Although I feel like Vampires as a tribe in XLN is receiving the least amount interesting tribal mechanics, I think they have a chance of still being strong in a straight-forward no-nonsense midrange lifelink deck. Luckily, we do get some carry-over vampires from the KLD block to aid us in our endeavor:
First off, it was a hard choice choosing between running Bloodcrazed Paladin over Gifted Aetherborn MB. BUT, I foresee the vampire tokens created by Mavren Fein, Dusk Apostle and Call to the Feast being able to mitigate the life lost from our card draw engine Arguel's Blood Fast Game 1, so Aetherborn isn't necessarily needed. The sideboard is the most interesting part of the deck, I think. Against midrange, the combination of Sanguine Sacrament+Vona, Butcher of Magan is no joke. Add Aetherborn to the board making our opponent pause when attacking with large ground creatures along with Ixalan's Binding exiling them, and we got ourselves a stew. Yahenni's Expertise is great against aggro! Imagine killing a bunch our creatures plus our opponent's creatures, then casting a a huge Bloodcrazed Paladin after that for free?!? Value city! It's shame Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet will not be around post rotation to witness the glory of his vampiric race. I really hope they spoil one or two more 1-drop vampires with upside at the common/uncommon level.
I like this, giving up my beloved Zombies but I think this could be fun. I'd maybe run both the Paladins and the Aetherborns actually as 16 creatures seems low. But I'm no expert. Thanks for the idea.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
Agreed. I made this deck fourteen days ago before the full XLN spoiler went up, so a lot of the cards you listed had not yet been revealed. I just haven't up dated the deck since then. Moving forward, I no longer think splashing for G is advantageous for us, so I'll be making what changes I think need to be made shortly.
Switched from Abzan to BW Vampires because it was more efficient and the deck wasn't doing much with it's G mana if at all. I also made the choice to switch from a tokens strategy to a midrange one so I can play more for value and cast more spells on curve than I could before. I may want to run one more Sanctum Seeker MB, but I need to figure out what I'd cut for it. Maybe one Yahenni?
I'll post my decklist soon for this one. Orzhov lifelink combat specialists is the direction I'm going as we have a lot of great tools to grind the game out like the old BW zombie lists used to. Also, we finally got a reason to use Baleful Ammit so that's great. I think I'm doing a 2/2 split on Bishop of Rebirth and Liliana, Death's Majesty. The primary reason is that we are going to have lots of graveyard hate in the format and the second they see Bishop of Rebirth or The Scarab God we are going to get the Deathgorge Scavenger and Deadeye tracker of the world are going to be popping in and joining the totem and the lovely desert that blows up yards.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
I have been playing a BW Lifegain Deck for a number of weeks, now, as it does really well against Ramunap Red. It could easily be transitioned into a Vampire deck, but time will tell if the switch is worth it.
A few notes on the deck before I talk about Vampire conversion:
I chose Forsake the Worldly in the board as my local meta has a ton of vehicles, but more importantly Gearhulk recursion. By exiling them, I can ensure they don't come back.
The idea behind the Trials and Cartouches is that the Trials are useful cards on their own--Ambition letting me get rid of problematic creatures, and Solidarity helping me gain a lot of life/push some damage through--and the Cartouche's let me reuse them. Giving Gifted Aetherborn First Strike is a beating and putting him to 4 health makes it even more difficult for Ramunap Red to deal with.
The Authority of the Consuls started out maindeck, but they are so bad against some of the control matchups--especially UW Approach where they are 100% useless--that I boarded them, but if there is a lot of aggro in your local meta then by all means maindeck them.
As this deck doesn't rely on counters of any sort outside of Aethersphere Harvester, you can replace them from the board with Solemnity if energy decks are prevalent in your local meta. No one cares about Fat Kitty if they have 0 energy.
The vampire build I have been toying with is similar in nature, but replacing some of the other cards with vampire-related cards:
There are more lifegain cards in this deck, which is why a few copies of Crested Sunmare still remain, but I was trying to leverage more Sanctum Seeker interaction. Yahenni is amazing with cards like Fumigate as he survives the board wipe after you sacrifice a creature, and he gets counters for each of your opponents dying creatures.
