MTG Salvation

Quote from RedGauntlet »

Quote from trappedinlimbo »

If you are going to be playing a mono coloured in Standard, there better be a good reason for it. Here, I don't see a reason to not be splashing a colour besides being unique. The lack of Dig Through Time means that you will often lose a lot of games because you aren't drawing cards you need. You're finishers also aren't as good as none of them have any evasion. Squelching Leeches is probably your worst finisher as it will eat every removal spell your opponent has. Erebos seems alright here as a card draw engine, I'm not sure why you said you wouldn't use him for that as most of the time he won't be turned on anyway. Having 1 Gray Merchant makes little to no sense as you don't have a lot of ways to dig through your deck and at most he would be leaching 6. Palace Siege is absolutely terrible in a control deck. Paying 5 mana for a leech 2 every turn will really not do much for you in the long run.

Regardless, I would imagine that you are still going to play the deck so I will make some suggestions. Go up to 4 Gray Merchants as they don't instantly lose value if they get hit with a removal spell. Go up to 2 Erebos as it's a great card engine for you since you aren't playing Blue. I would cut the Palace Siege's and cut down to 2 or 1 Squelching Leeches.

You're underestimating Palace Siege greatly.Its amazing with Gary since it provides devotion and recursion while also can be a finisher if left alone.You're a control deck so you have the power to grind for Palace Siege end games

I agree; if you're going to run a more Devotion oriented Black list; then I think 4 Palace Sieges is the starting point to build it around.

Been brewing with Tasigur... he makes this deck even more grindy. I like it. Will post list when I come to something more solid.

Quote from SuperSeed »

Been brewing with Tasigur... he makes this deck even more grindy. I like it. Will post list when I come to something more solid.

Boy; you just completely changing everything about the deck. lol

How does Tasigur fit in Mono Black Control? Without having the ability to activate the ability on Tasigur; I don't see how it's really all that great in the long run.

Quote from MrRotten »

Quote from SuperSeed »

Been brewing with Tasigur... he makes this deck even more grindy. I like it. Will post list when I come to something more solid.

Boy; you just completely changing everything about the deck. lol

How does Tasigur fit in Mono Black Control? Without having the ability to activate the ability on Tasigur; I don't see how it's really all that great in the long run.

I mean he fits into our grindy game plan, I've ditched the Squelching Leeches for now in favor of 4 Palace Siege, 4 Merchant. Still working on multiple builds, Tasigur might not fit in actually, just messing around with ideas.

I like the sound of Gary with Palace Siege. I think 3-4 fountain is bad especially when you need to hit BB.

I mainly play UB control. I run 2 - 3 radiant fountains. I am rarely (but sometimes) kept off either BB or UU because I get 2 fountains in 4 lands. In mono black I feel you can run 3 - 4 Fountains because you have no other colour to help the Fountain block you from BB. I also run 2 Urborgs in my UB control, but I am probably the only one.

I would advise you to keep an open mind about a splash colour. I am not advocating it directly. But you can get some utility from other colours.

Not a fan of Urborg in a mono deck because i don't want enemy decks to get mana fixing

Quote from peterforrence »

I mainly play UB control. I run 2 - 3 radiant fountains. I am rarely (but sometimes) kept off either BB or UU because I get 2 fountains in 4 lands. In mono black I feel you can run 3 - 4 Fountains because you have no other colour to help the Fountain block you from BB. I also run 2 Urborgs in my UB control, but I am probably the only one.

I would advise you to keep an open mind about a splash colour. I am not advocating it directly. But you can get some utility from other colours.

Comparing UB control to this build is different because we have Squelching Leeches to factor in. Leeches should be a 4/4 if you are dropping it T4 otherwise it's useless imo. Splashing any color would make it an automatic drop. Also Siege Palace has a lot of LP gain potential.

Without Leeches, then all your point's are extremely relevant and I would advocate the same. No doubt blue is the best color we can splash.

Quote from RedGauntlet »

Not a fan of Urborg in a mono deck because i don't want enemy decks to get mana fixing

One Urborg is ok. Potential to turn your fetch lands into real lands if low on LPs. I'm not 100% on it though haven't played enough in the new format.

Leeches is not the reason to play this deck lol.

Master of the feast + gary + Whip of Erebos and i think you'll be onto something. and Tasigur would be amazing, run 8 fetches and some scryelands that produce black/green. and by some i mean all 8.

Enjoy making your Bx Devotion Deck; I'm out.

This thread has steered into a realm I did not want it to go.

Good luck to you all.

You're the one who's against looking at all options available. If you consider 8 permanents that have black mana symbols in them a "devotion" deck then so be it (my version). You're posting on a public forum where you're going to get suggestions. I see this as running away from improving a deck with possibility, I'm still going to run my Mono Black Control deck tomorrow. The fact is that Gray Merchant is a needed piece to the puzzle , especially since you're running Palace Siege as a key component.

I will try the Gary + Siege build I like the concept, keep exploring.

I also like the idea of trying Tasigur as well so I'm just going to leave this rough draft.

