As to the Vedalken Heretic discussion: I'd really like for my deck to have 7-8 two-drops, 4 of those will be Jhessian Infiltrator, and I'm just considering the Heretic for the other slot. More than likely it will end up being Qasali Pridemage, but I figure Heretic is worth testing at least.
If you're gonna run Heretic, which I believe is questionable at best, you really need to tun Lorescale Coatl as well. If Heretic hits, he just gets killed, but pair him with Lorescale, and suddenly your opponent isn't as worried about your little 1/1 Heretic, instead looking at the Lorescale.
If you're gonna run Heretic, which I believe is questionable at best, you really need to tun Lorescale Coatl as well. If Heretic hits, he just gets killed, but pair him with Lorescale, and suddenly your opponent isn't as worried about your little 1/1 Heretic, instead looking at the Lorescale.
Just my two cents.
yes, the synergy of their abilities work very well, but are not very aggressive. you need Heretic to get in the red zone to make it useful, and without evasion of any sort, it will be chumped very very often. a turn 2 pridemage is much more threatening.
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im sorry I was unclear I was talking about the difference between the 2/2 unblockable and the 3/2 esper stormblade, I am actually only running stormblade as my two drops, however I'm also running all 8 acceleraters so that might influence a bit. no, the one point from the fetchland is completely irrelevant I agree. there are just so few decks running flying creatures these days (no im not counting baneslayer angel) that I have relegated infiltraitor to my sb. I'm not sayin you have to like it I am merely discussing its merits, just test it, I think you will see great results.
Here's my reasoning, though:
Stormblade Pros:
-(conditional) bigger power
-(conditional) flyer
Stormblade Cons:
-it's way too conditional
-lots of flyers in ZEN make flying underwhelming
-in Fallout/ 'Clasm range
Infiltrator Pros:
-always a 2/2
-always unblockable
Infiltrator Cons:
-in Fallout/ 'Clasm range
-low power is a bit weak without assistance
IMO the cons of the Stormblade sure outweigh it's pros. If you like it, that's cool, but I really think there are better options out there.
If you're gonna run Heretic, which I believe is questionable at best, you really need to tun Lorescale Coatl as well. If Heretic hits, he just gets killed, but pair him with Lorescale, and suddenly your opponent isn't as worried about your little 1/1 Heretic, instead looking at the Lorescale.
Just my two cents.
I agree, but as dante said, it's not very aggressive. I feel like it could be a decent option, but I'd definitely rather play Infiltrator, or Rhox, or Stag, or Jenara on turn 2. So maybe there's my problem, I'm looking too much at having a stable of two-drops, and not considering playing an absurd amount of three-drop threats. Definitely a possibility
The best two drop in standard is Putrid Leech. I think I might switch Bant Midrange to Dark Bant. The new fetches (G/B and B/W makes this possible). Plus Soul Manipulation is fantastic for card advantage.
Plus, Maelstrom Pulse can deal with Walkers, which right now we can't, barring a Negate.
So after having tested it I really have to remove the way to conditional clause, there both in fallout range so we can remove that, so basicly it is +1power and not always unblockable vs-1power and always unblockable. If you would explain to me what zendikar flyers you expect to be played I would be apprciative.
I think taint is referring to the vampire tribal (one has flying, but there is more to reveal) and perhaps u/w control's wall of reverence . To top it off, the orb of insight shows about 40 references to flying in the set.
Back to the stormblade debate, I say if it works in your meta, then by all means, run it. In my meta, it's practically pointless with the abundance of spectral, fae, and baneslayer, so infiltrator is a better choice for me. Evasion is bant's best weapon against swarm, especially with rafiq, so it's best to utilize whatever is available and whatever works more efficiently.
Know what card would work well with Bant? View from Above. It's reusable evasion, since most Bant cards like War Monk / Rafiq are white, so you can use this card to continually give them flying.
Know what card would work well with Bant? View from Above. It's reusable evasion, since most Bant cards like War Monk / Rafiq are white, so you can use this card to continually give them flying.
Or you could use something like Elspeth that is good on her own and not a useless draw when you just got swept.
Know what card would work well with Bant? View from Above. It's reusable evasion, since most Bant cards like War Monk / Rafiq are white, so you can use this card to continually give them flying.
While that is true, the card will become dead at some point (like when you have no creatures). I will have to agree with CorpT on elspeth because she gives your creature both an attack boost and evasion (or tokens for shielding), while drawing fire from your opponent's removal or damage effects.
fair enough, I geuss it just matters how your metagame is, down here its all jund and 5cc very few other decks.
My question is, do you ever run into problems with it not getting "pumped" from another multicolored permanent? I see it as being worse than Shorecrasher in that regard, as it forces you to play something when you might not need it (ie. Rhox War Monk just to trigger the Mimic,) and even then the Shorecrasher was good since it hit for 5 and trampled, whereas the Stormblade just flies and hits for 3.
Also, View From Above is not what we need. Elspeth does the job just fine
I play Stoic Angel and it's been fantastic. Sleep was underwhelming, though. Usually when I'm playing token or swarm decks I'll just let them swing with everything, then drop the Stoic. If they can't remove it, they can't do anything. Sleep just took up space when I tried it.
