So, we just got a bunch of Conspiracy spoilers today, including several very interesting draft-specific cards.
In the vein of Cogwork Librarian, there appears to be a whole batch of at least five cards that are drafted face-up and have an effect on the draft.
For 1, you get a 1/1 that also lets you look at any one unopened pack or pack waiting between players
For 2, you get a 2/2 that also lets you immediately open another pack and add it to the draft
For 3, you get a 2/1 flier that lets you look at the next card drafted from that booster
For 4, you get Cogwork Librarian
For 5, you get a card that you mark what pick you made it at, and when you play it it ETBs with that many +1/+1 counters.
The 1 and 3 drops seem a bit weak, definitely not worth considering, IMO. The two drop, Lore Seeker, is definitely worth a look. The ability to get another first pick by grabbing him makes him very attractive. It also adds about 2 extra picks per player to the draft (assuming 8 man pods and 15-card packs). It does require you have enough cards for excess boosters on hand (making it the first non-SilverBordered card that does that), but it's at the very least exciting. The fact that it's a colorless Grizzly Bear means it might make the cut as a 23rd card in an aggressive deck as well.
The other one worth noting is Lurking Automaton, the 5-drop. It's a very interesting card because it gets better the later it's picked. You almost never want to grab this thing in the first pass around, but any time on the wheel, it becomes potentially worthwhile. As a 5 mana 9/9 makes this similar to Precursor Golem, though with less token synergy. At 12th pick, he adds as much power to the board as Wolfir Silverheart, and very little can compete with him as a 14th or 15th pick.
We also finally have the Conspiracy cardtype revealed. As speculated, they are the cards that are not Vintage or Legacy legal. There are two types of Conspiracy.
Regular Conspiracies start the game face up in the Command Zone, and confer an immediate benefit. The two revealed thus far as -5 minimum deck size and start the game with a 1/1 defender.
Hidden Agenda Conspiracies start the game face down with a card secretly named. At any time, you can flip them up and reveal the named card. Advantages given include copying the named instant/sorcery when cast, creatures with the given name having haste, tapping for one mana of any color, or entering with an additional +1/+1 counter, or spells with that name costing 1 less.
I can't see the Hidden Agendas being terribly good in Cube, given that you don't have the potential for multiple copies of a common like you do in real draft. The normal Conspiracy cards have potential though. -5 decksize is pretty neat, and it's easy to imagine some other effects that would be worth a draft pick (+1 starting/maximum handsize, for example).
What do people think? Will you be considering any of these cards for your Cubes?
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I've already started considering the Lore Seeker. Its an interesting card and most of the people here would prefer to crack actual boosters for it which would be fun. Cogwork is also tempting, but less likely.
As for the conspiracies, I probably won't run any, but that -5 decksize one is sorely tempting, I'd just hate to cut an actual card at 360 to fit it in.
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Rest in RIP My Signature, I guess. 2015-2016, we hardly knew ye.
Total side note but I like how people are discussing running this over itself.
Well, it has to be said that Kolaghan is clearly better than Kolaghan. Considering what BR decks usually want and how stiff the competition in this guild is, there is no way that I would run Kolaghan over Kolaghan! Kolaghan might make it in as the sixth guild card or so. Kolaghan on the other hand ranks several places below that.
It was so funny to me when they described this as a downgrade to the original Zurgo during the Pax East panel. I was thinking if this is a downgrade, they should really "downgrade" all legendary creatures. Haha.
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3. Decide I don't want to disassemble one of my existing decks
4. Give up and do nothing
I don't see the point of this new shroud mechanic. It's strictly worse than Hexproof. Threshold is pretty bad too, Delirium is a much better mechanic and probably easier to activate.
Otherwise this card is a pretty neat guy. Dodges removal and grows into a Primal Huntbeast. 3/5
Cogwork Librarian is the only one I'm going to include for now. The others are too complicated in my opinion and too many of those effects water down good playables as well as making the draft super confusing for players.
