... and they're all non-negotiables ATM in my cube... Captain of the Watch is an army in a can that gets blinked for fun and profit, Sunscorch Regent always ends up 10/10+, and Wingmate Roc is close to being a higher pick than Sun Titan at this point (it always gets its token, always gains life, always connects with a face somewhere along the line... just dominant).
Reaver all the way. A 4/4 beater is cool and all, but what else does it do or encourage people to draft? Reaver is an all-start in decks I've seen that play Lifegain mechanics or equipment aggro.
After catching up with the playgroup last night, it looks like BfZ may actually get zero cards into our cube. Only one still on the table for potential inclusion is Quarantine Field, but I'd have to figure out what to drop to get it in.
Reaver all the way. A 4/4 beater is cool and all, but what else does it do or encourage people to draft? Reaver is an all-start in decks I've seen that play Lifegain mechanics or equipment aggro.
Thanks for that! Reaver is currently in, but is somewhat of a removal magnet, as you could imagine. I was pondering something a little more resilient, but you're right - Reaver falls into the "wins the game if left alone" category.
Okay, well I'm getting back into tinkering with my cube for the moment and I'd deciding to swallow my pride and proxy and actual manabase. I've been working with a bad pauper manabase for way too long and I ought to do something about it. My wallet can't exactly handle that kind of evisceration and I was already gonna drop like $50 on swapping out all the basics for BFZ.
Bouncelands are staying in because I really like them. They're taplands but they're card advantage, have some shenanigans that go along with them, and they make a lot of land-light hands keepable. Vivids are staying in because they're great in 3 color and get around color identity so they're very draftable. Other than that, I probably need 3 cycles of duals to fill in. Any suggestions are greatly appreciated. I feel like the obvious two are fetches and shocks. I don't know how I feel about ABU duals.
EDIT: Oh yeah, my MTGS thread is horribly out of date so use the cubetutor. I need to get around to fixing that.
I have fetches and shocks in my cube, and my group refuses to drop the Shards Tri-Lands (e.g. Arcane Sanctum). They'd probably want the Khans copies in too if I had room for them.
If you want to jazz up your cube's manabase without spending a fortune, that's probably where I'd recommend starting.
Okay, well I'm getting back into tinkering with my cube for the moment and I'd deciding to swallow my pride and proxy and actual manabase. I've been working with a bad pauper manabase for way too long and I ought to do something about it. My wallet can't exactly handle that kind of evisceration and I was already gonna drop like $50 on swapping out all the basics for BFZ.
Bouncelands are staying in because I really like them. They're taplands but they're card advantage, have some shenanigans that go along with them, and they make a lot of land-light hands keepable. Vivids are staying in because they're great in 3 color and get around color identity so they're very draftable. Other than that, I probably need 3 cycles of duals to fill in. Any suggestions are greatly appreciated. I feel like the obvious two are fetches and shocks. I don't know how I feel about ABU duals.
EDIT: Oh yeah, my MTGS thread is horribly out of date so use the cubetutor. I need to get around to fixing that.
Why aren't you adding ABUR Duals? If you are make counterfeits it doesn't seem like morality would be an issue If you are going for an ideal land base you can go with:
10 ABUR
10 Shock
10 Fetch
10 Bounce (not something I like at all, but whatever... I love the scrylands )
10 Check lands -or- 10 Filter lands.
I don't like the Vivids at all, but I suspect that your opinion of them is based on running them aside ETBT'd duals where they look like ass-stars. Next to a more efficient land base I think that 3-5 5 color lands instead of the Vivids will make more sense.
After some more regular cubing (once every 2 weeks!) we decided that a few updates were in order.
First of all, game winners that required no work weren't fun. You would have an intense match and someone would just slam an Exsanguinate, Insurrection, Cyclonic Rift or Craterhoof Behemoth (this one is debatable) and just insta win. So those cards are out. A few others got the axe because of fun factor (Elesh Norn, Grand Cenobite).
