Does anyone else have problems with people in their playgroup moaning about 'you put the thing together, so of course you have an advantage over us'?
Except that the playgroup is actually 2-1 in sealed against you and you're also married to her?
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I can't say I'm pleased to see you and must warn you I may have to do something about it.
EDH: UGEdric
Pauper: URDelver
Modern: UGRDelver
Draft my cube: Eric's 390 Unpowered
Does anyone else have problems with people in their playgroup moaning about 'you put the thing together, so of course you have an advantage over us'?
Eh. Not really. Every now and again (usually from people we don't draft with often), I'll get a "you obv know every card in the cube so you're going to win," or something like that. I usually say that 1) I don't have the contents of my cubes memorized, 2) Even if I did, I still have no idea what's in your deck past the cards I've seen in games, 3) I made it to the Pro Tour as a judge but never a player, so we're probably on roughly equal footing there, and 4) STFU.
Does anyone else have problems with people in their playgroup moaning about 'you put the thing together, so of course you have an advantage over us'?
Eh. Not really. Every now and again (usually from people we don't draft with often), I'll get a "you obv know every card in the cube so you're going to win," or something like that. I usually say that 1) I don't have the contents of my cubes memorized, 2) Even if I did, I still have no idea what's in your deck past the cards I've seen in games, 3) I made it to the Pro Tour as a judge but never a player, so we're probably on roughly equal footing there, and 4) STFU.
5) We're just playing for fun and I'd rather use my cube to test out kooky deck ideas and see what's supported and what isn't than to Spike out and use some small edge to try to grind out wins against my friends. When I cube online I'm mostly looking to win.
Yes, and we do typically play with a prize pool (one Standard-legal booster apiece) so some players have complained when I come in first. They're absolutely right that I have the advantage of knowing the entire cardpool inside out, but I probably have a bigger advantage in terms of being familiar with the traditional cube environment and the kinds of decks that can be built. I'm often playing with people who have never played any cube before. Players who have played other cubes before give me a much tougher match-up.
Also, there are no secrets about what's in my cube. Anyone can go to my CT page and check out the list, and do practice drafts to get to know their options and I encourage anyone about to draft my cube for the first time to check it out. The only time I ever had a completely new-to-cube player 3-0'd a draft of my cube, it was because he'd done his homework and drafted several decks against the CT bots. It turns out that edge isn't that difficult to erase for someone who wants to!
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465 card Unpowered cube thread. Draft it here and I'll be happy to return the favor.
450 card Peasant cube thread. Draft it here.
5) We're just playing for fun and I'd rather use my cube to test out kooky deck ideas and see what's supported and what isn't than to Spike out and use some small edge to try to grind out wins against my friends. When I cube online I'm mostly looking to win.
A fair point. I'm not in tournament mode when I'm cubing with friends.
Also, you're in Baltimore and I'm in Silver Spring (and from Baltimore orignally). We have to cube sometime.
People don't like MTGS because they associate it with me, and I'm a bloody tyrant that rules over the forum with an iron fist.
And if multiple members here have independent tested success with a card, it's because of hivemind/groupthink, and can't possibly be because particular cards/strategies have actually performed well for us.
And we're all powermaxers; disregarding "fun" for the "powerful" cards ...even though those two concepts aren't mutually exclusive for the vast majority of the cube managers here. Fun cards are the powerful ones for me, and for a lot of other folks too.
There are certainly times (moreso historically than as of late) where I was overly hostile with other members. I've made an attempt over the, well, several years now, to shake that image. But, I deserve a lot of the lingering criticisms, so that's that. But a lot of it stems from folks not tolerating differing opinions. A lot of conversations have gone:
Them: What do you think of card/strategy A?
Me: Card/strategy A didn't work for me or my group because of reasons X, Y and Z.
Them: Groupthink! Hivemind! Power-maxer! Tyrant!
Me: ...
But thems the brakes I guess. A lot of folks don't want criticism, and they don't want to hear why things might not work. They only want reenforcement ...funnily enough, that leads to more hive-mindedness than creating open differing discussions does, so ya. Oh well.
But people want different things from their forum posting experience, which is what I've learned over my tenure here. When I post an idea about a card/strategy, I want the cold, hard truth. I want the criticism. I want people to share both their positive and negative experiences with the idea, because that's what's most helpful to me. So, when I post feedback, it's curt. To-the-point, and without handling the feedback with kid gloves and a dozen disclaimers. We've lost posters here because they've been too afraid to post any conflicting feedback because of the backlash they'd get (come back Antknee! )! It's unfortunate when we lose forum presence on either side of a debate because of differing opinions.