Did we have anything like heroic intervention in white? Pirates will be running cannonade so they have a good answer to swarms of small creatures and bears. I'm running the 2/3 flying dwarf right now out of the side since there aren't a huge number of good vampires yet.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
I like the ideas here.
However, I think 3 is probably a better number for legion's landing. With it being legendary, you'll only ever have one cranking out tokens and at 3 mana per, that is plenty. With it only a single 1/1 for 1 by itself it is ok, but not great. Needing 3 creatures attacking to flip slows it enough it feels like 3 is the right number.
Arguels blood fast feels too "slow/expensive" for 3 of. You're paying 4 mana and 2 life to replenish itself. And 2 more mana/life to get any value out of it. The flip side costs you a creature to gain life. You are generally going to be ahead of your opponents and this isn't going to help you finish them, or behind and this not impacting you.
I'd rather run full sets of Sactum and Vicious than all these enchantments which don't impact enough.
Sadly, no. I feel like the best solution we have for that right now is Bloodcrazed Paladin. Problem is, if they sweep EOT, they can just make him take a long walk off a short pier. Incidentally, play-testing with my friends, I have gotten into the habit of saying: "Your Glorybringer is gonna take a long walk." Lol.
I have been playing a BW Lifegain Deck for a number of weeks, now, as it does really well against Ramunap Red. It could easily be transitioned into a Vampire deck, but time will tell if the switch is worth it.
A few notes on the deck before I talk about Vampire conversion:
I chose Forsake the Worldly in the board as my local meta has a ton of vehicles, but more importantly Gearhulk recursion. By exiling them, I can ensure they don't come back.
The idea behind the Trials and Cartouches is that the Trials are useful cards on their own--Ambition letting me get rid of problematic creatures, and Solidarity helping me gain a lot of life/push some damage through--and the Cartouche's let me reuse them. Giving Gifted Aetherborn First Strike is a beating and putting him to 4 health makes it even more difficult for Ramunap Red to deal with.
The Authority of the Consuls started out maindeck, but they are so bad against some of the control matchups--especially UW Approach where they are 100% useless--that I boarded them, but if there is a lot of aggro in your local meta then by all means maindeck them.
As this deck doesn't rely on counters of any sort outside of Aethersphere Harvester, you can replace them from the board with Solemnity if energy decks are prevalent in your local meta. No one cares about Fat Kitty if they have 0 energy.
The vampire build I have been toying with is similar in nature, but replacing some of the other cards with vampire-related cards:
There are more lifegain cards in this deck, which is why a few copies of Crested Sunmare still remain, but I was trying to leverage more Sanctum Seeker interaction. Yahenni is amazing with cards like Fumigate as he survives the board wipe after you sacrifice a creature, and he gets counters for each of your opponents dying creatures.
I like your setup minus a couple of cards:
Essence Extraction: is too "cute" a card. You're already playing a deck with lifegain already built in. Paying three mana just to maybe remove a creature is one mana too much. Hard kill spells is what you want. Consider running +1 more Fatal Push and +2 Walk the Plank in Extractions place.
Lay Bear the Heart (SB): Now that the "Legendary rule" is being applied to planeswalkers, Heart has fewer targets to hit. Duress is "strictly better" in that it hits most of the targets you'd want to hit with Heart minus creatures (but that's what your removal spells are for) and it's one less mana to cast.
Did we have anything like heroic intervention in white? Pirates will be running cannonade so they have a good answer to swarms of small creatures and bears. I'm running the 2/3 flying dwarf right now out of the side since there aren't a huge number of good vampires yet.
I mean, is Fiery Cannonade really a card to worry about all that much? Most of the powerful vampires that matter (Gifted Aetherborn, Yahenni, Undying Partisan, Sanctum Seeker, etc) all have the ability to survive such a sweeper. Weakening tribal synergies just to run a 2/3 flyer with lifelink in the deck that isn't a vampire just doesn't seem worth it.
I have been playing a BW Lifegain Deck for a number of weeks, now, as it does really well against Ramunap Red. It could easily be transitioned into a Vampire deck, but time will tell if the switch is worth it.
