+1 look at top card of your library, if it's noncreature/nonland, put into your hand
-2 next instant/sorcery spell you cast has rebound
-9 emblem: opponent's can't cast noncreature cards
loyalty 6
I'm underwhelmed. Seems to not do enough for cube, but it is a cool card with a ton of loyalty for the cost. Perhaps if "spells matter" is heavily supported in your cube this could be pretty cool.
Yes, that's a very high starting loyalty, but she can't defend herself.
Decks with few creatures tend to have a high count of lands for being control, so her +1 is going to do nothing at least 40% of the time without support.
I'd need to read the W and U spells again to be sure, but I feel like her -2 would be better in red than blue. We'll see.
I like it quite a bit as a tool for UWx planeswalker/burn/wrath/etc control that generally runs very few creature finishers anyways. In something like that I imagine this has probably 50% chance of hitting with the +1, and that's not to mention that it essentially has 3 delayed Twincasts already built in. You can still plan on cool Plow Under shenanigans like Chandra 3.0, but on what is generally a much better walker for the most part. Plus, UW in bigger cubes is weak after the frontrunners as discussed in the UW command thread, so this is probably going to be a lock for me.
Well, I see the second ability and I see ridiculous value. Any draw spell, white removal or burn spell. It's like a 'fixed' Chandra, the Firebrand in that sense. I think this could be a great card for the control decks, the main drawback being the likelihood of having to use the rather mediocre [+1] on the turn it comes down. However, there are a vast number of excellent one CMC spells that can be rebounded satisfactorily, so waiting to have five mana up is probably the right play with this 'walker. And you can do that three times without having to [+1]. In the event you don't have a suitable spell, it may get you one and gets towards a reasonable ultimate, in a pinch. My first (very raw) impression is that it is a very attractive offering, but YMMV. A potential drawback is that rebound is a nonbo with counterspells, but it's just a consideration when deckbuilding, perhaps.
They only just spoiled this card and I'm already tired of playing against it in EDH, haha.
I don't really feel like she does a whole lot in cube, though. I prefer the UW cards I'm running, Venser, and the Command over her, and that's just off the top of my head.
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Total side note but I like how people are discussing running this over itself.
Well, it has to be said that Kolaghan is clearly better than Kolaghan. Considering what BR decks usually want and how stiff the competition in this guild is, there is no way that I would run Kolaghan over Kolaghan! Kolaghan might make it in as the sixth guild card or so. Kolaghan on the other hand ranks several places below that.
It was so funny to me when they described this as a downgrade to the original Zurgo during the Pax East panel. I was thinking if this is a downgrade, they should really "downgrade" all legendary creatures. Haha.
My deck designing is quite concise at this point:
1. Come up with deck idea
2. Realize this idea is somehow fundamentally similar to another deck I have or that is commonly played in my group
3. Decide I don't want to disassemble one of my existing decks
4. Give up and do nothing
I don't see the point of this new shroud mechanic. It's strictly worse than Hexproof. Threshold is pretty bad too, Delirium is a much better mechanic and probably easier to activate.
Otherwise this card is a pretty neat guy. Dodges removal and grows into a Primal Huntbeast. 3/5
Hm, even higher starting loyalty than Jace, the Living Guildpact (at the same cost). Occasional card advantage instead of reliable card selection on the + ability. More narrow, but cheaper - ability. Generally weaker, but potentially more annoying ultimate.
There are many spells that would love to get rebound. At least if you add red or black as a third color. The second ability can be a powerful source of card advantage. And using it still leaves her with a lot of loyalty.
The first ability will hit only around 1/3 of the time, even in most control decks. There are a few cards that let you manipulate the top of your library though.
She seems to be one of the weaker, more narrow planeswalkers, but I wouldn't rule her out. Could be a nice alternative to Venser, the Sojourner, if you care more about a spells matter theme than about a blink/bounce theme.
Venser was sucky here (each of the three times he was in). Narset also requires support in the form of other cards, but crucially, can potentially help you towards getting them, and costs the 2WU than Venser should have cost as a non self-sufficient engine card.
They only just spoiled this card and I'm already tired of playing against it in EDH, haha.
True that.
Hm, even higher starting loyalty than Jace, the Living Guildpact (at a cost of 4). Occasional card advantage instead of reliable card selection on the + ability. More narrow, but cheaper - ability. Generally weaker, but potentially more annoying ultimate.
There are many spells that would love to get rebound. At least if you add red or black as a third color. The second ability can be a powerful source of card advantage. And using it still leaves her with a lot of loyalty.
JtLG only gets one activation of his main ability, compared to three, and never gets you a card with his [+]. There's a reason that Jace sucks. I think you're right about red/black.
Are there any good blue or white spells to give rebound to though? Can't think of any...
There are almost no white spells that you would want to rebound. Several blue ones though. Even Brainstorm and friends are nice to rebound, since they become pure card advantage (and help set up the top of your library for Narset's next turn). The real meat lies in red or black, so she is more like a Jeskai/Grixis hybrid than a pure Azorius card.
Are there any good blue or white spells to give rebound to though? Can't think of any...
