Here's what I've been playing with for a while. I plan to take it to FNM this week, so I thought I'd get some suggestions from the friendly people at MTGS.
Well, I think the deck is lacking synergy and structure. They're all decent cards, but you're caught in the middle between naya aggro and naya tempo. If you want to play naya aggro, I'd recommend dropping to a 4 mana curve max playing something like this.
If you see a lot of control archetypes that will be sideing earthquake/fallout, then I would recommend just MDing escorts. They're not a bad t3 drop as 3/3s either way.
Hmm... You might have a point. I did notice that I have a lot of 4-drops, which occasionally caused some issues. Dropping the curve like that would certainly make it more aggressive. Thanks for the suggestion.
No problem. Not to make choices tough, but you could always go the more tempo route, playing hierarch, or llanowar if on a budget, steward, and playing the behemoths/bbes/and wurm. Though personally I think with the current card meta the aggro version is much better.
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Yeah, I just thought about taking out the Shepherds for Wurms. I'm on a mini-budget... At least to the point where I couldn't get 4 BOPs before tomorrow. I still think I'll give the Tempo deck a shot this week and see how it goes. The Johnny in me is curious.
if you have cascade cards like Bloodbraid elf you need to have little to no 1 drops (I.E:Noble Heirarch) Also wilt-leaf cavaliers is a good card to cascade into. Ripclan Crasher and ceradon yearling are easily replacible with stigma lasher and collosal might (great combo) Here is my list:
Watch the 2 toughness guys. Everyone who can will be packing a lot of sweepers with the rise of WW decks, so you want to avoid most cards that have less than 3 toughness. Fortunately you are in the right shard to do it, with cards like:
Now, since you aren't running any big spells, you might want to consider Gaddock Teeg to shut down enemy planeswalkers and spells like Cryptic Command and the like. One final thing, is I would toss in as a 2 of either Behemoth Sledge or Shield of the Oversoul to give you some reach. Your deck is weak againsts flyers and needs a way to get through an army of chump blocking kithkin/soldiers/fairies.
path is bad here cuz if u cascade into it its a waste
That's not true. Nothing requires you to play the spell; and if your opponent has a creature, it's useful for removing that which would have otherwise blocked the BBE.
I would suggest Knight of New Alara as a 4 of in Naya agg decks. The pump is insane, especially if you are playing the blade creatures or things like woolly thoctar.
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It's like a koala bear crapped a rainbow in my brain!
I would suggest Knight of New Alara as a 4 of in Naya agg decks. The pump is insane, especially if you are playing the blade creatures or things like woolly thoctar.
Knight of New Alara is good in decks that are more modeled to run the 'blade' 2/1s, but even though on paper hes great, he straight up just dies so quick the build of the deck gets shaky. I've tried implementing him, but as a t4 drop, it either gets countered or blown up. Everything kills him, and when he dies, you've lost all your momentum with that build. I don't know what meta you have that a knight of new alara survives any responses, but in competitive one it gets blown out of the water. If you want to run aggro, you have to have multiple threats, not just half way houses with one huge pump stick with a bullseye on his head.
@archmage251 there's many times where I want to hit a path with bbe. Sometimes its a waste, i'll admit. But it's helped me a lot more often than hurt, thats for sure.
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I have thought about just sideboarding some Windstorm for my decks for those annoying flyers when i am playing decks that I dont use birds.
Also, would Overrun x3 possibly work out better for a aggro deck then Tower Above? Tower seems more like for ramping up a single monster, while overruns beef up every creature and gives them trample. I can see the use of both cards, just in the mindset that you are trying to pump out a lot of creatures quick to zerg them and overrun seems to support it better to me. But if i am wrong, let me know so I can redo my deck, i am new
Knight of New Alara is good in decks that are more modeled to run the 'blade' 2/1s, but even though on paper hes great, he straight up just dies so quick the build of the deck gets shaky. I've tried implementing him, but as a t4 drop, it either gets countered or blown up. Everything kills him, and when he dies, you've lost all your momentum with that build. I don't know what meta you have that a knight of new alara survives any responses, but in competitive one it gets blown out of the water. If you want to run aggro, you have to have multiple threats, not just half way houses with one huge pump stick with a bullseye on his head.