A few notes on the deck before I talk about Vampire conversion:
I chose Forsake the Worldly in the board as my local meta has a ton of vehicles, but more importantly Gearhulk recursion. By exiling them, I can ensure they don't come back.
The idea behind the Trials and Cartouches is that the Trials are useful cards on their own--Ambition letting me get rid of problematic creatures, and Solidarity helping me gain a lot of life/push some damage through--and the Cartouche's let me reuse them. Giving Gifted Aetherborn First Strike is a beating and putting him to 4 health makes it even more difficult for Ramunap Red to deal with.
The Authority of the Consuls started out maindeck, but they are so bad against some of the control matchups--especially UW Approach where they are 100% useless--that I boarded them, but if there is a lot of aggro in your local meta then by all means maindeck them.
As this deck doesn't rely on counters of any sort outside of Aethersphere Harvester, you can replace them from the board with Solemnity if energy decks are prevalent in your local meta. No one cares about Fat Kitty if they have 0 energy.
The vampire build I have been toying with is similar in nature, but replacing some of the other cards with vampire-related cards:
There are more lifegain cards in this deck, which is why a few copies of Crested Sunmare still remain, but I was trying to leverage more Sanctum Seeker interaction. Yahenni is amazing with cards like Fumigate as he survives the board wipe after you sacrifice a creature, and he gets counters for each of your opponents dying creatures.
I like your setup minus a couple of cards:
Essence Extraction: is too "cute" a card. You're already playing a deck with lifegain already built in. Paying three mana just to maybe remove a creature is one mana too much. Hard kill spells is what you want. Consider running +1 more Fatal Push and +2 Walk the Plank in Extractions place.
Lay Bear the Heart (SB): Now that the "Legendary rule" is being applied to planeswalkers, Heart has fewer targets to hit. Duress is "strictly better" in that it hits most of the targets you'd want to hit with Heart minus creatures (but that's what your removal spells are for) and it's one less mana to cast.
I get what you're saying, completely; but I would recommend you at least try it out for a couple games of testing. It should not be underestimated that you can also create Horses on your opponent's turn, this way. That's why I play it, and it often does what it's meant to do. Making 5/5's on both your turn and your opponent's turn can be quite a quick clock.
Also, Lay Bare the Heart was put in over Duress after testing, because it removes Carnage Tyrant, Ripjaw Raptor, The Scarab God, and Torrential Gearhulk. All of those cards can be difficult to deal with and testing has shown that LBtH is a great answer to them.
In a vacuum I agree that the cards you suggested are great, but I have tested this deck against a number of Ixalan standard decklists, and I based these changes off that testing.
I like the ideas here.
However, I think 3 is probably a better number for legion's landing. With it being legendary, you'll only ever have one cranking out tokens and at 3 mana per, that is plenty. With it only a single 1/1 for 1 by itself it is ok, but not great. Needing 3 creatures attacking to flip slows it enough it feels like 3 is the right number.
Arguels blood fast feels too "slow/expensive" for 3 of. You're paying 4 mana and 2 life to replenish itself. And 2 more mana/life to get any value out of it. The flip side costs you a creature to gain life. You are generally going to be ahead of your opponents and this isn't going to help you finish them, or behind and this not impacting you.
I'd rather run full sets of Sactum and Vicious than all these enchantments which don't impact enough.
Disagree on Legion's Landing. You shouldn't think of it as an enchantment, but more like a 1/1 lifelink vampire creature that flips into a land that can produce more vampires mid/late game. Plus Fatal Push will be the best removal spell in the format, so replacing one Landing with another is a good way to trigger Revolt on Push.
If you're feeling iffy on Arguel's Blood Fast, consider running Costly Plunder in it's place. The thing about Fast is that it gives you CA early game and reach late game. In a deck that is midrange like most of the lists seen in this thread, you don't want to board stall and be placed into "topdeck mode." In all likelihood you won't be activating it each turn. Only when you run out of gas in hand and need to get creatures on the field.
Did we have anything like heroic intervention in white? Pirates will be running cannonade so they have a good answer to swarms of small creatures and bears. I'm running the 2/3 flying dwarf right now out of the side since there aren't a huge number of good vampires yet.