I think I'm going to move the Stag to the SB and move the Negates to the MD. I just wanted more 3 drops.
I just realized that Scute Mob would be fantastic in this deck. He can be a chump blocker or a late game beater / life gain engine when coupled with Wall of Reverence.
EDIT: Realized that this deck doesn't need Garruk. An overrun ability doesn't work well with the whole 'attack with one guy a turn' theme.
Hey I like your mid range deck man. I'm going to do some play testing of my own and hopefully post one up soon.
I ran this yesterday and ended up going 6-0. I made some last minute changes and honestly did not expect to win, let alone sweep. I've been messing with the counterspells for awhile, and I ended up putting Cancel in the side board just because I had no idea what else to do. I'd run Cryptic, but I'm trying to see if I can make this deck viable post-rotation.
What do you guys think? I'm always down for some constructive criticism. I hate having Cancel in there, but it was a last-minute decision. I'm loving how this plays right now. I can play aggro, but if I need to slow it down, Jace and Stoic make it easy. Just looking for some tips.
I ran this yesterday and ended up going 6-0. I made some last minute changes and honestly did not expect to win, let alone sweep. I've been messing with the counterspells for awhile, and I ended up putting Cancel in the side board just because I had no idea what else to do. I'd run Cryptic, but I'm trying to see if I can make this deck viable post-rotation.
What do you guys think? I'm always down for some constructive criticism. I hate having Cancel in there, but it was a last-minute decision. I'm loving how this plays right now. I can play aggro, but if I need to slow it down, Jace and Stoic make it easy. Just looking for some tips.
I would take out Cancel and add Bant Charm. Your deck doesn't have enough MD removal, and in a format where a 5/5 lifelinker for 5 is flying around, that could be a big mistake.
You guys really think Finest Hour Aggro is going to jump into Tier1 status in the Zen meta??? Caz I played this deck for a while and I constantly won at my FNM spot but when I took it to a PTQ I got smoked:mad:
Ever since then I haven't played it and I even considered trading it away!!!
You guys really think Finest Hour Aggro is going to jump into Tier1 status in the Zen meta??? Caz I played this deck for a while and I constantly won at my FNM spot but when I took it to a PTQ I got smoked:mad:
Ever since then I haven't played it and I even considered trading it away!!!
Right now the top decks (with 150 ZEN cards still to go) look to be Bant, Jund, and maybe some variant of U/W control. Mono black aggro and goblins seemed promising but they can't hold up against Sable Stags, Harm's Way and Celestial Purge imo.
Finest Hour Aggro is a glass cannon.. Extremely Powerful, but easy to break apart for the most part , but luckily, Bant is very versatile. If your not satisfied with Bant Aggro, you can run Stoic's and go with Bant control , using Vigilance or whatever tricks you want. For all we know, with the new Cat beast win condition , Rhox War Monk + Rafiq , and the Cat Beast can make Bant Life gain a new variation.... The new metagame is a mystery.
I would take out Cancel and add Bant Charm. Your deck doesn't have enough MD removal, and in a format where a 5/5 lifelinker for 5 is flying around, that could be a big mistake.
Yeah, I actually took out Bant Charm awhile back. I've been thinking about putting it back in.
And what do you guys do about card draw? My current deck has virtually no card draw capabilities, and I consistently run into card disadvantage issues. Would something like Niveous Wisps fit in?
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I'm back after a brief stint in block with a new idea for Bant and I'm going for a Knight of the Reliquary for several reasons. Anyhow, I can't discuss it here because of the rules of the moderators.
I'm back after a brief stint in block with a new idea for Bant and I'm going for a Knight of the Reliquary for several reasons. Anyhow, I can't discuss it here because of the rules of the moderators.
I have actually very rarely have issues not getting my stormblades pumped, and, rafiq and finest hour aside curving hierarch stormblade stoic can be rather rediculous if your opponant is trying to beat you on the ground. I've actually found that since I'm running so much flying I can win without rafiq and finest, it actually seems to make the deck better in general. This is answering the question about pumping stormblade not the new knight of the reliquary, which in my opinion could be a 3bazilllion/3bazillion and it still wouldn't have evasion or lifelink so i aint playn it.
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If you're gonna run Heretic, which I believe is questionable at best, you really need to tun Lorescale Coatl as well. If Heretic hits, he just gets killed, but pair him with Lorescale, and suddenly your opponent isn't as worried about your little 1/1 Heretic, instead looking at the Lorescale.
Just my two cents.
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yes, the synergy of their abilities work very well, but are not very aggressive. you need Heretic to get in the red zone to make it useful, and without evasion of any sort, it will be chumped very very often. a turn 2 pridemage is much more threatening.
Here's my reasoning, though:
Stormblade Pros:
-(conditional) bigger power
-(conditional) flyer
Stormblade Cons:
-it's way too conditional
-lots of flyers in ZEN make flying underwhelming
-in Fallout/ 'Clasm range
Infiltrator Pros:
-always a 2/2
-always unblockable
Infiltrator Cons:
-in Fallout/ 'Clasm range
-low power is a bit weak without assistance
IMO the cons of the Stormblade sure outweigh it's pros. If you like it, that's cool, but I really think there are better options out there.
