I have played a similar list and it is pretty resiliant, funniest game was vs frites who resolved 6 Thragtusk, 3 Angel of Serenity and still lost to me. Although my list was running 7 wraths post board. I have not tested Drogskol Reaver yet.
Esper Control
Introduction: Esper had seen some amount of small success before Gatecrash but once Gatecrash was released it finally gained some of the Shock Lands that it needed to gain traction. It has since been piloted to some success top 8ing at SCG Edison and PT Montreal. The deck relies on cards like Sphinx's Revelation to gain insurmountable card advantage and then using Nephalia Drownyard or Jace, Memory Adept to mill our opponent out.
There's the core of our deck, we have 55 cards here leaving us with 5 Flex slots. First let's take a look at some of our card choices:
Card Choices:
The Land Base:
The generally accept number of lands to run is 27, since we aren't running Farseek we need to make sure that we are able to make our land drops every turn. On top of this our lands transform into a win condition in the end game.
Duals and Basics are pretty much set, 20 Duals and 2-3 Basics. This leaves us with 4 slots for utility which can be filled with any selection of the following:
Nephalia Drownyard: A key card in our deck, because our land eventually acts as a win condition this allows us to run a very low number of threats and play more answers. Because of this I would recommend running no less than 3.
Augur of Bolas: Let's us grab a spell off of the top and leaves behind a blocker, what's not to like?
Snapcaster Mage: Let's us reuse any of our spells and can act as a blocker or beater in a pinch.
Ultimate Price: You'll definitely run into this not being able to remove something but we really don't have many better options. It's an unfortunate evil that we have to live with.
Victim of Night: This will deal with things a lot better than Ultimate Price will but the double black on turn 2 seems a little too greedy in a deck that hopes to supreme verdict on turn 4.
Murder: This will kill whatever you throw it at but the extra turn can seriously be a beating against some aggro decks. Possible sideboard card but I wouldn't run any main.
Devour Flesh: The life gain is pretty irrelevant as our number one win condition is milling our opponent out so 90% off the time it's a diabolic edict. It can also be used on yourself to gain some life if needed.
Dissipate: Our go to counter spell, the prevalence of Cavern of Souls means that we want to keep the number of main board counterspells low but having access to Snapcaster takes the sting away when we need them.
Sphinx's Revelation: The backbone of our deck, I wouldn't run any less than 4.
Think Twice: Lets us draw into all of our land drops and gives us something to dump our mana into when we need it.
Azorius Charm: Most of the time this will be putting an attacker back on top of our opponent's deck but worst case scenario we cycle it for a card. Don't forget that we have the option to drownyard away anything we azorius charm.
Supreme Verdict: The best wrath that we have access to, I wouldn't run any less than 4.
Flex Slots:
Restoration Angel: Very synergistic with both of our other creatures and can act as an emergency blocker or threat.
Planar Cleasning: Clears up any problem permanents that we normally have trouble dealing with. How many you run depends on if you run Enchantments or Planeswalkers.
Terminus: The bottom of the deck clause will be mostly irrelevant now that Zombies have fallen out of favor but miracling can be pretty big game against aggro.
Jace, Memory Adept: Represents a very real clock in milling our opponents out if they can't deal with it. You definitely want some in your 75.
Jace, Architect of Thought: Less sustainable card draw than Memory Adept. Whether you run him or not is very dependent on the list.
Tamiyo, the Moon Sage: Keeps one threat on lock down, can draw you some cards if needed and makes the game very hard to loose if you can ultimate.
Forbidden Alchemy: Digs for anything we need and dumps things into our graveyard for Snapcaster it can then be flashed back later in the game to dig again.
Detention Sphere: Deals with any trouble permanents that our opponent plays.
Let's take a look at some of our options for our sideboard.
Jace, Memory Adept: If you don't have a spot for him in the mainboard, 1 or 2 in the sideboard are absolutely amazing in the control matchup.
Rest in PeaceHelps us in the UWR and Reanimator matchups.
Psychic SpiralHelps prevent us from being milled out while also acting as a win condition.
Dispel: Great in the control mirror where you're looking to stop your opponent's Revelations while forcing through your own.
Negate: Great for catching pesky planeswalkers and big sorcery spells such as Rakdos's Return.
Witchbane Orb: Shuts down opposing Jaces, Rakdos's Return, Slaughter Games, etc.
Gloom Surgeon: Great against aggro, eats removal which slows them down or it can just block for days.
Angel of Serenity: Acts as pseudo-removal and a win condition making it very hard to deal with.
Pithing Needle: Shuts down our opponent's planeswalkers and any lands that give us trouble.
Duress: Great card in both the control and midrange mirror, great at shutting down stuff like Rakdos's Return and Slaughter Games or even just making sure it's safe for us to fire off a Sphinx's Relevation.
Matchups:
Since there are a lot of different decks being run in each Archetype rather than talking about how good or bad a match up is I'll talk about key cards in each matchup and what to look out for from them. Their removal is pretty dead against us and we just want to try and stay alive and deal with their planeswalkers before they can grind us out.
