For me banned cards are only cards that are banned in vintage.
My list is unpowered but only because I cant afford the P9, and also some other cards like Maze of Ith and Mana Drain. I don't proxy.
Aesthetics wise, I do not ban any card. I actually like to have some white border cards as well as a mix of foil, promo, timshifted, and other cards, as a representative of Magic's past.
This is not a hard rule, but I would like to have my cards to be out of the box as much as possible, so I also tend choose the version with the reminder text as much as much as possible. That is why I wont put in complex textless cards (well, I do, but I have a back up card with text for reference/ or to put in if it is confusing - my playgroup are old time players and do not play often - we dont always remember all the cards)
When I first started my cube, my playgroup and I decided Academy Ruins was too demoralising to play against. We hated working hard to destroy something broken like Vedalken Shackles just to have it come back again endlessly. I know now that it's not too good, but we've never added it back and it's not a big deal.
I guess I just don't understand the concept of banning cards in cube. In a format where you can play literally every card ever printed and ever could be printed. (if it floats your boat) The distinction between "banning" and "not running" seems arbitrary at best. I don't run moat, does that mean I banned the card? I also don't run grizzly bears, does that mean I banned Grizzly Bears? No, I just don't run them.
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I think a banned list would for cube would be defined as cards that are strong enough on power level to make it into the cube, that for whatever reason you don't run.
My personal lexicon would be I don't run Grizzly Bears, I've banned Land Tax from my cube. A completely meaningless distinction I know, but whatever.
The connotation here is that cards which aren't included because they are 'too-good' are "banned", and cards which aren't included because they 'aren't-good-enough' are "not run".
Your point is valid, nonetheless. Cube is "create-your-own format" which means that everything not included in the cube is 'banned' and everything else is legal. Cube owners are the DCI for their particular cube.
In my cube:
Ante-cards - doesn't feel like real magic cards anymore (after the ante-rule was removed).
Un-cards - not real magic cards (imo).
Chaos Orb - too much of a hassle
Corpse Dance - the only playable card that cares about graveyard order. My cube doesn't have this card in it and my players can therefor arrange their graves anyway they want.
Flip Cards - imposes a problem for me and my playgroup because we don't like the additional information revealed during drafting. This aren't a problem for many others - kudos to you...
The only card banned from my cube is limited resources. It was removed after we had some unfun experiences with it.
Further all tournament-legal cards are allowed (thus no "un-" cards) and although not strictly tournament-legal both chaos orb and shahrazad are included.
cheers,
lplaat
How has Shahrazad played out for you? Outside of a very small and informal group I would never include it, personally. Part of the appeal of the card is that the opponent might just concede due to time considerations..without that dimension (we just play out the subgame every time) I'm not sure its worth it. We've only had one subgame recently and it was using Enter the Dungeon. By the time we finished it we'd lost track of the original game because we forgot to start at 5 life. I said we should back up and declare me the winner since I'd dealt the first 5 damage, but got overruled
We did play on the floor too (our desk was too low and had bracing underneath to literally play underneath it)
The problem with Enter the Dungeon (tangent) is that the winner gets to tutor. If the card was "Play a subgame, if you win tutor for two cards" it would be quite different. But starting at 5 life does mitigate that risk substantially (if you remember to start at 5 life!!)
Damn straight you have to flip it. I think that it's cool you play that card and require the dexterity. Props.
Unfortunately I'm not all-in on Chaos Orb. My errata is that you can destroy any *single* card it lands on, but not *all* of them. My group is competitive enough that they'd spread their cards all over the table to avoid the one-sided Apocalypse, which is both the right play and utterly obnoxious.
Unfortunately I'm not all-in on Chaos Orb. My errata is that you can destroy any *single* card it lands on, but not *all* of them. My group is competitive enough that they'd spread their cards all over the table to avoid the one-sided Apocalypse, which is both the right play and utterly obnoxious.
After thinking about it, we may go all in on this thing..yeah, it is obnoxious but its just one card..and there are a few others that people play that produce similarly grating scenarios.
How has Shahrazad played out for you? Outside of a very small and informal group I would never include it, personally. Part of the appeal of the card is that the opponent might just concede due to time considerations..without that dimension (we just play out the subgame every time) I'm not sure its worth it.
