Sol Ring and Jitte are the most powerful cards in the cube for me and I go back and forth on which one I like more. In my 360, I thought Jitte was much better but at 720 when everything is a bit slower, Sol Ring might have a slight edge.
Jitte is just so strong and turn you draw it, it's a giant blowout to draw it on turn 4 and put it on your three drop, whereas Sol Ring might not always be that insane if it's not in your opener - but when it is it's pretty difficult to lose being two turns ahead.
I'm fixing up my cube and adding better cards to it. I want to add better cards but nothing like Sol Ring which some consider to be too good for a unpowered cube. I'm trying to keep the focus away from planeswalkers. I currently only have 4 in my cube. I was thinking of adding Gideon Jura and Koth the Hammer. How does Koth compare to Chandra Nalaar? How does Gideon comapre to Ajani Goldmane? How do they compared to more broken cards such as Jitte, Mind Twist, Balance, Armaggedon, Upheaval, etc?
I'm fixing up my cube and adding better cards to it. I want to add better cards but nothing like Sol Ring which some consider to be too good for a unpowered cube. I'm trying to keep the focus away from planeswalkers. I currently only have 4 in my cube. I was thinking of adding Gideon Jura and Koth the Hammer. How does Koth compare to Chandra Nalaar? How does Gideon comapre to Ajani Goldmane? How do they compared to more broken cards such as Jitte, Mind Twist, Balance, Armaggedon, Upheaval, etc?
Koth is a better then Chandra. Koth is more aggresive, while Chandra shines in red controllish decks.
Same with Gideon. He is stronger then Ajani, but they shine in different decks. Ajani is boss in aggro and token, while Gideon is great in control and midrange.
Koth and Gideon are a level below the cards you mention. They are good, but not up to par with that group of cards. For me only JTMS can be in that list. Elspeth 1 is close as is Ajani Vengeant.
Koth is a better then Chandra. Koth is more aggresive, while Chandra shines in red controllish decks.
Same with Gideon. He is stronger then Ajani, but they shine in different decks. Ajani is boss in aggro and token, while Gideon is great in control and midrange.
Koth and Gideon are a level below the cards you mention. They are good, but not up to par with that group of cards. For me only JTMS can be in that list. Elspeth 1 is close as is Ajani Vengeant.
I'm trying to fix up my cube but also keep things balanced as possible. I'm replacing some lowered powered cards in my cube. I noticed I have 4 enchantments in red including Sulfuric Vortex, Furnace of Rath, Pandemonium and Relentless Assault. Most of these enchantments used to be good but now are not worth anything. I don't really need than many red enchantments. I figure I could take out Relentless Assault and replace it with Koth.
If I added Koth and Gideon I would have 6 planewalkers. 2 White, 2 Red, 1 Green and 1 Blue. I don't want to give red and white too many powerful cards. I don't want too many planeswalkers in my cube. I'm guessing Koth and Gideon would be more closer in power to cards like Ob-Nixilis or Grave Titan?
Since your cube is not only missing the fetches, but also stuff lie wasteland, stripmine, the land recursion cards, Snapcaster, most reanimation spells, Vraska fits better into your list.
The list in my sig is a few months outdated, there are better reanimation spells/targets in there now and a few other graveyard based things like Loam. Still, fetches are too pricey for me.
I am also voluntarily limiting the numvers of PW in my Cube.
I chose to run 1 per section, an to run the best one available for each section.
Here is my selection for reference:
Elspeth, Knight-Errant
Jace TMS
Liliana of the Veil
Koth of the Hammer
Garruk Wildspeaker
Ajani Vengeant
Karn Liberated
You got the best ones, except arguably in green where the ability to power out Primal Hunter and then get infinite 3/3s or a hand refill might be bette than a delayed Overrun, depending on what your green does.
The only PWs I would really miss are the other Jaces but they are more to taste. But we see some Jace/Tezz control builds here (powered).
EDIT: I know there is a popular sentiment toward Garruk Relentless but he is more midrange-y. He is pretty strong though.
I think Garruk Relentless has dethroned the original Garruk as the best green planeswalker after cubing with him since his spoiling. The card is just so good, and the effect is so very welcome in green.
I think Garruk Relentless has dethroned the original Garruk as the best green planeswalker after cubing with him since his spoiling. The card is just so good, and the effect is so very welcome in green.
Messing with the battlefield is a good effect. Whodathunkit?
Seriously, Garruk Relentless is my favorite of the three in cube too.
I actually like Primal Hunter the most. The color intensity hasn't mattered too often and he steals the most games. I like Wildspeaker the least and Relentless is always solid. The deathtouch wolves are just so annoying.
Don't get me wrong, I'm not knocking Primal Hunter at all. Once he's resolved, it's usually lights out. But Relentless goes into more decks, he's easily splashable, and provides green with an ability that's hard to come by on cubeworthy cards.
