Total zombie + zombie token maker in count in black = 7
I prefer graveborn muse, it's a solid card. When dealing with creatures that need to survive to generate value, 4 vs 5 is a big difference.
It has more upside potential too (a couple zombies + lifegain = legit engine).
Great synergy with Grey merchant too if you run that...
I had a brief phase where I was super high on solemn visitor (mostly due to playing it in constructed), so kept subbing them both out back and forth to get a better sense of what's better. I did this for maybe 10+ cubes heh.
Overall I settled on Lord of innistrad. It's better in a wider range of archetypes. Solemn visitor was disgusting in agro mirrors (the huge immediate lifegain is why it sees modern play over lord of innistrad, very important vs burn) and potentially better in tokens, but there were a bit too many matchups/deck where I wanted the planeswalker itself to be the stand alone threat.
Generating 2/2 flyers is great and all, but sorin innistrads ultimate is often game ending. Much easier for certain decks to come back vs a couple 2/2 flyers than a sorin ultimate.
Paradoxically, I don't really want Tomb for a deck running lots of expensive drops. The life loss gets out of hand fast. I would use it primarily as an aggro card. Lotus and Dynamo are ramp and Wildfire support.
I really like tomb, but not in every deck. I like it to faciliate explosive starts, and those explosive starts being hard to react to.
Going turn 1 tomb -> signet, turn 2 -> 4 drop or spew out artifact ramp can lead to very nutty starts.
or turn 1 elf, turn 2 tomb -> 4 drop in green
I'd say Tomb > dynamo >= Gilded lotus (not sure about that one).
I consistantly swap dynamo for gilded lotus and I never am convinced what is correct.
The three are all very close in my eyes tho fwiw, and work well together in conjunction with signets.
I like Lotus more than Dynamo, since Lotus can effectively cost 2 a reasonable amount of the time by allowing you to play a coloured spell on the same turn. Playing something significant with 3 compared to WWW, say, is much trickier.
I like Lotus more than Dynamo, since Lotus can effectively cost 2 a reasonable amount of the time by allowing you to play a coloured spell on the same turn. Playing something significant with 3 compared to WWW, say, is much trickier.
This is a good point in general. One of my design goals is to encourage decks that are 1.5-3 colors, so I'm playing Dynamo over Lotus.
I like Lotus more than Dynamo, since Lotus can effectively cost 2 a reasonable amount of the time by allowing you to play a coloured spell on the same turn. Playing something significant with 3 compared to WWW, say, is much trickier.
This is a good point in general. One of my design goals is to encourage decks that are 1.5-3 colors, so I'm playing Dynamo over Lotus.
I love lotus in my blue decks. Drop it turn 5 with a counter spell still up. Next turn I can uptap into upheavl with mana to spare.
I think Berserk is best but it is my favorite card of all time and stacks with double strike ( And used as removal a surprising amount of time) The pod never really got there and some people felt it was a trap. Cradle is fine, but only silly when you are way ahead(usually). It has a very minimal set up cost as most green decks play lots of creatures so I argue for its inclusion in even tiny cubes.
My pick: Gaea's Cradle can quickly ramp with just a couple mana elves or other creatures. Can also be a dud, though.
Also good: Berserk is a one-man instant-speed overrun. Best combat trick I can think.
Worst of the bunch: Pod never really worked for us. On a non-constructed singleton format, it is hard to guarantee a good progression of CMCs, in our experience.
I like Cradle the most of those three, but it's good in Wake/Token-Ramp and super ramp decks, and I support both. Without those two decktypes floating around, I'd probably be able to let it go.
Pod is a build around card that lacks other engines that also gain value from having a smooth curve of ETB creatures. There's a couple (momentary blink?) but in singleton cubes I'm not a big fan of it.
It can be selectively sweet tho. Playing 2 in my non-singleton makes a world of difference vs 1. That in conjunction with extra kiki-jiki combo support lead to some interesting combo pod decks.
Berserk is a pet card of mine, but is expendible. Don't want to randomly shove it in any green deck. It can be supported as part of a green pump spell zoo agro type deck. Ghor-clan rampager, selesnya charm, wolfir silverheart, ajani caller of the pride, rancor, vines of vastwood, rafiq of the many.. I supported it for a while, I had good results when I drafted it. But I had it for like 10 cubes and think I was the only one who drafted it.. Cut the whole package and berserk was apart of it.
Cradle is a card that allows good green decks to be great green decks. (requires a fair number of early mana accelerators, but you want that anyway...)
@ Spike Rogue: I would keep Dynamo and Lotus. +3 mana is a huge boost, exactly what decks with super expensive cards want. While Tomb ramps early and costs no mana, it only grants +1 mana and costs 2 life, which quickly becomes a real issue.
@ armando: I am not a huge fan of any of these cards. Cradle is the strongest of the bunch, but I hate super swingy cards like this. Broken mana boost one game, worse than a basic forest the next? Ugh. I haven't played with Berserk, but it seems that half the time, a simple Giant Growth would be better? At least in an aggressive deck where most of your creatures are small. In a midrange deck, Berserk should be better. In the end, I think I like Pod the most of these cards. A fun card that you either build around or just put into your The Rock value deck, with lots of etb effects and optimally some graveyard interaction.