Shahrazad is pretty amazing in Wx aggro. Wr is probably the best for it (followed by Wb and Wg). It also drastically improves under 6th ed rules. Pre-M10, cards removed from the game in the subgame would stay rfg'd upon returning to the main game. This meant that a subgame crypt could frequently force a concession even if lethal damage was on the stack. Leading with T1 savannah lions, T2 shahrazad, swing, is one of the most powerful unaccelerated openers in the game and creates a 12-life swing on t2.
Make sure that your playgroup doesn't mind the whole subgame process though.
Just got to say, you've definitely earned distinction as an MTGS hero
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Because he's the hero MTGS deserves, and the one it needs right now. So we'll global him. Because he can take it. Because he's not just our hero. He's a silent guardian, a watchful protector. An expired rascal.
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ExpiredRascals you sir are a god-like hero.
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ER is a masterful god who cannot be beaten in any endeavour.
After thinking about it, we may go all in on this thing..yeah, it is obnoxious but its just one card..and there are a few others that people play that produce similarly grating scenarios.
In related news, last night I picked up a Guardian Beast. Didn't actually realize the interaction between Beast and Chaos Orb.
Shahrazad is not in my cube, and won't be. The scenario above is very good, but in the end we have places to be and things to do, and waiting for a round of subgame to finish is awful.
In related news, last night I picked up a Guardian Beast. Didn't actually realize the interaction between Beast and Chaos Orb.
Shahrazad is not in my cube, and won't be. The scenario above is very good, but in the end we have places to be and things to do, and waiting for a round of subgame to finish is awful.
Kinda agree on Shahrazad but at 1x its not that big a deal. I think the problem with it in other formats is that it can happen multiple times every game. It won't likely be drawn every game in Cube matches and you only have one copy. If the match goes 2-0 with a subgame thats no different than a 3 game match.
That said, I wouldn't play it in a bigger group but my brother and I are going to play for roughly a set amount of time so it doesn't make a difference.
Guardian Beast? i remember that guy! Surprised they didn't errate Chaos Orb to be a sacrifice.
As it has been said before, Banning seems like an odd choice of words, but I will not play:
Un-cards or Holiday Cards - I'm sure Booster Tutor and Gifts Given would be super fun to play with but with all the cards I have already to pick from I think i can afford to say no to them across the board.[/font]
Dexterity Cards - Basically people hate having to spread their cards out in the off chance that their opponent has a chaos orb, and we don't have the room for everybody to do that anyways. Plus I don't want people flipping my expensive cards all over the place
Ante Cards - Just no
Foreign Cards - It is my cube, and sometimes even I do not know the wording on some for the cards in it, let alone people who don't play very much.
These were conscious choices when constructing my cube from the beginning.
As for cards which were taken out after for some reason
Nether Shadow . I have an Alpha printing of the card and the text on it is VERY different from the text on the revised and forward printings (and hence the official wording). To avoid confusion i took it out.
Isochron Scepter - It wasn't taken out for being too strong, but when I was trimming cards it did get taken out because it never made for an enjoyable play experience on either side of the table. Nobody ever said it was broken or recommended I should take it out - but people were actually happy when I told them it was cut
Originally I had textless cards in my cube. Because I play with people who do not know what each of these cards does I originally changed that to only Wrath of God and Damnation were textless, but when I got a hold of a Beta Wrath I just went and picked up a foil Damnation so I could get rid of textless completely.
Cards from weird sets
They are/were not tournament legal, hard to acquire and/or don't feel like real Magic cards
-Promo only cards
-Unhinged/Unglued cards
-Portal cards
Time Reasons / Reduce Interactivity
It is not only boring for the player who has to play against something like Moat, but also the eight other people who have to wait until the game finishes.
Flavor Reasons
Even if WotC finds it fun to give green + white countermagic, blue direct damage, black artifact destruction and green some card draw, there has to be a good reason before I start playing these cards
I don't have anything against using most cards. I don't want spend the money to put in cards like Moat or Nether Void but I Like playing with enchantments. I like cards like Grave Pact, No Mercy, Furnace of Wrath and Propaganda. If you have any reason to ban cards from your cube I could see Sol Ring being banned. If you get Sol Ring out in your opening hand there is a good chance you will probably win the game. I think Sol Ring gives players too much of advantage for whoever gets it. The cards that do deserve not being banned from your cube are cards like any of the ANTE cards or Chaos Orb.