I've already started considering the Lore Seeker. Its an interesting card and most of the people here would prefer to crack actual boosters for it which would be fun. Cogwork is also tempting, but less likely.
As for the conspiracies, I probably won't run any, but that -5 decksize one is sorely tempting, I'd just hate to cut an actual card at 360 to fit it in.
I'm inclined to agree on most counts, but I will say that if there was ever a reason my drafters would totally understand there being 361 cards in a cube, these would be it
Also, I've been testing cogwork librarian as a 3 mana 3/3 and he's been preforming pretty well. At least on that logic, the 2 mana add a pack creature sounds interesting.
With Conspiracies being more like Vanguards or Hero cards than regular cards (they aren't Vintage-legal anyway), I wouldn't include them as regular cards. They'd be a separated list, maybe drafted separately (like EDH cubes do with the Commanders). But I'd need to see the whole list to consider them.
I'm trying to visualize how the 2-drop effectively works. Sounds crazy.
I'm trying to visualize how the 2-drop effectively works. Sounds crazy.
Well, you've got to have more than enough cards to make more packs than you need for your draft. Make an extra one (either at the start or when someone actually picks the card). Rather than drafting the next pack you'd be passed (leave it in queue for you for now), crack the new pack and make your pick from there. Then pass that pack, pick up the next one in queue, and proceed as normal. That pack will go around maybe longer than the rest of your packs, depending where this guy's picked, but logistically it shouldn't really cause any issues.
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So much design space, so little explored. The conspiracys are so weak I don't have to worry about the mechanic.
The drafting cards are interesting on the other hand. I like the 2 drop for fun factor, at least worth a try. the librian still fell too useless. I think the 5 drop will be a beating but I am not sure I want a 5 drop vanilla artifact even if it will usually be 10/10.
I wouldn't include conspiracies in a cube pack, but consider the implications as an external add-on, like General drafting for EDH cubes. I'd probably take a cue from board games and offer each player a selection of two or three random conspiracies to pick from in draft order. Having the entire list of 11 or whatever available to the first drafter is too much of an advantage.
My problem with the conspiracies is that none of them really do anything. I would have much rather had mo more powerful symmetric effects that I could build a deck around, like howling mine or mana flare.
My problem with the conspiracies is that none of them really do anything. I would have much rather had mo more powerful symmetric effects that I could build a deck around, like howling mine or mana flare.
There's a pretty good chance that there is 6 more we haven't seen, so maybe one of them will be more unique.
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Rest in RIP My Signature, I guess. 2015-2016, we hardly knew ye.
Total side note but I like how people are discussing running this over itself.
Well, it has to be said that Kolaghan is clearly better than Kolaghan. Considering what BR decks usually want and how stiff the competition in this guild is, there is no way that I would run Kolaghan over Kolaghan! Kolaghan might make it in as the sixth guild card or so. Kolaghan on the other hand ranks several places below that.
It was so funny to me when they described this as a downgrade to the original Zurgo during the Pax East panel. I was thinking if this is a downgrade, they should really "downgrade" all legendary creatures. Haha.
My deck designing is quite concise at this point:
1. Come up with deck idea
2. Realize this idea is somehow fundamentally similar to another deck I have or that is commonly played in my group
3. Decide I don't want to disassemble one of my existing decks
4. Give up and do nothing
I don't see the point of this new shroud mechanic. It's strictly worse than Hexproof. Threshold is pretty bad too, Delirium is a much better mechanic and probably easier to activate.
Otherwise this card is a pretty neat guy. Dodges removal and grows into a Primal Huntbeast. 3/5
While I won't cube with the Conspiracy cards, all the draft-altering artifact creatures deserve a closer look. Note that I am only talking about their use in a cube booster draft here. If you use other methods of drafting, the evaluation might change. For each card, there are three aspects to consider: How much will it impact the draft? How likely is it that the card actually sees play after the draft? How much work does using the card during a draft create?