@archmage251 there's many times where I want to hit a path with bbe. Sometimes its a waste, i'll admit. But it's helped me a lot more often than hurt, thats for sure.
Before you claim it's bad, look at my list. There's plenty of threats there. Ram Gang, Bloodbraid, Finks, Wooly, Hackblade, etc...
Knight of New Alara as a 3 of in my deck provides a big boost to whats left when they've wasted all their removal on the other threats. Then, a Naya Charm or Tower Above gets you through for massive damage.
Before you claim it's bad, look at my list. There's plenty of threats there. Ram Gang, Bloodbraid, Finks, Wooly, Hackblade, etc...
Knight of New Alara as a 3 of in my deck provides a big boost to whats left when they've wasted all their removal on the other threats. Then, a Naya Charm or Tower Above gets you through for massive damage.
That's all well and good, so its not border post aggro style. The major outline that I was trying to say is yes, you have other threats, but something as fragile as a 2/2, which puts it possible to die to everything, is not that great. On paper, Creakwood liege looked like it would be a monster, and a lot of people thought it would alter standard, but, it faded out. its two toughness just made it too easy to kill. On top of that, liege is black, so knight of alara even has deathmark/doom blade to worry about in addition to everything else. If i'm paying four mana in an aggro deck for one threat, it should do at least a few of the following things. Which alara does not.
X Survive the lightning bolt test
X Give free spells/abilities
X Immune to most (not all) of current meta removal
X Protection of color(s)
X Passive combat abilities (First strike, trample, etc)
X Better stats to mana ratio
0 Pumps rest of threats
In my book, 1/7 isn't that good of a deal. Yes, he's techy and what not and yes if he stays on the field, he can be destructive. People say the same thing about Baneslayer Angel, but I think baneslayer is actually amazing. Why? It can single handedly alter a game. Where as the Knight is solely dependent on the rest of your threats. This guy was the next liege. Everyone thought he could be a bomb, and tried desperately to make him one when he came out. But the removal in the format is just too abundant and powerful. He doesn't make it out the gate, let alone hit the table.
That's all well and good, so its not border post aggro style. The major outline that I was trying to say is yes, you have other threats, but something as fragile as a 2/2, which puts it possible to die to everything, is not that great. On paper, Creakwood liege looked like it would be a monster, and a lot of people thought it would alter standard, but, it faded out. its two toughness just made it too easy to kill. On top of that, liege is black, so knight of alara even has deathmark/doom blade to worry about in addition to everything else. If i'm paying four mana in an aggro deck for one threat, it should do at least a few of the following things. Which alara does not.
X Survive the lightning bolt test
X Give free spells/abilities
X Immune to most (not all) of current meta removal
X Protection of color(s)
X Passive combat abilities (First strike, trample, etc)
X Better stats to mana ratio
0 Pumps rest of threats
In my book, 1/7 isn't that good of a deal. Yes, he's techy and what not and yes if he stays on the field, he can be destructive. People say the same thing about Baneslayer Angel, but I think baneslayer is actually amazing. Why? It can single handedly alter a game. Where as the Knight is solely dependent on the rest of your threats. This guy was the next liege. Everyone thought he could be a bomb, and tried desperately to make him one when he came out. But the removal in the format is just too abundant and powerful. He doesn't make it out the gate, let alone hit the table.
Oh boy, the "it dies to removal" argument.
What position is he wasting in the deck? None. Your opponent won't be playing 24 removal spells, i can tell you that now. Add silence to the decklist if you're worried about removal, and you can use him as a 4 mana huge boost to your creatures on the turn you're swinging for the fences.
What position is he wasting in the deck? None. Your opponent won't be playing 24 removal spells, i can tell you that now. Add silence to the decklist if you're worried about removal, and you can use him as a 4 mana huge boost to your creatures on the turn you're swinging for the fences.