Jund Midrange:
Preboard games will generally resolve around Rakdos's Return and Sphinx's Revelation, we need to try and avoid getting hit by return while revelating for as much as possible.
Rakdos's Return: Making sure we don't get hit by a large Rakdos's Return is one of the main things we need to avoid in this matchup, luckily we have counterspells to deal with this so we try to avoid this by tapping out as little as possible. We can also respond with a Sphinx's Revelation for a large amount to keep some key cards.
Thragtusk: Interacts very favorably with board wipes and removal in general and represents a clock on its own. Tamiyo keeps it locked down quite well if you're running Planeswalkers or you just have to be ready to 2 for 1 yourself dealing with it.
Kessig Wolf Run: Turns any creature that they have into a very real threat. Fortunately we can interact with this very favorably via removal or stuff like Azorius charm. Obviously a good Ghost Quarter target.
Liliana of the Veil: Very strong against us as we have fewer ways to deal with it than other control lists running red. Our main ways of interacting with a resolved Liliana are either Detention Sphere or attacking it down with a Resto Angel. Planar Cleansing works as well but is pretty poor against a turn 3 Liliana when we're on the draw.
Garruk, Primal Hunter: Again, pretty great against us because we have trouble interacting with planeswalkers. Detention Sphere and Resto Angel are a little worse since it will still leave behind beast tokens. Planar Cleansing is pretty great as it will clear up any beasts as well as dealing with him.
Postboard:
They're gonna bring in more Rakdos's Returns as well as big game in Slaughter Games and Underworld Connections. Our goals remain the same but now with us trying to avoid a Slaughter Games on Sphinx's Revelation. Duress is pretty big game against them as it deals with all the key cards in the matchup. A resolved Witchbane Orb is also pretty great for us as it allows us to stop worrying about both Rakdos's Return and Slaughter Games.
Underworld Connections: Allows them to grind out the long game, interacts poorly with Ghost Quarter and Planar Cleansing. If it becomes a massive problem we're even able to Detention Sphere it.
Slaughter Games: Post board one of the scariest things that we can see is a turn 3 Slaughter Games off of Farseek. Since it can't be countered our main way of stopping this is via Duress. This will generally name Sphinx's Revelation or Supreme Verdict depending on the board state.
Naya Blitz:
Generally this matchup resolves around if we can Supreme Verdict on turn 4 or not, after this our superior late game will let us run away with the game. Post wrath we need to respect Haste creatures as well as Searing spear.
Burning-Tree Emissary: We're not scared of this card so much as we're scared of the nut draws that it enables. Allows them to dump their hand very quickly which will kill us if we can't wrath away their board.
Champion of the Parish: We need to deal with this as quickly as possible as it can get out of control very quickly.
Experiment One: Same as above but less explosive although it's harder to remove.
Cavern of Souls: Cavern on Human makes our Counterspells pretty dead in hand so we'll generally board them out after game 1.
Searing Spear: Just something we need to respect that they are running, will generally be aimed to the face so we need to try and stay out of burn range.
Giant Growth: Generally used as Searing Spear 5-7, They won't have a massive amount of combat trick value against us but we have to respect the damage.
Postboard:
They'll generally bring in things to either deal with wraths or keep us off of them.
Boros Charm: Pretty much all of the modes can be live against us, it allows them to survive wraths, get us into burn range a lot quicker and even kill us out of nowhere with the double strike.
Thalia, Guardian of Thraben: We need to remove this as soon as possible, this can keep us off of wrath mana for a turn which may be everything they need to kill us.
Pretty interesting. How does it win though if tamiyo doesnt get to ultimate?
Is sorin + lingering souls + pike enough to go to town?
Sorin + Souls is plenty once you've stabilized against most decks in the format. Note that he has 3 Drownyards in the side as well for the control mirrors.
Solid deck, and from personal experience, one of the better decks against Bant variations.
Sorin+Lingering souls is what kills people. Once you stabilize, sorin starts making emblems and you tend to put the game away in a turn or 2. I'm playing a ROUGH version of this deck in the IQ.
LP, I'm checking your article out as well. Behind all of your swag is the brain of one of the most intelligent Magic players I've ever known. I guess that's one more thing for you to add to the wall of ego that is your Sally sig.
I can go with that. LK, you are the Mace Windu of red mages...cool, tempered logic in deliberation, but capable of just flat kicking tail when the situation warrants it.
Sideboard 2 x Dispel (They are fckin amazing in the mirror/counter wars/landing geist and jace 3.0) 2 x Jace, Memory Adept 2 x Dissipate 2 x Negate 2 x Sundering Growth (Key runes are getting too popular and D spheres wernt enough for walkers, creature threats, and key runes) 3 x Geist of Saint Traft (combined with lingering souls/sorin can really put the hurt on another control player)
Was running 26 lands before, but 27 is the right number. Runs so much smoother now, however might take out a drownyard and 1 island for an evolving wilds and a swamp. not sure yet.