I agree, but as dante said, it's not very aggressive. I feel like it could be a decent option, but I'd definitely rather play Infiltrator, or Rhox, or Stag, or Jenara on turn 2. So maybe there's my problem, I'm looking too much at having a stable of two-drops, and not considering playing an absurd amount of three-drop threats. Definitely a possibility
:symw::symu::symg:Sovereign Mythic (8-4-0)
:symw::symu:Mythic Bant (20-10-0)
:symr::symb::symg: Jund
:symw::symr::symg:Where Ancients Suck
Plus, Maelstrom Pulse can deal with Walkers, which right now we can't, barring a Negate.
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Back to the stormblade debate, I say if it works in your meta, then by all means, run it. In my meta, it's practically pointless with the abundance of spectral, fae, and baneslayer, so infiltrator is a better choice for me. Evasion is bant's best weapon against swarm, especially with rafiq, so it's best to utilize whatever is available and whatever works more efficiently.
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Legacy
WUG Bant
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Or you could use something like Elspeth that is good on her own and not a useless draw when you just got swept.
While that is true, the card will become dead at some point (like when you have no creatures). I will have to agree with CorpT on elspeth because she gives your creature both an attack boost and evasion (or tokens for shielding), while drawing fire from your opponent's removal or damage effects.
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Standard
UW UW Control
B MBC (developing)
Legacy
WUG Bant
My question is, do you ever run into problems with it not getting "pumped" from another multicolored permanent? I see it as being worse than Shorecrasher in that regard, as it forces you to play something when you might not need it (ie. Rhox War Monk just to trigger the Mimic,) and even then the Shorecrasher was good since it hit for 5 and trampled, whereas the Stormblade just flies and hits for 3.
Also, View From Above is not what we need. Elspeth does the job just fine
:symw::symu::symg:Sovereign Mythic (8-4-0)
:symw::symu:Mythic Bant (20-10-0)
:symr::symb::symg: Jund
:symw::symr::symg:Where Ancients Suck
I play Stoic Angel and it's been fantastic. Sleep was underwhelming, though. Usually when I'm playing token or swarm decks I'll just let them swing with everything, then drop the Stoic. If they can't remove it, they can't do anything. Sleep just took up space when I tried it.
Hey I like your mid range deck man. I'm going to do some play testing of my own and hopefully post one up soon.
Thanks. I'm still working on Putrid Leech Bant.dec but so far my midrange build looks like this:
4x Scute Mob
4x Rafiq of the Many
4x Rhox War Monk
4x Noble Hierarch
4x Wall of Reverence
2x Elspeth, Knight Errant
2x Negate
4x Bant Charm
4x Path to Exile
2x Harm's Way
4x Seaside Citadel
7x Forest
5x Island
2x Plains
4x Great Sable Stag
4x Celestial Purge
3x Qasali Pridemage
2x Mark of Asylum
2x Pithing Needle
Barring any Zenanigans I think this build looks solid.
So here's my list:
4x Noble Hierarch
3x Birds of Paradise
4x Jhessian Infiltraitor
4x Rhox War Monk
1x Jenara, Asura of War
4x Rafiq of the Many
4x Stoic Angel
Spells:
3x Path to Exile
4x Negate
2x Jace Belerin
2x Elspeth, Knight-Errant
2x Finest Hour
6x Forest
3x Plains
3x Island
4x Sunpetal Grove
3x Glacial Fortress
2x Seaside Citadel
2x Reflecting Pool
4x Burrenton Forge-Tender
2x Pithing Needle
2x Cancel
3x Meddling Mage
4x Great Sable Stag
What do you guys think? I'm always down for some constructive criticism. I hate having Cancel in there, but it was a last-minute decision. I'm loving how this plays right now. I can play aggro, but if I need to slow it down, Jace and Stoic make it easy. Just looking for some tips.
I would take out Cancel and add Bant Charm. Your deck doesn't have enough MD removal, and in a format where a 5/5 lifelinker for 5 is flying around, that could be a big mistake.
Ever since then I haven't played it and I even considered trading it away!!!
Thanks to Dantcg for the Sig!
Right now the top decks (with 150 ZEN cards still to go) look to be Bant, Jund, and maybe some variant of U/W control. Mono black aggro and goblins seemed promising but they can't hold up against Sable Stags, Harm's Way and Celestial Purge imo.
Yeah, I actually took out Bant Charm awhile back. I've been thinking about putting it back in.
And what do you guys do about card draw? My current deck has virtually no card draw capabilities, and I consistently run into card disadvantage issues. Would something like Niveous Wisps fit in?
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Check out our EDH Cube! Constructive discussion welcomed. Hell, just a response would be nice.
http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showpost.php?p=8316611&postcount=1
If you guys are interested here is the link:
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I'm looking at something very similar (with KotR), but more midrange.
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