If you actually even read my post instead of starting a comeback, you would have noticed that I said that as long as it survived through a decent amount of removal, not ALL removal. What does Baneslayer do? It survives blast and bolt, two of the most common basic removals in the game right now that people play four ofs in decks. It doesn't survive all of it, but since it can survive some is a big deal. Knight dies to tarfire for crying out loud, second, the vast majority of removal is instant speed, so they won't even stay pumped. It's nothing more than easily disruptable overrun with no trample. Hmm, a bunch of dudes swinging? tarfire? fallout? lightning bolt? Everything else? Too easy to disrupt. In an aggro deck, you cannot be disrupted. A pump ability needs to be cheap, i.e wisened cenn or, harder to disrupt/remove i.e Honor of the Pure or Glorious Anthem. This is my opinion obviously. But its apparently shared, or Knight wouldn't be a jank two dollar rare. If it was as effective as you said, Naya would probably be a higher tier in the competitive meta.
Wilt leaf liege is better in the spot over knight of new alara..he works ok in Block though. Hows about running more turn 1 mana dorks for something like turn 1 heirarch turn 2 ram gang/thoctar, turn 3 bloodbraid? some RG variants have been making it to top 8 in a few major events doing this (see deckcheck). Sure cascading into a mana dork is meh but its still ramp/CA right? Enlisted wurm might even be playable if you had 6-8 ramp spells. lots of cascade will make a good mid game i think, even if you loose out on speed. Naya is better midrange anyway IMO, instead of pushing early creatures in the form of Cerodon yearling or rip clan crasher, just play more relevant spells turns 3 onwards (Bigger creatures/threats i.e. Ajani Vengeant). If you want speed go RB or RG.
spellbreaker behemoth is cheap $ wise and Mana wise, plus its a 5/5 with a somewhat relevant ability. It survives almost all removal, and it fits in Naya colors.
Spellbreaker is a good card imo, and I usually either have it sb'd or md'd depending on my meta. My FNM has a lot of control variants. U/W control, grixis, and the fae. Usually there I actually main him, because a 5/5 on t4-t5 is pretty powerful since usually thats when they hold back to fire a CC. After Lor rotation, I don't see him as viable as say, stag or other creatures at his mana cost because what we have seen so far of the coming format without Lor is a much more aggro/tempo format brewing than control.
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still tweaking mana base and sb, but sb definitely wants 1 more path and fallout, some great sable stags and some wilt leaf for the blightning deck
It's a decent build, i've been tweaking with something like that for a while now. I'm not sure I like fallout md since it potentially kills most of your threats, but that's situational. I kind of find it surprising that you haven't ran into much land trouble considering you're playing 8 new duals. Personally I prefer jungle shrine, but it's definately not bad.
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4 Wild Nacatl
4 Steward of Valeron
3 Qasali Pridemage
4 Woolly Thoctar
1 Dauntless Escort
2 Spellbreaker Behemoth
3 Cliffrunner Behemoth
1 Wilt-Leaf Liege
3 Mycoid Shepherd
4 Bloodbraid Elf
2 Blitz Hellion
3 Naya Charm
6 Forest
5 Plains
5 Mountain
4 Ancient Ziggurat
3 Colossal Might
1 Qasali Pridemage
3 Dauntless Escort
4 Scattershot Archer
4 Volcanic Fallout
Any suggestions would be appreciated. Thanks!
If you see a lot of control archetypes that will be sideing earthquake/fallout, then I would recommend just MDing escorts. They're not a bad t3 drop as 3/3s either way.
3 Elite Vanguard / Tattermunge Maniac
4 Rip-clan Crasher
4 Cerodon Yearling
4 Qasali Guildmage
4 Boggart Ram-gang
4 Bloodbraid elf
4 Woolly Thoctar
4 Lightning bolt
4 Ancient Ziggurat
7 Forest
7 Mountain
6 Plains
UWR UWR Mid-Range
GBW Junk
Legacy
RBG Punishing Jund
Vintage
0 Ichorid
X MUD
UWR UWR Mid-Range
GBW Junk
Legacy
RBG Punishing Jund
Vintage
0 Ichorid
X MUD
3
4 Stigma Lasher
4 Boggart Ram-Gang
2 Woolly Thoctar
4 Kitchen Finks
4 Bloodbraid Elf
2 Chameleon Colossus
3 Wilt-Leaf Leige
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Colossal Might
2 Naya Charm
3 Fire-Lit Thicket
2 Jungle Shrine
4 Rootbound Crag
2 Sunpetal Grove
1 Wooded Bastion
4 Forest
1 Plains
i doubt youll get all the cards by fnm but you could try
^^
thanks to brofaux for this banner
my trade thread:
http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=251821
1) Wilt-Leaf Liege isn't that great in this deck, trust me I've tried. He just slows the deck.