1Whispergear Sneak 1/1
Draft impact: low + random
Playability: unplayable
Logistics: low
Verdict: This one is just too weak both during draft and during play to cube.
2Lore Seeker 2/2
Draft impact: high
Playability: borderline playable
Logistics: medium
Verdict: This one gives you another first pick, thus increasing the chance to get another powerful card. That is especially nice if there aren't any cards that you would want to pick in the current booster. Or maybe you would actually want to pick this creature for your deck in an otherwise empty pack? A 2/2 for 2 might see play if you don't get enough 2-drops. It is subpar, but at least, it fills out the curve. Creating another booster and passing it among the smaller, regular packs takes a bit of work and concentration. Adding another booster to the rotation is especially nice if you are drafting with few people (like 4 - 6) though.
3Cogwork Spy 2/1 flying
Draft impact: low
Playability: unplayable
Logistics: low
Verdict: This one is too weak to see play. Knowing a single pick that the player after you made isn't that great, considering that the best card that you took from this pack was this weakling. It gets even weaker during the second and third booster.
4Cogwork Librarian 3/3
Draft impact: high + interesting
Playability: unplayable
Logistics: low
Verdict: There are often boosters that contain multiple cards that you really want to draft and don't expect to go around the table, so this card here can be a godsend. Going back into the booster, so that it will often be used multiple times by different players during a single draft makes is very interesting. However, it gets weaker during later boosters. It is also too weak to see play in a deck, which is a major stroke against it (unless you are ok with cubing with unplayable cards).
5Lurking Automaton 0/0 + counters
Draft impact: low
Playability: playable
Logistics: low + annoying
Verdict: While there are a few good 4-drop and 6-drop artifact creatures, the 5-mana slot only really has Batterskull and Precursor Golem. This card here will usually be a 9/9 - 12/12 for 5, which makes it roughly as powerful as the Golem. Not having multiple bodies sucks, but at least it doesn't come with the drawback. It isn't that interesting to draft with though and having to note the pick number for all the games demands some paper or other method to keep track of that information.
Bottom line: The only cards from this list that I consider for my cube are the ones for 2 and 5 mana. The former because it is interesting during the draft and because it somewhat qualifies as a small colorless aggro creature (which are almost non-existent). The latter because there isn't much in its slot yet. The one for 4 mana has the coolest effect during the draft, but I won't cube with an unplayable card.
So here is a real contender. Decent stats, good ability, neat draft mechanic that works with all draft styles, I think we have a neat card most everyone would be happy playing.
Deal Broker 3
Artifact Creature - Construct
Draft Deal Broker face up.
Immediately after the draft, you may reveal a card in your card pool. Each other player may offer you one card in his or her card pool in exchange. You may accept any one offer. t, Draw a card, then discard a card.
2/3
I would consider adding this card even without the draft altering mechanic. Reanimator decks could use the discard outlet, and control decks could use a looter that can actually block favorably sometimes.
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465 card Unpowered cube thread. Draft it here and I'll be happy to return the favor.
450 card Peasant cube thread. Draft it here.
So here is a real contender. Decent stats, good ability, neat draft mechanic that works with all draft styles, I think we have a neat card most everyone would be happy playing.
Deal Broker 3
Artifact Creature - Construct
Draft Deal Broker face up.
Immediately after the draft, you may reveal a card in your card pool. Each other player may offer you one card in his or her card pool in exchange. You may accept any one offer. t, Draw a card, then discard a card.
2/3
I think about adding this guy. I think it's a fairly fun draft altering ability, and a card that can be used in artifact-based decks or reanimator.
Power Play 0
Conspiracy
You are the starting player.
Being able to win every die roll looks very strong, especially if you're drafting an aggro deck. This is the first Conspiracy I'm strongly considering.