So far I am liking it and its strong, when the next set comes around with proper duals this WILL be the control deck to beat hands down
Splashing only for drownyard? Interesting, makes control mirrors way better but how do you feel about sorin and souls?
I think the sideboard could use a bit of work
I find sorrin doesn't compliment the mill strategy...and the sb has been tested extensively. It's mostly for control, because the mb is so aggro oriented, that there are a lot of dead cards in the control mirror.
Angel's mercy is for the third sphinx's revelation, but can come down earlier and gains u 7 life instead of 1 life and 1 card.
The fourth verdict comes in against any deck running creatures and counter back-up, and the o-ring is for sphere battles, though, i'm considering making that the 4rth sphere b/c I don't really have any permanents that i wanna sphere/o-ring battle over. It might just be better to have the 4rth sphere, as it helps in the token matchup.
Knight of Glory's rise is a meta call for zombies, but I think it's getting worse cause of br zombies, and the fact that zombies is falling out of favor.
I might change it to geist of st traft only because it seems really good in the mirror (but I'm already so good against control).
Feelin of dread is also better than souls imo, it comes down earlier and form a defensive standpoint, does everything souls does, but better, as well as being easier on the mana (this is essentially a uw deck with a splash of black for alchemy and late game drownyard). I can see a case being made for both sorrin and souls together as a wincon, but I've never been a fan of attacking with souls tokens.
I do conceed that it makes me weaker to hexproof shenanigans
Feelin of dread is also better than souls imo, it comes down earlier and form a defensive standpoint, does everything souls does, but better, as well as being easier on the mana (this is essentially a uw deck with a splash of black for alchemy and late game drownyard). I can see a case being made for both sorrin and souls together as a wincon, but I've never been a fan of attacking with souls tokens.
I do conceed that it makes me weaker to hexproof shenanigans
Lingering souls is amazing and is one of the main reasons to splash black. The mill strategy is pretty much only good against control.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"No one may threaten or commit violence ('aggress') against another man's person or property. Violence may be employed only against the man who commits such violence; that is, only defensively against the aggressive violence of another. In short, no violence may be employed against a nonaggressor. Here is the fundamental rule from which can be deduced the entire corpus of libertarian theory." - Murray Rothbard, Cited from "War, Peace, and the State"
Pretty interesting. How does it win though if tamiyo doesnt get to ultimate?
Is sorin + lingering souls + pike enough to go to town?
Sorin emblems usually gets there. But have to be careful about over-extending with lingering souls to not waste them because you might have to end up wrathing.
With lingering souls chump blocking + removal its pretty easy to get tamiyo to ultimate unless they have dreadbore of course. It happens pretty often for me at least.
It gets awkward vs decks where wrath is not a great solution to the pressure (such as reanimator chaining angels). Because you might end up having to use lingering souls defensively. In which case your out is tamiyo ult/jace ult/drownyard (which is awkward vs reanimator).
I think if reanimator is in your meta purify the grave is mandatory for sideboard.
The other matchup I found difficult was junk walkers/tokens. Admittedly I probably sideboarded incorrectly, not realising he was running not only sorin and garruk but also lilliana and vraska. I had to mull both games so I'd need to play the matchup more to figure out what changes there might be.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"No one may threaten or commit violence ('aggress') against another man's person or property. Violence may be employed only against the man who commits such violence; that is, only defensively against the aggressive violence of another. In short, no violence may be employed against a nonaggressor. Here is the fundamental rule from which can be deduced the entire corpus of libertarian theory." - Murray Rothbard, Cited from "War, Peace, and the State"
this is something i have been working on the past few weeks. I have been very happy with its preformance at the past 2-3 weeks of play at my local store.
this is something i have been working on the past few weeks. I have been very happy with its preformance at the past 2-3 weeks of play at my local store.
record is 12-2. which i am happy with.
Interesting, hows the desecration demon been for you?
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"No one may threaten or commit violence ('aggress') against another man's person or property. Violence may be employed only against the man who commits such violence; that is, only defensively against the aggressive violence of another. In short, no violence may be employed against a nonaggressor. Here is the fundamental rule from which can be deduced the entire corpus of libertarian theory." - Murray Rothbard, Cited from "War, Peace, and the State"
I like desecration demon (I alos tryed bloodgift demon not as resilent but draw is nice)
He is really a solid hitter for 4cc. It puts a lot of the aggro kids in my meta in a wierd spot. they either sac a creature to do some sorta damage or they swing and lose a creature or do nothing until they hopefully find an answer. It gives me time to find the answers i need for the rest of there creatures.
I like desecration demon (I alos tryed bloodgift demon not as resilent but draw is nice)
He is really a solid hitter for 4cc. It puts a lot of the aggro kids in my meta in a wierd spot. they either sac a creature to do some sorta damage or they swing and lose a creature or do nothing until they hopefully find an answer. It gives me time to find the answers i need for the rest of there creatures.