2) Chameleon Colossus is a house but he is also slow in an aggro deck.
These would be my changes and why I would make them.
-2 Chameleons, +2 Naya Charm
Reason, because Cascading into a Naya Charm off of a BBE is insane when you have Stigma Lasher and another creature like Whooly Thoctar out.
-3 Wilt-Leaf Liege, +1 Path to Exile, +2 Whooly Thoctar
Reason, because Cascading into either of these is just better than anything else the deck can do really.
http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?p=5401186#post5401186
^^
thanks to brofaux for this banner
my trade thread:
http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=251821
Wren's Run Vanquisher
Wilt-Leaf Cavaliers
Wooly Thoctar
Boggart Ram-Gang
Cliffrunner Behemoth
Now, since you aren't running any big spells, you might want to consider Gaddock Teeg to shut down enemy planeswalkers and spells like Cryptic Command and the like. One final thing, is I would toss in as a 2 of either Behemoth Sledge or Shield of the Oversoul to give you some reach. Your deck is weak againsts flyers and needs a way to get through an army of chump blocking kithkin/soldiers/fairies.
That's not true. Nothing requires you to play the spell; and if your opponent has a creature, it's useful for removing that which would have otherwise blocked the BBE.
Currently Playing:
Type 2
:0mana::symw:TOPGUN:symw::0mana:
:symg::symg:Eldrazi Green:symg::symg:
Development:
Type 2
:symu::symw:Spread Em' Merfolk:symu::symw:
It's like a koala bear crapped a rainbow in my brain!
^This
4 Bloodbraid Elf
4 Jund Hackblade
4 Woolly Thoctar
3 Naya Hushblade
3 Knight of New Alara
3 Kitchen Finks
3 Boggart Ram Gang
Non-creature Spells: 13
4 Lightning Bolt
3 Volcanic Fallout
3 Tower Above
3 Naya Charm
5 Plains
5 Mountain
5 Forest
4 Jungle Shrine
4 Ancient Ziggurat
4 Flame Javelin
3 Martial Coup
3 Colossal Might
3 Mage Slayer
2 Behemoth Sledge
There's a solid, tested budget build that's gotten me into several top 8's. (Bolts are new, used to be shocks)
Good luck.
Standard:
Transmuter Elixir WUB
Naya Knight 'Blade RGW
Mighty Polymorphin' Progenitus UR
Extended:
RoflThopter UB
Casual:
Teferi Control/Mill U
@archmage251 there's many times where I want to hit a path with bbe. Sometimes its a waste, i'll admit. But it's helped me a lot more often than hurt, thats for sure.
UWR UWR Mid-Range
GBW Junk
Legacy
RBG Punishing Jund
Vintage
0 Ichorid
X MUD
I have thought about just sideboarding some Windstorm for my decks for those annoying flyers when i am playing decks that I dont use birds.
Also, would Overrun x3 possibly work out better for a aggro deck then Tower Above? Tower seems more like for ramping up a single monster, while overruns beef up every creature and gives them trample. I can see the use of both cards, just in the mindset that you are trying to pump out a lot of creatures quick to zerg them and overrun seems to support it better to me. But if i am wrong, let me know so I can redo my deck, i am new
Before you claim it's bad, look at my list. There's plenty of threats there. Ram Gang, Bloodbraid, Finks, Wooly, Hackblade, etc...
Knight of New Alara as a 3 of in my deck provides a big boost to whats left when they've wasted all their removal on the other threats. Then, a Naya Charm or Tower Above gets you through for massive damage.
Standard:
Transmuter Elixir WUB
Naya Knight 'Blade RGW
Mighty Polymorphin' Progenitus UR
Extended:
RoflThopter UB
Casual:
Teferi Control/Mill U
That's all well and good, so its not border post aggro style. The major outline that I was trying to say is yes, you have other threats, but something as fragile as a 2/2, which puts it possible to die to everything, is not that great. On paper, Creakwood liege looked like it would be a monster, and a lot of people thought it would alter standard, but, it faded out. its two toughness just made it too easy to kill. On top of that, liege is black, so knight of alara even has deathmark/doom blade to worry about in addition to everything else. If i'm paying four mana in an aggro deck for one threat, it should do at least a few of the following things. Which alara does not.
