...if green is really that dependent on having such a removal. If this were the case, I believe much more cubers would have included Beast Within...
Except Beast Within is terrible creature removal, and this isn't. So the comparison doesn't apply.
If you were looking for extra resource denial, Beast would be a good option and Song of the Dryads would be a terrible suggestion. If you're looking for threat mitigation (which I am) the two cards flip roles, and Song is the better option.
A better comparison would be like saying that Pongify should be used because it's off color removal and comparing it to Path to Exile. Pongify isn't good creature removal in the cube, but Path is. Because giving your opponent a creature as a drawback to your creature removal spell is ...bad. But exchanging it for a different resource is often enough worthwhile.
A lot of cubers (at least around here) initially had some high praise for Beast Within and did run it for a while. The problem with Beast Within was the 3/3. As it turns out, even just a Beast is a pain. You dealt with one thing and ended up needing to deal with this other thing. A Forest is much less of a problem than a 3/3.
But exchanging it for a different resource is often enough worthwhile.
The same can be said about Beast Within. Nuking pretty much any five-star noncreature card was a good play because what you were killing was a cube card way better than a vanilla 3/3. And that's on top of all the fat dragony targets running around. I'm not saying Beast Within is an A-list card, but it is was occasionally a decent out in a color that has very little of them.
Agreed. But green can deal with noncreature threats, and can't effectively deal with creatures. Which is why Song being good against creatures makes it a more valuable cube card than Beast Within which isn't.
The point is that the comparison to Beast Within isn't apt, because that card is awful at removing creatures, and this card isn't. They're as close to each other in that role as Path to Exile and Pongify are.
If you read the rest of my post, I talk about the uses for which Beast is better, which is basically for resource denial. Other than blowing up lands/manafacts, I'd much rather have Song available.
It's a corner case, but you could use this as the worst green ramp spell ever, if needed. (Similar to how you could use Beast Within in response to removal to give yourself a 3/3, in fact.)
It's a corner case, but you could use this as the worst green ramp spell ever, if needed. (Similar to how you could use Beast Within in response to removal to give yourself a 3/3, in fact.)
That's a totally legit (albeit subpar) application that will come up. It will happen less than Beast Within-ing one of your own things will most likely, but it will happen.
Doesn't sing 'work' for AP too (shutting it off)? Or am I missing something?
-AA
It should. The "you can't win the game" on AP is an ability, and this thing should get rid of all abilities. Although, I think that was the point Dschumm was making?
This card actually caused quite the confusion in a recent cube draft. My opponent used Necromancy on my binned Primeval Titan. I enchant the Titan with Song of the Dryads. My opponent assured me the oracle text of Necromancy didn't include it becoming an Aura, so we played most of the game with him having a Forest before someone intervened and said that Necromancy did in fact become an aura, an aura that would have been sacrificed as soon as the Titan became an illegal permanent to enchant. I was rather rump-rustled that a) we didn't check the oracle wording, what with Necromancy being a terribly confusing card to play according to the rules in the first place, and b) he used the extra mana to make more Pack Rats than he should have been able to make and won the game with them.
Now, outside of that context, the card played beautifully; I paid 3 green mana and got to deal with a huge threat while he got a minor recompense (albeit, in that particular scenario, one he shouldn't have had). The strange interaction with Necromancy is just one of many I look forward to discovering with Song of the Dryads. In that cube I also realized it could enchant lands too, so that you can fix your own mana if you need green, or you can hose an opponent who is stuck on a certain color. It can be a ramp spell on a redundant permanent. It's got versatility out the wazoo.
Song played a big role in a GU controlish deck that went 3-0 this afternoon. The deck would have had trouble dealing with a 3/3 (comparing to Beast Within) since both green and blue are quite light on creature removal. The deck was also fairly light on creatures, and was very much control oriented with just a bit of ramp. My player said the forest was a very small price to pay for an extremely flexible answer to just about any threat. I saw it take out a Hippie that was poised to start ripping his hand apart.
He also mentioned Kiora and Courser being major contributors, stuffing aggressive strategies and buying time. Green playing a significant role in a control deck is wonderful music to my ears
Except Beast Within is terrible creature removal, and this isn't. So the comparison doesn't apply.
If you were looking for extra resource denial, Beast would be a good option and Song of the Dryads would be a terrible suggestion. If you're looking for threat mitigation (which I am) the two cards flip roles, and Song is the better option.
A better comparison would be like saying that Pongify should be used because it's off color removal and comparing it to Path to Exile. Pongify isn't good creature removal in the cube, but Path is. Because giving your opponent a creature as a drawback to your creature removal spell is ...bad. But exchanging it for a different resource is often enough worthwhile.
My 630 Card Powered Cube
My Article - "Cube Design Philosophy"
My Article - "Mana Short: A study in limited resource management."
My 50th Set (P)review - Discusses my top 20 Cube cards from OTJ!