I mean, is Fiery Cannonade really a card to worry about all that much? Most of the powerful vampires that matter (Gifted Aetherborn, Yahenni, Undying Partisan, Sanctum Seeker, etc) all have the ability to survive such a sweeper. Weakening tribal synergies just to run a 2/3 flyer with lifelink in the deck that isn't a vampire just doesn't seem worth it.
It depends on what the objective of the deck is. If I'm topping with Bishop of Rebirth than I don't really need vampire synergy to do anything. The only cards that care about synergy are Mavren Fein, Dusk Apostle and Sanctum Seeker. We only have a few cards that really let the Sanctum Seeker shine right now so I'm more interested in the alternative strategy of recurring just plain good stuff late game that we might have lost to combat.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
I agree with most everything you said, except I wouldn't call the flipside of Fast reach. It heals you, but doesn't hurt the opponent. It's more anti-reach to your opponent.
I prefer Arguel's Blood Fast a whole lot more than Costly Plunder. If we had some treasure synergy it would be potentially better, but otherwise the life is better than the creature sacrifice.
Also, tried a few different configurations, but it looks like pure vampires is probably the most strait forward way to run the deck. I think the big weakness it has is dealing with big creature decks, and Dusk // Dawn seems oddly fitting in the deck more than Fumigate. Most of the creatures in the deck are 2 power or less, and it takes care of big beaters like Carnage Tyrant. It does hit Sanctum Seeker and Bishop of Rebirth, but there are alternative ways to bring those back if needed.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
i've basically given up on two colors. BW manabase is more awkward than I realized, especially when you want to cast double black 4 drops like Sanctum Seeker on turn 4 but you need your lands to line up the right way to do so while also trying not to stumble on the way. This build is decent I've found, doesn't really lose creature matchups easily and is pretty resilient (going turn 3 Oketra's Monument into turn 4 double Legion Conquistador is very consistent and very powerful), the Inspiring Clerics help against Mono Red as does the natural lifelink of the deck. Shefet Dunes is amazing, full 4 and I never looked back. Metallic Mimic is an okay lord for vamps who can also be set to support soldiers from Monument, most of the time he eats removal but when he doesn't he does good work.
I'll be looking into a Mono Black Vampires build soon though; Black has a lot of powerful tools, possibly at the cost of resilience and wideness without Monument but with more removal, better creatures (being able to easily and consistently play Gifted Aetherborn on 2 sounds great), and possibly a better bomb in Sanctum Seeker
You only need double white on turn 5 and double black only comes up on turn 4. The mana-base is not that bad since the deck is nearly all vampires and the only things that aren't vampires are enchantments or colorless artifacts. I'm running Cast Out in place of Vraska's Contempt due to it being easier to cast and the fact it can be cycled when not needed. Also, I've found running Desert's Hold to be an effective way to deal with a lot of things in this format.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
Why no love for Vona, Butcher of Magan ? The effect on the board and the stats are more impressive than Bishop (who doesn't get back Sanctum Seeker, too bad). Yes you pay 7 life, but that's nothing when you are behind and you need to kill sthg big, and it races hard. Crested Sunmare is also better than Bishop imho, since it makes tokens that are on par with or bigger than the rest of the format for the most part. And it's another card along with Sanctum Seeker that invite us to kamikaze attack with our tokens, if token's where the deck leans towards.
The only reason I didn't play mimic is that without an anthem it gets dual shot a lot by Dino decks. Still, there just doesn't seem to be a lot of good options.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
Vona is strong by herself, but Sunmare is way more impressive at breaking stall boards. Hard to figure out whether one is overkill or worse than the other in the dark. In terms of synergy, the Horse is the card I always want to draw.
Harvester is a must in a token approach. Unclaimed Territory is bad in such a version. Yahenni, Undying Partisan does nothing for this list, while Mavren can always replace itself by attacking (1 token), then dying so we can cast another. Worth playing at least 3. Arguel's Blood Fast is the better card I found to hit land drops or the payoffs. Unsure about it.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Pioneer - A bunch of stuff Modern - Humans Legacy - Grixis Phoenix / Death & Taxes
Well, I guess now I need to find some kind of trope saying that can incorporate the horse and the vampires. I was originally going with "My Little Pony, Lifegain is Magic", but now we have vampire Conquistadors coming out of the wood works.