X Survive the lightning bolt test
X Give free spells/abilities
X Immune to most (not all) of current meta removal
X Protection of color(s)
X Passive combat abilities (First strike, trample, etc)
X Better stats to mana ratio
0 Pumps rest of threats
In my book, 1/7 isn't that good of a deal. Yes, he's techy and what not and yes if he stays on the field, he can be destructive. People say the same thing about Baneslayer Angel, but I think baneslayer is actually amazing. Why? It can single handedly alter a game. Where as the Knight is solely dependent on the rest of your threats. This guy was the next liege. Everyone thought he could be a bomb, and tried desperately to make him one when he came out. But the removal in the format is just too abundant and powerful. He doesn't make it out the gate, let alone hit the table.
UWR UWR Mid-Range
GBW Junk
Legacy
RBG Punishing Jund
Vintage
0 Ichorid
X MUD
Oh boy, the "it dies to removal" argument.
What position is he wasting in the deck? None. Your opponent won't be playing 24 removal spells, i can tell you that now. Add silence to the decklist if you're worried about removal, and you can use him as a 4 mana huge boost to your creatures on the turn you're swinging for the fences.
Standard:
Transmuter Elixir WUB
Naya Knight 'Blade RGW
Mighty Polymorphin' Progenitus UR
Extended:
RoflThopter UB
Casual:
Teferi Control/Mill U
If you actually even read my post instead of starting a comeback, you would have noticed that I said that as long as it survived through a decent amount of removal, not ALL removal. What does Baneslayer do? It survives blast and bolt, two of the most common basic removals in the game right now that people play four ofs in decks. It doesn't survive all of it, but since it can survive some is a big deal. Knight dies to tarfire for crying out loud, second, the vast majority of removal is instant speed, so they won't even stay pumped. It's nothing more than easily disruptable overrun with no trample. Hmm, a bunch of dudes swinging? tarfire? fallout? lightning bolt? Everything else? Too easy to disrupt. In an aggro deck, you cannot be disrupted. A pump ability needs to be cheap, i.e wisened cenn or, harder to disrupt/remove i.e Honor of the Pure or Glorious Anthem. This is my opinion obviously. But its apparently shared, or Knight wouldn't be a jank two dollar rare. If it was as effective as you said, Naya would probably be a higher tier in the competitive meta.
UWR UWR Mid-Range
GBW Junk
Legacy
RBG Punishing Jund
Vintage
0 Ichorid
X MUD
something like this maybe?:
4 noble heirarch
2 birds of paradise
4 boggart ram gang
4 wooly thoctar
4 bloodbraid elf
3 wilt leaf liege
3 enlisted wurm
add in some naya charms/paths/sledges and it seems solid.
UWR UWR Mid-Range
GBW Junk
Legacy
RBG Punishing Jund
Vintage
0 Ichorid
X MUD
UWR UWR Mid-Range
GBW Junk
Legacy
RBG Punishing Jund
Vintage
0 Ichorid
X MUD
[deck]
[CARD] 4 sunpetal grove
4 rootbound crag
2 wooded bastion
4 forest
5 mountain
5 plains
2 Uril the miststalker
4 spellbreaker behemoth
4 Bloodbraid elf
4 wooly thoctar
4 quasali pridemage
4 figure of destiny
4 lightning bolt
2 Behemoth sledge
3 volcanic fallout
3 path to exile
2 Ajani Vengeant
[/CARD][deck]
still tweaking mana base and sb, but sb definitely wants 1 more path and fallout, some great sable stags and some wilt leaf for the blightning deck
It's a decent build, i've been tweaking with something like that for a while now. I'm not sure I like fallout md since it potentially kills most of your threats, but that's situational. I kind of find it surprising that you haven't ran into much land trouble considering you're playing 8 new duals. Personally I prefer jungle shrine, but it's definately not bad.
UWR UWR Mid-Range
GBW Junk
Legacy
RBG Punishing Jund
Vintage
0 Ichorid
X MUD