So I've seen all sorts of decks attempting to capitalize on all the great zombies (mummies) we've gotten (and still may be receiving) from AKH. But few have attempted to cast zombies as is instead of binning them to the graveyard. What are the benefits of playing zombies this way? Well...
So this is the starting point. Deck is BW/x because it could either go in a more Mardu Aristocrat or Esper Embalm direction (depending on what else we get from AKH). As of right (without any testing) the deck looks very midrange/controller-ish. The idea is to play zombies with ETB abilities that either stall our opponent or make it hard to kill us because of all the lifegain. Turns 5+, we outright kill (Kalitas), exile (Ayli), or overrun our opponent with zombies (Liliana). The secondary win con comes in draining our opponent of life for every zombie we play (Wanderer). Sideboard takes the deck in a more controlling direction, with graveyard and aggro hate more than anything else.
Without soi blue zombie gy mechanics you have very few ways to put zombies into play on the opponents turn. This means you miss out on a lot of the power of binding mummy
Without soi blue zombie gy mechanics you have very few ways to put zombies into play on the opponents turn. This means you miss out on a lot of the power of binding mummy
So true. Just woke up to full spoiler being up. Gonna take a look at it again and see what changes I could potentially make.
Why is everyone avoiding Plague Belcher? That card is insane. For one, it at worst comes in as a 3/2 menace. In most situations in a grindy zombie deck, you can burn a token to bring it in as a 5/4 with menace that also coincidently drains the other guy for one damage. It is literally one of the best zombies in the upcoming standard.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
I think amonkhet zombies will play alot different from SoI zombies, I think it will be more an Aristocrat build than graveyard based madness shenanigans.
You have 2 awesome drain creatures at cmc 2 (Wayward Servant) and 3 (Plague Belcher). You have a lord who can give your horde Menace to make it hard for your opponent to block. you have access to 2 one cmc removal spells (fatal push and time to reflect).
Fill it in with Cryptbreaker, Binding Mummy, Dread Wanderer (maybe go with prized amalgam package (and it is really cute with Binding Mummy, get back haunted dead and a couple of amalgams, tap their team and go ham) tho I dont think you run enough discard to make it worth, and I dont think you want Haunted dead in this kind of deck).
You can potentially end your curve at 3 and just go all out aggro in the early turns, then grind with drain, menace and crarddraw from Cryptbreaker to seal the deal.
Why is everyone avoiding Plague Belcher? That card is insane. For one, it at worst comes in as a 3/2 menace. In most situations in a grindy zombie deck, you can burn a token to bring it in as a 5/4 with menace that also coincidently drains the other guy for one damage. It is literally one of the best zombies in the upcoming standard.
It's because I simply can't find room. The Haunted Dead + Prized Amalgam package is just too strong. I could see adding it in after they rotate out, but not now. Binding Mummy is deceptively powerful, slowing down vehicle decks and stopping fatties. Life drain is cute, but doesn't win you the game unless you're playing a dedicated drain deck.
I was thinking more aggro, but yeah. I'm thinking there's more than one zombie strategy floating around right now. That, or there is a hybrid deck that just happens to use zombies with B/R or B/G.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
why? bears with relevant abilities tend to be useful, plenty of ways to activate it during your opponents turn, be it cryptbreaker or haunted dead with amalgams. Key to his strenght is that it triggers of zombies entering the battlefield, not when you cast a zombie spell like Diregraf Colossus.
Feels like a worst Topplegiest. IMO most builds won't have room for him. If rather play relentless and removal in my 2 slot. Ill post my list later today when I'm at my computer as opposed to my phone.
Sideboard transitions into a more aristrocrats build against other aggro or creature heavy builds. fragmentize are there for the usual suspects, but now more then ever cause of trespasser's curse[card/]. ost legacy for beefslab, as well as anquished unmaking and never/return. Just my first draft i'll be testing. Could turn into a more grindy midrange or more of an aristrocrats build. We will see in a week or two what people have come up with and work from there. Thoughts?
Sideboard transitions into a more aristrocrats build against other aggro or creature heavy builds. fragmentize are there for the usual suspects, but now more then ever cause of trespasser's curse[card/]. ost legacy for beefslab, as well as anquished unmaking and never/return. Just my first draft i'll be testing. Could turn into a more grindy midrange or more of an aristrocrats build. We will see in a week or two what people have come up with and work from there. Thoughts?
I think what your deck lacks is valid answers to the meta. Binding Mummy can stop a Heart of Kiran in its tracks, or any other fatty with flying (Archangel Avacyn) or evasion (Noxious Gearhulk) wanting to swing in. You're going the dump and pump route, which isn't bad, but you need to have more deck and board interactions to Mardu Vehicles, Copycat, and the like. The thing that made RB Zombies from SOI block a success is the fact that it can draw and bin zombies super fast, as opposed to mono black zombie decks like yours that are very mana intensive and slow to start. I'd consider maybe adding more removal/card draw mainboard instead of all the pump spells.