I think it's the right call to use Mavren Fein, Dusk Apostle with Vona, Butcher of Magan and Crested Sunmare. It feels like aggro vampires is something that will be coming in the next set. That or we end up with Aetherborn and dwarves again from Kaladesh with the Merfolk and Vampires, resulting in nothing but pirates and dinosaurs for all eternity.
Mavren Fein, Dusk Apostle: He's a build around. He punches below curve on his own and is highly dependent on having an evasive on tribe creature to reliably trigger the token ability, but if he can stay on the field for at least two turns with an evasive vampire swinging you likely got the value you need out of him. Keep in mind a 2/2 vanilla bear at 3 mana is bad even in limited. In standard playing this when facing down Rampaging Ferocidon or even a Deathgorge Scavenger isn't going to feel nice.
Also as far as mimic goes to try and make up some of these deficiencies, keep in mind anyone can run mimic and it's really fragile in this format. Red has tons of options to blow creatures out of the water and even some of the inefficient -1/-1 counter cards from the last block will kill it. Mimic is also less "good" when drawn late game like the Vicious Conquistador, and vampires wants to go long.
So case in point, to make a good vampire deck right now, aim for things that help it do what it appears to be designed for: Grinding the rails.
Edit: removed stuff on the sanctum seeker because I'm tired and wrote a bunch of stuff that didn't make sense.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
Has anyone tried hidden stockpile yet? With vampires basically dieing in just about every other card in ixalan, I got a feeling we aren't getting an anthem. That would mean the vampires actually cared enough to try and keep their minions alive. I totally do not get that feeling with Fiery Cannonade, Crash the Ramparts, etc, having the kind of flavor text they got. Given the other tribes, I'm sort of expecting a lot of casualties on vampires due to how the deck seems to want to play. This is especially not helped that the format has basically gone into moderns "dies to bolt" situation with Abrade, Yahenni's Expertise, Lightning Strike, and Harnessed Lightning all existing in the format. Just about every flavor of red is going to be running 3 damage removal and probably a 2-3 damage sweeper. That is hell on wheels. Looking at it from that perspective it's not hard to see why dinosaurs is popular right now.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
4 Unclaimed Territory
4 Concealed Courtyard
1 Sunpetal Grove
4 Evolving Wilds
3 Plains
7 Swamp
1 Forest
CREATURES 16
4 Duskborne Skymarcher
3 Mavren Fein, Dusk Apostle
2 Bishop of Rebirth
4 Bloodcrazed Paladin
3 Yahenni, Undying Partisan
2 Call to the Feast
4 Fatal Push
2 Walk the Plank
ENCHANTMENTS 7
2 Anointed Procession
3 Arguel's Blood Fast
2 Growing Rites of Itlimoc
ARTIFACTS 3
2 Lifecrafter's Bestiary
1 Vanquisher's Banner
2 Sanguine Sacrament
2 Ixalan's Binding
2 Vona, Butcher of Magan
4 Gifted Aetherborn
1 Vraska's Contempt
4 Yahenni's Expertise
First off, it was a hard choice choosing between running Bloodcrazed Paladin over Gifted Aetherborn MB. BUT, I foresee the vampire tokens created by Mavren Fein, Dusk Apostle and Call to the Feast being able to mitigate the life lost from our card draw engine Arguel's Blood Fast Game 1, so Aetherborn isn't necessarily needed. The sideboard is the most interesting part of the deck, I think. Against midrange, the combination of Sanguine Sacrament+Vona, Butcher of Magan is no joke. Add Aetherborn to the board making our opponent pause when attacking with large ground creatures along with Ixalan's Binding exiling them, and we got ourselves a stew. Yahenni's Expertise is great against aggro! Imagine killing a bunch our creatures plus our opponent's creatures, then casting a a huge Bloodcrazed Paladin after that for free?!? Value city! It's shame Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet will not be around post rotation to witness the glory of his vampiric race. I really hope they spoil one or two more 1-drop vampires with upside at the common/uncommon level.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
Agreed. I made this deck fourteen days ago before the full XLN spoiler went up, so a lot of the cards you listed had not yet been revealed. I just haven't up dated the deck since then. Moving forward, I no longer think splashing for G is advantageous for us, so I'll be making what changes I think need to be made shortly.