Seems really sketchy giving your opponent the option to chump block him with any creature, or make it so he can't block.
I wish we had access to a better finisher, preferably something that impacts the board and can block thragtusk without trading. I might give drogskol reaver a whirl next week. I really miss consecrated sphinx!
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"No one may threaten or commit violence ('aggress') against another man's person or property. Violence may be employed only against the man who commits such violence; that is, only defensively against the aggressive violence of another. In short, no violence may be employed against a nonaggressor. Here is the fundamental rule from which can be deduced the entire corpus of libertarian theory." - Murray Rothbard, Cited from "War, Peace, and the State"
this is something i have been working on the past few weeks. I have been very happy with its preformance at the past 2-3 weeks of play at my local store.
record is 12-2. which i am happy with.
Seems weak to an aggressive zombies build. Desecration Demon can just be tapped with its ability by saccing a gravecrawler, and then they can swing in like normally. Possibly triggering blood artist while they're at it. The only saving grace is either a bad zombie player/hand or miracle terminus
I do like curse of death's hold however, but I think knight of glory sb might be helpful. Also Sphinx's revelation is insane (in the membrane), I like 2 MB.
Less Dissi more synco.....Pate that is.
Nighthawk is awesome though.
I don't like lingering souls to be honest. I rather put in more control like essence scatter and synocopate (which I am in the process of doing) also I normally side dd out for bloodline keeper against zombies since he gives me a fair number of blockers. Until I Can stabilize
P.s. the majority of my meta is humans. Also I have another list with most of my updated stuff.
Well Ive been playing a bit of an esper build, saw the original list on a star city article about states and sleeved it up that night to give it a shot. Ive made a few changes ever since, and to be honest the only black in the deck is drownyard. every other thing Ive tried to splash in just hasnt been justifiable yet.
Anyway, here is the decklist.
The Dispels in the Sideboard are probably the weakest card and will be coming out for something more relevant, not idea what yet, however I am primarily in a control dominated meta so they may yet find their way back into the 75.
I chose not to play sorin because my 4 drop is really for the supreme verdicts and Jace right now. Im playing this primarily as the old U/B control used to be played. Draw cards, counter your things wipe your board and drownyard you to death pretty much every game. My main problem so far has been aggro matchups with rancor involved, which is reflected in my switch from lingering souls to feeling of dread, they both serve the same stalling purpose, however feeling is much better against rancor, although admittedly without the alternate win-con possibilities as souls.
Pretty interesting. How does it win though if tamiyo doesnt get to ultimate?
Is sorin + lingering souls + pike enough to go to town?
Not really, but a single and timely swing from a Lifelinking Vampire + Pike could win you games.
I like how it was full of interactive spells, though I still notice the lack of instant speed response except for Azorius Charm which usually acts like Think Twice here, as can utilize the pseudo-removal or the lifelinker mode as well just like an aggro deck.
Also, sometimes, Azorius Charm(pseudo removal) + Nephalia Drownyard opponent seems pretty sweet against problematic threats making Azorius Charm's work a real removal.
a 1 or two of rift isnt going to help against multiple rancors where feeling of dread does. they rancor the creature, i just tap it and take no damage. However i do agree on sorin and am trying to find some room for him in the deck. Im thinking either cutting a syncopate and a think twice for 2 sorin or something along those lines...
I think that's a great idea if your deck is a little on the slow side with lots of wraths. Definitely helps past turn 5. What we really want is something along the lines of Pristine Talisman.
2 Augur of Bolas
2 Snapcaster Mage
Planeswalkers
3 Jace, Architect of Thought
2 Sorin, Lord of Innistrad
2 Tamiyo, the Moon Sage
Spells
4 Azorius Charm
1 Cyclonic Rift
2 Detention Sphere
3 Forbidden Alchemy
4 Lingering Souls
1 Sever the Bloodline
1 Sphinx's Revelation
3 Supreme Verdict
1 Terminus
2 Thought Scour
1 Ultimate Price
1 Runechanter's Pike
Lands
4 Drowned Catacomb
2 Evolving Wilds
4 Glacial Fortress
4 Hallowed Fountain
2 Island
4 Isolated Chapel
1 Nephalia Drownyard
2 Plains
1 Swamp
1 Vault of the Archangel
3 Curse of Death's Hold
1 Drogskol Reaver
3 Negate
3 Nephalia Drownyard
1 Sever the Bloodline
2 Sundering Growth
1 Terminus
1 Ultimate Price
I have played a similar list and it is pretty resiliant, funniest game was vs frites who resolved 6 Thragtusk, 3 Angel of Serenity and still lost to me. Although my list was running 7 wraths post board. I have not tested Drogskol Reaver yet.