I actually think you're wrong wtwtf. Not a lot of people on this forum use chaos orb, but from what I've heard, a ton of cubes outside of this forum use it.
If I played Chaos Orb in my cube, I'd play it as written. Much more fun that way. I'm sure the joke would wear thin, similar to my experiences with playing Un-cards, but I'd be keen to give it a go for a while.
I'd also play Chaos Orb as written. I think it depends on your play group, and how much they 'd enjoy a random but powerful effect, and also how much it would cause situations where players are spreading their cards right out, arguments about whether it is actually touching a card, etc.
I don't feel my cube needs an almost strictly better Vindicate.
"When I use a word," Humpty Dumpty said, in rather a scornful tone, "it means just what I choose it to mean - neither more nor less." -Lewis Carroll, Through the Looking Glass
Just got to say, you've definitely earned distinction as an MTGS hero
Quote from Stardust »
Because he's the hero MTGS deserves, and the one it needs right now. So we'll global him. Because he can take it. Because he's not just our hero. He's a silent guardian, a watchful protector. An expired rascal.
Quote from LuckNorris »
ExpiredRascals you sir are a god-like hero.
Quote from Lanxal »
ER is a masterful god who cannot be beaten in any endeavour.
Quote from votan »
:ER:, you suck as a hero
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I mean, all of them mill. But I agree that only the milling on the 3rd one is oppressive.
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I allow unglued/unhinged/portal/holiday promos and no card is too good to be banned because of power level.
[Remixes] - [The Brutal Cube - 360 Powered] - [My Cube Article] - ['Print-This' Wishlist]
My list is unpowered but only because I cant afford the P9, and also some other cards like Maze of Ith and Mana Drain. I don't proxy.
Aesthetics wise, I do not ban any card. I actually like to have some white border cards as well as a mix of foil, promo, timshifted, and other cards, as a representative of Magic's past.
This is not a hard rule, but I would like to have my cards to be out of the box as much as possible, so I also tend choose the version with the reminder text as much as much as possible. That is why I wont put in complex textless cards (well, I do, but I have a back up card with text for reference/ or to put in if it is confusing - my playgroup are old time players and do not play often - we dont always remember all the cards)
IN:
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OUT:
Wall of Denial
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Juju Alters - Altered MTG Cards
To your banned list?
(I like the change, by the way)
Draft it on Cubetutor!
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Cube Tutor
My personal lexicon would be I don't run Grizzly Bears, I've banned Land Tax from my cube. A completely meaningless distinction I know, but whatever.
Your point is valid, nonetheless. Cube is "create-your-own format" which means that everything not included in the cube is 'banned' and everything else is legal. Cube owners are the DCI for their particular cube.
[Remixes] - [The Brutal Cube - 360 Powered] - [My Cube Article] - ['Print-This' Wishlist]
Ante-cards - doesn't feel like real magic cards anymore (after the ante-rule was removed).
Un-cards - not real magic cards (imo).
Chaos Orb - too much of a hassle
Corpse Dance - the only playable card that cares about graveyard order. My cube doesn't have this card in it and my players can therefor arrange their graves anyway they want.
Flip Cards - imposes a problem for me and my playgroup because we don't like the additional information revealed during drafting. This aren't a problem for many others - kudos to you...
My Tribal cube
My 93/94 old school cube
My Artifact cube
My Hearthstone Quiz App for iOS
How has Shahrazad played out for you? Outside of a very small and informal group I would never include it, personally. Part of the appeal of the card is that the opponent might just concede due to time considerations..without that dimension (we just play out the subgame every time) I'm not sure its worth it. We've only had one subgame recently and it was using Enter the Dungeon. By the time we finished it we'd lost track of the original game because we forgot to start at 5 life. I said we should back up and declare me the winner since I'd dealt the first 5 damage, but got overruled
We did play on the floor too (our desk was too low and had bracing underneath to literally play underneath it)
The problem with Enter the Dungeon (tangent) is that the winner gets to tutor. If the card was "Play a subgame, if you win tutor for two cards" it would be quite different. But starting at 5 life does mitigate that risk substantially (if you remember to start at 5 life!!)