I only run 4 out of the 5 original planeswalkers. I run Jace 1.0, Garruk Wildspeaker, Ajani Goldmane and Chandra. I don't run any black planeswalkers because most aren't very good. The only really good black planeswalker is Lilian of the Veil. My cube is around 375 cards right now. I was thinking of adding Gideon Jura and Koth the Hammer to the cube. I realize Gideon works better in controls decks vs. Ajani which is better for aggro.
I'm trying to balance out my cube. I'm trying to make stuff that is good for both aggro and midrange or control. What I don't want to do is put too many planeswalkers in my cube. I don't like the idea of White playing 5 planwalkers and red only has 2. Why does white have 5 good planeswalkers but red only has 2 that are really good?
All the Garruks are really good though, let's get that straight! I wouldn't cut any of the three even at 330.
He wants to limit the amount of planeswalkers, so he's going to have to cut some.
I like Primal Hunter a little more than the other two as well, he's a green mana more but is so much better than the other two it's worth the risk. The three Garruks are definitely the three planeswalker types that are most similar to each other in power level. Chandras vary wildly and Jaces are good but 2.0 is so much better than the other two it's not even remotely close to being arguable.
Jaces are good but 2.0 is so much better than the other two it's not even remotely close to being arguable.
There are three others now since Architect. Jace 2 is the best my a mile but I think one could make a case for any of the others even at 360. I wouldn't want more than 2 at that level though.
There are three others now since Architect. Jace 2 is the best my a mile but I think one could make a case for any of the others even at 360. I wouldn't want more than 2 at that level though.
There are three others now since Architect. Jace 2 is the best my a mile but I think one could make a case for any of the others even at 360. I wouldn't want more than 2 at that level though.
Not counting Architect which isn't close to 360, the 1.0 and 3.0 do totally different things.
Also, Jace/Tezz control can be pretty good especially if you get Magical Hacker. Hes crap overall but here is what he turns your PW into:
Memory Adept: draw 20
Beleren: Mill 20
Mind Sculptor: no library, no hand
Liliana of the Veil: armageddon or nev's disk them (as a couryesy, their choice!)
Tezzeret the Seeker: super Tinker or robot army
Here's a laugh, Memory Adept is debateably the "worst" because it costs 6 mana to do immediately and you have to discard down to 7. So its "only" super Yawgmoth's Bargain.
It's definitely scary to see on turn two, but not oppressively so. If it's the only one of it's kind, it should be fine. We put it in recently to see how it would do, and it has been fine so far.
I don't know. Do you also try to balance the number of enchantments or sorcery per color?
Planeswalker is just a type, what matters is the impact on your Cube. Don't limit yourself on such things. There are great aggro PW, there are great control ones, there are ones that really improve some archetypes (Pox, Artifact, etc.) Grouping them together based on their type sounds more an hinderance than a balancing tool.
I'm trying to balance out my cube so both aggro and control can be good. I feel like planeswalkers get stacked in white. White has 5 planeswalkers in which 4 of them are only really good in aggro decks. Ajani Goldmane is the worst of them and Elspeth 1.0 is the best. I feel like only running Gideon Jura and Ajain Goldmane in my cube. I don't see why white needs 4 planeswalkers that can all fit in the same type of deck.
I think monolith is ok for unpowered. It doesn't produce mana every turn so it plays more like a dark ritual than a sol ring. It does help tinker decks, as well as obvious ramp builds, but I haven't seen it just dominate games/matches like other fast mana.
Actually, I would prolly not play elspeth 2 in a typical aggro deck. If you must play only 2 planeswalker, play Gideon 1 and Elspeth 1 I suppose.
What would you use Elspeth 2 for? Elspeth Tirel's first ability allows you to gain 1 life for each creature control. Elspeth 2 wants you to play aggro. Most of the white planeswalkers seem best used in an aggro deck and not control or midrange. Both Ajani favor having creatures in your deck. Both Elsepth also seem to favor having plenty of creatures in your deck. I guess with Elspeth 1 you can play that in a control deck and not aggro deck.
I'm fixing up my cube and adding better cards to it. I want to add better cards but nothing like Sol Ring which some consider to be too good for a unpowered cube. I'm trying to keep the focus away from planeswalkers. I currently only have 4 in my cube. I was thinking of adding Gideon Jura and Koth the Hammer. How does Koth compare to Chandra Nalaar? How does Gideon comapre to Ajani Goldmane? How do they compared to more broken cards such as Jitte, Mind Twist, Balance, Armaggedon, Upheaval, etc?
Koth is a better then Chandra. Koth is more aggresive, while Chandra shines in red controllish decks.
Same with Gideon. He is stronger then Ajani, but they shine in different decks. Ajani is boss in aggro and token, while Gideon is great in control and midrange.