This is mono black, not dissolve + Treasure Cruise. Not playing Gray Merchant with Palace Siege is a mistake as it's the best interaction in the deck.

Yeah i would try to keep the deck mono colored jsut to explore Gary better.God i miss Underworld Connections

In that case the list below can be helpful to people. It's all our BB cards in the format so far we can splash. My thoughts included for a control setup.

FRF
Archfiend of Depravity - debatable possibility
Ancestral Vengeance - our first low CMC BB enchantment in the format so far, more creature based, wouldn't be control.
Noxious Dragon - debatable possibility

KTK
Necropolis Fiend - a good pick as a one off. Good fuel through our spells.
Krumar Bond-Kin - not good, better 5-drops.

M15
Liliana Vess - she is a must in my eyes for black control
Soul of Innistrad - debatable possibility, meh
Indulgent Tormentor - debatable possibility, SB maybe
Ob Nixilis, Unshackled - debatable possibility
Blood Host - no
Caustic Tar - maybe, another clock?

JOU
Dictate of Erebos - more creature based
King-Macar, the God Curse - no
Master of the Feast - no
Squelching Leeches - maybe splashed

BNG
Eater of Hope - no
Champion of Stray Souls - no
Archfiend of Finality - no
Shrike Harpy - interesting card but meh
Warchanter of Mogis - no

THS
Hythonia the Cruel - interesting card but meh
Whip of Erebos - more creature based
Agent of Fates - no
Abhorrent Overlord - one yes, good with palace and gary
Nighthowler - no
Insatiable Harpy - no
Keepsake Gorgon - no
Disciple of Phenax - fits the control profile but met

There's nothing to discuss becasue this isn't a Devotion strategy. Gray Merchant of Asphodel and Palace Siege. Every single card you've up in that list isn't playable in this list as it adds nothing to controlling the board state.

Has anyone thought about a one of empty the pits for an additional win con that also makes blockers?

Forgot about Ulcerate as another cheap removal.Yes it hurts alot but with Gary and Palace Siege health might not be that problematic

Quote from MrRotten »

Quote from SuperSeed »

Been brewing with Tasigur... he makes this deck even more grindy. I like it. Will post list when I come to something more solid.

Boy; you just completely changing everything about the deck. lol

How does Tasigur fit in Mono Black Control? Without having the ability to activate the ability on Tasigur; I don't see how it's really all that great in the long run.

Throw in a couple of fetches to be able to activate? Every card would still be black and controlling... getting to cast those MBC spells a 2nd or 3rd or 4th time is fairly pertinent. Back in the day of odyssey block being able to get 2 casts out of Chainers edicts were part of what kept that deck ahead in midgame

As for Ulcerate, if you were going to play a lot of them, in addition to all the other pain you're dealing yourself, I don't think waiting until turn 5 or 6 to start gaining life back is going to work unless the board is clear and your opponent is top-decking.

Actually, having looked at all the decklists and comments up until this point, I am surprised that there seems to be so little control. Many builds seem to believe that there will not be a creature rush down before Crux of Fate is live on turn 5. I get that Thoughtseize can slow down the rush but quite a few lists are running many copies of Sign in Blood and Read the Bones and very little in the way of early-game removal (not that there's a whole lot in Standard right now). In the meantime, I see that Silence the Believers seems to be a popular choice, which is a turn 4 play at the earliest. Ugin, the Spirit Dragon has shown up a lot, too, but you're not dropping it in this deck until turn 8, at which point you're either going to be long dead or your opponent will have scooped (unless you're playing against control). The 5-mana slot in this deck seems to be pretty stacked as well, with Crux, Siege, Gray Merchant, and sometimes Liliana Vess in there.

I should ask if the goal of this deck is to beat aggro or control. Mono-black non-aggro decks can often be tailored to beat one or the other, so maybe I'm just seeing decks that are leaning more towards beating control? I'm not too current with the meta, but that can be a regional/local thing, too. It just seems like the mono-black builds here are kind of slow, and I am always worried about the aggro matchup. How have people's results gone against aggro?

You have Drown in Sorrow,Bileblight and Pharika's cure for agro

You have (in all of the recent deck builds here) 2 Drown in Sorrow main with maybe one more in the side, and all the Pharika's Cures in the side, so in game 1 you have 2 Drown, 3 Bile Blight main, along with some number of Hero's Downfalls. All the other removal being run is a 4 drop or later and is probably designed to deal with midrange or big threats. Is this enough for the aggro matchup, or is the plan to hope to get lucky game 1 then bring in all the creature hate for game 2 and 3? I'm just trying to understand where the deck is going and what the main focus is. If the goal is to just dump game 1 vs. aggro and try to beat out control or midrange strategies, why not run more discard in the main and move the fast removal to the side? I ask this because by putting some hate vs. aggro and some hate vs. control, don't you weaken your matchup against both of them?

I like running mono-black a lot, even when it's not warranted, so I really would like this deck to be successful. I just want to make sure I'm understanding the objectives of the current builds and can identify what can improve the deck.

Kool dekk!