Other than that we decided we wanted more multicolor cards and a lower curve overall. So a few fatties got cut and more fixing was added. Finally since we are only 4 at a time drafting, I decided to leave out themes for now (tokens, artifacts matter, ...) and just play solid cards all around since you would open a few theme cards and the other half would not be in the draft pool.
As always feedback and suggestions are welcome. Here are a few issues I currently have:
- I have one too many card in black and green. Just don't know what to cut!
- Red early plays. Red is so bad at 2 drops that I'm not ready to play the terrible ones. I already think Ashling, the Pilgrim and Young Pyromancer are subpar...
- Not a fan of Jhoira of the Ghitu, but not sure what else to play in Izzet.
- Thinking of ditching Golgari Signet in favor of Deathrite Shaman to free up space for Maelstrom Pulse.
- Similarly, I'm considering dropping Simic Signet in favor of Coiling Oracle.
Anyways, thanks for taking the time to read all my bla bla. Happy drafting!
After some more regular cubing (once every 2 weeks!) we decided that a few updates were in order.
First of all, game winners that required no work weren't fun. You would have an intense match and someone would just slam an Exsanguinate, Insurrection, Cyclonic Rift or Craterhoof Behemoth (this one is debatable) and just insta win. So those cards are out. A few others got the axe because of fun factor (Elesh Norn, Grand Cenobite).
Other than that we decided we wanted more multicolor cards and a lower curve overall. So a few fatties got cut and more fixing was added. Finally since we are only 4 at a time drafting, I decided to leave out themes for now (tokens, artifacts matter, ...) and just play solid cards all around since you would open a few theme cards and the other half would not be in the draft pool.
As always feedback and suggestions are welcome. Here are a few issues I currently have:
- I have one too many card in black and green. Just don't know what to cut!
- Red early plays. Red is so bad at 2 drops that I'm not ready to play the terrible ones. I already think Ashling, the Pilgrim and Young Pyromancer are subpar...
- Not a fan of Jhoira of the Ghitu, but not sure what else to play in Izzet.
- Thinking of ditching Golgari Signet in favor of Deathrite Shaman to free up space for Maelstrom Pulse.
- Similarly, I'm considering dropping Simic Signet in favor of Coiling Oracle.
Anyways, thanks for taking the time to read all my bla bla. Happy drafting!
As always feedback and suggestions are welcome. Here are a few issues I currently have:
- I have one too many card in black and green. Just don't know what to cut!
- Red early plays. Red is so bad at 2 drops that I'm not ready to play the terrible ones. I already think Ashling, the Pilgrim and Young Pyromancer are subpar...
- Not a fan of Jhoira of the Ghitu, but not sure what else to play in Izzet.
- Thinking of ditching Golgari Signet in favor of Deathrite Shaman to free up space for Maelstrom Pulse.
- Similarly, I'm considering dropping Simic Signet in favor of Coiling Oracle.
I'd cut Withered Wretch from black and agree with Nissa's Revelation for green.
I'm also at a loss for what to do with early red drops (and red in general, actually). Artifacts works pretty well, but even that theme isn't deep enough to cover the entire section. Right now I'm using big burn but I'm pretty sure it's not going to stay.
Not a fan of Ral Zarek? I like Dominus of Fealty here but the casting cost might be a bit rough. At least when you have an artifact theme you can fill Izzet with some decent cards.
Thanks for the answers!
I cut Nissa's Revelation from green, but hesitate to cut the early drops in black. I might just drop a card in red in favor of one in black (shocking I know!).
I'm going to try out Nin, as I've never actually played with him, but if he doesn't work out, I'll just add Steam Augury. Can't go wrong with that and I already have Keranos and Dack in there.
My Izzet section is currently Ral Zarek / Dominus of Fealty / Niv-Mizzet, the Firemind / Mercurial Chemister / Nivix Guildmage.