4 Unclaimed Territory
4 Concealed Courtyard
4 Evolving Wilds
8 Swamp
4 Plains
CREATURES 22
3 Mavren Fein, Dusk Apostle
2 Crested Sunmare
4 Vicious Conquistador
4 Bloodcrazed Paladin
4 Gifted Aetherborn
3 Yahenni, Undying Partisan
2 Sanctum Seeker
4 Fatal Push
2 Walk the Plank
ENCHANTMENTS 7
4 Legion's Landing
3 Arguel's Blood Fast
ARTIFACTS 1
1 Vanquisher's Banner
2 Sanguine Sacrament
2 Cast Out
4 Fumigate
2 Bishop of Rebirth
2 Vona, Butcher of Magan
1 Never // Return
2 Vraska's Contempt
Switched from Abzan to BW Vampires because it was more efficient and the deck wasn't doing much with it's G mana if at all. I also made the choice to switch from a tokens strategy to a midrange one so I can play more for value and cast more spells on curve than I could before. I may want to run one more Sanctum Seeker MB, but I need to figure out what I'd cut for it. Maybe one Yahenni?
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
04 Gifted Aetherborn
04 Aerial Responder
03 Crested Sunmare
02 Noxious Gearhulk
Instant(7):
04 Fatal Push
03 Essence Extraction
Sorceries(6):
03 Fumigate
03 Doomfall
Enchantments(8):
03 Cast Out
02 Cartouche of Solidarity
02 Trial of Ambition
01 Trial of Solidarity
02 Aethersphere Harvester
Lands(24):
07 Swamp
05 Plains
04 Forsaken Sanctuary
04 Concealed Courtyard
04 Evolving Wilds
04 Lay Bare the Heart
03 Authority of the Consuls
03 Forsake the Worldly
03 Crook of Condemnation
02 Never // Return
A few notes on the deck before I talk about Vampire conversion:
The vampire build I have been toying with is similar in nature, but replacing some of the other cards with vampire-related cards:
04 Gifted Aetherborn
04 Adanto Vanguard
03 Yahenni, Undying Partisan
02 Sanctum Seeker
02 Crested Sunmare
02 Vicious Conquistador
Instant(8):
03 Fatal Push
03 Essence Extraction
02 Vraska's Contempt
03 Call to the Feast
02 Fumigate
Enchantments(7):
04 Legion's Landing
03 Cast Out
Lands(23):
07 Swamp
04 Plains
04 Forsaken Sanctuary
04 Concealed Courtyard
04 Evolving Wilds
04 Lay Bare the Heart
03 Authority of the Consuls
03 Forsake the Worldly
03 Crook of Condemnation
02 Never // Return
There are more lifegain cards in this deck, which is why a few copies of Crested Sunmare still remain, but I was trying to leverage more Sanctum Seeker interaction. Yahenni is amazing with cards like Fumigate as he survives the board wipe after you sacrifice a creature, and he gets counters for each of your opponents dying creatures.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
However, I think 3 is probably a better number for legion's landing. With it being legendary, you'll only ever have one cranking out tokens and at 3 mana per, that is plenty. With it only a single 1/1 for 1 by itself it is ok, but not great. Needing 3 creatures attacking to flip slows it enough it feels like 3 is the right number.
Arguels blood fast feels too "slow/expensive" for 3 of. You're paying 4 mana and 2 life to replenish itself. And 2 more mana/life to get any value out of it. The flip side costs you a creature to gain life. You are generally going to be ahead of your opponents and this isn't going to help you finish them, or behind and this not impacting you.
I'd rather run full sets of Sactum and Vicious than all these enchantments which don't impact enough.