So here is a real contender. Decent stats, good ability, neat draft mechanic that works with all draft styles, I think we have a neat card most everyone would be happy playing.
Deal Broker 3
Artifact Creature - Construct
Draft Deal Broker face up.
Immediately after the draft, you may reveal a card in your card pool. Each other player may offer you one card in his or her card pool in exchange. You may accept any one offer. t, Draw a card, then discard a card.
2/3
Woah. The body + looting effect makes this the most likely to be maindecked among the constructs. Add that to an actually relevant draft ability and we have the most cubable draft construct so far.
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In the vein of Cogwork Librarian, there appears to be a whole batch of at least five cards that are drafted face-up and have an effect on the draft.
For 1, you get a 1/1 that also lets you look at any one unopened pack or pack waiting between players
For 2, you get a 2/2 that also lets you immediately open another pack and add it to the draft
For 3, you get a 2/1 flier that lets you look at the next card drafted from that booster
For 4, you get Cogwork Librarian
For 5, you get a card that you mark what pick you made it at, and when you play it it ETBs with that many +1/+1 counters.
The 1 and 3 drops seem a bit weak, definitely not worth considering, IMO. The two drop, Lore Seeker, is definitely worth a look. The ability to get another first pick by grabbing him makes him very attractive. It also adds about 2 extra picks per player to the draft (assuming 8 man pods and 15-card packs). It does require you have enough cards for excess boosters on hand (making it the first non-Silver Bordered card that does that), but it's at the very least exciting. The fact that it's a colorless Grizzly Bear means it might make the cut as a 23rd card in an aggressive deck as well.
The other one worth noting is Lurking Automaton, the 5-drop. It's a very interesting card because it gets better the later it's picked. You almost never want to grab this thing in the first pass around, but any time on the wheel, it becomes potentially worthwhile. As a 5 mana 9/9 makes this similar to Precursor Golem, though with less token synergy. At 12th pick, he adds as much power to the board as Wolfir Silverheart, and very little can compete with him as a 14th or 15th pick.
We also finally have the Conspiracy cardtype revealed. As speculated, they are the cards that are not Vintage or Legacy legal. There are two types of Conspiracy.
Regular Conspiracies start the game face up in the Command Zone, and confer an immediate benefit. The two revealed thus far as -5 minimum deck size and start the game with a 1/1 defender.
Hidden Agenda Conspiracies start the game face down with a card secretly named. At any time, you can flip them up and reveal the named card. Advantages given include copying the named instant/sorcery when cast, creatures with the given name having haste, tapping for one mana of any color, or entering with an additional +1/+1 counter, or spells with that name costing 1 less.
I can't see the Hidden Agendas being terribly good in Cube, given that you don't have the potential for multiple copies of a common like you do in real draft. The normal Conspiracy cards have potential though. -5 decksize is pretty neat, and it's easy to imagine some other effects that would be worth a draft pick (+1 starting/maximum handsize, for example).
What do people think? Will you be considering any of these cards for your Cubes?
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As for the conspiracies, I probably won't run any, but that -5 decksize one is sorely tempting, I'd just hate to cut an actual card at 360 to fit it in.
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I'm inclined to agree on most counts, but I will say that if there was ever a reason my drafters would totally understand there being 361 cards in a cube, these would be it
Also, I've been testing cogwork librarian as a 3 mana 3/3 and he's been preforming pretty well. At least on that logic, the 2 mana add a pack creature sounds interesting.
I'm trying to visualize how the 2-drop effectively works. Sounds crazy.
And could be introduced without that much of a headache.
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Well, you've got to have more than enough cards to make more packs than you need for your draft. Make an extra one (either at the start or when someone actually picks the card). Rather than drafting the next pack you'd be passed (leave it in queue for you for now), crack the new pack and make your pick from there. Then pass that pack, pick up the next one in queue, and proceed as normal. That pack will go around maybe longer than the rest of your packs, depending where this guy's picked, but logistically it shouldn't really cause any issues.