This is an opinion-driven discussion forum, based on both theory and experience. All posters should understand that the caveat of "-but YMMV, of course, and always do what's best for you and your playgroup." shouldn't need to be added to every single post here. It's a given. That's the nature of the cube. So, a response of "That card/strategy was bad for me because of X and Y..." actually reads "That card/strategy was bad for me because of X and Y ...but YMMV, of course, and always do what's best for you and your playgroup." But people take criticisms too personally. We all do.
This is supposed to be a forum for discussing any and all things cube, and I happen to really enjoy the posters here. I think the cube managers in this forum have a lot to offer, and I've learned as much as I've shared over the years being here. Even when (nay, especially when) people disagree with the cards/ideas I'm sharing. That kind of honest criticism is what's most useful to me, which is why most of my feedback is presented that way. It's never personal, it's just cube. And cube is serious business.
Anyways, cheers, and happy cubing. I look forward to many more years of discussing all the ins and outs of this rich and deep format, and welcome all the discussion (both reenforcing and conflicting) that makes this community awesome.
5) We're just playing for fun and I'd rather use my cube to test out kooky deck ideas and see what's supported and what isn't than to Spike out and use some small edge to try to grind out wins against my friends. When I cube online I'm mostly looking to win.
A fair point. I'm not in tournament mode when I'm cubing with friends.
Also, you're in Baltimore and I'm in Silver Spring (and from Baltimore orignally). We have to cube sometime.
Totally! I'm actually looking for a group to get to cube with more (when time allows). Free time is in short supply these days, but my main playgroup is not quite as into cube as I am, so I'd be happy to be able to also hang with a group that does more cubing.
I appreciate all the responses my message got. No point quoting all of you to respond separately, but really, thank you people for taking the time to explain this stuff to a noob. I feel I understand a bit more, and funnily, a bit less, in the sense that your responses make this place feel even less like the culty hivemind some seem to see it as.
I too got the feeling that people associate this board with super-mega-powermaxing that they see as an unbalanced drafting environment, and I guess it's not even that long ago that powered cubes might have been like that. It seems to me that many of the great cards that have helped balance powered and "standard" unpowered cubes are pretty new inclusions (e.g. much of the black aggro cards), and cubing used to be much more of a MTGO-cube-ish midrange festival.
-
About players complaining, playgroup managing etc: I find that even if people check out the cube contents on CT, people who are new to cube or e.g. don't know that much about old constructed formats tend to shy away from some archetypes and either try and stay with safe aggro-midrange picks (which can screw their draft if there's competition for these cards) or make interesting and weird but in the end dysfunctional mishmash decks. Anyone else have a similar issue? I've been considering having a casual draft where any and all players are encouraged to ask questions during the draft, like "why on earth is this card here" or "how do I even use this". Do you have any general tips on how to teach the format to newer people without making it seem like a chore?
I find the best way to learn to appreciate an archetype and to make one interested in learning more about it is getting beaten by it. So just shuffle up and play the Cube!
I too got the feeling that people associate this board with super-mega-powermaxing that they see as an unbalanced drafting environment, and I guess it's not even that long ago that powered cubes might have been like that. It seems to me that many of the great cards that have helped balance powered and "standard" unpowered cubes are pretty new inclusions (e.g. much of the black aggro cards), and cubing used to be much more of a MTGO-cube-ish midrange festival.
Yeah, it helps.
I recently lost a draft where i had 2 moxen and a Time Walk, to a guy that played Mono-WW without Power, Armageddon or Ravages of War. He did have double Thalia and the perfect curve though.
yassssss! i'm checking these forums daily to see when the sign up goes up
PS. whoever Spike Rogue gets will be an incredibly lucky dude. Spike's the most generous santa i've ever had and he's inspired me to give greatly this year
I'm going to bed and really hope I wake up to hillary as president. Else the world will truly be a darker place. Trump as president would be the single worst event so far in my lifetime.
Trump is part of a larger movement taking place globally wherein authoritarianism is favored. See Erdogan, the Brexit vote, the general sentiment in parts of Europe, etc.
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I can't say I'm pleased to see you and must warn you I may have to do something about it.