Esper Control
Introduction: Esper had seen some amount of small success before Gatecrash but once Gatecrash was released it finally gained some of the Shock Lands that it needed to gain traction. It has since been piloted to some success top 8ing at SCG Edison and PT Montreal. The deck relies on cards like Sphinx's Revelation to gain insurmountable card advantage and then using Nephalia Drownyard or Jace, Memory Adept to mill our opponent out.
Here's the core of our deck:
4 Drowned Catacomb
3 Nephalia Drownyard
1 Ghost Quarter
4 Isolated Chapel
4 Glacial Fortress
4 Hallowed Fountain
2 Godless Shrine
2 Watery Grave
2 Island
1 Plains
4 Augur of Bolas
2 Snapcaster Mage
Spells
4 Sphinx's Revelation
4 Think Twice
4 Azorius Charm
4 Supreme Verdict
2 Dissipate
4 Removal Spells (Devour Flesh, Ultimate Price , Murder)
There's the core of our deck, we have 55 cards here leaving us with 5 Flex slots. First let's take a look at some of our card choices:
Card Choices:
The Land Base:
The generally accept number of lands to run is 27, since we aren't running Farseek we need to make sure that we are able to make our land drops every turn. On top of this our lands transform into a win condition in the end game.
Duals and Basics are pretty much set, 20 Duals and 2-3 Basics. This leaves us with 4 slots for utility which can be filled with any selection of the following:
Nephalia Drownyard: A key card in our deck, because our land eventually acts as a win condition this allows us to run a very low number of threats and play more answers. Because of this I would recommend running no less than 3.
Ghost Quarter: A great answer to problematic lands such as Kessig Wolf Run, Cavern of Souls, Nephalia Drownyard, etc. I wouldn't run more than 1 because our mana base is already stretched thin by our Nephalia Drownyards.
Augur of Bolas: Let's us grab a spell off of the top and leaves behind a blocker, what's not to like?
Snapcaster Mage: Let's us reuse any of our spells and can act as a blocker or beater in a pinch.
Ultimate Price: You'll definitely run into this not being able to remove something but we really don't have many better options. It's an unfortunate evil that we have to live with.
Victim of Night: This will deal with things a lot better than Ultimate Price will but the double black on turn 2 seems a little too greedy in a deck that hopes to supreme verdict on turn 4.
Murder: This will kill whatever you throw it at but the extra turn can seriously be a beating against some aggro decks. Possible sideboard card but I wouldn't run any main.
Devour Flesh: The life gain is pretty irrelevant as our number one win condition is milling our opponent out so 90% off the time it's a diabolic edict. It can also be used on yourself to gain some life if needed.
Dissipate: Our go to counter spell, the prevalence of Cavern of Souls means that we want to keep the number of main board counterspells low but having access to Snapcaster takes the sting away when we need them.
Sphinx's Revelation: The backbone of our deck, I wouldn't run any less than 4.
Think Twice: Lets us draw into all of our land drops and gives us something to dump our mana into when we need it.
Azorius Charm: Most of the time this will be putting an attacker back on top of our opponent's deck but worst case scenario we cycle it for a card. Don't forget that we have the option to drownyard away anything we azorius charm.
Supreme Verdict: The best wrath that we have access to, I wouldn't run any less than 4.
Flex Slots:
Planar Cleasning: Clears up any problem permanents that we normally have trouble dealing with. How many you run depends on if you run Enchantments or Planeswalkers.
Terminus: The bottom of the deck clause will be mostly irrelevant now that Zombies have fallen out of favor but miracling can be pretty big game against aggro.
Jace, Memory Adept: Represents a very real clock in milling our opponents out if they can't deal with it. You definitely want some in your 75.
Jace, Architect of Thought: Less sustainable card draw than Memory Adept. Whether you run him or not is very dependent on the list.
Tamiyo, the Moon Sage: Keeps one threat on lock down, can draw you some cards if needed and makes the game very hard to loose if you can ultimate.
Forbidden Alchemy: Digs for anything we need and dumps things into our graveyard for Snapcaster it can then be flashed back later in the game to dig again.
Detention Sphere: Deals with any trouble permanents that our opponent plays.