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The drafting cards are interesting on the other hand. I like the 2 drop for fun factor, at least worth a try. the librian still fell too useless. I think the 5 drop will be a beating but I am not sure I want a 5 drop vanilla artifact even if it will usually be 10/10.
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There's a pretty good chance that there is 6 more we haven't seen, so maybe one of them will be more unique.
Does Loreseeker plus this automaton mean it could be bigger than 15/15? They both refer to the "draft round" it looks like
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1 Whispergear Sneak 1/1
Draft impact: low + random
Playability: unplayable
Logistics: low
Verdict: This one is just too weak both during draft and during play to cube.
2 Lore Seeker 2/2
Draft impact: high
Playability: borderline playable
Logistics: medium
Verdict: This one gives you another first pick, thus increasing the chance to get another powerful card. That is especially nice if there aren't any cards that you would want to pick in the current booster. Or maybe you would actually want to pick this creature for your deck in an otherwise empty pack? A 2/2 for 2 might see play if you don't get enough 2-drops. It is subpar, but at least, it fills out the curve. Creating another booster and passing it among the smaller, regular packs takes a bit of work and concentration. Adding another booster to the rotation is especially nice if you are drafting with few people (like 4 - 6) though.
3 Cogwork Spy 2/1 flying
Draft impact: low
Playability: unplayable
Logistics: low
Verdict: This one is too weak to see play. Knowing a single pick that the player after you made isn't that great, considering that the best card that you took from this pack was this weakling. It gets even weaker during the second and third booster.
4 Cogwork Librarian 3/3
Draft impact: high + interesting
Playability: unplayable
Logistics: low
Verdict: There are often boosters that contain multiple cards that you really want to draft and don't expect to go around the table, so this card here can be a godsend. Going back into the booster, so that it will often be used multiple times by different players during a single draft makes is very interesting. However, it gets weaker during later boosters. It is also too weak to see play in a deck, which is a major stroke against it (unless you are ok with cubing with unplayable cards).
5 Lurking Automaton 0/0 + counters
Draft impact: low
Playability: playable
Logistics: low + annoying
Verdict: While there are a few good 4-drop and 6-drop artifact creatures, the 5-mana slot only really has Batterskull and Precursor Golem. This card here will usually be a 9/9 - 12/12 for 5, which makes it roughly as powerful as the Golem. Not having multiple bodies sucks, but at least it doesn't come with the drawback. It isn't that interesting to draft with though and having to note the pick number for all the games demands some paper or other method to keep track of that information.
Bottom line: The only cards from this list that I consider for my cube are the ones for 2 and 5 mana. The former because it is interesting during the draft and because it somewhat qualifies as a small colorless aggro creature (which are almost non-existent). The latter because there isn't much in its slot yet. The one for 4 mana has the coolest effect during the draft, but I won't cube with an unplayable card.
Uril, the Miststalker RGW -- Ulamog, the Infinite Gyre C -- Vhati il-Dal BG -- Jor Kadeen, the Prevailer RW -- Animar, Soul of Elements URG
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Deal Broker
3
Artifact Creature - Construct
Draft Deal Broker face up.
Immediately after the draft, you may reveal a card in your card pool. Each other player may offer you one card in his or her card pool in exchange. You may accept any one offer.
t, Draw a card, then discard a card.
2/3
450 card Peasant cube thread. Draft it here.
I think about adding this guy. I think it's a fairly fun draft altering ability, and a card that can be used in artifact-based decks or reanimator.
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0
Conspiracy
You are the starting player.
Being able to win every die roll looks very strong, especially if you're drafting an aggro deck. This is the first Conspiracy I'm strongly considering.
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Woah. The body + looting effect makes this the most likely to be maindecked among the constructs. Add that to an actually relevant draft ability and we have the most cubable draft construct so far.