EDH: UGEdric
Pauper: URDelver
Modern: UGRDelver
Draft my cube: Eric's 390 Unpowered
No disrespect, but we already have an election discussion thread. I love having this forum as a place that's compartmentalized away from the wider world.
But if you feel you need to vent/bounce ideas off the cube community, I get that.
Eh, it's a small section of this forum. I'm OK with our Offtopic thread having political talk as long as it doesn't bleed into the card talk so that anyone who does want to talk politics can, and anyone who doesn't can avoid this thread.
I'm going to bed and really hope I wake up to hillary as president. Else the world will truly be a darker place. Trump as president would be the single worst event so far in my lifetime.
Living here as a gay man who is passionate about the environment, that's how I feel too. I'm only now beginning to not feel like I'm in a nightmare.
The thing I find most disheartening, well other than the fact that Donald ******* Trump is going to be our next president, is that if this were an actual vote and not a presidential election, we'd still have a democrat in the office. The electoral college system really has a way of making you feel like your vote doesn't matter.
For the record, I live in TN, a predominantly Republican state, and I've voted Democrat in every election I've been able to vote in since 2000.
@rant: I'm sorry, buddy. I hope you and yours can just go on living business as usual at the very least.
The thing I find most disheartening, well other than the fact that Donald ******* Trump is going to be our next president, is that if this were an actual vote and not a presidential election, we'd still have a democrat in the office. The electoral college system really has a way of making you feel like your vote doesn't matter.
For the record, I live in TN, a predominantly Republican state, and I've voted Democrat in every election I've been able to vote in since 2000.
@rant: I'm sorry, buddy. I hope you and yours can just go on living business as usual at the very least.
Thanks. I really appreciate that. It's been easy to feel that at least 25% of the population hates me.
The electoral college is undemocratic and prioritizes rural states over urban ones. It needs to go.
The thing I find most disheartening, well other than the fact that Donald ******* Trump is going to be our next president, is that if this were an actual vote and not a presidential election, we'd still have a democrat in the office. The electoral college system really has a way of making you feel like your vote doesn't matter.
For the record, I live in TN, a predominantly Republican state, and I've voted Democrat in every election I've been able to vote in since 2000.
@rant: I'm sorry, buddy. I hope you and yours can just go on living business as usual at the very least.
I have seen this argument a lot and its incredibly flawed. No one knows what would happen if it was not based on the electoral college as the campaigns would have been run radically differently people in states that are not swing states who don't vote due to seeing it as useless might all the sudden vote money would have went to different areas adds ran in different places to say you know how it would be if it was another system is simply wrong. In fact the candidates themselves may have been different if it was a different system than what we have you simply cannot know. I personally know people in California that did not vote because there is no point to them because they live in California . I can see you wanting a different system but to make any assumption about this election after the fact assuming things were different is pure conjecture.
Our Australian opposition leader referred to Trump as "barking mad" a few months back. He's got some backpedalling to do...
I hope no one who was in opposition of trump does any back pedaling.
Well said. Backpedalling only in the sense that he's got a chance of having to work hand-in-hand with him one day - I doubt he's going to be supporting his policies in any way, shape or form.
And to be fair, this is what he's quoted as saying in the last 24hrs:
“What it shows is that where you have a divide in society, where you have people left behind by the pace of economic change, you will see responses and more extreme political outcomes,” Mr Shorten said.
“I’ll always call it as I see it. I’ve certainly said that some of his views were extreme and I didn’t agree with them. But the American people have now spoken. For the relationship between Australia and America, it doesn’t depend on particular governments or personalities.
Can't argue with that approach too much. The way we've gone through our Prime Ministers lately, he's a sporting chance to become our leader at some point during Trump's reign/rule/dictatorship.
I mean, when you get down to it, don't we all just want to shuffle up and play Magic? I do.
Except that the playgroup is actually 2-1 in sealed against you and you're also married to her?
EDH: UGEdric
Pauper: UR Delver
Modern: UGR Delver
Draft my cube: Eric's 390 Unpowered
Eh. Not really. Every now and again (usually from people we don't draft with often), I'll get a "you obv know every card in the cube so you're going to win," or something like that. I usually say that 1) I don't have the contents of my cubes memorized, 2) Even if I did, I still have no idea what's in your deck past the cards I've seen in games, 3) I made it to the Pro Tour as a judge but never a player, so we're probably on roughly equal footing there, and 4) STFU.