After ten or so cards, the options for cheap blue counterspells become rather dry. A bigger cube like mine has to look for some second-rate cards like these. I was just about to bring Complicate back, when I watched a Legacy Cube draft online and saw that Dissolve is in that cube. So, this might be an option? I would include it instantly if it had scry 2. Scry 1 feels pretty marginal, but it is a 3-mana hard counter with a relevant upside...
How would you guys rank the black three drops? Wizards blessed us with an influx of new additions over this past year, and I feel like I haven't had sufficient time to test all of them out and see their synergies/strengths.Right now I think the only staples are Ophiomancer and Nighthawk.
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I prefer graveborn muse, it's a solid card. When dealing with creatures that need to survive to generate value, 4 vs 5 is a big difference.
It has more upside potential too (a couple zombies + lifegain = legit engine).
Great synergy with Grey merchant too if you run that...
Last Updated 02/07/24
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I had a brief phase where I was super high on solemn visitor (mostly due to playing it in constructed), so kept subbing them both out back and forth to get a better sense of what's better. I did this for maybe 10+ cubes heh.
Overall I settled on Lord of innistrad. It's better in a wider range of archetypes. Solemn visitor was disgusting in agro mirrors (the huge immediate lifegain is why it sees modern play over lord of innistrad, very important vs burn) and potentially better in tokens, but there were a bit too many matchups/deck where I wanted the planeswalker itself to be the stand alone threat.
Generating 2/2 flyers is great and all, but sorin innistrads ultimate is often game ending. Much easier for certain decks to come back vs a couple 2/2 flyers than a sorin ultimate.
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Choose two:
Ancient Tomb
Thran Dynamo
Gilded Lotus
450 card Peasant cube thread. Draft it here.
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Going turn 1 tomb -> signet, turn 2 -> 4 drop or spew out artifact ramp can lead to very nutty starts.
or turn 1 elf, turn 2 tomb -> 4 drop in green
I'd say Tomb > dynamo >= Gilded lotus (not sure about that one).
I consistantly swap dynamo for gilded lotus and I never am convinced what is correct.
The three are all very close in my eyes tho fwiw, and work well together in conjunction with signets.
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"What am I looking at? Ashes, dead man."
I love lotus in my blue decks. Drop it turn 5 with a counter spell still up. Next turn I can uptap into upheavl with mana to spare.
I think Berserk is best but it is my favorite card of all time and stacks with double strike ( And used as removal a surprising amount of time) The pod never really got there and some people felt it was a trap. Cradle is fine, but only silly when you are way ahead(usually). It has a very minimal set up cost as most green decks play lots of creatures so I argue for its inclusion in even tiny cubes.
My pick: Gaea's Cradle can quickly ramp with just a couple mana elves or other creatures. Can also be a dud, though.
Also good: Berserk is a one-man instant-speed overrun. Best combat trick I can think.
Worst of the bunch: Pod never really worked for us. On a non-constructed singleton format, it is hard to guarantee a good progression of CMCs, in our experience.
My 630 Card Powered Cube
My Article - "Cube Design Philosophy"
My Article - "Mana Short: A study in limited resource management."
My 50th Set (P)review - Discusses my top 20 Cube cards from OTJ!
Pod is a build around card that lacks other engines that also gain value from having a smooth curve of ETB creatures. There's a couple (momentary blink?) but in singleton cubes I'm not a big fan of it.
It can be selectively sweet tho. Playing 2 in my non-singleton makes a world of difference vs 1. That in conjunction with extra kiki-jiki combo support lead to some interesting combo pod decks.
Berserk is a pet card of mine, but is expendible. Don't want to randomly shove it in any green deck. It can be supported as part of a green pump spell zoo agro type deck. Ghor-clan rampager, selesnya charm, wolfir silverheart, ajani caller of the pride, rancor, vines of vastwood, rafiq of the many.. I supported it for a while, I had good results when I drafted it. But I had it for like 10 cubes and think I was the only one who drafted it.. Cut the whole package and berserk was apart of it.
Cradle is a card that allows good green decks to be great green decks. (requires a fair number of early mana accelerators, but you want that anyway...)
My vote is Cradle >> Berserk >= Pod
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@ armando: I am not a huge fan of any of these cards. Cradle is the strongest of the bunch, but I hate super swingy cards like this. Broken mana boost one game, worse than a basic forest the next? Ugh. I haven't played with Berserk, but it seems that half the time, a simple Giant Growth would be better? At least in an aggressive deck where most of your creatures are small. In a midrange deck, Berserk should be better. In the end, I think I like Pod the most of these cards. A fun card that you either build around or just put into your The Rock value deck, with lots of etb effects and optimally some graveyard interaction.
...
Pick one:
Complicate vs Dissolve
After ten or so cards, the options for cheap blue counterspells become rather dry. A bigger cube like mine has to look for some second-rate cards like these. I was just about to bring Complicate back, when I watched a Legacy Cube draft online and saw that Dissolve is in that cube. So, this might be an option? I would include it instantly if it had scry 2. Scry 1 feels pretty marginal, but it is a 3-mana hard counter with a relevant upside...
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I like the Marauder more.
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I run Complicate at 450 and it's a great counter. Gets maindecked all the time.
Nighthawk didn't even make the cut, and at this point perhaps Flesh Carver is my favourite one.
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