I didn't actually make room for Twinflame. My thought was that the restriction to only your creatures limits its value too much for the smaller cubes. What do you guys think?
How can that be!? Playing Nin as your commander is like playing Braingeyser as your commander which is nuts.
Because creatures don't last long in general, the Cube pushes for 3 color decks, she's mana hungry, and doesn't have haste. RWU, RUG, and Grixis are popular, but Izzet isn't.
I like Twinflame quite a bit. Heat Shimmer has been in and out of my Cube and I think is currently in and Twinflame seems better. Shimmer lets you copy opposing guys, but Twinflame is one cheaper AND has a replicate mode, which is enough value for me to definitely try it out over the Shimmer.
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After rotation, I may pick up the full set and run it. After my last 8-person draft, folks were complaining that fixing was a little rough (though I like to blame the guy running horde of notions that night). One of the people in my playgroup thinks adding a scry land to each guild will help matters, which I don't have any objections to, and the extra scry power seems somewhat useful to each color combo. Until rotation though, I'm thinking of putting all 5 vivid lands in (they take up less color-identity space IMO), and maybe throwing in an extra mana rock or two + mana confluence, when I can get my paws on one.
Now that we've got the complete cycle of Scrylands, is anyone considering them for their Cubes? I could see running them over the Checklands in mine.
I have all 8 already and will add the last 2 as soon as I can get them. We love them. The ETB tapped thing isn't a big deal in most cases and that Scry smooths things out really well. They replaced the M10 Checklands.
After rotation, I may pick up the full set and run it. After my last 8-person draft, folks were complaining that fixing was a little rough (though I like to blame the guy running horde of notions that night). One of the people in my playgroup thinks adding a scry land to each guild will help matters, which I don't have any objections to, and the extra scry power seems somewhat useful to each color combo. Until rotation though, I'm thinking of putting all 5 vivid lands in (they take up less color-identity space IMO), and maybe throwing in an extra mana rock or two + mana confluence, when I can get my paws on one.
Hmm.... looking at your list, you're currently only running Dual, Shock, Fetch for each color pair. I run these plus the Filters for each pair, and I've considered adding another set (either the Checklands, Pains, or now Scrylands). Your Cube is even a little bigger than mine. Adding a fourth cycle plus Vivids would help you a lot.
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I'm playing most of the scry lands but my cube is gigantic so I have 8 color fixing land for each color combo. Some color pairs were still running Guild Gates...
I'm playing most of the scry lands but my cube is gigantic so I have 8 color fixing land for each color combo. Some color pairs were still running Guild Gates...
EIGHT? That's pretty crazy. I'd probably go (in order of inclusion):
Where Assorted is Horizon Canopy for WG, ManDuals for the other allied colors, and I guess Karoos for the enemy colors. So I guess I could see Gates for those enemy combinations without Scrylands.
I'd definitely like to see some other cycles completed, notably the Manduals and the Scars Fastlands, so that enemy pairs have better support. Gates and Karoos are just plain bad.
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I really don't like scry at sorcery speed, so many things change before your next turn especially in a multiplayer game. The comes into play tapped is a pain in the ass in lot of situation, so i rate the scrylands after painlands and checklands. My personal choice is:
Dual
Fetch
Shock
Filter
Pain
Check
Scry
The biggest thing the scrylands can do is filter lands away when you have enough or filter nonlands away when you're looking for land.
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In my search for enemy lands I considered/ran Tainted lands and the Lorwyn tribal lands for some pairs. The Guildgates are fine though and I'll probably go up to 9 fixers per pair the next time I expand when the next core set comes up.
In my search for enemy lands I considered/ran Tainted lands and the Lorwyn tribal lands for some pairs. The Guildgates are fine though and I'll probably go up to 9 fixers per pair the next time I expand when the next core set comes up.
I don't like the karoos because they're slow, you have to discard if you play them t2 with no t1 play, and you get hammered hard if they get destroyed or bounced.
Tainted Lands are fine, as are the Lorwyn lands (both should be better than Gates), but between the two you only cover a few pairs GB has both Tainted Woods and Gilt-Leaf Palace, BW has Tainted Field, WR has Ancient Amphitheater, and RU and UG have nothing.
How large is your flipping Cube that you want 9 fixers per pair?