The only one of those five that routinely gets burn is Mercurial Chemister, which is not the cheapest cast, but is very productive once out. Provides a lot of cards, a bit of creature removal, and is a good discard outlet for Grixis decks. Out of the others, Ral and the Guildmage show up occasionally in particular decks (though they likely have to be strongly Izzet), and I never, ever see Niv and Dominus (people love them, but they are very, very hard to cast). Niv at least made it out a couple of months ago after being fetched by Sarkhan's Triumph!
Hello! I'm building a multiplayer cube, and I'm trying to decide what mana-fixing cycles I want to run. I know I want one cycle of artifacts that provide ramp as well as fixing, and I think the Ravnica Guild Signets are the best of those. I also want to run the Khans and Alara tri-lands, because they fit into a wide range of decks and are relatively inexpensive. Beyond that, I want 10-20 more sources of fixing.
Some cycles I'm considering are Ravnica karoos, Theros temples, Lorwyn vivids, and the full Manland cycle once Oath of the Gatewatch is released. I also would like to include a few all-color fixers like Exotic Orchard, Forbidden Orchard, and Coalition Relic.
What has your experience been with mana fixing? How valuable are the lands that give virtual card advantage (karoos and temples)? Do you like lands and artifacts that can do something besides generate mana when the game goes long?
When cubetutor is finished with its downtime, I'd encourage you to check out folks' links to their cubes there. Keep in mind though, that many of the posters here are running edh cubes with color identity restrictions, meaning the tri-lands (while great in many other cubes) fit in too few decks to reliably work while drafting edh.
I think the cycles question you brought up was discussed a few pages ago, with wildfire providing a good and succinct hierarchy of dual lands that a person should prioritize. How much is budget or proxying a consideration for you and your group? If proxying isn't a problem, then the standard line looks something like this:
I have some budget constraints (certainly not gonna buy ABUR duals), but I'm also more focused on fun than raw power. I lik temples because they smooth draws, making it more likely that everyone gets a chance to play Magic. Bouncelands help people who are short on land, and Manlands help people who are flooding out. I want cycles that will improve game play, not just be better than basics.
... is utterly bats insane.
Probably goes straight into my cube, provided it's not too expensive. I'm already imagining it comboing with Titans, Primordials, Hydra Omnivore, Gary, Wurmcoil Engine, Wingmate Roc...
... is utterly bats insane.
Probably goes straight into my cube, provided it's not too expensive. I'm already imagining it comboing with Titans, Primordials, Hydra Omnivore, Gary, Wurmcoil Engine, Wingmate Roc...
Card seems straight up busted. So far that's two cards we will be testing from C15. Hope there is more to come
I have some budget constraints (certainly not gonna buy ABUR duals), but I'm also more focused on fun than raw power. I lik temples because they smooth draws, making it more likely that everyone gets a chance to play Magic. Bouncelands help people who are short on land, and Manlands help people who are flooding out. I want cycles that will improve game play, not just be better than basics.
I can't say I've actually cubed with any of the others, but you mentioned the Tri-Lands earlier, and I totally recommend them.
As mentioned further back in the thread, my playgroup refused to drop the Shards Tri-Lands when I brought shocks and fetches into my cube - they asked to drop the Signets instead (which are also very good).
The number of times we've had people tied to two colours, pick up a tri-land with those two colours at the end of Pack 2, luck into some hot cards from the tri-lands third colour in Pack 3... they allow splashing a third colour far more easily. Which, IMHO, equals more fun.
What do you guys think about UN cards in your Cubes? I run Rare-B-Gone and just added City of Ass, and thought that maybe those were a little more taboo in the eyes of others.
What do you guys think about UN cards in your Cubes? I run Rare-B-Gone and just added City of Ass, and thought that maybe those were a little more taboo in the eyes of others.
