable on other dudes for just 3), but it's a massive tempo hit to take if you get your dude killed in response to the equip. This risk is worth it with the swords for example not just because it's 1 mana cheaper but also because the swords provide CA (or Pseudo CA) and just way way more value by comparison.
Equip cost matters. The more it is, the bigger the tempo loss so the ROI needs to be worth it.
Playing a piece of equipment is already a tempo loss since you are generally getting nothing out of it until you equip it to a body. This is acceptable in an aggressive deck if you can get that tempo back by making your dudes bigger. Warhammer does this poorly compared to other more aggressive options. Bonesplitter is +2 power for a total cost of 2 (that's twice as efficient as Warhammer). Wargear is +3 for 3. That's why they are great in aggressive decks and warhammer isn't.
Warhammer is fine in midrange strategies, but even there you'd just rather get way more value from a sword for ultimately less mana.
http://riptidelab.com/forum/threads/modular-cube-5-colors.800/
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http://riptidelab.com/forum/threads/retro-combo-cube.1454/
Basically, if I'm spending 3 mana to equip I want it to improve a creature's survivability. On the other hand, not many equips offer substantial lifegain & evasion in one package.
Bonesplitter is much better than Machete, being able to equip for less mana without sacrificing the additional pressure the card provides is key.
Wargear is a beating, and is definitely a card I'd get in there asap. It's better than some Swords are in a lot of decks.
Greaves needs to go into a deck that either has targets that you really want to protect, or targets that can abuse the haste. So ramp decks are ideally suited to take advantage of it, because it can protect your Rofellos/Treespeaker until you drop your Titan or Primus, when you can transfer the Greaves to that threat for insane profit. It's also a great way to protect fragile engine creatures that are cornerstones for your strategy like Welder, Metalworker and Fauna Shaman for their respective decks. It can be used as a pseudo Fires effect for midrange decks that curve from mana dorks into 5+ power 4-6 drops, giving each haste along the way and applying additional pressure. Lastly, it can be used to protect expensive creatures that can't defend themselves, like Baneslayer, Kalonian Hydra and Consecrated Sphinx, where it shores up their only weaknesses. It's not just an equipment you toss into any deck and profit, but it's very good in the right deck or with the right targets.
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