There are almost no white spells that you would want to rebound. Several blue ones though. Even Brainstorm and friends are nice to rebound, since they become pure card advantage (and help set up the top of your library for Narset's next turn). The real meat lies in red or black, so she is more like a Jeskai/Grixis hybrid than a pure Azorius card.
Rebounding a wrath means you get 2 turns of reprise. Rebounding Dig though Time or Treasure Cruise...nuff said
Are there any good blue or white spells to give rebound to though? Can't think of any...
Path/Swords, Council's Judgement, other single-target removal
Ancestral Recall, Ponder/Preordain/etc (a rebounded cantrip works very well with her +1 next turn), FoF/Dig, other draw spells
Time Walk!
Cryptic Command, Into the Roil
Show and Tell, Tinker, Bribery
Spectral Procession
I think this is definitely worth testing, but I'm a little bummed, since I was hoping to try to make room for Ojutai's Command (and, potentially, Ojutai?).
I'm going to give it a shot in my cube. My Azorius is currently Venser, Supreme Verdict, Detention Sphere and Judge's Familiar. While not the same slot, Judge's Familiar rarely gets played so I'll probably swap out those two and then tinker from there. Ojutai's Command will probably also be tested in that slot.
Excited for the card, foils of it are going to be gorgeous.
Why wouldn't the insta-tutors be good with Rebound? You automatically get to draw whatever you're looking for off the second one, any deck that would run the Tutors would probably be happy with two of them. Getting a mox one turn and a jitte/equipment deck could be next, or two removal spells off of Mystical Tutor, or...it goes on. Long story short, they seem awesome to rebound.
And I could see Wrath rebounding be nice, since it kind of acts like a Time Walk/doesn't really let your opponent cast any creatures.
But yeah, you obviously don't rebound a counterspell haha
Are there any good blue or white spells to give rebound to though? Can't think of any...
There are almost no white spells that you would want to rebound. Several blue ones though. Even Brainstorm and friends are nice to rebound, since they become pure card advantage (and help set up the top of your library for Narset's next turn). The real meat lies in red or black, so she is more like a Jeskai/Grixis hybrid than a pure Azorius card.
Rebounding a wrath means you get 2 turns of reprise. Rebounding Dig though Time or Treasure Cruise...nuff said
Getting to double up a Swords to Plowshares, Path to Exile, wrath, spectral procession, lingering souls, battle screech, council's judgement, or unexpectedly absent are all things I look forwards too.
I normally poo-poo new planeswalkers but this one gets me excited. Maybe this wiffs an just sucks up 7 damage. That is pretty good.
Why wouldn't the insta-tutors be good with Rebound? You automatically get to draw whatever you're looking for off the second one, any deck that would run the Tutors would probably be happy with two of them. Getting a mox one turn and a jitte/equipment deck could be next, or two removal spells off of Mystical Tutor, or...it goes on. Long story short, they seem awesome to rebound.
Because the turn order is Upkeep - Draw - Main, and the Tutors put the card on the top of the library. Rebound plays the card again in your upkeep, so you'd be fetching for a card to put on the top before you could draw the card you fetched the first time.
T1, Main: Use Narset's -2, cast Enlightened Tutor, put Jitte on the top of your library, exile Tutor.
T2, Upkeep: Tutor is cast again. Jitte is still on the library so either fetch it again or fetch something else and have Jitte shuffled.
T2, Draw: draw the Jitte or whatever else
T2, Main: you could use Narset's +1 now, but without knowing what's on top.
Ponder works better, IF you want two of the cards you look at when it rebounds (and one is noncreature nonland, of course). Just put the card Narset can get as the second-to-the-top.
You could probably make it work in blue where you draw the first one before your upkeep somehow. I see what you're saying now and get it, but there are def ways to make it work/be awesome. Your ponder example is ideal because the rebounded tutor acts like a can-be-better fetch in that you'll shuffle away cards you could not want from the ponder and get a card you absolutely want.
You -2, rebound the tutor, then on ur next upkeep step the second resolves, you draw that card, then have a guaranteed draw with the +1 since its your first tutored card.
You -2, rebound the tutor, then on ur next upkeep step the second resolves, you draw that card, then have a guaranteed draw with the +1 since its your first tutored card.
No because of the "shuffle your library" part of the Tutor. The first tutored card is still part of the library so it will be shuffled.
You could probably make it work in blue where you draw the first one before your upkeep somehow.
Yeah, maybe if you have the Tutor and Ponder you're better rebounding the tutor and using Ponder to get the first tutored card. Or if you have Jace 1.0 and Narset out (superfriends.dec?)
But at this point you're talking three-card combos and I tend not to believe in them when evaluating a card.
You -2, rebound the tutor, then on ur next upkeep step the second resolves, you draw that card, then have a guaranteed draw with the +1 since its your first tutored card.
-2 an enlightened tutor, the card goes on top.
During upkeep, second rebounded tutor happens, you search and shuffle.
THEN you draw.
So your first one is actually shuffled, as wildice pointed out to me.
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If I acquire this card, I think I'll try it over D-Sphere. I agree that now we have a lot of that O-Ring effect, and perhaps a two-colored one with a less-often bonus might be worth switching for a more unique card.