Sample Decklists:
4 Drowned Catacomb
4 Nephalia Drownyard
4 Isolated Chapel
4 Glacial Fortress
4 Hallowed Fountain
2 Godless Shrine
2 Watery Grave
2 Island
1 Plains
Creatures
4 Augur of Bolas
3 Restoration Angel
2 Snapcaster Mage
4 Sphinx's Revelation
4 Think Twice
4 Azorius Charm
4 Supreme Verdict
2 Planar Cleansing
2 Dissipate
2 Devour Flesh
1 Ultimate Price
1 Dramatic Rescue
1 Rest in Peace
1 Psychic Spiral
1 Negate
2 Jace, Memory Adept
3 Gloom Surgeon
2 Duress
1 Dispel
2 Angel of Serenity
2 Witchbane Orb
4 Isolated Chapel
4 Hallowed Fountain
4 Glacial Fortress
4 Drowned Catacomb
4 Nephalia Drownyard
3 Watery Grave
2 Godless Shrine
1 Plains
1 Island
Creatures
3 Augur of Bolas
2 Snapcaster Mage
Enchantments
3 Blind Obedience
1 Tamiyo, the Moon Sage
1 Jace, Memory Adept
1 Detention Sphere
Spells
4 Azorius Charm
4 Sphinx's Revelation
3 Think Twice
3 Terminus
2 Ultimate Price
2 Supreme Verdict
2 Devour Flesh
1 Forbidden Alchemy
1 Dissipate
1 Terminus
1 Supreme Verdict
1 Jace, Memory Adept
1 Detention Sphere
3 Rest in Peace
2 Dispel
1 Feeling of Dread
3 Negate
1 Psychic Spiral
1 Pithing Needle
Sideboard:
Jace, Memory Adept: If you don't have a spot for him in the mainboard, 1 or 2 in the sideboard are absolutely amazing in the control matchup.
Rest in PeaceHelps us in the UWR and Reanimator matchups.
Psychic SpiralHelps prevent us from being milled out while also acting as a win condition.
Dispel: Great in the control mirror where you're looking to stop your opponent's Revelations while forcing through your own.
Negate: Great for catching pesky planeswalkers and big sorcery spells such as Rakdos's Return.
Witchbane Orb: Shuts down opposing Jaces, Rakdos's Return, Slaughter Games, etc.
Gloom Surgeon: Great against aggro, eats removal which slows them down or it can just block for days.
Angel of Serenity: Acts as pseudo-removal and a win condition making it very hard to deal with.
Pithing Needle: Shuts down our opponent's planeswalkers and any lands that give us trouble.
Duress: Great card in both the control and midrange mirror, great at shutting down stuff like Rakdos's Return and Slaughter Games or even just making sure it's safe for us to fire off a Sphinx's Relevation.
Matchups:
Since there are a lot of different decks being run in each Archetype rather than talking about how good or bad a match up is I'll talk about key cards in each matchup and what to look out for from them. Their removal is pretty dead against us and we just want to try and stay alive and deal with their planeswalkers before they can grind us out.
Jund Midrange:
Rakdos's Return: Making sure we don't get hit by a large Rakdos's Return is one of the main things we need to avoid in this matchup, luckily we have counterspells to deal with this so we try to avoid this by tapping out as little as possible. We can also respond with a Sphinx's Revelation for a large amount to keep some key cards.
Thragtusk: Interacts very favorably with board wipes and removal in general and represents a clock on its own. Tamiyo keeps it locked down quite well if you're running Planeswalkers or you just have to be ready to 2 for 1 yourself dealing with it.
Kessig Wolf Run: Turns any creature that they have into a very real threat. Fortunately we can interact with this very favorably via removal or stuff like Azorius charm. Obviously a good Ghost Quarter target.
Liliana of the Veil: Very strong against us as we have fewer ways to deal with it than other control lists running red. Our main ways of interacting with a resolved Liliana are either Detention Sphere or attacking it down with a Resto Angel. Planar Cleansing works as well but is pretty poor against a turn 3 Liliana when we're on the draw.
Garruk, Primal Hunter: Again, pretty great against us because we have trouble interacting with planeswalkers. Detention Sphere and Resto Angel are a little worse since it will still leave behind beast tokens. Planar Cleansing is pretty great as it will clear up any beasts as well as dealing with him.
Postboard:
They're gonna bring in more Rakdos's Returns as well as big game in Slaughter Games and Underworld Connections. Our goals remain the same but now with us trying to avoid a Slaughter Games on Sphinx's Revelation. Duress is pretty big game against them as it deals with all the key cards in the matchup. A resolved Witchbane Orb is also pretty great for us as it allows us to stop worrying about both Rakdos's Return and Slaughter Games.
Underworld Connections: Allows them to grind out the long game, interacts poorly with Ghost Quarter and Planar Cleansing. If it becomes a massive problem we're even able to Detention Sphere it.
Slaughter Games: Post board one of the scariest things that we can see is a turn 3 Slaughter Games off of Farseek. Since it can't be countered our main way of stopping this is via Duress. This will generally name Sphinx's Revelation or Supreme Verdict depending on the board state.
Naya Blitz:
Burning-Tree Emissary: We're not scared of this card so much as we're scared of the nut draws that it enables. Allows them to dump their hand very quickly which will kill us if we can't wrath away their board.
Champion of the Parish: We need to deal with this as quickly as possible as it can get out of control very quickly.
Experiment One: Same as above but less explosive although it's harder to remove.
Cavern of Souls: Cavern on Human makes our Counterspells pretty dead in hand so we'll generally board them out after game 1.
Searing Spear: Just something we need to respect that they are running, will generally be aimed to the face so we need to try and stay out of burn range.
Giant Growth: Generally used as Searing Spear 5-7, They won't have a massive amount of combat trick value against us but we have to respect the damage.