I ran some in my regular cube for a while and got conflicting opinions but mostly negative. Booster Tutor making a pack of leftover cards is an option. Rare-B-Gone is good stuff.
What do you guys think about UN cards in your Cubes? I run Rare-B-Gone and just added City of Ass, and thought that maybe those were a little more taboo in the eyes of others.
I like City of Ass. We also tried Blacker Lotus and Rare-B-Gone. Instead of tearing it into pieces we exiled it but it was too much of a gimmick. We found Rare-B-Gone to be pretty powerful as well but ultimately we cut it. It certainly hits a lot of targets.
Ironically, I tried it because I saw it in your cube!
Oh and H20,
I agree on both of those new cards for our cube. They both look very appealing. Speaking of which, this weekend after you guys nerd out on Battletech
I ran some in my regular cube for a while and got conflicting opinions but mostly negative. Booster Tutor making a pack of leftover cards is an option. Rare-B-Gone is good stuff.
Interested to hear what the negative opinions were. City of Ass is basically just a boring redundant tapped Command Tower, but I also found that Reflecting Pool has had a harder time firing for 3 than I initially thought.
Since Rare-B-Gone hits Mythics I had to try it out - that and Rakdos blows and I've tried putting the most over the top stuff in there.
Interested to hear what the negative opinions were. City of Ass is basically just a boring redundant tapped Command Tower, but I also found that Reflecting Pool has had a harder time firing for 3 than I initially thought.
Mostly your typical I lost therefore bad arguments but we'd been playing Frazzled Editor wrong as he does not count flavor text or reminder text so he got a lot of complaints. Booster Tutor was also really pushing the power limit I try to have. Overall I liked them but I was in the minority so they had to go.
I've considered using city of ass before, but the un-sets' goofball themes turn me off. Even in the legitimate game, I really hate the slapstick and moronic quotes they assign to goblins.
... and they're all non-negotiables ATM in my cube...
Captain of the Watch is an army in a can that gets blinked for fun and profit, Sunscorch Regent always ends up 10/10+, and Wingmate Roc is close to being a higher pick than Sun Titan at this point (it always gets its token, always gains life, always connects with a face somewhere along the line... just dominant).
My Stupidly Large Number of Current Decks
PucaTrade with me!
The Multiplayer Power Rankings
Cube: the Gittening (My Multiplayer Cube) - MTGS Cube List | @ CubeTutor
The N00b Cube (Peasant cube for new players) - MTGS Cube List | @ CubeTutor
Same CC, same colour identity...
My Stupidly Large Number of Current Decks
PucaTrade with me!
The Multiplayer Power Rankings
Cube: the Gittening (My Multiplayer Cube) - MTGS Cube List | @ CubeTutor
The N00b Cube (Peasant cube for new players) - MTGS Cube List | @ CubeTutor
WUBRGPauper Battle BoxWUBRG ... and why I am not a fan of Wayne Reynolds' Illustrations.
Thanks for that! Reaver is currently in, but is somewhat of a removal magnet, as you could imagine. I was pondering something a little more resilient, but you're right - Reaver falls into the "wins the game if left alone" category.
My Stupidly Large Number of Current Decks
PucaTrade with me!
The Multiplayer Power Rankings
Cube: the Gittening (My Multiplayer Cube) - MTGS Cube List | @ CubeTutor
The N00b Cube (Peasant cube for new players) - MTGS Cube List | @ CubeTutor
Bouncelands are staying in because I really like them. They're taplands but they're card advantage, have some shenanigans that go along with them, and they make a lot of land-light hands keepable. Vivids are staying in because they're great in 3 color and get around color identity so they're very draftable. Other than that, I probably need 3 cycles of duals to fill in. Any suggestions are greatly appreciated. I feel like the obvious two are fetches and shocks. I don't know how I feel about ABU duals.
EDIT: Oh yeah, my MTGS thread is horribly out of date so use the cubetutor. I need to get around to fixing that.