My Eternal Cube on CubeTutor| |My Reject Rare Cube on CubeTutor| |My Peasant Cube on CubeTutor
I used to write for MTGS, including Cranial Insertion and cube articles. Good on you if you can find those after the upgrade.
5) We're just playing for fun and I'd rather use my cube to test out kooky deck ideas and see what's supported and what isn't than to Spike out and use some small edge to try to grind out wins against my friends. When I cube online I'm mostly looking to win.
Also, there are no secrets about what's in my cube. Anyone can go to my CT page and check out the list, and do practice drafts to get to know their options and I encourage anyone about to draft my cube for the first time to check it out. The only time I ever had a completely new-to-cube player 3-0'd a draft of my cube, it was because he'd done his homework and drafted several decks against the CT bots. It turns out that edge isn't that difficult to erase for someone who wants to!
450 card Peasant cube thread. Draft it here.
A fair point. I'm not in tournament mode when I'm cubing with friends.
Also, you're in Baltimore and I'm in Silver Spring (and from Baltimore orignally). We have to cube sometime.
My Eternal Cube on CubeTutor| |My Reject Rare Cube on CubeTutor| |My Peasant Cube on CubeTutor
I used to write for MTGS, including Cranial Insertion and cube articles. Good on you if you can find those after the upgrade.
And if multiple members here have independent tested success with a card, it's because of hivemind/groupthink, and can't possibly be because particular cards/strategies have actually performed well for us.
And we're all powermaxers; disregarding "fun" for the "powerful" cards ...even though those two concepts aren't mutually exclusive for the vast majority of the cube managers here. Fun cards are the powerful ones for me, and for a lot of other folks too.
There are certainly times (moreso historically than as of late) where I was overly hostile with other members. I've made an attempt over the, well, several years now, to shake that image. But, I deserve a lot of the lingering criticisms, so that's that. But a lot of it stems from folks not tolerating differing opinions. A lot of conversations have gone:
Them: What do you think of card/strategy A?
Me: Card/strategy A didn't work for me or my group because of reasons X, Y and Z.
Them: Groupthink! Hivemind! Power-maxer! Tyrant!
Me: ...
But thems the brakes I guess. A lot of folks don't want criticism, and they don't want to hear why things might not work. They only want reenforcement ...funnily enough, that leads to more hive-mindedness than creating open differing discussions does, so ya. Oh well.
But people want different things from their forum posting experience, which is what I've learned over my tenure here. When I post an idea about a card/strategy, I want the cold, hard truth. I want the criticism. I want people to share both their positive and negative experiences with the idea, because that's what's most helpful to me. So, when I post feedback, it's curt. To-the-point, and without handling the feedback with kid gloves and a dozen disclaimers. We've lost posters here because they've been too afraid to post any conflicting feedback because of the backlash they'd get (come back Antknee! )! It's unfortunate when we lose forum presence on either side of a debate because of differing opinions.
This is an opinion-driven discussion forum, based on both theory and experience. All posters should understand that the caveat of "-but YMMV, of course, and always do what's best for you and your playgroup." shouldn't need to be added to every single post here. It's a given. That's the nature of the cube. So, a response of "That card/strategy was bad for me because of X and Y..." actually reads "That card/strategy was bad for me because of X and Y ...but YMMV, of course, and always do what's best for you and your playgroup." But people take criticisms too personally. We all do.
This is supposed to be a forum for discussing any and all things cube, and I happen to really enjoy the posters here. I think the cube managers in this forum have a lot to offer, and I've learned as much as I've shared over the years being here. Even when (nay, especially when) people disagree with the cards/ideas I'm sharing. That kind of honest criticism is what's most useful to me, which is why most of my feedback is presented that way. It's never personal, it's just cube. And cube is serious business.
Anyways, cheers, and happy cubing. I look forward to many more years of discussing all the ins and outs of this rich and deep format, and welcome all the discussion (both reenforcing and conflicting) that makes this community awesome.
My 630 Card Powered Cube
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Totally! I'm actually looking for a group to get to cube with more (when time allows). Free time is in short supply these days, but my main playgroup is not quite as into cube as I am, so I'd be happy to be able to also hang with a group that does more cubing.
I too got the feeling that people associate this board with super-mega-powermaxing that they see as an unbalanced drafting environment, and I guess it's not even that long ago that powered cubes might have been like that. It seems to me that many of the great cards that have helped balance powered and "standard" unpowered cubes are pretty new inclusions (e.g. much of the black aggro cards), and cubing used to be much more of a MTGO-cube-ish midrange festival.