Postboard:
They'll generally bring in things to either deal with wraths or keep us off of them.
Boros Charm: Pretty much all of the modes can be live against us, it allows them to survive wraths, get us into burn range a lot quicker and even kill us out of nowhere with the double strike.
Thalia, Guardian of Thraben: We need to remove this as soon as possible, this can keep us off of wrath mana for a turn which may be everything they need to kill us.
UWR Tempo:
UWR Control:
Naya Midrange:
Mono Red:
Wolf-Run Bant:
The Aristocrats:
Jund Aggro:
Human Reanimator:
Junk Reanimator:
Saito Zoo:
3/11/2013: Added Jund and Naya Blitz Matchups.
Warning, Redundant thread.
From Standard Proven Forum Rules:
Sorin + Souls is plenty once you've stabilized against most decks in the format. Note that he has 3 Drownyards in the side as well for the control mirrors.
Solid deck, and from personal experience, one of the better decks against Bant variations.
My sideboard is more vs control orientated.
4 x Detention Sphere
Planeswalkers
4 x Jace, Architect of Thought
3 x Sorin, Lord of Innistrad
2 x Tamiyo, The Moon Sage
Sorcery
4 x Terminus
1 x Supreme Verdict
3 x Lingering Souls
Instants
2 x Feeling of Dread
1 x Cyclonic Rift
1 x Sphinx's Revelation
4 x Azorius Charm
3 x Syncopate
1 x Ultimate Price
4 x Plains
4 x Island
3 x Nephalia Drownyard
4 x Hallowed Fountain
4 x Glacial Fortress
4 x Drowned Catacomb
4 x Isolated Chapel
2 x Dispel (They are fckin amazing in the mirror/counter wars/landing geist and jace 3.0)
2 x Jace, Memory Adept
2 x Dissipate
2 x Negate
2 x Sundering Growth (Key runes are getting too popular and D spheres wernt enough for walkers, creature threats, and key runes)
3 x Geist of Saint Traft (combined with lingering souls/sorin can really put the hurt on another control player)
Was running 26 lands before, but 27 is the right number. Runs so much smoother now, however might take out a drownyard and 1 island for an evolving wilds and a swamp. not sure yet.
So far I am liking it and its strong, when the next set comes around with proper duals this WILL be the control deck to beat hands down
this link should be helpful for explaining how to use the deck tags properly.
4 Azorius Charm
3 Think Twice
2 forbidden alchemy
3 Detention Sphere
2 Dissipate
1 Snapcaster Mage
4 Terminus
3 Supreme Verdict
3 Jace, Architect of Thought
2 Tamiyo, the Moon Sage
2 sphinx's revelation
1 increasing confusion
4 Hallowed Fountain
4 Glacial Fortress
3 Drowned Catacomb
1 Isolated Chapel
4 Island
4 Plains
1 Swamp
2 Evolving Wilds
3 Nephalia Drownyard
1 Angel's Mercy
2 Jace, Memory Adept
2 Tormod's Crypt
1 Duress
3 Negate
1 Dissipate
1 Oblivion Ring
1 Supreme Verdict
3 Knight of Glory
Splashing only for drownyard? Interesting, makes control mirrors way better but how do you feel about sorin and souls?
I think the sideboard could use a bit of work
I find sorrin doesn't compliment the mill strategy...and the sb has been tested extensively. It's mostly for control, because the mb is so aggro oriented, that there are a lot of dead cards in the control mirror.
Angel's mercy is for the third sphinx's revelation, but can come down earlier and gains u 7 life instead of 1 life and 1 card.
The fourth verdict comes in against any deck running creatures and counter back-up, and the o-ring is for sphere battles, though, i'm considering making that the 4rth sphere b/c I don't really have any permanents that i wanna sphere/o-ring battle over. It might just be better to have the 4rth sphere, as it helps in the token matchup.
Knight of Glory's rise is a meta call for zombies, but I think it's getting worse cause of br zombies, and the fact that zombies is falling out of favor.
I might change it to geist of st traft only because it seems really good in the mirror (but I'm already so good against control).
I do conceed that it makes me weaker to hexproof shenanigans
Lingering souls is amazing and is one of the main reasons to splash black. The mill strategy is pretty much only good against control.
I think i also need to clear up one SB spot for another card vs aggro (to take out the 3 syncopates mb)
Sorin emblems usually gets there. But have to be careful about over-extending with lingering souls to not waste them because you might have to end up wrathing.
With lingering souls chump blocking + removal its pretty easy to get tamiyo to ultimate unless they have dreadbore of course. It happens pretty often for me at least.
It gets awkward vs decks where wrath is not a great solution to the pressure (such as reanimator chaining angels). Because you might end up having to use lingering souls defensively. In which case your out is tamiyo ult/jace ult/drownyard (which is awkward vs reanimator).
I think if reanimator is in your meta purify the grave is mandatory for sideboard.