MTGS Average Peasant Cube 2023 Edition
Follow me. I tweet.
The same can be said about Beast Within. Nuking pretty much any five-star noncreature card was a good play because what you were killing was a cube card way better than a vanilla 3/3. And that's on top of all the fat dragony targets running around. I'm not saying Beast Within is an A-list card, but it
iswas occasionally a decent out in a color that has very little of them.My Cube (DeckStats)
My Pauper Cube: 540 (CubeTutor link!)
Level 1 Judge
The point is that the comparison to Beast Within isn't apt, because that card is awful at removing creatures, and this card isn't. They're as close to each other in that role as Path to Exile and Pongify are.
If you read the rest of my post, I talk about the uses for which Beast is better, which is basically for resource denial. Other than blowing up lands/manafacts, I'd much rather have Song available.
My 630 Card Powered Cube
My Article - "Cube Design Philosophy"
My Article - "Mana Short: A study in limited resource management."
My 50th Set (P)review - Discusses my top 20 Cube cards from OTJ!
-AA
I use descriptive language. Assume that I'm being nice and respectful. (I'll tell you when I'm not.)
My Cube: http://cubetutor.com/viewcube/9029
My vote would have been "Petrify". Too close to Putrefy?
thats my cube
I assume you are saying this is a plus of song?
375 unpowered cube - https://cubecobra.com/cube/list/601ac624832cdf1039947588
My 630 Card Powered Cube
My Article - "Cube Design Philosophy"
My Article - "Mana Short: A study in limited resource management."
My 50th Set (P)review - Discusses my top 20 Cube cards from OTJ!
I'd assume so, as 1 for 1<<<<<<<<<<2 for 1
Also, follow us on twitter! @TurnOneMagic
As someone who plays both Bramblecrush and Beast Within, this is a slam dunk for me.
My $40 MTGO cube
Draft my cube at Cubetutor!
That's a totally legit (albeit subpar) application that will come up. It will happen less than Beast Within-ing one of your own things will most likely, but it will happen.
Also, follow us on twitter! @TurnOneMagic
-AA
I use descriptive language. Assume that I'm being nice and respectful. (I'll tell you when I'm not.)
My Cube: http://cubetutor.com/viewcube/9029
It should. The "you can't win the game" on AP is an ability, and this thing should get rid of all abilities. Although, I think that was the point Dschumm was making?
375 unpowered cube - https://cubecobra.com/cube/list/601ac624832cdf1039947588
-AA
I use descriptive language. Assume that I'm being nice and respectful. (I'll tell you when I'm not.)
My Cube: http://cubetutor.com/viewcube/9029
-AA
I use descriptive language. Assume that I'm being nice and respectful. (I'll tell you when I'm not.)
My Cube: http://cubetutor.com/viewcube/9029
Now, outside of that context, the card played beautifully; I paid 3 green mana and got to deal with a huge threat while he got a minor recompense (albeit, in that particular scenario, one he shouldn't have had). The strange interaction with Necromancy is just one of many I look forward to discovering with Song of the Dryads. In that cube I also realized it could enchant lands too, so that you can fix your own mana if you need green, or you can hose an opponent who is stuck on a certain color. It can be a ramp spell on a redundant permanent. It's got versatility out the wazoo.
My 630 Card Powered Cube
My Article - "Cube Design Philosophy"
My Article - "Mana Short: A study in limited resource management."
My 50th Set (P)review - Discusses my top 20 Cube cards from OTJ!
He also mentioned Kiora and Courser being major contributors, stuffing aggressive strategies and buying time. Green playing a significant role in a control deck is wonderful music to my ears
I played it three times targeting:
1) Tolarian Academy
2) Wurmcoil Engine
3) Sun Titan
Felt awesome every time, since G/U isn't the best at "removal" spells.
WGURBLands!WGURB
WGUInfectWGU
Legacy Lands Primer
Top 8 SCG Oakland 2014
Helpdesk
My Cube on CubeTutor
UR Melek, Izzet ParagonUR, B Shirei, Shizo's CaretakerB, R Jaya Ballard, Task MageR,RW Tajic, Blade of the LegionRW, UB Lazav, Dimir MastermindUB, UB Circu, Dimir LobotomistUB, RWU Zedruu the GreatheartedRWU, GUBThe MimeoplasmGUB, UGExperiment Kraj UG, WDarien, King of KjeldorW, BMarrow-GnawerB, WBGKarador, Ghost ChieftainWBG, UTeferi, Temporal ArchmageU, GWUDerevi, Empyrial TacticianGWU, RDaretti, Scrap SavantR, UTalrand, Sky SummonerU, GEzuri, Renegade LeaderG, WUBRGReaper KingWUBRG, RGXenagos, God of RevelsRG, CKozilek, Butcher of TruthC, WUBRGGeneral TazriWUBRG, GTitania, Protector of ArgothG