Fair enough on the pump spell in oketra's name. More of a pet card to test. You mention binding mummy against Noxious,cat combo and mardu.Wouldn't a play set of grasp just do the job better? Deal with it once at instant speed instead of relying on casting more zombies or eating removal?
I'm just waiting for the new set to drop so I can start the building. I play online so I have a bit of a wait. I'm sure in the coming weeks we will have a mess of lists to look over and test. Starcity,Tcg,etc are all going to start flooding mock lists this week.
Fair enough on the pump spell in oketra's name. More of a pet card to test. You mention binding mummy against Noxious,cat combo and mardu.Wouldn't a play set of grasp just do the job better? Deal with it once at instant speed instead of relying on casting more zombies or eating removal?
What Binding Mummy does is buy you a turn, much the way an unsummon spell would.Meanwhile you sneak in incremental damage by eliminating a potential blocker. And if you hadn't notice, the deck I posted runs three Grasp of Darkness mainboard, so there's that. Mummy, however, has a repeatble effect that doesn't cost us multiple card slots.
In my opinion you guys are simply trying WAY too hard to make white work in Zombies. It just doesn't. binding mummy isn't good enough to be tier 1 competitive, and while I do think time to reflect is good, It is not worth mucking up the whole mana base for. Why would I want to run a 2/2 Zombie that maybe will tap an opponents threat sometimes, when i can just run a playset of grasp of darkness and some fatal push which are all better answers to heart of kiran? In my opinion, the more consistent decks will be straight blue black.
In my opinion you guys are simply trying WAY too hard to make white work in Zombies. It just doesn't. binding mummy isn't good enough to be tier 1 competitive, and while I do think time to reflect is good, It is not worth mucking up the whole mana base for. Why would I want to run a 2/2 Zombie that maybe will tap an opponents threat sometimes, when i can just run a playset of grasp of darkness and some fatal push which are all better answers to heart of kiran? In my opinion, the more consistent decks will be straight blue black.
Sigh... I Feel like this needs repeating because the message seems to somehow have gotten lost. Binding Mummy won't "solve" the meta. No one ever said that it would. It is but a cog, not a major piece, in any deck that wants it. The suggestion I've been making all along is that you run it alongside kill spells and stalling tactics to advance your board. That's it. And the decklist I posted reflects this.
I guess the question now becomes why you think UB zombies will be a thing now? What have we gotten from Amonkhet in blue that would make zombies more powerful? Clearly Wizards think white has a chance in zombies, seeing as how they've printed all these white zombies this set, and Embalm is primarily a white mechanic.
Id love to just go full on mono black zombies if I could TBH. I'm running the white just for the fragmentize in the board. With the mana base to support it I threw in a few new cards just to test. None from my main are needed and are easily changeable. I just believe we need the enchantment hate really bad with trespassers curse popping up. Meta is gonna be heavy aggro for the first bit with RW Exort and various Cat and token strategies being brewed so I think were going to be seeing it a lot in the first few weeks. I know ill be running it in other decks . Not to mention mirror matches. Fragmentize is the most important card in my board.
By the way, I'd stay away from Relentless Dead unless you got some from draft or bought some when the price was low. They aren't really as good as they look since you have to keep mana open all the time to make use of his abilities.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
I feel a small white splash is justifiable, given Wayward Servant and several good white support cards. It does not need to be pushed, but with the excess of zombies and zombie makers, Servant is good for the drain effects, imo
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Currently Playing:
Standard - Some kind of control
Modern - UB Mill (casual)
EDH - Meren's Grave Shenanigans
The way I see it right now, take the best zombies from Amonkhet and merge it with the best of SoI block and we got ourselves a deck for now until we get to go further with the theme in hour of devastation. Personally, I think zombies got a ton better without Saheeli because it grinds the rails better than any deck out there and the only hate against it is GY exile. Plague Belcher, Wayward Servant, Dread Wanderer, and new Liliana are all really good additions.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
4 Shambling Vent
4 Concealed Courtyard
4 Evolving Wilds
2 Irrigated Farmland
2 Fetid Pools
4 Swamp
CREATURES 23
4 Dread Wanderer
3 Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet
4 Haunted Dead
4 Prized Amalgam
4 Binding Mummy
4 Anointer Priest
2 Liliana, Death's Majesty
INSTANTS AND SORCERIES 11
4 Fatal Push
4 Altar's Reap
3 Grasp of Darkness
ENCHANTMENTS 2
2 Anointed Procession
ARTIFACTS 2
2 Embalmer's Tools
3 Scarab Feast
2 Dispossess
2 Never//Return
2 Anguished Unmaking
1 Time to Reflect
3 Dusk//Dawn
2 Cast Out
So this is the starting point. Deck is BW/x because it could either go in a more Mardu Aristocrat or Esper Embalm direction (depending on what else we get from AKH). As of right (without any testing) the deck looks very midrange/controller-ish. The idea is to play zombies with ETB abilities that either stall our opponent or make it hard to kill us because of all the lifegain. Turns 5+, we outright kill (Kalitas),
exile (Ayli), or overrun our opponent with zombies (Liliana). The secondary win con comes in draining our opponent of life for every zombie we play (Wanderer). Sideboard takes the deck in a more controlling direction, with graveyard and aggro hate more than anything else.Modern: WURG Twin
Standard: Mardu Planeswalkers
http://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/the-game/standard-type-2/deck-creation-standard/661834-mardu-planeswalker?comment=1
Monthly Proxy Legacy
Charlotte/Greensboro area, NC
Pm me for details
One is in the sideboard. Don't know whether it should be mainboard or more than a "1 of" at this point. Haven't tested it out yet.