Koth and Gideon are a level below the cards you mention. They are good, but not up to par with that group of cards. For me only JTMS can be in that list. Elspeth 1 is close as is Ajani Vengeant.
I feel compelled to repeat everything I hear
If I added Koth and Gideon I would have 6 planewalkers. 2 White, 2 Red, 1 Green and 1 Blue. I don't want to give red and white too many powerful cards. I don't want too many planeswalkers in my cube. I'm guessing Koth and Gideon would be more closer in power to cards like Ob-Nixilis or Grave Titan?
The list in my sig is a few months outdated, there are better reanimation spells/targets in there now and a few other graveyard based things like Loam. Still, fetches are too pricey for me.
Updated 11/01/13
-->Standard:
:symwg::symwg::symwg: Aggressive Midrange
:symu::symu::symu: Devotion
-->Modern:
:symwg::symrg::symug: Kiki-Jiki Pod
:0mana::symur::0mana: Affinity
You got the best ones, except arguably in green where the ability to power out Primal Hunter and then get infinite 3/3s or a hand refill might be bette than a delayed Overrun, depending on what your green does.
The only PWs I would really miss are the other Jaces but they are more to taste. But we see some Jace/Tezz control builds here (powered).
EDIT: I know there is a popular sentiment toward Garruk Relentless but he is more midrange-y. He is pretty strong though.
On spoiled card wishlisting and 'should-have-had'-isms:
At 330 and even 360 I could see playing single digit Planeswalkers.
His list plus the other 2 Garruks and pick either Jace. Powered I would definitely want Tezzeret however.
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Messing with the battlefield is a good effect. Whodathunkit?
Seriously, Garruk Relentless is my favorite of the three in cube too.
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My Article - "Cube Design Philosophy"
My Article - "Mana Short: A study in limited resource management."
My 49th Set (P)review - Discusses my top 20 Cube cards from MKM!
I'm trying to balance out my cube. I'm trying to make stuff that is good for both aggro and midrange or control. What I don't want to do is put too many planeswalkers in my cube. I don't like the idea of White playing 5 planwalkers and red only has 2. Why does white have 5 good planeswalkers but red only has 2 that are really good?
He wants to limit the amount of planeswalkers, so he's going to have to cut some.
I like Primal Hunter a little more than the other two as well, he's a green mana more but is so much better than the other two it's worth the risk. The three Garruks are definitely the three planeswalker types that are most similar to each other in power level. Chandras vary wildly and Jaces are good but 2.0 is so much better than the other two it's not even remotely close to being arguable.
Yeah, every cube should play Liliana of the Veil.
Blimpy's Aggro-Focused Cube (powered 360)
I'm always open to suggestions on how to improve my cube. Take a look and ask a question, or give a constructive critique whenever you can.
There are three others now since Architect. Jace 2 is the best my a mile but I think one could make a case for any of the others even at 360. I wouldn't want more than 2 at that level though.
Agreed. Great 'walker.
On spoiled card wishlisting and 'should-have-had'-isms:
I forgot about Architect. Point still stands.
Blimpy's Aggro-Focused Cube (powered 360)
I'm always open to suggestions on how to improve my cube. Take a look and ask a question, or give a constructive critique whenever you can.
Not counting Architect which isn't close to 360, the 1.0 and 3.0 do totally different things.
Also, Jace/Tezz control can be pretty good especially if you get Magical Hacker. Hes crap overall but here is what he turns your PW into:
Memory Adept: draw 20
Beleren: Mill 20
Mind Sculptor: no library, no hand
Liliana of the Veil: armageddon or nev's disk them (as a couryesy, their choice!)
Tezzeret the Seeker: super Tinker or robot army
Here's a laugh, Memory Adept is debateably the "worst" because it costs 6 mana to do immediately and you have to discard down to 7. So its "only" super Yawgmoth's Bargain.
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I run it in my "unpowered" cube and don't think so.
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It's definitely scary to see on turn two, but not oppressively so. If it's the only one of it's kind, it should be fine. We put it in recently to see how it would do, and it has been fine so far.
360 Unpowered Cube | Cubetutor
My 630 Card Powered Cube
My Article - "Cube Design Philosophy"
My Article - "Mana Short: A study in limited resource management."
My 49th Set (P)review - Discusses my top 20 Cube cards from MKM!
I'm trying to balance out my cube so both aggro and control can be good. I feel like planeswalkers get stacked in white. White has 5 planeswalkers in which 4 of them are only really good in aggro decks. Ajani Goldmane is the worst of them and Elspeth 1.0 is the best. I feel like only running Gideon Jura and Ajain Goldmane in my cube. I don't see why white needs 4 planeswalkers that can all fit in the same type of deck.
http://cubetutor.com/cubeblog/993
http://www.cubetutor.com/cubeblog/23690