Generals meant to be drafted first in a single pack of 6 cards.
And here is the actual cube, meant to be drafted in 4 regular sized packs. (60 card decks)
If you want to jazz up your cube's manabase without spending a fortune, that's probably where I'd recommend starting.
My Stupidly Large Number of Current Decks
PucaTrade with me!
The Multiplayer Power Rankings
Cube: the Gittening (My Multiplayer Cube) - MTGS Cube List | @ CubeTutor
The N00b Cube (Peasant cube for new players) - MTGS Cube List | @ CubeTutor
Why aren't you adding ABUR Duals? If you are make counterfeits it doesn't seem like morality would be an issue If you are going for an ideal land base you can go with:
10 ABUR
10 Shock
10 Fetch
10 Bounce (not something I like at all, but whatever... I love the scrylands )
10 Check lands -or- 10 Filter lands.
I don't like the Vivids at all, but I suspect that your opinion of them is based on running them aside ETBT'd duals where they look like ass-stars. Next to a more efficient land base I think that 3-5 5 color lands instead of the Vivids will make more sense.
WUBRGPauper Battle BoxWUBRG ... and why I am not a fan of Wayne Reynolds' Illustrations.
First of all, game winners that required no work weren't fun. You would have an intense match and someone would just slam an Exsanguinate, Insurrection, Cyclonic Rift or Craterhoof Behemoth (this one is debatable) and just insta win. So those cards are out. A few others got the axe because of fun factor (Elesh Norn, Grand Cenobite).
Other than that we decided we wanted more multicolor cards and a lower curve overall. So a few fatties got cut and more fixing was added. Finally since we are only 4 at a time drafting, I decided to leave out themes for now (tokens, artifacts matter, ...) and just play solid cards all around since you would open a few theme cards and the other half would not be in the draft pool.
So here is the updated list :
http://www.cubetutor.com/viewcube/40855
As always feedback and suggestions are welcome. Here are a few issues I currently have:
- I have one too many card in black and green. Just don't know what to cut!
- Red early plays. Red is so bad at 2 drops that I'm not ready to play the terrible ones. I already think Ashling, the Pilgrim and Young Pyromancer are subpar...
- Not a fan of Jhoira of the Ghitu, but not sure what else to play in Izzet.
- Thinking of ditching Golgari Signet in favor of Deathrite Shaman to free up space for Maelstrom Pulse.
- Similarly, I'm considering dropping Simic Signet in favor of Coiling Oracle.
Anyways, thanks for taking the time to read all my bla bla. Happy drafting!
My 450ish 1vs1 cube
-I would cut Oona's Prowler and Nissa's Revelation.
-Humble Defector has been very good for us. I also like Stingscourger and Orcish Settlers.
-Nin, the Pain Artist is amazing.
-I made this swap myself so I approve.
-Ironically I made this one as well when I cut back on Signets.
Keranos, God of Storms
Steam Augury
Dack Fayden (not as huge of a fan of Ral)
Desolate Lighthouse
Currently Playing:
Legacy: Something U/W Controlish
EDH Cube
Hypercube! A New EDH Deck Every Week(ish)!
I cut Nissa's Revelation from green, but hesitate to cut the early drops in black. I might just drop a card in red in favor of one in black (shocking I know!).
I'm going to try out Nin, as I've never actually played with him, but if he doesn't work out, I'll just add Steam Augury. Can't go wrong with that and I already have Keranos and Dack in there.
My 450ish 1vs1 cube
The only one of those five that routinely gets burn is Mercurial Chemister, which is not the cheapest cast, but is very productive once out. Provides a lot of cards, a bit of creature removal, and is a good discard outlet for Grixis decks. Out of the others, Ral and the Guildmage show up occasionally in particular decks (though they likely have to be strongly Izzet), and I never, ever see Niv and Dominus (people love them, but they are very, very hard to cast). Niv at least made it out a couple of months ago after being fetched by Sarkhan's Triumph!