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The karoos are also 2 lands in one which is quite powerful. Resetting Bojuka Bog is pretty sweet, they're great with untap effects and I can definitely see including the Onslaught cycling lands in the future which they interact well with. They certainly have all the drawbacks you mentioned but I think they're fine as a high risk high reward card. I certainly wouldn't want a deck full of them but if that's the fixing land I see for my color combo I'm not disappointed taking it.
The karoos are also 2 lands in one which is quite powerful. Resetting Bojuka Bog is pretty sweet, they're great with untap effects and I can definitely see including the Onslaught cycling lands in the future which they interact well with. They certainly have all the drawbacks you mentioned but I think they're fine as a high risk high reward card. I certainly wouldn't want a deck full of them but if that's the fixing land I see for my color combo I'm not disappointed taking it.
Fair.
I think that 1 dual per 100 cards is too high for EDH Cube. I've got 4 cycles at 640, and if I go to 960, I'd run 6 cycles, maaaybe 7.
1 dual per 100 is standard for regular cubes, but those cubes also only draft 45 cards per player. A 720 with 7 sets only drafts 3.5 of those sets on average.
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Yeah. Especially when Basics do the lion's share of the work. I've thought about cutting duals all together since they don't seem to make that big of a difference. Then I remember they are too expensive to sit around and change my mind. But, I think that the cost of adding too much fixing is in the additional time it takes to draft.
I think that 1 dual per 100 cards is too high for EDH Cube. I've got 4 cycles at 640, and if I go to 960, I'd run 6 cycles, maaaybe 7.
1 dual per 100 is standard for regular cubes, but those cubes also only draft 45 cards per player. A 720 with 7 sets only drafts 3.5 of those sets on average.
There are also less of a percentage of rainbow lands in large EDH cubes when compared to standard size cubes (I believe, haven't done the math). Additionally cube tends to push multicolor decks whereas it's often preferable to have a monocolor or a 2 color deck heavily slanted towards one color in regular cubes which leads to more fighting over color fixing. Of course regular cube decks can splash which isn't possible in EDH so that's a factor as well. For now I've been happy with the number I run and will probably try to keep about a 1 dual per 100 ratio unless it becomes a problem. I'd actually like my land section to be the biggest one in my cube and right now it's still behind artifacts.
Yeah. Especially when Basics do the lion's share of the work. I've thought about cutting duals all together since they don't seem to make that big of a difference. Then I remember they are too expensive to sit around and change my mind. But, I think that the cost of adding too much fixing is in the additional time it takes to draft.
I think having dual lands is good because it makes three colored decks eaiser and five colored decks possible.
Duals are also "free includes" in decks and therefore almost never bad picks, which is good when you end up having to cut like 35%-40% of the cards you draft from your final list.
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I know. But, as long as you avoid super color intense cards you can usually get away with it. Don't most people build 2 color with a splash of a third anyway?
They are "free" except that drafting 600 (5-15 card packs) takes a lot longer than 480 (4 15-card packs). If I wanted to speed things up I would look first at lands.
I know. But, as long as you avoid super color intense cards you can usually get away with it. Don't most people build 2 color with a splash of a third anyway?
They are "free" except that drafting 600 (5-15 card packs) takes a lot longer than 480 (4 15-card packs). If I wanted to speed things up I would look first at lands.
ANd Cryptic Command... Furnace of Rath.... Invoke Prejudice.... Oh I know. There are a lot of cards I've deliberately left out of my cube because I'd rather people easily play 3 color decks than get color screwed. Mine's already well build for this stuff
It's also why I am pumped about the easy to cast Gravepact and Furnace coming out today.
ANd Cryptic Command... Furnace of Rath.... Invoke Prejudice.... Oh I know. There are a lot of cards I've deliberately left out of my cube because I'd rather people easily play 3 color decks than get color screwed.
They can do that by taking mana fixing and this hurts more aggressive decks a lot more than the slow durdle decks since they need the fixing more. Meh not a fan.
Anyways what do you guys think about the Onslaught cycling land cycle (Lonely Sandbar and co.). I'm thinking to put it in my next update just curious your thoughts.
I feel like the Cycling lands are probably too low impact to be worth the slots.
They're not something I'd run in a normal EDH deck unless I was doing Loam shenanigans or other cycling triggers. I guess I could see running the green ones to go with Loam if you've got the room for them.
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360 Unpowered Cube | Cubetutor
Because creatures don't last long in general, the Cube pushes for 3 color decks, she's mana hungry, and doesn't have haste. RWU, RUG, and Grixis are popular, but Izzet isn't.