I like your setup minus a couple of cards:
Essence Extraction: is too "cute" a card. You're already playing a deck with lifegain already built in. Paying three mana just to maybe remove a creature is one mana too much. Hard kill spells is what you want. Consider running +1 more Fatal Push and +2 Walk the Plank in Extractions place.
Lay Bear the Heart (SB): Now that the "Legendary rule" is being applied to planeswalkers, Heart has fewer targets to hit. Duress is "strictly better" in that it hits most of the targets you'd want to hit with Heart minus creatures (but that's what your removal spells are for) and it's one less mana to cast.
I mean, is Fiery Cannonade really a card to worry about all that much? Most of the powerful vampires that matter (Gifted Aetherborn, Yahenni, Undying Partisan, Sanctum Seeker, etc) all have the ability to survive such a sweeper. Weakening tribal synergies just to run a 2/3 flyer with lifelink in the deck that isn't a vampire just doesn't seem worth it.
I get what you're saying, completely; but I would recommend you at least try it out for a couple games of testing. It should not be underestimated that you can also create Horses on your opponent's turn, this way. That's why I play it, and it often does what it's meant to do. Making 5/5's on both your turn and your opponent's turn can be quite a quick clock.
Also, Lay Bare the Heart was put in over Duress after testing, because it removes Carnage Tyrant, Ripjaw Raptor, The Scarab God, and Torrential Gearhulk. All of those cards can be difficult to deal with and testing has shown that LBtH is a great answer to them.
In a vacuum I agree that the cards you suggested are great, but I have tested this deck against a number of Ixalan standard decklists, and I based these changes off that testing.
Disagree on Legion's Landing. You shouldn't think of it as an enchantment, but more like a 1/1 lifelink vampire creature that flips into a land that can produce more vampires mid/late game. Plus Fatal Push will be the best removal spell in the format, so replacing one Landing with another is a good way to trigger Revolt on Push.
If you're feeling iffy on Arguel's Blood Fast, consider running Costly Plunder in it's place. The thing about Fast is that it gives you CA early game and reach late game. In a deck that is midrange like most of the lists seen in this thread, you don't want to board stall and be placed into "topdeck mode." In all likelihood you won't be activating it each turn. Only when you run out of gas in hand and need to get creatures on the field.
It depends on what the objective of the deck is. If I'm topping with Bishop of Rebirth than I don't really need vampire synergy to do anything. The only cards that care about synergy are Mavren Fein, Dusk Apostle and Sanctum Seeker. We only have a few cards that really let the Sanctum Seeker shine right now so I'm more interested in the alternative strategy of recurring just plain good stuff late game that we might have lost to combat.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
Also, tried a few different configurations, but it looks like pure vampires is probably the most strait forward way to run the deck. I think the big weakness it has is dealing with big creature decks, and Dusk // Dawn seems oddly fitting in the deck more than Fumigate. Most of the creatures in the deck are 2 power or less, and it takes care of big beaters like Carnage Tyrant. It does hit Sanctum Seeker and Bishop of Rebirth, but there are alternative ways to bring those back if needed.
4 Concealed Courtyard
4 Ifnir Deadlands
4 Plains
2 Scavenger Grounds
3 Shefet Dunes
2 Swamp
4 Unclaimed Territory
3 Arguel's Blood Fast
2 Cast Out
3 Desert's Hold
4 Legion's Landing
2 Never // Return
2 Oketra's Monument
3 Bishop of Rebirth
4 Bishop's Soldier
4 Duskborne Skymarcher
4 Gifted Aetherborn
3 Mavren Fein, Dusk Apostle
3 Sanctum Seeker
Lands still need work in this one.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
4 Adanto Vanguard
4 Bishop's Soldier
2 Bishop of Rebirth
3 Inspiring Cleric
4 Legion Conquistador
4 Duskborne Skymarcher
2 Mavren Fein, Dusk Apostle
3 Metallic Mimic
3 Skywhaler's Shot
4 Shefet Dunes
4 Desert of the True
17 Plains
i've basically given up on two colors. BW manabase is more awkward than I realized, especially when you want to cast double black 4 drops like Sanctum Seeker on turn 4 but you need your lands to line up the right way to do so while also trying not to stumble on the way. This build is decent I've found, doesn't really lose creature matchups easily and is pretty resilient (going turn 3 Oketra's Monument into turn 4 double Legion Conquistador is very consistent and very powerful), the Inspiring Clerics help against Mono Red as does the natural lifelink of the deck. Shefet Dunes is amazing, full 4 and I never looked back. Metallic Mimic is an okay lord for vamps who can also be set to support soldiers from Monument, most of the time he eats removal but when he doesn't he does good work.