So true. Just woke up to full spoiler being up. Gonna take a look at it again and see what changes I could potentially make.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
You have 2 awesome drain creatures at cmc 2 (Wayward Servant) and 3 (Plague Belcher). You have a lord who can give your horde Menace to make it hard for your opponent to block. you have access to 2 one cmc removal spells (fatal push and time to reflect).
Fill it in with Cryptbreaker, Binding Mummy, Dread Wanderer (maybe go with prized amalgam package (and it is really cute with Binding Mummy, get back haunted dead and a couple of amalgams, tap their team and go ham) tho I dont think you run enough discard to make it worth, and I dont think you want Haunted dead in this kind of deck).
You can potentially end your curve at 3 and just go all out aggro in the early turns, then grind with drain, menace and crarddraw from Cryptbreaker to seal the deal.
Id that!
Trade with me, h:Alters and EdhFoils:)
Cards I have altered
It's because I simply can't find room. The Haunted Dead + Prized Amalgam package is just too strong. I could see adding it in after they rotate out, but not now. Binding Mummy is deceptively powerful, slowing down vehicle decks and stopping fatties. Life drain is cute, but doesn't win you the game unless you're playing a dedicated drain deck.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
why? bears with relevant abilities tend to be useful, plenty of ways to activate it during your opponents turn, be it cryptbreaker or haunted dead with amalgams. Key to his strenght is that it triggers of zombies entering the battlefield, not when you cast a zombie spell like Diregraf Colossus.
Id that!
Trade with me, h:Alters and EdhFoils:)
Cards I have altered
Creatures
4 cryptbreaker
4 dread wanderer
4 relentless dead
4 lord of the accused
3 diregraf colossus
3 plague belcher
2 noosegraf mob
Spells
4 fatal push
3 time to reflect
3 in oketra's name
Support
2 liliana death's majesty
2 liliana's mastery
Lands
4 shambling vents
4 concealed courtyard
2 westvale abbey
12 swamp
Sideboard
4 zulaport zealot
3 yehenni's expertise
3 fragmentize
2 lost legacy
2 anquished unmaking
1 never/return
Sideboard transitions into a more aristrocrats build against other aggro or creature heavy builds. fragmentize are there for the usual suspects, but now more then ever cause of trespasser's curse[card/]. ost legacy for beefslab, as well as anquished unmaking and never/return. Just my first draft i'll be testing. Could turn into a more grindy midrange or more of an aristrocrats build. We will see in a week or two what people have come up with and work from there. Thoughts?
I think what your deck lacks is valid answers to the meta. Binding Mummy can stop a Heart of Kiran in its tracks, or any other fatty with flying (Archangel Avacyn) or evasion (Noxious Gearhulk) wanting to swing in. You're going the dump and pump route, which isn't bad, but you need to have more deck and board interactions to Mardu Vehicles, Copycat, and the like. The thing that made RB Zombies from SOI block a success is the fact that it can draw and bin zombies super fast, as opposed to mono black zombie decks like yours that are very mana intensive and slow to start. I'd consider maybe adding more removal/card draw mainboard instead of all the pump spells.
What Binding Mummy does is buy you a turn, much the way an unsummon spell would.Meanwhile you sneak in incremental damage by eliminating a potential blocker. And if you hadn't notice, the deck I posted runs three Grasp of Darkness mainboard, so there's that. Mummy, however, has a repeatble effect that doesn't cost us multiple card slots.
Sigh... I Feel like this needs repeating because the message seems to somehow have gotten lost. Binding Mummy won't "solve" the meta. No one ever said that it would. It is but a cog, not a major piece, in any deck that wants it. The suggestion I've been making all along is that you run it alongside kill spells and stalling tactics to advance your board. That's it. And the decklist I posted reflects this.
I guess the question now becomes why you think UB zombies will be a thing now? What have we gotten from Amonkhet in blue that would make zombies more powerful? Clearly Wizards think white has a chance in zombies, seeing as how they've printed all these white zombies this set, and Embalm is primarily a white mechanic.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
Standard - Some kind of control
Modern - UB Mill (casual)
EDH - Meren's Grave Shenanigans
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!