Unfortunately I'm not all-in on Chaos Orb. My errata is that you can destroy any *single* card it lands on, but not *all* of them. My group is competitive enough that they'd spread their cards all over the table to avoid the one-sided Apocalypse, which is both the right play and utterly obnoxious.
After thinking about it, we may go all in on this thing..yeah, it is obnoxious but its just one card..and there are a few others that people play that produce similarly grating scenarios.
Shahrazad is pretty amazing in Wx aggro. Wr is probably the best for it (followed by Wb and Wg). It also drastically improves under 6th ed rules. Pre-M10, cards removed from the game in the subgame would stay rfg'd upon returning to the main game. This meant that a subgame crypt could frequently force a concession even if lethal damage was on the stack. Leading with T1 savannah lions, T2 shahrazad, swing, is one of the most powerful unaccelerated openers in the game and creates a 12-life swing on t2.
Make sure that your playgroup doesn't mind the whole subgame process though.
Body Count: GRRRUUUUUUUUUUU
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My Cube for use with 6th ed. Rules
In related news, last night I picked up a Guardian Beast. Didn't actually realize the interaction between Beast and Chaos Orb.
Shahrazad is not in my cube, and won't be. The scenario above is very good, but in the end we have places to be and things to do, and waiting for a round of subgame to finish is awful.
Kinda agree on Shahrazad but at 1x its not that big a deal. I think the problem with it in other formats is that it can happen multiple times every game. It won't likely be drawn every game in Cube matches and you only have one copy. If the match goes 2-0 with a subgame thats no different than a 3 game match.
That said, I wouldn't play it in a bigger group but my brother and I are going to play for roughly a set amount of time so it doesn't make a difference.
Guardian Beast? i remember that guy! Surprised they didn't errate Chaos Orb to be a sacrifice.
Un-cards or Holiday Cards - I'm sure Booster Tutor and Gifts Given would be super fun to play with but with all the cards I have already to pick from I think i can afford to say no to them across the board.[/font]
Dexterity Cards - Basically people hate having to spread their cards out in the off chance that their opponent has a chaos orb, and we don't have the room for everybody to do that anyways. Plus I don't want people flipping my expensive cards all over the place
Ante Cards - Just no
Foreign Cards - It is my cube, and sometimes even I do not know the wording on some for the cards in it, let alone people who don't play very much.
These were conscious choices when constructing my cube from the beginning.
As for cards which were taken out after for some reason
Nether Shadow . I have an Alpha printing of the card and the text on it is VERY different from the text on the revised and forward printings (and hence the official wording). To avoid confusion i took it out.
Isochron Scepter - It wasn't taken out for being too strong, but when I was trimming cards it did get taken out because it never made for an enjoyable play experience on either side of the table. Nobody ever said it was broken or recommended I should take it out - but people were actually happy when I told them it was cut
Originally I had textless cards in my cube. Because I play with people who do not know what each of these cards does I originally changed that to only Wrath of God and Damnation were textless, but when I got a hold of a Beta Wrath I just went and picked up a foil Damnation so I could get rid of textless completely.
I don't have anything against using most cards. I don't want spend the money to put in cards like Moat or Nether Void but I Like playing with enchantments. I like cards like Grave Pact, No Mercy, Furnace of Wrath and Propaganda. If you have any reason to ban cards from your cube I could see Sol Ring being banned. If you get Sol Ring out in your opening hand there is a good chance you will probably win the game. I think Sol Ring gives players too much of advantage for whoever gets it. The cards that do deserve not being banned from your cube are cards like any of the ANTE cards or Chaos Orb.
My 630 Card Powered Cube
My Article - "Cube Design Philosophy"
My Article - "Mana Short: A study in limited resource management."
My 50th Set (P)review - Discusses my top 20 Cube cards from OTJ!
Juju Alters - Altered MTG Cards
I don't feel my cube needs an almost strictly better Vindicate.
My 380 Beginners’ Cube on Cube Tutor
"When I use a word," Humpty Dumpty said, in rather a scornful tone, "it means just what I choose it to mean - neither more nor less." -Lewis Carroll, Through the Looking Glass
Do outdated rules count as custom errata/house rules?
My mana burn and thawing glaciers might take offense
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My Cube for use with 6th ed. Rules