2UW
+1 look at top card of your library, if it's noncreature/nonland, put into your hand
-2 next instant/sorcery spell you cast has rebound
-9 emblem: opponent's can't cast noncreature cards
loyalty 6
I'm underwhelmed. Seems to not do enough for cube, but it is a cool card with a ton of loyalty for the cost. Perhaps if "spells matter" is heavily supported in your cube this could be pretty cool.
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Decks with few creatures tend to have a high count of lands for being control, so her +1 is going to do nothing at least 40% of the time without support.
I'd need to read the W and U spells again to be sure, but I feel like her -2 would be better in red than blue. We'll see.
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On spoiled card wishlisting and 'should-have-had'-isms:
I don't really feel like she does a whole lot in cube, though. I prefer the UW cards I'm running, Venser, and the Command over her, and that's just off the top of my head.
There are many spells that would love to get rebound. At least if you add red or black as a third color. The second ability can be a powerful source of card advantage. And using it still leaves her with a lot of loyalty.
The first ability will hit only around 1/3 of the time, even in most control decks. There are a few cards that let you manipulate the top of your library though.
She seems to be one of the weaker, more narrow planeswalkers, but I wouldn't rule her out. Could be a nice alternative to Venser, the Sojourner, if you care more about a spells matter theme than about a blink/bounce theme.
Uril, the Miststalker RGW -- Ulamog, the Infinite Gyre C -- Vhati il-Dal BG -- Jor Kadeen, the Prevailer RW -- Animar, Soul of Elements URG
Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker R -- Maga, Traitor to Mortals B -- Ghave, Guru of Spores BGW -- Sliver Hivelord WUBRG
True that.
JtLG only gets one activation of his main ability, compared to three, and never gets you a card with his [+]. There's a reason that Jace sucks. I think you're right about red/black.
On spoiled card wishlisting and 'should-have-had'-isms:
Uril, the Miststalker RGW -- Ulamog, the Infinite Gyre C -- Vhati il-Dal BG -- Jor Kadeen, the Prevailer RW -- Animar, Soul of Elements URG
Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker R -- Maga, Traitor to Mortals B -- Ghave, Guru of Spores BGW -- Sliver Hivelord WUBRG
Rebounding a wrath means you get 2 turns of reprise. Rebounding Dig though Time or Treasure Cruise...nuff said
Path/Swords, Council's Judgement, other single-target removal
Ancestral Recall, Ponder/Preordain/etc (a rebounded cantrip works very well with her +1 next turn), FoF/Dig, other draw spells
Time Walk!
Cryptic Command, Into the Roil
Show and Tell, Tinker, Bribery
Spectral Procession
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Excited for the card, foils of it are going to be gorgeous.
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Cubetutor
And I could see Wrath rebounding be nice, since it kind of acts like a Time Walk/doesn't really let your opponent cast any creatures.
But yeah, you obviously don't rebound a counterspell haha
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Getting to double up a Swords to Plowshares, Path to Exile, wrath, spectral procession, lingering souls, battle screech, council's judgement, or unexpectedly absent are all things I look forwards too.
I normally poo-poo new planeswalkers but this one gets me excited. Maybe this wiffs an just sucks up 7 damage. That is pretty good.
Because the turn order is Upkeep - Draw - Main, and the Tutors put the card on the top of the library. Rebound plays the card again in your upkeep, so you'd be fetching for a card to put on the top before you could draw the card you fetched the first time.
T1, Main: Use Narset's -2, cast Enlightened Tutor, put Jitte on the top of your library, exile Tutor.
T2, Upkeep: Tutor is cast again. Jitte is still on the library so either fetch it again or fetch something else and have Jitte shuffled.
T2, Draw: draw the Jitte or whatever else
T2, Main: you could use Narset's +1 now, but without knowing what's on top.
Ponder works better, IF you want two of the cards you look at when it rebounds (and one is noncreature nonland, of course). Just put the card Narset can get as the second-to-the-top.
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You can't in this specific scenario because we're discussing -2ing the tutor.
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No because of the "shuffle your library" part of the Tutor. The first tutored card is still part of the library so it will be shuffled.
Yeah, maybe if you have the Tutor and Ponder you're better rebounding the tutor and using Ponder to get the first tutored card. Or if you have Jace 1.0 and Narset out (superfriends.dec?)
But at this point you're talking three-card combos and I tend not to believe in them when evaluating a card.
Also limited to creature light control decks
Good card, but azorius is too stacked to justify a narrow card that isn't particularly interesting.
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-2 an enlightened tutor, the card goes on top.
During upkeep, second rebounded tutor happens, you search and shuffle.
THEN you draw.
So your first one is actually shuffled, as wildice pointed out to me.
---------------
If I acquire this card, I think I'll try it over D-Sphere. I agree that now we have a lot of that O-Ring effect, and perhaps a two-colored one with a less-often bonus might be worth switching for a more unique card.
Also, follow us on twitter! @TurnOneMagic
(CubeTutor & MTGS)
360 Peasant Cube!
Custom Cube
RWU Miracles RWU