The Skywhaler's Shots are concessions to Ripjaw Raptor who I have no idea how to beat, and Glorybringer who can be troublesome for the deck but on the whole removal options in White just aren't great, which I guess is the cost of dropping Black. The sideboard is a bit wonky, but I've been loving Settle the Wreckage as well as Ixalan's Binding and Gideon's Intervention.
I'll be looking into a Mono Black Vampires build soon though; Black has a lot of powerful tools, possibly at the cost of resilience and wideness without Monument but with more removal, better creatures (being able to easily and consistently play Gifted Aetherborn on 2 sounds great), and possibly a better bomb in Sanctum Seeker
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
Crested Sunmare is also better than Bishop imho, since it makes tokens that are on par with or bigger than the rest of the format for the most part. And it's another card along with Sanctum Seeker that invite us to kamikaze attack with our tokens, if token's where the deck leans towards.
Metallic Mimic seems like a necessary evil, since Sanctum Seeker and the 5-drop we choose to run must survive Chandra, Torch of Defiance, Glorybringer and Cut // Ribbons, and the vampire tokens must survive Walking Ballista. And potentially be able to block Ripjaw Raptor, Regisaur Alpha, Winding Constrictor stuff, etc... favorably.
Bloodcrazed Paladin isn't MD playable, and is at best a SB tech VS wrath effects. The synergy with Yahenni, Undying Partisan isn't quite there.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
2 Arguel's Blood Fast
2 Aethersphere Harvester
4 Fatal Push
2 Walk the Plank
4 Queen's Commission
4 Call to The Feast
4 Metallic Mimic
4 Mavren Fein, Dusk Apostle
2 Vona, Butcher of Magan
2 Crested Sunmare
4 Concealed Courtyard
4 Evolving Wilds
5 Swamp
3 Plains
3 Ifnir Deadlands
3 Shefet Dunes
Vona is strong by herself, but Sunmare is way more impressive at breaking stall boards. Hard to figure out whether one is overkill or worse than the other in the dark. In terms of synergy, the Horse is the card I always want to draw.
Harvester is a must in a token approach.
Unclaimed Territory is bad in such a version.
Yahenni, Undying Partisan does nothing for this list, while Mavren can always replace itself by attacking (1 token), then dying so we can cast another. Worth playing at least 3.
Arguel's Blood Fast is the better card I found to hit land drops or the payoffs. Unsure about it.
I think it's the right call to use Mavren Fein, Dusk Apostle with Vona, Butcher of Magan and Crested Sunmare. It feels like aggro vampires is something that will be coming in the next set. That or we end up with Aetherborn and dwarves again from Kaladesh with the Merfolk and Vampires, resulting in nothing but pirates and dinosaurs for all eternity.
Mavren Fein, Dusk Apostle: He's a build around. He punches below curve on his own and is highly dependent on having an evasive on tribe creature to reliably trigger the token ability, but if he can stay on the field for at least two turns with an evasive vampire swinging you likely got the value you need out of him. Keep in mind a 2/2 vanilla bear at 3 mana is bad even in limited. In standard playing this when facing down Rampaging Ferocidon or even a Deathgorge Scavenger isn't going to feel nice.
Also as far as mimic goes to try and make up some of these deficiencies, keep in mind anyone can run mimic and it's really fragile in this format. Red has tons of options to blow creatures out of the water and even some of the inefficient -1/-1 counter cards from the last block will kill it. Mimic is also less "good" when drawn late game like the Vicious Conquistador, and vampires wants to go long.
So case in point, to make a good vampire deck right now, aim for things that help it do what it appears to be designed for: Grinding the rails.
Edit: removed stuff on the sanctum seeker because I'm tired and wrote a bunch of stuff that didn't make sense.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!