The other matchup I found difficult was junk walkers/tokens. Admittedly I probably sideboarded incorrectly, not realising he was running not only sorin and garruk but also lilliana and vraska. I had to mull both games so I'd need to play the matchup more to figure out what changes there might be.
4 Hallowed Fountian
4 Glacial fortress
4 drowned catacombs
4 isolated chapels
4 islands
3 swamp
2 plains
1 vault of the arch angel
Walkers
3 Jace, Architecht of thought
2 Taymio, Moonsage
2 Sorrin, Lord of innastrad
3 Vampire Nighthawks
2 desecration demons
2 angel of serenity
Counters
3 Dissapate
1 Synocapate
Spells
3 Azorious charm
4 Terminus
3 Supreme Verdict
3 Detention sphere
2 Curse of deaths hold
1 sphinx revelation
2 Oblivion rings
3 cyclonic rifts
2 sever the bloodlines
2 bloodline keeper
2 syncopate
2 pithing needle
2 Drogskol reaver
this is something i have been working on the past few weeks. I have been very happy with its preformance at the past 2-3 weeks of play at my local store.
record is 12-2. which i am happy with.
Interesting, hows the desecration demon been for you?
He is really a solid hitter for 4cc. It puts a lot of the aggro kids in my meta in a wierd spot. they either sac a creature to do some sorta damage or they swing and lose a creature or do nothing until they hopefully find an answer. It gives me time to find the answers i need for the rest of there creatures.
Seems really sketchy giving your opponent the option to chump block him with any creature, or make it so he can't block.
I wish we had access to a better finisher, preferably something that impacts the board and can block thragtusk without trading. I might give drogskol reaver a whirl next week. I really miss consecrated sphinx!
Seems weak to an aggressive zombies build.
Desecration Demon can just be tapped with its ability by saccing a gravecrawler, and then they can swing in like normally. Possibly triggering blood artist while they're at it. The only saving grace is either a bad zombie player/hand or miracle terminus
I do like curse of death's hold however, but I think knight of glory sb might be helpful. Also Sphinx's revelation is insane (in the membrane), I like 2 MB.
Less Dissi more synco.....Pate that is.
Nighthawk is awesome though.
Main question is, where the lingering souls at?
P.s. the majority of my meta is humans. Also I have another list with most of my updated stuff.
Anyway, here is the decklist.
4x Augur of Bolas
3x Supreme Verdict
4x Terminus
4x Think Twice
4x Azorius Charm
3x Feeling of Dread
2x Forbidden Alchemy
4x Syncopate
2x Sphinx's Revalation
2x Tamiyo, the Moon Sage
4x Hallowed Fountan
4x Glacial Fortress
3x Drowned Catacomb
3x Isolated Chapel
3x Nephilia Drownyard
5x Island
4x Plains
4x Detention Sphere
3x Dissipate
2x Negate
2x Sundering Growth
2x Dispel
1x Supreme Verdict
1x ?
The Dispels in the Sideboard are probably the weakest card and will be coming out for something more relevant, not idea what yet, however I am primarily in a control dominated meta so they may yet find their way back into the 75.
I chose not to play sorin because my 4 drop is really for the supreme verdicts and Jace right now. Im playing this primarily as the old U/B control used to be played. Draw cards, counter your things wipe your board and drownyard you to death pretty much every game. My main problem so far has been aggro matchups with rancor involved, which is reflected in my switch from lingering souls to feeling of dread, they both serve the same stalling purpose, however feeling is much better against rancor, although admittedly without the alternate win-con possibilities as souls.
Not really, but a single and timely swing from a Lifelinking Vampire + Pike could win you games.
I like how it was full of interactive spells, though I still notice the lack of instant speed response except for Azorius Charm which usually acts like Think Twice here, as can utilize the pseudo-removal or the lifelinker mode as well just like an aggro deck.
Also, sometimes, Azorius Charm(pseudo removal) + Nephalia Drownyard opponent seems pretty sweet against problematic threats making Azorius Charm's work a real removal.
For Rancor, you could just play 1 or 2 Cyclonic Rifts.
For Rancor, you could just play 1 or 2 Cyclonic Rifts.
4 Detention Sphere
Instant: 13
2 Azorius Charm
1 Cyclonic Rift
2 Feeling of Dread
2 Sphinx's Revelation
2 Syncopate
4 Think Twice
Land: 26
4 Drowned Catacomb
4 Glacial Fortress
4 Hallowed Fountain
2 Island
4 Isolated Chapel
3 Nephalia Drownyard
2 Plains
2 Swamp
1 Vault of the Archangel
2 Sorin, Lord of Innistrad
2 Tamiyo, the Moon Sage
Sorcery: 13
3 Entreat the Angels
4 Lingering Souls
2 Supreme Verdict
4 Terminus
1 Angel of Serenity
2 Dissipate
2 Erase
2 Syncopate
3 Tribute to Hunger
3 Jace, Memory Adept
2 Liliana of the Veil
I do testing on cockatrice inbox me if you want to play.