-
About players complaining, playgroup managing etc: I find that even if people check out the cube contents on CT, people who are new to cube or e.g. don't know that much about old constructed formats tend to shy away from some archetypes and either try and stay with safe aggro-midrange picks (which can screw their draft if there's competition for these cards) or make interesting and weird but in the end dysfunctional mishmash decks. Anyone else have a similar issue? I've been considering having a casual draft where any and all players are encouraged to ask questions during the draft, like "why on earth is this card here" or "how do I even use this". Do you have any general tips on how to teach the format to newer people without making it seem like a chore?
"What am I looking at? Ashes, dead man."
Yeah, it helps.
I recently lost a draft where i had 2 moxen and a Time Walk, to a guy that played Mono-WW without Power, Armageddon or Ravages of War. He did have double Thalia and the perfect curve though.
My Tribal cube
My 93/94 old school cube
My Artifact cube
My Hearthstone Quiz App for iOS
Spoiler alert: I am!
450 card Peasant cube thread. Draft it here.
PS. whoever Spike Rogue gets will be an incredibly lucky dude. Spike's the most generous santa i've ever had and he's inspired me to give greatly this year
I'm going to bed and really hope I wake up to hillary as president. Else the world will truly be a darker place. Trump as president would be the single worst event so far in my lifetime.
My Tribal cube
My 93/94 old school cube
My Artifact cube
My Hearthstone Quiz App for iOS
EDH: UGEdric
Pauper: UR Delver
Modern: UGR Delver
Draft my cube: Eric's 390 Unpowered
My Stupidly Large Number of Current Decks
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Cube: the Gittening (My Multiplayer Cube) - MTGS Cube List | @ CubeTutor
The N00b Cube (Peasant cube for new players) - MTGS Cube List | @ CubeTutor
I hope no one who was in opposition of trump does any back pedaling.
Also, follow us on twitter! @TurnOneMagic
But if you feel you need to vent/bounce ideas off the cube community, I get that.
Also, follow us on twitter! @TurnOneMagic
Living here as a gay man who is passionate about the environment, that's how I feel too. I'm only now beginning to not feel like I'm in a nightmare.
Cheers,
rant
My Cube
CubeCobra: https://cubecobra.com/cube/overview/5f5d0310ed602310515d4c32
Cube Tutor: http://cubetutor.com/viewcube/1963
For the record, I live in TN, a predominantly Republican state, and I've voted Democrat in every election I've been able to vote in since 2000.
@rant: I'm sorry, buddy. I hope you and yours can just go on living business as usual at the very least.
MTGS Average Peasant Cube 2023 Edition
Follow me. I tweet.
Thanks. I really appreciate that. It's been easy to feel that at least 25% of the population hates me.
The electoral college is undemocratic and prioritizes rural states over urban ones. It needs to go.
Cheers,
rant
My Cube
CubeCobra: https://cubecobra.com/cube/overview/5f5d0310ed602310515d4c32
Cube Tutor: http://cubetutor.com/viewcube/1963
I have seen this argument a lot and its incredibly flawed. No one knows what would happen if it was not based on the electoral college as the campaigns would have been run radically differently people in states that are not swing states who don't vote due to seeing it as useless might all the sudden vote money would have went to different areas adds ran in different places to say you know how it would be if it was another system is simply wrong. In fact the candidates themselves may have been different if it was a different system than what we have you simply cannot know. I personally know people in California that did not vote because there is no point to them because they live in California . I can see you wanting a different system but to make any assumption about this election after the fact assuming things were different is pure conjecture.
Damia http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=410191
DDFT Legacyhttp://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=505247
Domain Zoo http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?p=10212429#post10212429
Well said. Backpedalling only in the sense that he's got a chance of having to work hand-in-hand with him one day - I doubt he's going to be supporting his policies in any way, shape or form.
And to be fair, this is what he's quoted as saying in the last 24hrs:
Can't argue with that approach too much. The way we've gone through our Prime Ministers lately, he's a sporting chance to become our leader at some point during Trump's reign/rule/dictatorship.
My Stupidly Large Number of Current Decks
PucaTrade with me!
The Multiplayer Power Rankings
Cube: the Gittening (My Multiplayer Cube) - MTGS Cube List | @ CubeTutor
The N00b Cube (Peasant cube for new players) - MTGS Cube List | @ CubeTutor