WUBRGPauper Battle BoxWUBRG ... and why I am not a fan of Wayne Reynolds' Illustrations.
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360 Unpowered Cube | Cubetutor
"Personally I love high-riak, low-reqars gambles. Life's best with a decent amount of riak. And f*** reqars."
I have all 8 already and will add the last 2 as soon as I can get them. We love them. The ETB tapped thing isn't a big deal in most cases and that Scry smooths things out really well. They replaced the M10 Checklands.
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Hmm.... looking at your list, you're currently only running Dual, Shock, Fetch for each color pair. I run these plus the Filters for each pair, and I've considered adding another set (either the Checklands, Pains, or now Scrylands). Your Cube is even a little bigger than mine. Adding a fourth cycle plus Vivids would help you a lot.
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EIGHT? That's pretty crazy. I'd probably go (in order of inclusion):
Dual
Fetch
Shock
Filter
Scry
Check
Painland
Assorted
Where Assorted is Horizon Canopy for WG, ManDuals for the other allied colors, and I guess Karoos for the enemy colors. So I guess I could see Gates for those enemy combinations without Scrylands.
I'd definitely like to see some other cycles completed, notably the Manduals and the Scars Fastlands, so that enemy pairs have better support. Gates and Karoos are just plain bad.
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The biggest thing the scrylands can do is filter lands away when you have enough or filter nonlands away when you're looking for land.
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In my search for enemy lands I considered/ran Tainted lands and the Lorwyn tribal lands for some pairs. The Guildgates are fine though and I'll probably go up to 9 fixers per pair the next time I expand when the next core set comes up.
I don't like the karoos because they're slow, you have to discard if you play them t2 with no t1 play, and you get hammered hard if they get destroyed or bounced.
Tainted Lands are fine, as are the Lorwyn lands (both should be better than Gates), but between the two you only cover a few pairs GB has both Tainted Woods and Gilt-Leaf Palace, BW has Tainted Field, WR has Ancient Amphitheater, and RU and UG have nothing.
How large is your flipping Cube that you want 9 fixers per pair?
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The karoos are also 2 lands in one which is quite powerful. Resetting Bojuka Bog is pretty sweet, they're great with untap effects and I can definitely see including the Onslaught cycling lands in the future which they interact well with. They certainly have all the drawbacks you mentioned but I think they're fine as a high risk high reward card. I certainly wouldn't want a deck full of them but if that's the fixing land I see for my color combo I'm not disappointed taking it.
Fair.
I think that 1 dual per 100 cards is too high for EDH Cube. I've got 4 cycles at 640, and if I go to 960, I'd run 6 cycles, maaaybe 7.
1 dual per 100 is standard for regular cubes, but those cubes also only draft 45 cards per player. A 720 with 7 sets only drafts 3.5 of those sets on average.
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There are also less of a percentage of rainbow lands in large EDH cubes when compared to standard size cubes (I believe, haven't done the math). Additionally cube tends to push multicolor decks whereas it's often preferable to have a monocolor or a 2 color deck heavily slanted towards one color in regular cubes which leads to more fighting over color fixing. Of course regular cube decks can splash which isn't possible in EDH so that's a factor as well. For now I've been happy with the number I run and will probably try to keep about a 1 dual per 100 ratio unless it becomes a problem. I'd actually like my land section to be the biggest one in my cube and right now it's still behind artifacts.
I think having dual lands is good because it makes three colored decks eaiser and five colored decks possible.
Duals are also "free includes" in decks and therefore almost never bad picks, which is good when you end up having to cut like 35%-40% of the cards you draft from your final list.
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They are "free" except that drafting 600 (5-15 card packs) takes a lot longer than 480 (4 15-card packs). If I wanted to speed things up I would look first at lands.
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Interesting. I could definitely see that working.
Problem is, there's a ton of super high power CCC-cost cards, like Future Sight, Kiki-jiki, Mirror Breaker, Necropotence, etc.
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It's also why I am pumped about the easy to cast Gravepact and Furnace coming out today.
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They can do that by taking mana fixing and this hurts more aggressive decks a lot more than the slow durdle decks since they need the fixing more. Meh not a fan.
Anyways what do you guys think about the Onslaught cycling land cycle (Lonely Sandbar and co.). I'm thinking to put it in my next update just curious your thoughts.
They're not something I'd run in a normal EDH deck unless I was doing Loam shenanigans or other cycling triggers. I guess I could see running the green ones to go with Loam if you've got the room for them.
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