My Stupidly Large Number of Current Decks
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Cube: the Gittening (My Multiplayer Cube) - MTGS Cube List | @ CubeTutor
The N00b Cube (Peasant cube for new players) - MTGS Cube List | @ CubeTutor
Some cycles I'm considering are Ravnica karoos, Theros temples, Lorwyn vivids, and the full Manland cycle once Oath of the Gatewatch is released. I also would like to include a few all-color fixers like Exotic Orchard, Forbidden Orchard, and Coalition Relic.
What has your experience been with mana fixing? How valuable are the lands that give virtual card advantage (karoos and temples)? Do you like lands and artifacts that can do something besides generate mana when the game goes long?
CubeTutor Link
I think the cycles question you brought up was discussed a few pages ago, with wildfire providing a good and succinct hierarchy of dual lands that a person should prioritize. How much is budget or proxying a consideration for you and your group? If proxying isn't a problem, then the standard line looks something like this:
10 fetches > 10 ABUR duals > 10 shocks > 10 filter lands = 10 scry lands = 10 check lands = BFZ duals (depends on preference) > 10 bounce lands > 10 sanctuaries > 10 gates > all the rest...
"Personally I love high-riak, low-reqars gambles. Life's best with a decent amount of riak. And f*** reqars."
Here is my list so far(work in progress): http://www.cubetutor.com/viewcube/37862
CubeTutor Link
... is utterly bats insane.
Probably goes straight into my cube, provided it's not too expensive. I'm already imagining it comboing with Titans, Primordials, Hydra Omnivore, Gary, Wurmcoil Engine, Wingmate Roc...
My Stupidly Large Number of Current Decks
PucaTrade with me!
The Multiplayer Power Rankings
Cube: the Gittening (My Multiplayer Cube) - MTGS Cube List | @ CubeTutor
The N00b Cube (Peasant cube for new players) - MTGS Cube List | @ CubeTutor
Card seems straight up busted. So far that's two cards we will be testing from C15. Hope there is more to come
I can't say I've actually cubed with any of the others, but you mentioned the Tri-Lands earlier, and I totally recommend them.
As mentioned further back in the thread, my playgroup refused to drop the Shards Tri-Lands when I brought shocks and fetches into my cube - they asked to drop the Signets instead (which are also very good).
The number of times we've had people tied to two colours, pick up a tri-land with those two colours at the end of Pack 2, luck into some hot cards from the tri-lands third colour in Pack 3... they allow splashing a third colour far more easily. Which, IMHO, equals more fun.
My Stupidly Large Number of Current Decks
PucaTrade with me!
The Multiplayer Power Rankings
Cube: the Gittening (My Multiplayer Cube) - MTGS Cube List | @ CubeTutor
The N00b Cube (Peasant cube for new players) - MTGS Cube List | @ CubeTutor
WUBRGPauper Battle BoxWUBRG ... and why I am not a fan of Wayne Reynolds' Illustrations.
I like City of Ass. We also tried Blacker Lotus and Rare-B-Gone. Instead of tearing it into pieces we exiled it but it was too much of a gimmick. We found Rare-B-Gone to be pretty powerful as well but ultimately we cut it. It certainly hits a lot of targets.
Ironically, I tried it because I saw it in your cube!
Oh and H20,
I agree on both of those new cards for our cube. They both look very appealing. Speaking of which, this weekend after you guys nerd out on Battletech
Interested to hear what the negative opinions were. City of Ass is basically just a boring redundant tapped Command Tower, but I also found that Reflecting Pool has had a harder time firing for 3 than I initially thought.
WUBRGPauper Battle BoxWUBRG ... and why I am not a fan of Wayne Reynolds' Illustrations.
"Personally I love high-riak, low-reqars gambles. Life's best with a decent amount of riak. And f*** reqars."